Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)

[exidid]

Why do people insist on placing Peach on low tier!

 

[Scala]

Why do people insist on placing Peach on low tier!

Why do people insist on placing Yoshi on low tier!

bawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww nobody loves me or my main

 

[exidid]

Shut! Yoshi is over discussed already.

>

 

[Kiwikomix]

This thread needs moar Yoshi anyway.

@ Crewster: We all know you'll be posting your personal tier list in here about a week from now.

 

[Morrigan]

Why do people insist on placing Yoshi on low tier!

bawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww nobody loves me or my main

Lol, you're not in a position to make that kind of joke.

--

And whoever did that list some pages ago based on MANY tier lists posted in this thread...
Opinion based on opinions = fail.

 

[Lirok]

Opinion based on opinions = fail.

hah hah hah, bravo.

this is very correct btw.

 

[Judge Judy]

Take 2...

Top

1. Meta Knight
2. Snake

High.

3. Game and Watch
4. Falco
5. ROB
6. Pit
7. Marth
8. Toon Link
9. D3

Middle:

10. Olimar
11. Wario
12. Lucario
13. Pikachu
14. Ice Climbers
15. Kirby
16. Zelda
17. DK
18. ZSS
19. Diddy
20. Wolf
21. Fox

Low:

22. Ivysaur
23. Lucas
24. Shiek
25. Squirtle
26. Link
27. Mario
28. Ness
29. Peach
30. Sonic
31. Luigi
32. Ike
33. Bowser

Bottom:

34. Charizard
35. Yoshi
36. Jiggz
37. Samus
38. Captain Falcon
39. Ganon

First of all, PT need his own system, it's understandable that you separated them but you didn't even take fatigue and pokemon change into consideration. Next, D3 is above TL with a powerful grab game and that he has good match-ups over a majority of the cast. Link is too high, he needs to at least move down at least below Ness. Shiek is also too high, she should be at least below Mario. Lucas should be above Fox.

 

[gallax]

no i think sheik deserves to be higher than mario. there is a lot of potential in sheik. not that there isnt any in mario. im just saying that ive played good sheiks and they are able to put up quite a challenge, even to pikachu who is a sheik counter.

 

[Julz]

You don't have anything substantial to back up the placings of charizard, squirtle and ivysaur because they are all used at some point during any match with PT. The tournament placings refer to the 3 as being a part of PT.

 

[Nicole]

i'm sure this has been discussed already, but how is kirby only middle tier? he is fairly quick, has a great recovery, has lots of power for such a lightweight, and he's really one of the most versatile characters out there (in my humble opinion). yes, he gets KO'ed very easily, but so does Meta, who is top tier. i'm not saying Meta doesn't deserve his spot, but i'm not getting why kirby isn't at least high tier.

 

[Crank]

First of all, PT need his own system, it's understandable that you separated them but you didn't even take fatigue and pokemon change into consideration. Next, D3 is above TL with a powerful grab game and that he has good match-ups over a majority of the cast. Link is too high, he needs to at least move down at least below Ness. Shiek is also too high, she should be at least below Mario. Lucas should be above Fox.

TL also has good matchups against the majority of the cast, and also has a better offense than D3 imo, but of course D3s grabs and defense are too good I guess.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

This is the list of Heroes.
Working to bring it up to list of the gods and then List of Penguin's

Top:

1. Meta Knight
2. Mr.Game and Watch

High:

3. Snake
4. Falco
5. ROB
6. Pit
7. Marth
8. Toon Link
9. D3
10. Olimar
11. Pikachu
12. Wario
13. Kirby

Middle:

14. Lucario
15. Ice Climbers
16. Zelda
17. Wolf
18. ZSS
19. Diddy
20. Fox
21. DK
22. Charizard

Low:

23. Lucas
24. Shiek
25. Squirtle
26. Ness
27. Mario
28. Link
29. Yoshi
30. Peach
31. Luigi
32. Ike
33. Bowser
34. Ganondorf
35. Ivysaur
36. Sonic
37. Samus

Bottom:

