Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Jocario Zero]

I'm surprised at how well they optimized the game - going by an FAQ that I've read on the official site, it's only 18 GB. (by comparison, the PC version is 37 GB, and roughly 40 GB on PS4 and Xbox One) I figured that it wasn't getting a physical version because of how much space it took up, but clearly, that's not the case. (it takes up even less space than Doom (2016)'s Switch version)

Just watching that trailer reminds me of how much fun Doomguy would be in Smash. I don't know how likely it is, but I can dream.

Not having a physical version is a bit disappointing but...dude, this looks so good. I was dreaming hoping for a reveal at the game awards followed by
Doom Slayer as a dlc for smash.

 

[PeridotGX]

Outside of maaaaaybe something at TGA, I wouldn't expect anything major o happen for Nintendo until January/February, TBH. I think Nintendo's pretty much done for the year now that Age of Calamity is out, the Partner Directs are done for now and what NateDrake said a few months back now.

I mean, putting GB/GBA/DS on NSO works as a small last minute incentive to buy Switch Online on Christmas.

 

[PK Duststorm]

Nelson and Dino both bring up good points of discussion. Min min and even moreso Steve required a lot of TLC to be DLC. Out of all the dlc Ultimate has gotten (hell even the sm4sh dlc that wasnt a returning vet), Banjo's stands out.

I've always wondered about the phrase 'Banjo feels like a brawl/64 moveset.' I cant say much about him seemingly fitting another base game roster better, but I can attest to him feeling easier to implement than all other dlc fighters.

I've considered CP8 to be comfort food since Steve was revealed. I've actually prefer the contrary, that CP8 is yet another beast to program. Another evolution of the smash development team. But I certainly wouldn't mind someone who, mechanically, doesnt hold a candle to the last two. Until CP8 is here, I wouldn't base my own speculation on this train of thought yet: that the final four will continue Volume 2's opening with a trend of fighters far more complex than anything before them.

My vote is for a mix. Steve might end up being the nuttiest fighter once all is said and done, but I would not be surprised by one more outrageously complex fighter.

 

[Perkilator]

I'm surprised at how well they optimized the game - going by an FAQ that I've read on the official site, it's only 18 GB. (by comparison, the PC version is 37 GB, and roughly 40 GB on PS4 and Xbox One) I figured that it wasn't getting a physical version because of how much space it took up, but clearly, that's not the case. (it takes up even less space than Doom (2016)'s Switch version)

Just watching that trailer reminds me of how much fun Doomguy would be in Smash. I don't know how likely it is, but I can dream.

If Doom Eternal could be optimized this well, could KH3 be optimized similarly well? (With some necessary downgrades, of course)

 

[SharkLord]

If Doom Eternal could be optimized this well, could KH3 be optimized similarly well? (With some necessary downgrades, of course)

Depends on if Squeenix/Disney are willing to reach out to Panic Button.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I mean, putting GB/GBA/DS on NSO works as a small last minute incentive to buy Switch Online on Christmas.

Especially given that they've been pushing Switch bundles that include free months of the online service.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Do you guys agree with How Joker and Byleth were implemented, since it seems their movesets more represent the game they are from than the characters themselves?

Joker doesn't represent anything about how P5 plays lol

Byleth is alright, but I would've preferred fisticuffs and Divine Pulse because they're both more representative of Byleth and of how Three Houses is played.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Uniqueness is not a competition.

As long as a character can be unique in some way, they're good. Not every character can or should be Steve or Min Min. Smash team doesn't have to one up itself all the time.

 

[Idon]

Do you guys agree with How Joker and Byleth were implemented, since it seems their movesets more represent the game they are from than the characters themselves?

For Joker, I would say that it works pretty well. It's not much representative of Persona 5 gameplay, otherwise Arsene would be doing 90% of the work while Joker barks orders from the backline, but as a means of representing the "style" of Persona 5, it works.
I just wish he wasn't so poorly balanced and that Arsene had more attacks which made him separate from Joker, ala the Persona 4 Arena series, rather than Arsene being ostensibly an attack buff. A cool one mind you, but still relatively restrictive.

For Byleth, I personally think he's super boring and the moveset doesn't really mesh well together. Shoulda used his whipsword in conjuction with brawling and light magic instead of the most simplistic moves of the 4 physical weapon types. Guess you could make the argument the weapon triangle is finally represented at least. Ignoring the fact FE3H doesn't even have the weapon triangle

 

[BlondeLombax]

Smash Bros is coming!

