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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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drag0nscythe

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tbf we've already gotten various characters in Ultimate that fit the same description you've made. No one is saying Ryu is a lock but he does have some things pointing towards his favor compared to other characters. Koei Tecmo has had a really good relationship with Nintendo and according to Vergeben they have been in talks with Nintendo over Smash. Ryu has both classic and modern fans thanks to his modern action game reboot, his legacy spans generations. We've also heard Ninja Gaiden has some form of revival coming next year, which fits what Team Ninja said earlier about them being interested in tackling Ninja Gaiden again. Sure he could get mii costumed, but so could every other character so it's kind of a moot point.
All fair arguements, but I see many companies being buddy buddy with Nintendo. Dont think that really matters. And again, the leakers speakith. I dont trust them.

Speaking of Mii costumes, I think we gonna see more NEW AT Mii costumes like Squid Sisters and Bomberman

Shovel Knight is usually agreed upon as likely Mii Costume in future, but what about Waluigi, If he's not Playable like usual...
I want a Shovel Knight mii. that would be awesome.
 

Rie Sonomura

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Speaking of Mii costumes, I think we gonna see more NEW AT Mii costumes like Squid Sisters and Bomberman

Shovel Knight is usually agreed upon as likely Mii Costume in future, but what about Waluigi, If he's not Playable like usual...
The Rathalos armor returning is a given I feel
 

drag0nscythe

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Legacy is selectively important to specific characters, and Hayabusa is one of them where it shines like Mega Man or Simon. It isn't supposed to say "Hayabusa deserves it because of legacy", it's just supposed to say "Hayabusa is a ****ing legend in gaming".


No, I meant Hayabusa was just in other games that weren't his own, like how Terry is in KoF. I agree that it is a Banjo situation in the sense of it being nostalgia, but I don't think Shinobu leaking him less than a day before his reveal had any impact on people wanting him than nostalgia-ridden dudes who have been supporting Banjo for over a decade.

It's fine if you can't fathom why people think Hayabusa is likely or if you think he isn't. But at least recognize what makes people desire him or think he has a shot, whether it be Koei doing stuff in Smash or just the fact that Ninja Gaiden was an extremely successful series with unprecedented praise still years later.
It can be selective. But it falls more to fan demand then anything else. And Ryu is not the same levels of Megaman or Simon. People keep saying that, but I think it is more of them thinking he is more important then he really was.
And it is not fathoming why people want him. I know why people want him. I am saying he is not a shoo-in and that just because a leaker said "maybe" does not mean he is in the FP.

And NG praise..... Outside of Boomers, I dont see many newer gamers jumping to it.
 
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MarioRaccoon

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Speaking of Mii costumes, I think we gonna see more NEW AT Mii costumes like Squid Sisters and Bomberman

Shovel Knight is usually agreed upon as likely Mii Costume in future, but what about Waluigi, If he's not Playable like usual...
I completely agree, its probable that for each new challenger pack, the mii costume wave includes an AT promotion like the cases you mention. I also agree that Shovel Knight would be a no-brainer case. There are 4 CPs left, so 4 more ATs promotions left. Who they can be? Maybe Samurai Goroh (to include more F-Zero) content? Guile? Alucard? Waluigi? Ghirahim? Dr Wright? Rodin?
 

drag0nscythe

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I completely agree, its probable that for each new challenger pack, the mii costume wave includes an AT promotion like the cases you mention. I also agree that Shovel Knight would be a no-brainer case. There are 4 CPs left, so 4 more ATs promotions left. Who they can be? Maybe Samurai Goroh (to include more F-Zero) content? Guile? Alucard? Waluigi? Ghirahim? Dr Wright? Rodin?
Alucard should be playable. Or atleast a mii. that hair needs to be on a Mii.
 

7NATOR

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I completely agree, its probable that for each new challenger pack, the mii costume wave includes an AT promotion like the cases you mention. I also agree that Shovel Knight would be a no-brainer case. There are 4 CPs left, so 4 more ATs promotions left. Who they can be? Maybe Samurai Goroh (to include more F-Zero) content? Guile? Alucard? Waluigi? Ghirahim? Dr Wright? Rodin?
Considering Alucard was considered to be Playable before deciding on Simon/Richter, I think he would be a Mii.

