Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)

[Aggression]

I do recall there being a list of follow ups people could do, but that was in fact made by someone who failed to DI with Lucas/Ness. Does anyone happen to have a list of follow ups that include DI? I mean, usually, grabs are pretty fast (aside from tether grabs), and unless you have incredible range with speed or just raw speed alone, I can imagine that most of the follow ups that used to work, like the previously thought dashing grab follow ups, will fail.

Also, I'd like to know these finite chaingrabs on Lucas/Ness, because I can't seem to recall any.

there are none lol
the only reason ness sucks is because his recovery can be gimped, if his was identical to lucas' then ness would be far superior to lucas

 

[bluebolt]

sakurai dosent want you to tier them =l
however, it could be helpful for those who want to know what character is good. but tiers are basically speediest and best priority among other things.

 

[Sirius168]

sakurai dosent want you to tier them =l
however, it could be helpful for those who want to know what character is good. but tiers are basically speediest and best priority among other things.

what r u trying to say?

 

[Shy Guy 86]

What tier Falco and Wolf are currently in. I know Meta Knight is the best character now

 

[St. Viers]

rollerking---besides the spammiest chars, falco, pit, wolf, TL, bowser doesn't really do that badly. As the most anyone can "combo" is 2-3 uptilts, or a few specific combos at certain percents, it isn't like he's easy to 0-death.

He has great priority, due to range and speed of his jab, tilts, and his d/upsmash punish mistakes like few other moves, in terms of their speed-power. He has a great anti-platform game, and he still has a great oos game due to upB, and shield-drop/jump to klaw. His flame breath can be used to gimp, as well as to stop people approaching.

He isn't good by any stretch, but he isn't bottom tier, as seeing as hes >yoshi, puff, falcon, and ganon easily, as well as an amazing matchup vs Ike, and a suprisingly good matchup (though still advantage marth) against marth.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Look, we really NEED a tier list to work off (aka, criticize), we'll get nowhere if we just post our own tierlists.

I purpose we use Ch0zen0ne's tierlist, specifically I suggest that the intial post be edited with the that tier list contained and as we come to conclusions about placement it gets edited, what do you guys think?

It's definitely a lot better then most.

*pound*

I agree with you my good sir.

Very odd tier list, I'd like to talk with you about some specific things.

Firstoff, why is Wolf so high? His recovery is pretty lousy, and it's not like his projectile game or kill options are truly remarkable. While Fox probably has less effective projectiles, he does everything else much much better than Wolf. Beyond recovery, this includes comboing, ledgeguarding, and kill options.

You are also the first person I've seen place Mario above Luigi. Now honestly, I think I know why you might say Luigi is lower (he's slower, is worse at dealing with camping, and has worse projectiles and ledgeguarding) but does this really outweigh his very good priority and kill options? Just asking really.

What exactly makes Kirby bad? I thought his priority was good, his recovery decent, and his ability to gimp very good. Also Sheik. What's so terrible about her? I mean she has F-tilt combos, a very good U-smash, good projectiles, yeah. I'm not completely sure why Lucas is an entire tier lower than Ness either, especially when he's less gimpable right?

But dayum, I'm glad I'm not the only person who figured out Sonic's recovery is bad. XD

Wolf is quite high on my tierlist b/c he is EXTREMELY good at gimping toons w/out gimping them.. a well placed chain of Bairs off the stage will generally result in a low% death.. much like when MK Uairs-->UpB... not quite a gimp, but it really is [lol @ a brawl gimp >_>;]. Wolf also has his reflector [which unfortunately most players don't take advantage of] which is one of the BEST combo breakers in the game [priority/speed/ect]. He as alot of kill moves, a good amount of advanced techs, and his campy game is **** good... and tourney results don't lie.

As for Mario/Luigi... imo the ONLY thing that Luigi has that is >mario.. is his ability to get low% "pings" with Jigg's res.. i mean... Luigi's UpB >_>; I play against Boss [the best mario in the US] whom also secondaries Luigi. Luigi and Mario have about the same recovery, but mario has MUCH better ledge trixies; Mario can also GIMP ALOT of toons w/ his watergun/cape. Mario is far superior at comboing in comparison to Luigi, and Mario also has his "fireball approach" that is VERY good at dealing w/ spammers where Luigi often gets caught performing a DownB inorder to move to the right/left. Luigi is just a wild card.. in tourney play Mario is much for consistent, but Luigi randomly wins... why do you think Mang0 mains Luigi >_>

Kirby gets BADLY ***** by ALL of the top tier.. except snake but that would only be b/c he took his power..