View attachment 293308

Okay why do Peter and Lois's lips synch perfectly to the text I don't understand how people get so lucky

 

[SharkLord]

Do you guys agree with How Joker and Byleth were implemented, since it seems their movesets more represent the game they are from than the characters themselves?

Byleth's pretty fun, though the more that I think about it I feel like a pure whipsword or weapon switching mechanic would've been pretty cool too.

I do not play Persona so I have no say in the matter with Joker

 

[cashregister9]

Do you guys agree with How Joker and Byleth were implemented, since it seems their movesets more represent the game they are from than the characters themselves?

I've always thought that Byleth represents Fire Emblem: Three Houses as a whole decently but does not represent Byleth very well

The star of Persona 5 is the style so Joker mainly being inspired by the style of Persona 5 makes sense and fits for Joker.

 

[MooMew64]

I mean, putting GB/GBA/DS on NSO works as a small last minute incentive to buy Switch Online on Christmas.

I was more talking about a the odds of a Smash announcement or something like that since Rie posted that tweet talking about a the Direct page getting updated. NSO getting a new console is...Possible, but I could just as easily see them dropping two NES games and something like DKC 3 tomorrow as well.

 

[Megadoomer]

If Doom Eternal could be optimized this well, could KH3 be optimized similarly well? (With some necessary downgrades, of course)

Not sure - I've only played the introduction to Kingdom Hearts 3, so I don't know how intense it is in terms of graphics. (plus, I'm pretty sure that Panic Button employs wizards, given the sort of magic that they'd have to pull to get some of these ports working on the Switch)

 

[SharkLord]

Hey, you want someone to talk about? Let's go with Estelle Bright. Can't have Adol monopolizing the Falcom talk now, can we?

Alright, let's begin. Estelle is an... Uh...

look ys is my specialty not trails help me out here

 

[PK Duststorm]

I'll be honest. Even after lurking through several a conversation regarding Falcom stuff, I am not sold. Neither on smash speculation or interest in their stuff in any form.

 

[Brother AJ]

A little over a week until TGA... I'm excited regardless if we get a reveal. :D

 

[Perkilator]

Not sure - I've only played the introduction to Kingdom Hearts 3, so I don't know how intense it is in terms of graphics. (plus, I'm pretty sure that Panic Button employs wizards, given the sort of magic that they'd have to pull to get some of these ports working on the Switch)

Pretty big, but not too taxing, even on my normal PS4. Not even in the part where

Spoiler

there's a **** ton of Shadows on the screen at once near the end of the game when you use Keyblades of the past to battle them.

 

[Simplythe1]

Is it time for Falcom talk again? :D

 

[ShrimpScampi]

Do you guys agree with How Joker and Byleth were implemented, since it seems their movesets more represent the game they are from than the characters themselves?

To me, the way they did Joker was a good balance of his/Arsene's actual abilities, his general confident attitude, and making a moveset that's cohesive and not too complicated. I agree that a P4A-style move where Arsene attacks on his own would've been cool, but I see that more as another direction they could have taken his moveset than a negative on his actual moveset.

As for Byleth, I like them enough to main them, so yeah lol. Within Three Houses, you can build Byleth a ton of different ways with the different classes, and there's also the choice of which house to teach, so choices are a big deal in that game. So I think having their moveset cast a wide net and cover a bunch of choices by using the Heroes' Relics and the Sword of the Creator makes sense. Not to mention I find their moveset fun to use -- even just looking at the up special, it's super interesting for the different follow-ups you can do off of it. I'm also glad they didn't go with Divine Pulse (partially because I'd rather have the Prince of Persia with a time-reverse mechanic).

 

[cashregister9]

Hey, you want someone to talk about? Let's go with Estelle Bright. Can't have Adol monopolizing the Falcom talk now, can we?

Alright, let's begin. Estelle is an... Uh...

look ys is my specialty not trails help me out here

It's my time to shine cracks fingers

For those who don't know anything:
Estelle is the Protagonist of the Trails in the sky games and is considered the Icon of the Trails series as a whole. Trails of Cold Steel 4 is coming to switch next year in the west. Hajimari No Kiseki just released a couple months ago and Falcom confirmed that a new game is in development and is releasing next year.