Shovel Knight also is likely, like established, and if not Playable, Waluigi Will Probably get a more Comprehensive Mii costume that's not just a Hat

Lyn should also be a Mii, though I Don't know if that happen because of Lack of Pants

Rodin would be Sick, Just so you could have shades without having to wear Travis's Hair

If Not Playable, I Think a Shadow Costume could work, but that's gonna look more weird than Tails and Knuckles
 

Speed Weed

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I, just want more newer characters in Smash
fam we've gotten 3 newer characters in a row now
Also fun fact I didn't know until I looked this up, Strider actually originally debuted in May 1988 in a manga before Hayabusa, so I wonder if he's even eligible as a non video game originating character...
good_question.jpg

strider is weird cause while yes, he did technically originate in a manga, the game isn't really like a simple licensed adaptation in the vein of sayyyyyyy simpsons hit & run or the witcher 3 or whatever so much as both the manga and game were planned to be a thing from the start as part of a multimedia deal between capcom and moto kikaku (the company responsible for the manga). and he does consistently still show up in capcom stuff to this day meanwhile the manga has long ended

so like it's legitimately up for debate whether he can be considered a video game character or not. people often bring up geralt as the big mystery of "would this character be eligible?" but i think strider is the bigger grey area actually
 

Rie Sonomura

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How about FS/Victory Screen cameos?

Proto Man has a costume and he appears in Mega Man’s FS. I kinda expect Bass, Tom Nook (Isabelle-esque hat), Kumatora, Poo, maybe Mecha-Fiora? Much as I’d prefer her to be playable but if I must sacrifice her to get Elma, so be it
 
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RGFS

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Y'all jump on the bandwagon for Travis one time and now everyone's gonna be a Mii costume. :4pacman:


You're going to have to give me a few hours of dedication if you want me to give you a bootleg Smashboards article, but the gist is that Mortal Kombat isn't banned in Japan as people online, and for some reason Wikipedia still, claim. You can get MK11 in Japan, it just isn't localized. Mortal Kombat is a juggernaut of the fighting game genre and influential to many other game series. Easiest one off the top of my head is SamSho, it wouldn't exist without MK. Sometimes I question whether people see Smash as a celebration of gaming or a celebration of gaming from Japan specifically to pretend other games don't exist. :dizzy:
I see, I'd personally like to see this bootleg article. Do normal Japanese stores sell the game or are you just allowed to buy the American version and ship it? I know of MK's importance, that's why I felt he was likely in the same exact spot Terry ended up happening until I heard of the lack of popularity in Japan alongside the fact that it doesn't get localized. To me, being banned or not actually localized are very similar smoking guns that even hurt characters like those of Level-5.

I would consider MK one of the top series on my list of wanting to see them in Smash but the lack of even what seems like a niche MK fanbase in Japan really makes me count it out in terms of Nintendo even thinking about it. I want to be wrong about that since I believe Scorpion can work flawlessly with characters like Ridley and Roy already being fire loving stab boys.

Again another oddity for me could be the idea that Nintendo may feel their fighting game character quota got filled with Min Min. Sure, Nintendo can never have enough JRPG but that's more reflecting Japan's love for JRPG series. Sakurai has prioritized worldwide popularity first but I'm not sure if there's one series in Smash without at least a semi-decent Japan following. Even with Japan liking fighting games, what if a different fighting game series comes in and finishes Scorpion? I always could imagine Heihachi doing so but he came back as a costume with Min Min. Maybe even Soul Calibur get's prioritized?
 

chocolatejr9

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Man, Smash really is something huh?

We have music in Ultimate that originated in an EarthBound ROM hack:


AND a parody of a ****ing CREEPYPASTA:



It just kinda blows my mind how expansive Smash has become over the years.
For the longest time, I thought Slenderman was a video game character. That probably says a lot about me...
 

Mushroomguy12

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Speaking of Mii costumes, I think we gonna see more NEW AT Mii costumes like Squid Sisters and Bomberman

Shovel Knight is usually agreed upon as likely Mii Costume in future, but what about Waluigi, If he's not Playable like usual...
I completely agree, its probable that for each new challenger pack, the mii costume wave includes an AT promotion like the cases you mention. I also agree that Shovel Knight would be a no-brainer case. There are 4 CPs left, so 4 more ATs promotions left. Who they can be? Maybe Samurai Goroh (to include more F-Zero) content? Guile? Alucard? Waluigi? Ghirahim? Dr Wright? Rodin?
Considering Alucard was considered to be Playable before deciding on Simon/Richter, I think he would be a Mii.

Shovel Knight also is likely, like established, and if not Playable, Waluigi Will Probably get a more Comprehensive Mii costume that's not just a Hat

Lyn should also be a Mii, though I Don't know if that happen because of Lack of Pants

Rodin would be Sick, Just so you could have shades without having to wear Travis's Hair

If Not Playable, I Think a Shadow Costume could work, but that's gonna look more weird than Tails and Knuckles
Krystal Mii so furries can re-enact their real life costumes.