MK is like-

"Kirby did you bring the lube"

and Kirby is like-

"I needed stitches last time"



Seriously they are all ****.. Kirby is like he was in Melee.. his lowertier matchups were ok.. top tier makes him a VERY sad panda. He is also quite predictable, and has no range to back it up [like ROB/Marth].

Shiek is gimped by every character w/ a spike...

DID YOU KNOW--> when Shiek UpB's to the ledge.. and you spike just as she would ledgehog she gets spiked!

ORLY..

YESRLY!!!

Ness's Fair is Hax.. that is all ;p Seriously though.. imo Lucas is slower than Ness [mainly due to his aerials] and Ness still has his BAIR OF JUSTICE.. which is also Hax.

Chozen: I'm sorry, but DK has to be higher. He has a good matchup vs Snake and MK, and the only person in top tier he has trouble with is falco, really. He has a harder time against the spammy high tier chars, but as he can simply tilt through most projectiles, he isn't as screwed against spammers as one would think.

His tilts come out quick and have so much range that you can stuff most approaches, except for disjointed hitboxes. His d-throw sets up for tech chasing/punishing, he can still combo from cargo, and can combo simply by hitting, making them break out. He owns on stages with platforms, as they increase his mobility, and allow him to mess with peopel above him, thanks to his tilts, smashes, and n/u-airs.

I respect your opinion, and I like your insight into some chars (plus the fact that you're using actual info+statistics), but wrt DK, I feel your simple being lazy.

Also, Toon link is wicked hard to gimp thanks to being able to spam projectiles while recovering, and clear the ledge with bombs.

He has one of the stronger spikes, and insane aerial power.

You're correct.. i was being lazy... but honestly in my igonrance, i still cannot really quantify a spot for DK on the tier list.. doesn't Darkrain play DK?? why don't we have a midwesterner commonent on where DK should be placed on my tier list..

TL is ANNOYING to gimp.. i wouldn't quite go as far to say hard.. unless he just keeps bomb dropping, most Fairs/Bairs go straight through his Rang/Arrows... then again.. TL's Recovery>Link's.

ch0zen0ne is like the only person to back up his tier list with a good deabte lol
But should'nt DDD be placing in the second to highest tier group beacuse of his profusion of tournament wins? they don't lie. I know he has mediorce match-ups but the CG wins tournies easily. I just want to know why you put him slightly lower than most posters place the DDD.

I posted a top tier that looked like this last time-->

Snake
MK
G&W
DDD
Marth
Falco

that is what I honestly think.. but it doesn't matter what I THINK... only through the love and support of the community will i be able to post a tier list that smashers everywhere can love and respect... and if everyone disagrees w/ the most important tier then there are several things that are going on.....

1- I'm Wrong
2- They're Wrong
3- I could just shrug and let it go.. seeing as it is like 1/2 spots...

Ganon is wack-tier people.

WTF tier son... WTF tier.



Good Day Sirs.

 

[Kaizo]

guys, bowser should realy be bottom tier...he has like virtually no good matchups, especially vs anybody over low tier. P.S. I WAS JOKING

Oh, okay, I thought you were serious for a minute, but since you're joking, I won't have to kick you in the d*ck.

 

[buttsavage]

Jigglypuff should be higher up because she can beat any of these stupid characters you all make out to be gods and doesn't suck unless you're dumb enough to actually get hit a lot, which is still easy to get around.

 

[Wayland]

Kirby is like he was in Melee.

Yes, but he's better in every way. It's like pimp my ride. A Tercel in my garage is like a Tercel in Xibits garage, but his has better paint and accessories. Mid tier plz. Yeah, he's got some rough top-tier matchups, but who doesn't? That's why they're top tier, because they give mid tiers like Kirby a hard time.

