Official BBR Tier List v7

[NickRiddle]

Falcon has 0 priority, Luigi is slow as balls and cant approach, and Ness has a big grab release problem and a lackluster recovery. Could see Ness move up a bit I guess, but Falcon/Luigi have nowhere to go but down imo.



As someone who uses Mario, his down b change has nothing to do with his drop lol. While I do prefer the nado, its mostly due to Marios lack of range and priority.[/cilor]

There is no priority in Brawl, please stop spreading misinformation.

 

[Z'zgashi]

All this time ive been lied too.

/MK sword transcedent priority still OP

 

[DeLux]

I think he means priority in the context of a function of disjoint which is how it's typically expressed in the common vernacular

 

[Z'zgashi]

^ this, only with less big words

 

[infiniteV115]

That's just a poor choice of wording, then.

If you want to talk about a character's disjoint/range...call it disjoint/range O.o

 

[NickRiddle]

All this time ive been lied too.

/MK sword transcedent priority still OP

That is a transcendent move. That is technically priority, but Falcon and Mario can't have worse priority... Because it doesn't work that way.

 

[Vkrm]

It's just context. Since falcon's moves get beat by MK's moves, I dont think it'd wrong to say falcon has generally lower priority.

 

[infiniteV115]

They don't get "beaten", they get outranged. Falcon has ****tier range than MK, Falcon's attacks are slower than MK's, there's no reason to use the word 'priority'.

 

[Z'zgashi]

K, replace every use of priority with disjoint/range.

 

[NickRiddle]

They don't get "beaten", they get outranged. Falcon has ****tier range than MK, Falcon's attacks are slower than MK's, there's no reason to use the word 'priority'.

MKs sword moves are transcendent, and therefore don't interact with anything but hurtboxes... If I wasn't on my phone I would post my video...

 

[infiniteV115]

I know all about MK's moves, Nick. XD
They're all transcendent, except dash attack, glide attack, nado and drill rush, which all have projectile priority. And nado and drill rush act as ground/air moves depending on where MK is.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=327828 Read ppl. READ AND LEARN.

 

[Vkrm]

So they can't clank? They only trade?

 

[NickRiddle]

G:G moves can clank, unless the move is transcendent.

 

[Mekos]

OMG at the Lew brothers!! Yall know what we mean by priority!! Just let it be.

Lucas will ffing throw out a dair and DK will throw out an up air a tiny bit AFTER, and the up air will beat my dair.
Dks up air has more priority than my diar. It beats it.

There are moves in this game that beat other moves. Yes there are moves that clash but there are also moves that straight out beat others. That is what we mean by priority.

All yalls little lingo u use, we are saying the same thing. Let it be.

 

[infiniteV115]

T= Hitbox with Transcendent priority
P = Move with projectile priority
A = Air move
G = Ground move

T: anything = no clash

P: A/G = clash, P:T = no clash

A = clash, A:anything else = no clash

G = clash
G:G = clash unless % difference between moves is 9 or greater, in which case the stronger move continues while cancelling out the other.

And B-moves act as A/G depending on where they're used.

MK's nado is both a B-move with projectile priority. Thus, if MK nados while on the ground, if one of its hits clashes with something (it'll clash with anything that isn't transcendent), nado stops.

In the air, however, that one hit will be cancelled out but the nado continues, so another hit will just hit the opponent, which is why nado is so good. And it's why if you try to hit it with a non-transcendent aerial, you have to aim it to go between the hitboxes.

Not all aerials act as air moves. eg ZSS' nair has projectile priority

Not all projectiles have projectile priority. eg Falco's lasers are transcendent.

Ground moves can have transcendent/projectile priority, but most don't.

Edit: **** you Mekos XD

 

[NickRiddle]

OMG at the Lew brothers!! Yall know what we mean by priority!! Just let it be.

Lucas will ffing throw out a dair and DK will throw out an up air a tiny bit AFTER, and the up air will beat my dair.
Dks up air has more priority than my diar. It beats it.

There are moves in this game that beat other moves. Yes there are moves that clash but there are also moves that straight out beat others. That is what we mean by priority.

All yalls little lingo u use, we are saying the same thing. Let it be.

It either hits in between the hits of your dair, or it outranges it. Those are two very different things that might happen. Say the right terms, or accept that we are going to correct you, or go **** yourself

 

[Z'zgashi]

And I still dont see how me saying Falcon/Mario lack priority is incorrect seeing as they both dont have any Transcendent priority on anything, and other people who do out prioritize them.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

It is still more correct to say they lack range.

 

[Z'zgashi]

But even if they had a disjoint the length of FD, they are still out prioritized.