Star Fox - Krystal Cosplay | Anthro furry, Furry art, Fursuit furry
 
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RGFS

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It can be selective. But it falls more to fan demand then anything else. And Ryu is not the same levels of Megaman or Simon. People keep saying that, but I think it is more of them thinking he is more important then he really was.
And it is not fathoming why people want him. I know why people want him. I am saying he is not a shoo-in and that just because a leaker said "maybe" does not mean he is in the FP.

And NG praise..... Outside of Boomers, I dont see many newer gamers jumping to it.
Tbh I like the idea of Hayabusa but I can't think of a really standout moveset for him personally other than switching between a sword and ninja moves which isn't very interesting or exciting for the Smash roster. That doesn't really matter as much as him being fun to play but maybe that's one of the things holding him back in my mind.

I do see the Contra guys as a bit more iconic when compared to Hayabusa. Even simple things like the Contra code have has such an impact to pop culture. More unique potential too as a more down to earth or even sci-fi gunner. Hayabusa almost feels like the 7th wheel behind characters like Mario, Link, Samus, Mega Man, Simon, and Contra. The fact that he can show up in a list like that at all does at least say something about him I feel.
 

SneakyLink

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Krystal Mii so furries can re-enact their real life costumes.

Star Fox - Krystal Cosplay | Anthro furry, Furry art, Fursuit furry
1. Some cosplayers seem to go far no?
2. On the topic of assist trophies as Mii Costumes, how about Sheriff? Could probably work as a Gunner in a similar manner to the Minecraft costumes.
 

SKX31

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Y'all jump on the bandwagon for Travis one time and now everyone's gonna be a Mii costume. :4pacman:


You're going to have to give me a few hours of dedication if you want me to give you a bootleg Smashboards article, but the gist is that Mortal Kombat isn't banned in Japan as people online, and for some reason Wikipedia still, claim. You can get MK11 in Japan, it just isn't localized. Mortal Kombat is a juggernaut of the fighting game genre and influential to many other game series. Easiest one off the top of my head is SamSho, it wouldn't exist without MK. Sometimes I question whether people see Smash as a celebration of gaming or a celebration of gaming from Japan specifically to pretend other games don't exist. :dizzy:
I see, I'd personally like to see this bootleg article. Do normal Japanese stores sell the game or are you just allowed to buy the American version and ship it? I know of MK's importance, that's why I felt he was likely in the same exact spot Terry ended up happening until I heard of the lack of popularity in Japan alongside the fact that it doesn't get localized. To me, being banned or not actually localized are very similar smoking guns that even hurt characters like those of Level-5.

I would consider MK one of the top series on my list of wanting to see them in Smash but the lack of even what seems like a niche MK fanbase in Japan really makes me count it out in terms of Nintendo even thinking about it. I want to be wrong about that since I believe Scorpion can work flawlessly with characters like Ridley and Roy already being fire loving stab boys.

Again another oddity for me could be the idea that Nintendo may feel their fighting game character quota got filled with Min Min. Sure, Nintendo can never have enough JRPG but that's more reflecting Japan's love for JRPG series. Sakurai has prioritized worldwide popularity first but I'm not sure if there's one series in Smash without at least a semi-decent Japan following. Even with Japan liking fighting games, what if a different fighting game series comes in and finishes Scorpion? I always could imagine Heihachi doing so but he came back as a costume with Min Min. Maybe even Soul Calibur get's prioritized?
This is exactly why I've come around to the idea that a Mortal Kombat anime / OVA needs to be a thing.

Norio Wakamoto as Shao Kahn or bust.

While I do agree that MK is currently a major underdog, I don't think it's entirely out of it (depending on how Sakurai views Soul Calibur / Guilty Gear / other fighting games as well as MK). Yes, it not getting games released officially in Japan is a major roadblock, but I don't consider it insurmountable when other forms of entertainment don't have as strong of a "barrier" whether culturally or within the regulations. EDIT: Japanese releases of RE games have to censor the blood and such under CERO's recomendations, so it's not just imported games that are affected. There's a long history of very gory animes for example (even as IIRC they're also strongly considered adult-only within the general Japanese culture).

If MK is to be picked, then Sakurai / Nintendo will probably choose it due to its connections with SamSho and how absurdly impactful it was during its 90s heyday. Also, the sheer shock value.
 