 

[Grunt]

Jigglypuff should be higher up because she can beat any of these stupid characters you all make out to be gods and doesn't suck unless you're dumb enough to actually get hit a lot, which is still easy to get around.

kk
thx4 wurdz ov wizdum

 

[Shy Guy 86]

What tier Falco and Wolf are currently in. I know Meta Knight is the best character now

Meh, How come everyone ignores me =P

 

[Caael]

What A Cool Guy

He Can Start Every Word With A Capital Letter

BECAUSE THERE IS A FILTER WHERE IF YOU TYPE A WHOLE POST IN CAPITALS, IT MAKES ONLY THE FIRST LETTER CAPITAL. GET IT RIGHT.

 

[Kaizo]

BECAUSE THERE IS A FILTER WHERE IF YOU TYPE A WHOLE POST IN CAPITALS, IT MAKES ONLY THE FIRST LETTER CAPITAL. GET IT RIGHT.

I always thought it was in whole words that they do that, I guess I never noticed that it had to be the whole post. So....where is the lowercase letter in your post, or did you haxor smashboards o_O

 

[buttsavage]

snake is NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

 

[buttsavage]

metaknight is NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

 

[Grunt]

snake is NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

fail troll is fail.

 

[buttsavage]

mr game and watch is NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

 

[buttsavage]

fail troll is fail.

fail troll is NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

 

[buttsavage]

tiers are NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

 

[buttsavage]

smashboards is NOTHING to JIGGLYPUFF

 

[ShadowLink84]

I wish i had the ability to ban people.

 

[Xzax Kasrani]

STFU
Jiggs Sucks
Snake is EVERYTHING to JIGGLYPUFF
Meta Knight is EVERYTHING TO JIGGLYPUFF
SmashBoards is EVERTHING that is possible **** JIGGLYPUFF

 

[Unusual_Rex]

I believe my tier list may be one of the more accurate ones at the moment. Although it will almost certainly change over time. Note that most characters are bound to move up or down in positions.

I'm taking information from the Character Rankings List, and the Brawl Character Match-Up Chart. I'm trying to do my best to take in all characters advantages, and disadvantages to make an educated guess as to what the tier list may look like.

Hopefully this will help you guys out

(P.S. As new information comes in I'll try to update this list accordingly.)

A (U) beside a name means they could possibly move up on the list.
A (D) beside a name means they could possibly move down on the list.
An (N) beside the name means they could possibly move up or down on the list.

Top Tiers:

Meta Knight (D)
Snake (D)
Marth (N)
Mr. Game & Watch (U)

High Tiers:

Toon Link (D)
Captain Olimar (N)
Falco (U)
Pit (N)
R.O.B (U)
Wolf (N)

Middle Tiers:

Ice Climbers (N)
Pikachu (D)
King Dedede (N)
Wario (N)
Lucas (D)
Ness (N)
Kirby (U)
Fox (N)
Lucario (N)
Ike (N)
Diddy Kong (N)
Zero Suit Samus (U)
Squirtle (D)
Zelda (U)
Samus (N)
Sheik (U)
Peach (D)
Link (U)

Low Tier:

Sonic (U)
Ivysaur (N)
Charizard (N)
Luigi (U)
Mario (N)
Jigglypuff (D)

Bottom Tier:

Bowser (N)
Yoshi (N)
Captain Falcon (U)
Ganondorf (N)

Please comment on what you think about my tier list. I'd love to improve it. Give reasons why you think characters should be moved and not personal opinion! Thanks!

 

[Kiwikomix]

Snake above Meta-Knight. That's pretty much accepted now.
G-Dub above Marth, definitely, and Falco should be higher too.
ROB and Pikachu up, Pit and Olimar down.
Lucas, Ness, and Ike down.
Luigi up, right above Samus.
Zelda needs to be in high tier, she's just good enough for it.
Yoshi might actually move up. Now that there's a second jump glitch, he can get super armor whenever he needs it.
I'd actually like to talk about that... how much do you people think this will affect Yoshi's placement on the list?

 

[jiovanni007]

Kirby gets BADLY ***** by ALL of the top tier.. except snake but that would only be b/c he took his power..

MK is like-

"Kirby did you bring the lube"

and Kirby is like-

"I needed stitches last time"



Seriously they are all ****.. Kirby is like he was in Melee.. his lowertier matchups were ok.. top tier makes him a VERY sad panda. He is also quite predictable, and has no range to back it up [like ROB/Marth].