38. Jigglypuff
39.Craptorn Failcorn


1. Charizard doesn't get the rep he deserves.
2. Ganondorf...NEVER goes under Captain falcon...
3. Jiggs may move...not sure on her.
4. I would move ness and Lucas but im lazy.... so rlly put em where u want.
5. Game and watch is over Snake... I know omfg right? Well maybe they should be in the same tier.... maybe they should both be High and leave metaknight to rot in top tier on his lonesome.
6. I know DK right 0_o!?...nah Dk may move up but eh... eh...
7. Sonic and Samus may move.
8. Zamus is under inspection!
9. Also this list needs to look more at Luigi >.> he's probably under rep'd on this

but still
My list, my opinion. Take it with a grain of salt and a pack of skittles.

 

[Judge Judy]

no i think sheik deserves to be higher than mario. there is a lot of potential in sheik. not that there isnt any in mario. im just saying that ive played good sheiks and they are able to put up quite a challenge, even to pikachu who is a sheik counter.

You need to play some good Mario's then. Shiek is good at juggling but her defense is pretty poor. Mario has much better match-ups and can defend decently if he needs to in addition to being good at juggling.

 

[Nicole]

WOAH chrono, you kicked snake off of top tier, that's pretty ballsy

I'm not sure if I agree with all your placements, Sonic should not be below Ganondorf. Also, Peach and Luigi are easily above Link. Charizard in middle...I dunno...mid and high tiers look ok, it's the low tier that needs some work. And definitely move Ness and Lucas, they do not belong in low under any circumstance.

I still give you serious kudos for placing Snake where he belongs!

 

[Jibbles]

3. Snake
4. Falco
5. ROB
6. Pit
7. Marth
8. Toon Link
9. D3
10. Olimar
11. Pikachu
12. Wario
13. Kirby

Switch Pit with Marth at least and D3 needs to be waay higher. Actually Pit needs to move down more.

 

[Judge Judy]

9. Also this list needs to look more at Luigi >.> he's probably under rep'd on this

Very true, same with Mario. It doesn't matter how high either of them go on the tier chart, they always still seem to get less rep than everyone else...

 

[Gindler]

Bottom:

34. Bowser
35. Charizard
36. Yoshi
37. Jiggz
38. Captain Falcon
39. Ganon


???

Yoshi in bottom? his heavy armor in 2nd jump is enough for him to be in low.

Oh and if none of you have played a good mario, fireball spam is a VERY good defensive measure since they don't go in a straight line like falco's laser makin' them slightly more annoying and since they're slower even if you sidestep you'll sometimes still get hit by it. Cape+Fludd are more annoying than most people think too.

 

[ROOOOY!]

To the last list, Samus and Sonic better ****ing change. Sonic in the bottom 5? I want what you're smoking.

 

[Tenki]

lolweightlolrangelolprioritylolalmostbottomtier

that is all for sonic and why he should be near bottom tier..


=)



---------

PT should, as previously mentioned, be treated as one character when concerning tier lists, since there is no way aside from opponent allowance that you can stay as one Pokemon for the entire match. Only for matchups, however, should they be treated separately.

 

[Snail]

You live in Haarlem right? Ask Gaki if you can come to any of his weeklies if Chibi is there and u'll never think that way about Ike again.

Or just play me on wifi I don't care.

Edit: also, Ike's grab game IS great but his dthrow and uthrow are really bad and comboing to aether is really stupid. You don't even have to DI just airdodge out of it. And again projectiles aren't the main problem (unless it's bananas), even against like Falco or something I'm more worried about the CG and the utilt/dair then the lasers.

^^ I would like to play you on Wifi sometime. I'm getting one of those cable adapters for my Wii soon so I can have a non-crappy wireless connection.

I don't appreciate Ike much as of now but I'd like for someone to prove me wrong.

 

[Guilhe]

I agree with lowering Sonic’s position on the tiers Chrono as he is a highly unreliable character. But Luigi, Peach and Ike should be higher because being under Yoshi and nerfed Link is underestimating their potential and not taking into consideration their tournament rankings. Also, PT‘s Pokémons should share a tier placement, being analyzed as a whole because this thread demands so:

First, the tier list is primarily based on tournament results. Within these results, the specific character versus character match ups should also be analyzed.