 

[BSP]

And I still dont see how me saying Falcon/Mario lack priority is incorrect seeing as they both dont have any Transcendent priority on anything, and other people who do out prioritize them.

Mario's cape is transcendent

The range is still balls though

 

[infiniteV115]

Transcendent priority =/= less priority. Transcendent isn't always better.

 

[Z'zgashi]

But cape doesnt make the opponent flinch so i dont count it lol

 

[NickRiddle]

And I still dont see how me saying Falcon/Mario lack priority is incorrect seeing as they both dont have any Transcendent priority on anything, and other people who do out prioritize them.

Transcendent moves, when not disjointed, will trade, like ZSS's dash-attack. They also don't pop projectiles, so they are bad sometimes.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Transcendent moves, when not disjointed, will trade, like ZSS's dash-attack. They also don't pop projectiles, so they are bad sometimes.

right, this is part of the reason certain projectiles are good against Meta Knight when they aren't as good against other characters.

 

[da K.I.D.]

speed of attack also goes into the range/disjoint equation that is commonly refered to as, 'priority'

 

[NickRiddle]

Frame data = priority.
Guess I'm unsubscribing.

 

[infiniteV115]

Yeah except it's not really an equation. More like people just flat out using an incorrect and unnecessary word

 

[da K.I.D.]

I mean, its just an easy way of explaining a more complicated subject.

for the people that understand it, instead of saying, 'oh man, his up air came out with a bigger hit box that came out faster and further away from his body than my down air', its just simpler to say, 'oh, his up air, beat/outprioritised my dair.'

you know whats REALLY unnecessary, is how much of stink you guys are making about it.

 

[NickRiddle]

Saying the correct term is difficult now. Sorry you guys enjoy being vague as **** I guess.

 

[infiniteV115]

"Outspaced" is just as easy to say.
It's actually a lot easier because
-It's 2 syllables shorter
-It's the appropriate word to use in this context

This move outspaced that move. This move is bigger than that move.

Makes a lot more sense than

This move outprioritized that move. This move has more priority than that move.

I mean, what's gonna happen when somebody asks "What do you mean it has more priority?"
You're probably just gonna end up explaining that it's bigger/has more range anyway.

 

[da K.I.D.]

well, if im playing with you specifically for example.

and i try to back air you with sonic, and you SH up air me out of it. and I get mad because ZSSs moves come out faster than sonics, and i say, i hate getting outprioritised all the time, you already know what I mean so HOPEFULLY you would just laugh and say, yea, it sucks for you and move on.

 

[NickRiddle]

I would say it doesn't exist, and I would say my move just came out faster.

 

[da K.I.D.]

always gotta be difficult...

*eyeroll

 

[infiniteV115]

I hit you first.
It's not very complicated to me.

I mean if you were playing Sonic and then a Captain Falcon jumped towards you and initiated a Falcon Punch, and you decided to jab him during the startup, a very simple explanation would be that you hit him first, right?

Or same scenario but you shield instead, would you say your shield outprioritized his Falcon Punch?

 

[Spelt]

always gotta be difficult...

*eyeroll

Nah I think you're the one being difficult in this situation.

Saying outprioritized instead of outspaced is like a definition in a dictionary redirecting you to another definition.

 

[infiniteV115]

Holy ****
Spelt is still alive?

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

I hit you first.
It's not very complicated to me.

I mean if you were playing Sonic and then a Captain Falcon jumped towards you and initiated a Falcon Punch, and you decided to jab him during the startup, a very simple explanation would be that you hit him first, right?

Or same scenario but you shield instead, would you say your shield outprioritized his Falcon Punch?

But Falcon Punch beats shield

 

[infiniteV115]

I think in that situation, the blastzone outprioritized Stroumbert's OoS options, because he hit the blastzone before he was able to do anything out of shield.

amiriteoramirite

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

nope

Punch > Shield

Fact

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Why does this thread have to move overnight? >_>

that's not completely true. Shiek the first 3years, then fox from 07 to present day.

There's never been a dominant Sheik (unless you count M2K), and only a few dominant Foxes for short periods at a time.

In general, the first year or two were up in the air (sheik/marth/fox) - then Ken had his glory, then M2K had his (briefly, but during an important period).

Nah It isn't that bad. U gotta know the back story for that. M2k and I were at Chudats house for that tourney and spent the night.

We played mad friendlies and during the friendlies he asked me what to do in various situations and I taught him.

Then we met in tourney and he did just what I told him.
Basically I taught him how to shut me(my specific mixups and recovery) down and he did. lololol

So... because you had to show him how bad the MU is; it isn't actually that bad?
Match-up inexperience shouldn't be taken into account for MU ratios... >_>