No, just no. Kirby doesn't get ***** by the entire upper tier, just a considerable amount. The all out rapefests only include MK, Pika, and IC. The obvious disadvantaged match-ups include Marth, Toon Link and GaW. The rest are either very manageable or in Kirby's advantage.

R.O.B. you say will out camp him? Lasers get ducked very easily even when angled down, Inhale swallows sex toy, and Kirby's bair approach easily out prioritizes R.O.B.'s fair, and R.O.B. can be setup quite easily.

Falco you sya has t3h CG and t3h lazerz and t3h dash-cancel? Well Kirby has t3h floaty physics which makes Falco lucky to get off that 3rd and sometimes second grab, dash attack can be DI'd in a way as to avoid the usmash, lasers are easily ducked and not at all a factor against Kirby, Falco's recovery is poor and easily gimped especially since the phantasm is no longer intimidating at all, and Falco is not even that heavy and we should all know that Kirby is packing power this time around.

D3 you say spammability, a CG, power, weight, and range? Normally this would be the bane of Kirby in Brawl, but he can still get around it. Dthrow -> ftilt doesn't work on Kirby, ever. Bthrows hurt, but if you approach D3 with full jumps as opposed to SHs, then you negate his Melee-Marth-like grab range. Though D3 has weight and power, Kirby has a much better damage output in this match-up with his speedy aerials and combos. Kirby can still manage to knock D3 out at roughly 120% which is more than most characters can say. Also, any approach is able to do away with D3's projectile unless he manages to pull a Gordo.

Pit is a lame compared to Kirby and I've definitely proven that Kirby is better than him before (look around pages 670 IIRC).

Zelda looks better on paper, but in actuality, not only has Kirby been doing better in tourneys, but the match-up is more neutral than anything. They both have power, but are both light weight. Zelda has a disjoint, but Kirby can duck up close and avoid everything but a fsmash, diagonal ftilt, dtilt, or dsmash. Zelda is a defensive character and therefore very predictable so its not hard too capitalize on her defensive playing (i.e. spam, dsmash, dtilt -> fsmash, roll, Nayru's Love, fair, bair, uair) and the rock punishes any Zelda thinking they can get an easy kill with uair. Kirby can easily approach on the cooldown of many of Zelda's moves and punish accordingly.

Wolf, don't make me laugh, Gonzo showed you one reason, he's easily Star KOed under the stage, easily gimped, and if you decide to take his power, easily mindgamed into shining and creating an opening.

Olimar is probably one of Kirby's easiest match-ups. He's light, Pikmin are outprioritzed by nearly everything Kirby does, and he's easily gimped. Nothing more about Olimar needs to be said.

With all of that, you shold be able to see why Kirby should be placed at the lower-mid portion of the third tier in a six tier system (where I had him). In my system this was called upper tier. Just to be nitpicky, Top, High, Upper, Mid, Low, Bottom >>> Top, High, Upper Mid, Lower Mid, Low, Bottom for the simple fact that Brawl is more balanced and more characters have an opportunity to shine as compared to Melee. There are many more playable characters than unplayable characters which is why There should be 4 "positive" tiers and 2 "negative" tiers. There aren't enough bad characters in the game to justify even 3 "negative" tiers.

EDIT: Spaced out my typing because I really didn't think I typed that much when I began

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Son.. i can't take your tier list serioiusly... you have Olimar as top 6.

and to respond to another comment...

yes Kirby is better in everyway.. but the game has changed enough that the changes to the rest of the cast still negate much of the goodness that Kirby now benifits from..

 

[Unusual_Rex]

Snake above Meta-Knight. That's pretty much accepted now.
G-Dub above Marth, definitely, and Falco should be higher too.
ROB and Pikachu up, Pit and Olimar down.
Lucas, Ness, and Ike down.
Luigi up, right above Samus.
Zelda needs to be in high tier, she's just good enough for it.
Yoshi might actually move up. Now that there's a second jump glitch, he can get super armor whenever he needs it.
I'd actually like to talk about that... how much do you people think this will affect Yoshi's placement on the list?

I'll look into that and update the tier list in a bit. Is G-Dub Game & Watch?