Estelle specifically:
She is the first protagonist of the Trails series, she is the most Iconic and makes appearances in every other Trails game. She has a bo-staff and can use Orbal arts which is basically just magic.

Trails Specifically:
Trails as of now seems to be Falcom's current golden child as it sells quite well not only in Japan but other countries as well it is also the series Falcom tends to use in crossovers it has content in Langrisser, Phantasy Star, Monster Hunter, Taiko No Tatsujin ETC.

Also it has Falcom Tunes (tm)

EDIT: For those curious the whole franchise with the Exception of Zero, Azure and Hajimari no Kiseki are available on Steam. and the Cold Steel series specifically are on PS4, Cold Steel 3 and soon to be 4 are on switch. (although i'd prioritize the Steam versions if you can because CS3 is not a great place to start, The games can run on a potato)

 

[SNEKeater]

Hey, you want someone to talk about? Let's go with Estelle Bright. Can't have Adol monopolizing the Falcom talk now, can we?

Alright, let's begin. Estelle is an... Uh...

look ys is my specialty not trails help me out here

You must only know one thing about her. If it's her birthday, don't give her a boy as a present:

Well, she's also weak to kicks, I guess:

I'll be honest. Even after lurking through several a conversation regarding Falcom stuff, I am not sold. Neither on smash speculation or interest in their stuff in any form.

That's fair. Not everyone has to like or feel interest in every character or series. Sometimes the thread discusses characters I'm not really into or series that I'm not really an expert of, and that's okay.

 

[7NATOR]

I got to be honest

When I think of Falcom in Smash, at least these days, I always Pair It against Tales of because Falcom's Signature franchise is the Y's Series, which is an ARPG just like Tales of

Taking that into Account, Part of me does find it a Little hard believe Y's getting in Over Tales of, Especially since the Latter Series Has been one of the most Consistently Requested Franchise to get into the game, and That Tales of I believe is the 3rd biggest RPG in Japan (Or I think Kingdom Hearts beat it Actually, Perhaps Persona too)

Granted, Trails of is also a Pillar to Consider, Especially Cold Steel since that Particular Sub-Series has gotten alot of Fans into Falcom and such, and those games have been prominent on Switch Lately. Trails I Believe is a JRPG Unlike Y'S and Tales of, which are ARPG's, so Kind of different Audience there.

And Falcom is Completely new company, compared to Namco who's already Represented in the game, so there may be Company Politics advantage in Falcom's Favor (though Namco might also have favor with them Helping developing Smash).

What do you guys think?

 

[PLATINUM7]

Not sure - I've only played the introduction to Kingdom Hearts 3, so I don't know how intense it is in terms of graphics. (plus, I'm pretty sure that Panic Button employs wizards, given the sort of magic that they'd have to pull to get some of these ports working on the Switch)

I'd say it has some high graphical fidelity. You'd have to sacrifice some of that to get it running which is part of the usual visual vs portability you have to decide with for Switch ports. What's a bigger issue is probably more certain performance choke points. The game already pulls some tricks to run, like at one point you can clearly see that enemies in the background are 2D and have half the framerate of everything else.

 

[SNEKeater]

Also it has Falcom Tunes (tm)

I must say, I prefer the opening version of Silver Will, it's beatiful. Though I guess the one you posted it's more fitting for a battle

And I'm not gonna stop posting this arrangement made by Falcom Sound Team jdk of the battle theme from the first game. The first time I heard this version I was like "why I'm listening a Smash Ultimate remix?" lol

 

[SharkLord]

I got to be honest

When I think of Falcom in Smash, at least these days, I always Pair It against Tales of because Falcom's Signature franchise is the Y's Series, which is an ARPG just like Tales of

Taking that into Account, Part of me does find it a Little hard believe Y's getting in Over Tales of, Especially since the Latter Series Has been one of the most Consistently Requested Franchise to get into the game, and That Tales of I believe is the 3rd biggest RPG in Japan (Or I think Kingdom Hearts beat it Actually, Perhaps Persona too)

Granted, Trails of is also a Pillar to Consider, Especially Cold Steel since that Particular Sub-Series has gotten alot of Fans into Falcom and such, and those games have been prominent on Switch Lately. Trails I Believe is a JRPG Unlike Y'S and Tales of, which are ARPG's, so Kind of different Audience there.