As specified by Alpha Zealot, the tier placement is strictly related to the characters placements in the tournament rankings.

 

[Gindler]

Maybe not Ike or Peach, but Ike is most certainly under crappy yoshi.

This is why Ike is low/bottom http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TgWB28BKPd8

PT should really share a spot, although I know of a few people that main charizard and the opponents just let them go back to charizard, I mean you don't want to disgrace yourself by attacking an unprepared opponent.

 

[isomorphism]

The tournament results in every region for pretty much the entire time Ankoku has been maintaining the list has DK at around 10th (also the HY2L tier list and average tier lists have him around there). I'd love to see the justification for placing him at 21st.

 

[Mega_$m@sh]

Ike = GARBAGE

Sorry, I would have to say high of bottom tier or bottom of low tier

Ike is SLOW, has SLOW attacks, 1 thing he has over many [I use the term loosely] characters is range - and one thing he has for sure over everyone is PURE POWER

I love Ike to death but he just has too many disadvantages.

I do give Ike: huge priority and reach - Super Armor can be used to an advantage,
not all his attacks are slow the fastest ones are; A Jab, U-air, B-air, maybe the N-air, and side-B

His recovery is really one sided - it's either vertical or horizontal your choice...lolz

He actually can crush everyone on Bottom Tier IMO except Sonic - I think he deserves bottom of Low Tier

Would someone like to disagree?

 

[Kiwikomix]

Ike has one, MAYBE two moves that can actually be used in any given situation.
And you certainly can't get by on, like, three moves that come out within a second of you pressing the button.

 

[Scala]

The only thing ike has going for him is his jab and his bair. You can easily play so he doesn't get a chance to use it, and you can punish him for all the other attacks in his arsenal very easily

 

[Snail]

The tournament results in every region for pretty much the entire time Ankoku has been maintaining the list has DK at around 10th (also the HY2L tier list and average tier lists have him around there). I'd love to see the justification for placing him at 21st.

First, the reason DK is performing so well is the abundance of MKs and Snakes in competitive play. Now DK is obviously a great character, but his matchups against the top 2 make him perform better than he would fighting other characters. He's mostly used as a counterpick against Snake and MK.

Second, the standing infinite by King Dedede is extremely disadvantageous for DK and that probably stops him from getting higher in the list than he is. That and the fact that aside from the top 2, he doesn't have very favourable matchups against ROB, Marth, G&W, Falco etc. That means DK is mostly used as a counterpick against Snake and MK, which wins him matches, but doesn't make him a better character.

I think those are the reasons he isn't put higher up in the list, although I agree with you he deserves to be much higher than 21st.

 

[Deathcarter]

Ike = GARBAGE

Quoted for truth.

Yoshi is better than Ike


Sorry ROOOOY! for saying Sonic has horrible range. I agree his range is good.

 

[Mega_$m@sh]

Quoted for truth.

Yoshi is better than Ike


Sorry ROOOOY! for saying Sonic has horrible range. I agree his range is good.

1st Bold - LOLZ

2nd Bold - In every way except range and power - but Ike still doesn't cut it.

Also notice that when matchups between characters are mentioned - Ike isn't even brought up, I just found that funny

 

[Bl4nk]

Toon Link is overrated, anyone who puts him over great characters like Lucario, Wario and Donkey Kong should reconsider their choices if you ask me.

Game and Watch is top tier, better than both Dedede and Falco.

The Mario brothers (Luigi specifically) are somewhat underrated.

My opinions, come with objections if you have them.

 

[Yaya]

Pokemon Trainer has great potential, he's just insanely hard to use. I really don't think he's on the bottom of low tier, He is in low tier though.

 

[Mega_$m@sh]

Pokemon Trainer - bottom of low tier

Naw that's Ike's spot for sure lolz

 

[Yaya]

I didn't say that.