 

[Unusual_Rex]

Son.. i can't take your tier list serioiusly... you have Olimar as top 6.

and to respond to another comment...

yes Kirby is better in everyway.. but the game has changed enough that the changes to the rest of the cast still negate much of the goodness that Kirby now benifits from..

Because of that? You think my tier list is a joke? Olimar is fairly good. Can you give me reasons why?

Okay. Here is a more updated version. Tell me what you think.

A (U) beside a name means they could possibly move up on the list.
A (D) beside a name means they could possibly move down on the list.
An (N) beside the name means they could possibly move up or down on the list.

Top Tiers:

Snake (D)
Meta Knight (D)
Mr. Game & Watch (U)
Marth (N)

High Tiers:

Toon Link (D)
Falco (N)
Pit (N)
R.O.B (U)
Wolf (D)
King Dedede (N)

Middle Tiers:

Ice Climbers (N)
Pikachu (D)
Captain Olimar (N)
Wario (N)
Lucario (N)
Fox (N)
Lucas (D)
Ness (D)
Ike (N)
Diddy Kong (N)
Zero Suit Samus (U)
Squirtle (D)
Zelda (U)
Luigi (N)
Samus (N)
Sheik (U)
Kirby (N)
Peach (D)

Low Tier:

Link (U)
Sonic (U)
Ivysaur (N)
Charizard (N)
Mario (N)
Jigglypuff (D)

Bottom Tier:

Bowser (N)
Yoshi (N)
Captain Falcon (U)
Ganondorf (N)

Please comment on what you think about my tier list.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Don't double post please.. if you would like my reasoning, it's with my tier list 6-9 pgs back... enjoy that.

jiovanni007- sir you basically just told everyone that Kirby has a disadvantage against basically the ENTIRE upper echelon of my tier list. Kirby can be my new Olimar counterpick if that makes you happy... but basically your post changes nothing.. and the tourneys that Kirby was doing "well" in were mostly at the start of when Brawl came out... i mean.. just fwi.

name 5 tourneys in the past 2 months that ANY kirby player has won.. ANY.

 

[Unusual_Rex]

Don't double post please.. if you would like my reasoning, it's with my tier list 6-9 pgs back... enjoy that.

jiovanni007- sir you basically just told everyone that Kirby has a disadvantage against basically the ENTIRE upper echelon of my tier list. Kirby can be my new Olimar counterpick if that makes you happy... but basically your post changes nothing.. and the tourneys that Kirby was doing "well" in were mostly at the start of when Brawl came out... i mean.. just fwi.

name 5 tourneys in the past 2 months that ANY kirby player has won.. ANY.

I don't even know were to start on your list...

 

[boss8]

lol at mario being low tier GTFO

 

[Unusual_Rex]

lol at mario being low tier GTFO

Ummm... look at the match up chart and character rankings list...

 

[ShadowLink84]

Jiovanni will you please SPACE YOUR SENTENCES WITH PARAGRAPHS!?

 

[jiovanni007]

Don't double post please.. if you would like my reasoning, it's with my tier list 6-9 pgs back... enjoy that.

jiovanni007- sir you basically just told everyone that Kirby has a disadvantage against basically the ENTIRE upper echelon of my tier list. Kirby can be my new Olimar counterpick if that makes you happy... but basically your post changes nothing.. and the tourneys that Kirby was doing "well" in were mostly at the start of when Brawl came out... i mean.. just fwi.

name 5 tourneys in the past 2 months that ANY kirby player has won.. ANY.

You had Kirby in the low tier on your list, and I didn't say Kirby did bad against the entire upper echelon of your tier list. Your Top, High, and Upper are assumed by my to be the "upper echelon." I admitted that Kirby gets ***** by MK, Pika, and IC. IC is in your Middle tier and therefore no longer a part of this discussion. MK and Pika account for 2/15 of you upper echelon. I also admitted that Kirby was disadvantaged against Marth, GaW, and Toon Link. Factor that in with the previously mentioned characters and Kirby does bad against 5/15, or 1/3 of your upper echelon. I can only assume that converting the meaning of "entire" into number sense means 1. Last time I checked 1/3 =/= 1. You said basically the entire upper echelon which would be at least half, but it isn't even that much. That and I gave you reasoning that Kirby has neutral or advantageous match-ups against 6/15 members of your upper echelon. And I would like to hear any additional logical reasoning that Kirby should remain in the low tier. As far as tourney rankings go, I trust Ankoku's tourney rankings which has Kirby in the C rank, and conviently above Zelda and Toon Link.