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latsmash

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Contra is ultimately more popular than Ninja Gaiden I'd imagine, although these are one of these few situations where the "fun to play" aspect actually comes into effect.
 

NonSpecificGuy

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"Hayabusa hasn't been in a game for years."
Literally a couple of days ago:
People don’t realize that the team that makes Ninja Gaiden made the Nioh games. Jin Hayabusa was in Nioh 1 and Ren Hayabusa is in Nioh 2. It’s clear they still have plans for Ninja Gaiden
 

Cutie Gwen

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Is it weird that I picture Hayabusa playing like Captain Falcon with a sword?
Not really, Falcon's shtick is being fast but his big weakness is his disadvantage, a crap disadvantage would reflect difficulty of the original game like how the Belmonts have godawful mobility and recovery options
 

SKX31

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Is it weird that I picture Hayabusa playing like Captain Falcon with a sword?
Well, Hayabusa is japanese for Peregrine Falcon, no? :4pacman:

Oh no.

Not another character with an Armored Side-B -> Bunch of aerial nonsense with fastfalls / instant double jumps -> Stylish finisher.

:4pacman:

Not really, Falcon's shtick is being fast but his big weakness is his disadvantage, a crap disadvantage would reflect difficulty of the original game like how the Belmonts have godawful mobility and recovery options
I do picture Hayabusa as somewhat of a ZSS / Greninja combination - incredibly mobile, got some ranged pressure to him and solid aerials allowing a solid combo game; pretty light though, might not have as good ground attacks and might not have the best out of shield options.
 
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RGFS

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Contra is ultimately more popular than Ninja Gaiden I'd imagine, although these are one of these few situations where the "fun to play" aspect actually comes into effect.
I'm someone who believes any character you could think of can either be made fun by the Smash fanbase or Sakurai himself. In my opinion it comes down to the popularity (objective or fan demand to a slight lesser extent), critical acclaim, Nintendo's relationship (either praise from Sakurai or a relationship with Nintendo trying to blossom more), and potential (either for expanding Smash's reach, representation, uniqueness, or impact).

Multiple characters check boxes this way but I'm sure some check boxes harder than others like comparing Crash to someone like Spyro as an example. The way to get into Smash isn't about one yes or no question, it's more like multiple factors and how well they would score in those conditions in Nintendo and Sakurai's mind.

Sakurai and Nintendo know what they're doing every character seems like the best pick so far so I have almost full faith that I'll end up understanding or realizing how solid whatever picks are made by them at the end of this pass whether I even if I don't know or care about the characters.

Is it weird that I picture Hayabusa playing like Captain Falcon with a sword?
I really like that idea of Hayabusa with that archetype instead of just the Sheik/Greninja one
 
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SKX31

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every swordsman is an anime swordsman they're ****ing japanese characters
Wait, is Steve an anime swordsman now?

After Ganondorf being slower-but-stronger Falcon, we get Hayabusa as a faster-and-combo-focused Falcon.

Wait...
Hayabusa mains are going to make their opponents feel like they're constantly heckled by a bunch of eagles. Except said bunch of eagles is just one character. And then the opponents get spiked in the most Ninja Gaiden fashion possible.
 

Dinoman96

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You know, all the bird jokes about Hayabusa remind me of how we don't have anything resembling one of the most iconic enemy pattern in gaming.
View attachment 289675

Seriously why the hell don't we have a Medusa head fly around like that in the game
As far as Dracula's Castle is concerned, I think Sakurai and his team really took to heart regarding the complaints about how too gimmicky and wild Smash 4's stages were. Pretty much all the new Ultimate stages are way more tamer in design.

Like I imagine that if Banjo & Kazooie were newcomers in Smash 4, Gruntilda would of been a full blown abtrusive stage boss on Spiral Mountain, just like Yellow Devil on Wily Castle. Likewise, had Simon been there, Dracula's Castle would of probably featured a lot more hazards.
 
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Cutie Gwen

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TBH after the 8chan fiasco from last year,


As far as Dracula's Castle is concerned, I think Sakurai and his team really took to heart regarding the complaints about how too gimmicky and wild Smash 4's stages were. Pretty much all the new Ultimate stages are way more tamer in design.

Like I imagine that if Banjo & Kazooie were newcomers in Smash 4, Gruntilda would of been a full blown abtrusive stage boss on Spiral Mountain just like Yellow Devil. Likewise, had Simon been there, Dracula's Castle would of probably featured a lot more hazards.
I don't even need a hazard in particular for that, I'd be happy seeing some fly around in the back
 
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