And Falcom is Completely new company, compared to Namco who's already Represented in the game, so there may be Company Politics advantage in Falcom's Favor (though Namco might also have favor with them Helping developing Smash).

What do you guys think?

I mean we got two turn-based RPGs back-to-back last pass so...

 

[RileyXY1]

I mean we got two turn-based RPGs back-to-back last pass so...

Even though Persona and Dragon Quest have completely different styles of gameplay.

 

[7NATOR]

I mean we got two turn-based RPGs back-to-back last pass so...

I guess that's true

I Personally Just don't see both Happening in one Pass though

It's hard to explain. It's the same feeling I get with Ryu/Scorpion, Ryu/Dante, Lloyd/Dante, Ryu/Lloyd, Reimu/Geno. Like technically those combinations can happen in the Same pass, But I don't think those Combinations will happen in same pass

 

[SharkLord]

I guess that's true

I Personally Just don't see both Happening in one Pass though

It's hard to explain. It's the same feeling I get with Ryu/Scorpion, Ryu/Dante, Lloyd/Dante, Ryu/Lloyd, Reimu/Geno. Like technically those combinations can happen in the Same pass, But I don't think those Combinations will happen in same pass

Reimu/Geno

That's an oddly specific combo there

 

[SNEKeater]

I got to be honest

When I think of Falcom in Smash, at least these days, I always Pair It against Tales of because Falcom's Signature franchise is the Y's Series, which is an ARPG just like Tales of

Taking that into Account, Part of me does find it a Little hard believe Y's getting in Over Tales of, Especially since the Latter Series Has been one of the most Consistently Requested Franchise to get into the game, and That Tales of I believe is the 3rd biggest RPG in Japan (Or I think Kingdom Hearts beat it Actually, Perhaps Persona too)

Granted, Trails of is also a Pillar to Consider, Especially Cold Steel since that Particular Sub-Series has gotten alot of Fans into Falcom and such, and those games have been prominent on Switch Lately. Trails I Believe is a JRPG Unlike Y'S and Tales of, which are ARPG's, so Kind of different Audience there.

And Falcom is Completely new company, compared to Namco who's already Represented in the game, so there may be Company Politics advantage in Falcom's Favor (though Namco might also have favor with them Helping developing Smash).

What do you guys think?

I think it's hard to say which one is the flagship franchise of Falcom. Among fans, well, it's hard to tell. From what I've seen so far, I'd say Ys seems to be more popular outside of Japan, with Trails being more popular than Ys in Japan. Wouldn't be surprised if Trails is more popular in the West as well. The quantity of new games in the recent years makes me think the series could have become their first franchise in terms of profits and all.
If we talk about overall sales, we know Trails recently achieved 5 million copies worlwide, while according to Wikipedia Ys was at 4,8 million copies in 2017. Said numbers will have grow since then, so Ys must be their best selling franchise, but it seems that at this rate the Trails series is going to surpass Ys.


About Ys and Tales of, I don't see why both would be competition for each other. I don't think Sakurai or Nintendo make the selection trying to achieve a variety of genres in mind. If that was the case the first Pass would have brought a FPS rep, a puzzle character, a visual novel rep, and so on.

JRPGs are popular, also among Smash fans, so I don't think it would be impossible for Adol and Lloyd (or Yuri) to get in in the same Fighter Pass.

I'm not expecting both getting in so I wouldn't bet on itt, but it could technically happen. We got Joker and Hero as FP1 and FP2...

Even though Persona and Dragon Quest have completely different styles of gameplay.

??? Both are turn based games. Each one has some unique mechanics, as any game, but both are turn based games.

 

[SharkLord]

Even though Persona and Dragon Quest have completely different styles of gameplay.

I mean, so is Ys and Trails. Tales is a sidescrolling, combo-focused RPG with directional inputs, while Ys is more exploration-focused.

 

[RileyXY1]

I mean, so is Ys and Trails. Tales is a sidescrolling, combo-focused RPG with directional inputs, and Ys is more exploration-focused.

Then again, Lloyd is highly unlikely as he was a Smash 4 3rd party Mii Fighter costume and they're probably going to bring his costume back.

 

[7NATOR]

That's an oddly specific combo there

Both of the Characters are heavily based on Projectiles, and Magical Projectiles at that.