 

[Ch0zen0ne]

Sir that Matchup chart is whack.. the rankings are slightly more reasonable.. but it really just reflects character popularity.. if Bowser was the best character in the game, but no one knew b/c no one used him what difference would it make...

You say that MY tier list is CLEARLY incorrect.. well sir, it would seem that most of the other smashers in this thread have said they think MY list is a good place to start, as well as find that though they don't agree with some of it.. it seems mostly correct.

I go by straight matchups, and metagame from WC/MW/EC.. hence Wario/Pit... ROB/Wolf.. Falco/Marth

you have to look at everything my good sir.. you think i just "made" that list in 5 minutes of thinking? uhhmm.. it would seem that i've been exchanging PM's w/ various character specific forum leaders over the past 2 weeks to start to narrow down my list... so in all honesty the sh*t you talk really means NOTHING b/c at the end of the day.. the SBR is going to post of list VERY similar to mine, and YOU will be kicking yourself knocking you called it incorrect, when it was EXACTLY what was needed to stimulate discussion, create a control, and finish a tier list.

Good Day Sir.

edit- my good sir jiovanni007.. you have earned my respect. You are an intellegent poster, and make some excellent points... where would YOU put Kirby on my tier list if i may so ask?

 

[Unusual_Rex]

You've put Mario in upper tier...

I'm not saying you tier list sucks, but it does need some work. You put Olimar in the "WTF" tier... Yeah, he may not me top, but he's definitely better than alot of characters.

 

[Kaizo]

I wish i had the ability to ban people.

I wish i had the ability to e-****-slap people =3

Also, Olimar is actually very good. His only downfall is his recovery and lightness, but Olimar has too much range and raw power to be pushed around. He's like Ivysaur, but with far more power, far better/stronger aerial control, far better grabs, far better attacks, far better projectiles, far better camping, and far better awesomeness. That's why he's so good, you need to play with a good Olimar before you make judgements. And I don't mean your kiddy bk friend's Olimar, I mean a tournament-worthy Olimar. I've played against my friend's Olimar with my gimping beast of an MK (my MK is very good, would probably demolish any character you ever use ever) and he goes about even with me.

 

[Morrigan]

Ummm... look at the match up chart and character rankings list...

Oh, know I realize...you based you tier list off of that chart.

 

[jiovanni007]

edit- my good sir jiovanni007.. you have earned my respect. You are an intellegent poster, and make some excellent points... where would YOU put Kirby on my tier list if i may so ask?

Well with the exception of Mario, Ike, IC, and tier arrangement, your tier list mimics mine in the upper portion quite a bit. I would put Kirby in the lower portion of the 3rd tier. He does actually have some really good match-ups higher up, but some characters just do it better (I don't go by the whack match-up chart, I prefer to use logic, my own personal experiences, and evidence present in videos because they have Kirby being disadvantaged to Falco when it is actually quite the opposite). That plus the only counters he has outside of the upper portion of the tier list is Lucas and Ness. Lucas is the only trouble point as he is seeing more play than ever now, and is actually almost in the ranks of Pika, MK, and IC in terms of rapage of Kirby.

Zelda and Pit go down IMO opinion. Zelda doesn't have the tourney proof to place her that high ( I would put her at the bottom of third tier) and Pit doesn't match-up that well to everyone in the higher tiers (I have him 2nd to bottom of third tier and Kirby at 3rd to last in the 3rd tier).

As for the top, while the others you have listed are viable, MK and Snake just rack up so much at tourneys. They are by no means broken in my opinion (except for Snake's utilt it outprioritzes Kirby's bair wtf???) but they rank so much better than the 3rd best which is D3. D3 is almost to their level in competitive play, but not quite high enough to secure a spot in the top tier. In case no one has noticed, D3 is a beast and will continue to win. GaW I believe may overtake the third spot, but he would need a larger following than what he has right now.

 

[Unusual_Rex]

Oh, know I realize...you based you tier list off of that chart.

What else would I base it off? Mario (according to the rankings list) hasn't won a single tournament.