I said he didn't deserve that spot.

 

[ROOOOY!]

I honestly agree with you Yaya.
PT and Sonic have difficulty curves like running into a brick wall covered in AIDS filled shards of glass (to use well anyway.) It's simply because the majority of the community don't like playing with difficult characters and want easy wins wherever they go, so they ignore PT and Sonic and write them off as awful automatically, and so are horribly under rated simply from being the two hardest characters (IMO) to master.
It's totally true people.
Pokemon Trainer is not bottom tier.

 

[Yaya]

I tried using Sonic once, I couldn't control him at all

And Roy, your sig depresses me because it reminds me of the hellhole of idiots that is General Brawl Discussion.

 

[ROOOOY!]

I avoid that place altogether. Once the game got released it got flooded by total newbs making inane topics about nothing. xD
Personally, I can't see the reasoning for Mario being so constantly hailed as middle tier. I know that the Mario mains will come down like a ton of bricks on me for saying this, it's just his tournament results in general are really poor, and he's above characters in most charts with more potential than him, Peach is a good example. Yes, I understand he's under represented at tournaments >_<

Spoiler

Peach is mid tier

 

[Mega_$m@sh]

I didn't say that.

I said he didn't deserve that spot.

I know and I agree....

I tried using Sonic once, I couldn't control him at all

Sonic is my main, he takes time to master and once you learn his speed become the SHIZ because that's all you have in any match up lolz

He is easily one of the hardest characters to master

 

[Mr.Victory07]

Anyone for Jiggs for low tier? Her results are actually better than most low tier lurkers, and her learning curve and floatiness is what made everyone completely avoid her.She also still has a great air game

 

[Bl4nk]

Anyone for Jiggs for low tier? Her results are actually better than most low tier lurkers, and her learning curve and floatiness is what made everyone completely avoid her.She also still has a great air game

But everything else is ballz, even Sakurai stated that she doesn't have any other particular strenghts. One would assume that her air game should be SUPERIOR since she is slightly inferior to most of the cast in about every other aspect.

Quoting the Dojo: "Jigglypuff has neither a long reach nor a lot of power to its attacks. On top of that, it’s not a particularly fast runner and is extremely easy to KO because of how light it is.

At a glance, Jigglypuff seems like an utterly flawed character, but the truth is that Jigglypuff has a few abilities that balance things out, like its superior midair capabilities.

On top of the ability to jump five consecutive times in the air, Jigglypuff’s midair acceleration and top speed are in a class by themselves, making Jigglypuff the ultimate midair brawler."

Had only this been the truth, then she would probably have been viable, but in reality there are many characters that have much better airgame than jigglypuff while still not being super light or weak. An exelent example is Luigi, from what I have heard has better aerial game than jigglypuff, stronger smashes, longer reach and weights more.

Jigglypuff just have too many flaws and too few strengths to be considered much better than worst, rivaled only by the Captain.

 

[Mega_$m@sh]

But everything else is ballz, even Sakurai stated that she doesn't have any other particular strenghts. One would assume that her air game should be SUPERIOR since she is slightly inferior to most of the cast in about every other aspect.

Quoting the Dojo: "Jigglypuff has neither a long reach nor a lot of power to its attacks. On top of that, it’s not a particularly fast runner and is extremely easy to KO because of how light it is.

At a glance, Jigglypuff seems like an utterly flawed character, but the truth is that Jigglypuff has a few abilities that balance things out, like its superior midair capabilities.

On top of the ability to jump five consecutive times in the air, Jigglypuff’s midair acceleration and top speed are in a class by themselves, making Jigglypuff the ultimate midair brawler."

Had only this been the truth, then she would probably have been viable, but in reality there are many characters that has much better airgame than jigglypuff while still not being super light or weak. An exelent example is Luigi, from what I have heard has better aerial game than jigglypuff, stronger smashes AND weights more.

Jigglypuff just have too many flaws and too few strengths to be considered much better than worst, rivaled only by the Captain.

****....COLD MAN COLD lolz BUT bottom for her soooorry......