While Reimu is More Airbased, and they both overall have Different Techniques, I find it hard that both Geno and Reimu will be in the same Pass personally. Not that it's Impossible, but I think there may be more variance

And we did get 3 JRPGs in FP1, but they are very Different JRPGs

Persona has more of that Flavor, That Spice and is more mature, Dragon Quest is more Traditional and Like the Elder of all RPGs, and Fire Emblem is Fire Emblem, More Tactical, and stuff.

Now Comparing Tales of to Y's, I don't know how different the Flavors are. Perhaps they are different enough, Perhaps not. I don't think it's Impossible for both to get in this same pass, I'm just personally not counting on it

 

[SharkLord]

Then again, Lloyd is highly unlikely as he was a Smash 4 3rd party Mii Fighter costume and they're probably going to bring his costume back.

...I don't see what that has to do with similarities in gameplay?

 

[RileyXY1]

Both of the Characters are heavily based on Projectiles, and Magical Projectiles at that.

While Reimu is More Airbased, and they both overall have Different Techniques, I find it hard that both Geno and Reimu will be in the same Pass personally. Not that it's Impossible, but I think there may be more variance

And we did get 3 JRPGs in FP1, but they are very Different JRPGs

Persona has more of that Flavor, That Spice and is more mature, Dragon Quest is more Traditional and Like the Elder of all RPGs, and Fire Emblem is Fire Emblem, More Tactical, and stuff.

Now Comparing Tales of to Y's, I don't know how different the Flavors are. Perhaps they are different enough, Perhaps not. I don't think it's Impossible for both to get in this same pass, I'm just personally not counting on it

Geno and Reimu's games aren't even of the same genre. One comes from an RPG and the other comes from a shoot em up.

 

[7NATOR]

Geno and Reimu's games aren't even of the same genre. One comes from an RPG and the other comes from a shoot em up.

I get that, I just think in Practice, and being Implemented in smash, Both will Heavily be focused on Projectile Attacks

Now I do think both have different techniques, and both would have different stats, Mechanics, all of that. Despite that, I Personally don't see both being added in the Same pass

The best example I can give is Tracer and Shadow the Hedgehog being in fighter Pass 2. Both have different Techniques, Come from different Genres, appeal to Different Audiences, etc. But Tracer is focused on Time and Space, and Shadow is also Focused on Time and Space, so if Tracer got into Smash, That would be the moment I would give up on Shadow being in Smash Ultimate Personally

 

[SharkLord]

Both of the Characters are heavily based on Projectiles, and Magical Projectiles at that.

While Reimu is More Airbased, and they both overall have Different Techniques, I find it hard that both Geno and Reimu will be in the same Pass personally. Not that it's Impossible, but I think there may be more variance

And we did get 3 JRPGs in FP1, but they are very Different JRPGs

Persona has more of that Flavor, That Spice and is more mature, Dragon Quest is more Traditional and Like the Elder of all RPGs, and Fire Emblem is Fire Emblem, More Tactical, and stuff.

Now Comparing Tales of to Y's, I don't know how different the Flavors are. Perhaps they are different enough, Perhaps not. I don't think it's Impossible for both to get in this same pass, I'm just personally not counting on it

Beyond the fact that paper comes from trees I fail to see the similarities between a wooden puppet with rocket fists and a flying shrine maiden

 

[RileyXY1]

I get that, I just think in Practice, and being Implemented in smash, Both will Heavily be focused on Projectile Attacks

Now I do think both have different techniques, and both would have different stats, Mechanics, all of that. Despite that, I Personally don't see both being added in the Same pass

The best example I can give is Tracer and Shadow the Hedgehog being in fighter Pass 2. Both have different Techniques, Come from different Genres, appeal to Different Audiences, etc. But Tracer is focused on Time and Space, and Shadow is also Focused on Time and Space, so if Tracer got into Smash, That would be the moment I would give up on Shadow being in Smash Ultimate Personally

That is a very ridiculous reason.

 

[7NATOR]

Oh also, if you guys interested, here's a 4Chan leak with a Kill date of Tomorrow

/v/ - Super Smash Bros 12.1.20 - Video Games - 4chan (4channel.org)

Says something about a Teaser for Game Awards in it.

 

[SharkLord]

Well, she's also weak to kicks, I guess:

What Estelle players see when Ganondorf does the forward tilt: