Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Swamp Sensei]

And for some reason, people often see Roy as more unique from Marth in this game specifically. So who knows, maybe the render really does have something to do with how people view the character.

I think that's due to Roy playing VERY different from Marth.

They don't even have the same gameplan anymore.

 

[snowgolem]

I think that's due to Roy playing VERY different from Marth.

They don't even have the same gameplan anymore.

Fair enough, you’re probably right.
Either way, I’m pretty sure we can agree the rest of them suck and could’ve been way better.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Fair enough, you’re probably right.
Either way, I’m pretty sure we can agree the rest of them suck and could’ve been way better.

Render wise?

Eh I dunno, I kind of like Marth, Lucina and Male Corrin's poses. They look regal and defined.

Female Robin's got a weird neck though.

 

[N3ON]

Without getting into this deeply, I still feel as if you are greatly oversimplifying a great problem within the community, and no: You would not be envious of the circles that I and others had to contend with. It might be easy for you to think that, and tell people like me that it's our job to step back, but I wouldn't wish what I've endured on anyone. I know that you yourself are not actively looking to contribute to that problem, but I still think you fail to realize just how deep it goes. It's regrettable to me because I really appreciate the honest dialog you're trying to have about the subject, but with my physical handicap I cannot engage in a lengthy response to your points. I can only tell you that until you have received doxing threats because if the character you support in a children's video game, or had to council others over the grief caused by the way their support is mocked, you will never fully be able to understand. Your assertion that there was never any direct links to the four characters made by people simply isn't true. There was, for the longest time, a prevailing school of thought that insisted those four fanbases together were to be rightly shunned, mocked, and rejected because no "Sensible" Smash player would root for them. I'll double down on what I said: Supporting Ridley, K Rool etc was not "Fun" - it was not something I wish on the fan base of any character not in the game by now, and if you really feel like you haven't experienced that, more power to you. I have entire discords of people who wish they could say the same. It isn't our faults, either, We don't choose to let these things happen. It happens because there is a vile part of the culture around Smash that makes it okay. I know you can't control that and aren't trying to add to it, but I think you are in a sense trivializing what people go through when you assert that " X had a longer shot than Y" etc.

Again, if it seems like im glossing over your points its not because im trying to undermine you intentionally, It's because I physically can't answer it all so I have to summarize my thoughts in general. It is my position that we have not reached a point of true tolerance in this community and it has a long way to go in addressing these things. I realize there is a difference between honest discussion and exclusion, but the fact remains those things aren't always so easy to differentiate between and I feel that you are still downplaying how big of a problem it is, even if you may not be intending to.

I also realize that this has veered off from the discussion of the selection process and I'm sorry for that. It all just ties into this subject for me and I happen to be very passionate about it. I'm sorry I haven't been able to address you as effectively as I want. Please don't take this as me not having an argument or as an unwillingness to have a dialog. Like I said, this discussion is personally important to me but i'm just not capable of building a sufficient response. I encourage someone else--anyone--to better explain what i'm trying to say. I know someone out there has to understand and can word it better than I.

It's kinda funny that earlier you were accusing me of gate-keeping when now, apparently, I've not been doxxed enough to render a valid opinion. Unfortunately though, I'm going to share it anyway.

Look, if it's not "fun", if you're not getting enjoyment out of it - if it's, in fact, a detriment to your well-being, stop. It's not an obligation, it's not essential, it's not your livelihood. It's a pastime. All of this, all of this, is superfluous. It's not brave to jeopardize yourself over a video game, an optional crusade that eats away at your welfare for the sake of sticking by a fictional character is not worth lauding. It's myopic. You want to be the bigger person by being stalwart in the face of haters, be the even bigger person and don't hinder your psyche over randoms on the internet.

All the Ridley, K. Rool and Banjo fans could've just dropped a vote for their character on the ballot and bounced completely, and they'd still have wound up in the same position. Sakurai already knows Geno is popular, sticking it out is great if you're enjoying yourself, but if you're not, it's foolhardy.

And I know there's a... unique perspective inside your thread, but there's a pretty different vantage from all the other angles. You know how when you're super close to something you can only see what's right in front of your face, but when you pull back a bit you can see the whole picture?

Ultimately, people do face needless jeering in the fanbase, sometimes a lot, but I'm not capable of expunging negativity off the internet en masse. None of us are. What we are capable of, however, is autonomy, and anyone can leave at any time for any reason. You don't have to deal with the fanbase; exposure is optional. And mental health is a better reason to leave than a character is to stay.

 

[snowgolem]

Render wise?

Eh I dunno, I kind of like Marth, Lucina and Male Corrin's poses. They look regal and defined.

Female Robin's got a weird neck though.

Suck wasn’t the right word to use, since that’s just my opinion. But either way, I find them boring.
Yes, they look regal, but they could’ve done something with it. Again, they’re just standing there. With swords. I honestly would’ve preferred them just use their taunts as a base for their render. That would’ve looked more dynamic imo.
Like, Marth’s side taunt could’ve made a good dynamic-ish render.
And looking back at the old renders too, they have always been like this. 99% just standing with swords. You’d think that in Ultimate, where characters like Samus are getting a much-needed render upgrade, that they’d upgrade some of the Fire Emblem cast too. But no, just Roy. It’s kind of strange seeing all these characters looking ready for battle, and then Marth.. just standing there..

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Something that just occurred to me: even if Ridley was the base for Banjo

This is the first I've heard of this, though now I'm imagining what THAT crossover would entail.

I always found the "Ridley's too big" argument preposterous.
Ridley's always had a randomish size like Bowser ranging from barely bigger than the protagonist to big as a building.
The only characters I see as "too big" are characters the size of continents like Andross or Bionis.

I actually came up with a moveset concept for Metal Face once upon a time. It was spoilery, but it was essentially a Rosalina/Luma fighter with a weaker puppetmaster controlling a giant robot that attacks from the background of the stage.

Also I'm just waiting for all the Andross/Mother Brain fans to crawl out of the woodwork in support for them in Smash.

 

[MattOnwheels]

It's kinda funny that earlier you were accusing me of gate-keeping when now, apparently, I've not been doxxed enough to render a valid opinion. Unfortunately though, I'm going to share it anyway.

Look, if it's not "fun", if you're not getting enjoyment out of it - if it's, in fact, a detriment to your well-being, stop. It's not an obligation, it's not essential, it's not your livelihood. It's a pastime. All of this, all of this, is superfluous. It's not brave to jeopardize yourself over a video game, an optional crusade that eats away at your welfare for the sake of sticking by a fictional character is not worth lauding. It's myopic. You want to be the bigger person by being stalwart in the face of haters, be the even bigger person and don't hinder your psyche over randoms on the internet.

All the Ridley, K. Rool and Banjo fans could've just dropped a vote for their character on the ballot and bounced completely, and they'd still have wound up in the same position. Sakurai already knows Geno is popular, sticking it out is great if you're enjoying yourself, but if you're not, it's foolhardy.

And I know there's a... unique perspective inside your thread, but there's a pretty different vantage from all the other angles. You know how when you're super close to something you can only see what's right in front of your face, but when you pull back a bit you can see the whole picture?

Ultimately, people do face needless jeering in the fanbase, sometimes a lot, but I'm not capable of expunging negativity off the internet en masse. None of us are. What we are capable of, however, is autonomy, and anyone can leave at any time for any reason. You don't have to deal with the fanbase; exposure is optional. And mental health is a better reason to leave than a character is to stay.

I'm not saying you can't have an opinion. I'm just saying that it's hard for me to explain to you the extent of this problem from my point of view and it's not likely you will be able to see it the way I do. Im not trying to shut down your right to an opinion. I just think It's far too easy an answer to say it's our fault for getting invested and to simply "Walk away" and that would make everything easier. We need to examine why these things happen in the first place and strive to be better people. I think at the very least the fact we're having this discussion is a positive, THAT'S how change is going to be brought about.

I really don't want to seem like I'm shutting you down. Again, thats not what I'm going for here. I just disagree with your evaluation of the problem. I want you to feel free to disagree with me. All Im saying by bringing up being doxed was that I can't hope to accurately share to you my perspective. Ultimately yes, we can walk away, but it doesn't mean there isn't a problem to be addressed. Thats all.

I really do appreciate this conversation. Im not good at this. I'm trying my best not to seem like a nutcase but im not good at explaining myself and im sorry if im coming off as rude. Im only saying all this because I want to be understood but I feel like the more I talk the worse I sound.

 

[Ben Holt]

This is the first I've heard of this, though now I'm imagining what THAT crossover would entail.


View attachment 280293

I actually came up with a moveset concept for Metal Face once upon a time. It was spoilery, but it was essentially a Rosalina/Luma fighter with a weaker puppetmaster controlling a giant robot that attacks from the background of the stage.

Also I'm just waiting for all the Andross/Mother Brain fans to crawl out of the woodwork in support for them in Smash.

Mother Brain is also kinda... immobile.
Or at least the version used in Smash.
Though Super Metroid Mother Brain isn't the worst idea, but I actually think the next Metroid fighter should be The Baby.
I used to think that floating characters were out given that Smash involves falling, but Mewtwo, Dark Samus, etc.
Give us The Baby!

But back to important big characters, can I get a Wispy Woods?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

One the topic of news drought not belonging here, I'm genuinely surprised people aren't using that time to play new games to the point they find new characters they'd want alongside enjoying themselves. Just yesterday I started playing CastleVania Bloodlines and I'm really enjoying Eric Lecarde, he'd even be a surprisingly easy fit for Smash as he uses a lance and has potential for different specials as his versions of the cross and holy water work differently to Belmont's versions. For his final smash, his level 3 subweapon that fills the screen with green orbs sounds perfect

 

[Ben Holt]

One the topic of news drought not belonging here, I'm genuinely surprised people aren't using that time to play new games to the point they find new characters they'd want alongside enjoying themselves. Just yesterday I started playing CastleVania Bloodlines and I'm really enjoying Eric Lecarde, he'd even be a surprisingly easy fit for Smash as he uses a lance and has potential for different specials as his versions of the cross and holy water work differently to Belmont's versions. For his final smash, his level 3 subweapon that fills the screen with green orbs sounds perfect

I got a feeling I know where you got that game!

Note to self: Don't forget to get a better TV stand when this COVID s*** is over.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I got a feeling I know where you got that game!
View attachment 280296

Note to self: Don't forget to get a better TV stand when this COVID s*** is over.

What's this 'genesis' bull**** this is a Mega Drive household

I got it on the collection, it was discounted to 4.99 and I had like 300 gold coins, money well spent

 

[Ben Holt]

What's this 'genesis' bull**** this is a Mega Drive household

I got it on the collection, it was discounted to 4.99 and I had like 300 gold coins, money well spent

You gotta realize that the Master System sold poorly in the States, so the Mega Drive was a new beginning for Sega here, a Genesis, if you will.

And yes, if you got that collection for 5 bucks, that's a steal. I got mine on launch because I'm a nerd and a 90s kid who loves Castlevania.

Honestly, I wish Castlevania had become like God of War when it entered the 3D era. Then it'd probably still be a system selling franchise.

 

[GoodGrief741]

No more leaker ****. I've had enough of hearing what leakers said for the next year. The continual cycle of "x said this about a Direct soon!" and hype skyrocketing only to crash down has gotten old fast.

How about we just wait until we get news and be happy with what we get?

I want leakers to warn me of this kinda **** though. Unlike many people online, I did listen to the leaks and tempered expectations before that last Direct, saved myself the disappointment. Leaks can be helpful too.

Fun Fact: What a lot of people don't know is that Activision was a finalist on acquiring Rare and it actually was very close to happening, But the deal fell apart last minute then Microsoft floored Rare with that mega sized offer, Swooped in and scooped them up.

I nearly called this the worst timeline but then I realized that with how Crash and Spyro turned out, Banjo-Threeie would probably be a thing under Activision.

Now I'm sad.

Man even after we've gotten three of the most requested characters ever, people are still not satisfied or happy...

Weird how people want more characters in the game that's already sold 5 more characters

 

[MattOnwheels]

I apologize, all. I just...there's so much I want to say on the subject and I feel it;s important because the issue is being grossly misrepresented I feel, and I have no way of putting it in the proper light. It's making me upset. Im sorry I can't convey my positions more effectively. It tares me up more than I can say.

 

[ZelDan]

I definitely have enough games as is to keep me busy. I'm on my second playthrough of Trails of Mana and will likely do a third just to see all 3 different paths. I still have stuff liek Bug fables and Spongebob: BFBB in the backlog. I'm playing through Bloodstained: Curse of the Moon 2.

And this isn't even counting Persona 4 Golden PC is in my backlog and I know that one will be an investment.

So while I'm not going to run out of games anytime soon, it still would be nice to know what I can look forward to in the future.

 

[Ben Holt]

I apologize, all. I just...there's so much I want to say on the subject and I feel it;s important because the issue is being grossly misrepresented I feel, and I have no way of putting it in the proper light. It's making me upset. Im sorry I can't convey my positions more effectively. It tares me up more than I can say.

I'll take your side, amigo. I think I understand what you're saying. People get really worked up over video games, and saying "It's unhealthy to get upset over trivial things like video games" is very unhelpful.
Hell, I remember just last year that I had a LONG depressive spell over Pokémon Sword and Shield sucking so much. I knew it was irrational to be upset over a video game, but people are all different with different hobbies and passions. We all have escapes from our worlds, and video games are not an uncommon escape.
I've loved Pokémon since I was 4 years old when Pokémon Red and Blue first came to the United States, and for Sword and Shield to not only be made cheaply, worse looking than Pokémom Battle Revolution on the Wii, and cutting all the post-game content that has been slowly being cut ever since Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire scrapped the Battle Frontier...
All that dumb **** in addition to cutting out HALF the f***ing Pokémon in the series! Goddamn did it hit me in the gut when I needed it to drag me out of real life's depression.
I understand you 149%. Feelings aren't always rational. I know that N3ON speaks in a very eloquent, mean-sounding manner, but I don't think she actually means any malice.

The Smash community, just like any other large community can be toxic. Whether it's you being doxxed or the giant sexual abuse scandal that was brought to light recently, bad behaviors mustn't be tolerated.

 

[MattOnwheels]

I'll take your side, amigo. I think I understand what you're saying. People get really worked up over video games, and saying "It's unhealthy to get upset over trivial things like video games" is very unhelpful.
Hell, I remember just last year that I had a LONG depressive spell over Pokémon Sword and Shield sucking so much. I knew it was irrational to be upset over a video game, but people are all different with different hobbies and passions. We all have escapes from our worlds, and video games are not an uncommon escape.
I've loved Pokémon since I was 4 years old when Pokémon Red and Blue first came to the United States, and for Sword and Shield to not only be made cheaply, worse looking than Pokémom Battle Revolution on the Wii, and cutting all the post-game content that has been slowly being cut ever since Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire scrapped the Battle Frontier...
All that dumb **** in addition to cutting out HALF the f***ing Pokémon in the series! Goddamn did it hit me in the gut when I needed it to drag me out of real life's depression.
I understand you 149%. Feelings aren't always rational. I know that N3ON speaks in a very eloquent, mean-sounding manner, but I don't think she actually means any malice.

The Smash community, just like any other large community can be toxic. Whether it's you being doxxed or the giant sexual abuse scandal that was brought to light recently, bad behaviors mustn't be tolerated.

Oh my god, thank you. Just...Thank you...I needed this.

Edit: But I need to say, N3on is alright. She's not being mean so much as I can't properly explain to her what I'm trying to say. I do disagree with her simplification of the issue but its not her fault. A lot of people take her position as a default stance. I think it, too, can be unhealthy though. However, She's fine. She's trying to help in the way she knows how.

 

[Ben Holt]

Oh my god, thank you. Just...Thank you...I needed this.

No problem. I was bullied my entire life. I see myself in others, which is why I always want to stand up for the people whose ideas and feelings can easily be dogpiled upon.
Just understand that in a forum this large, it's easy to take multiple light criticisms as one big criticism, but the individual posters rarely intend malice.

Edit: It's easy to think a person is overreacting to mild criticism, but it's almost always the case that a person isn't sad BECAUSE of trivial things like video games, but they have other life problems, and disappointment from a video game, or other trivial thing like going to a pizzeria to find out that you drove all the way to find out they were closed the day you REALLY wanted pizza (true story) are just the straws that break the camel's back and cause a person's internal unhappiness to manifest.

 

[MattOnwheels]

No problem. I was bullied my entire life. I see myself in others, which is why I always want to stand up for the people whose ideas and feelings can easily be dogpiled upon.
Just understand that in a forum this large, it's easy to take multiple light criticisms as one big criticism, but the individual posters rarely intend malice.

I edited my post but yes, I need to remember that people come from all walks of life here and what works for one won't always be helpful to another, Sometimes, though, all you want is to be understood and it's frustrating when you feel like you can't convey how you feel well enough. I was never good at debate so I realize my arguments are going to seem shallow and without logic to most, but I really do feel strongly about my position. I just suck at making a good case for it. I wanna say again though: N3on means well and I don't blame her for taking my point of view the way she has, It's a common response to this sort of thing and she's only trying to help.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Oh my god, thank you. Just...Thank you...I needed this.

Edit: But I need to say, N3on is alright. She's not being mean so much as I can't properly explain to her what I'm trying to say. I do disagree with her simplification of the issue but its not her fault. A lot of people take her position as a default stance. I think it, too, can be unhealthy though. However, She's fine. She's trying to help in the way she knows how.

I think you're both right in some ways.

You both agree on the big stuff anyways.

 

[zumaddy]

I was doing a tier list ranking Ultimate characters by how much you hate to fight them, and it turns out I only put 11 fighters in the fun category. Oof...

So here's hoping the next character is fun to play and fight against. I find Min Min is the former, but definitely not the latter lol.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I'd be very surprised if we hear any Smash leaks soon given the Law Ninja are now on high alert after L turned out to be real 24 years and 1 month after release.

 

[Mamboo07]

Mother Brain is also kinda... immobile.
Or at least the version used in Smash.
Though Super Metroid Mother Brain isn't the worst idea, but I actually think the next Metroid fighter should be The Baby.
I used to think that floating characters were out given that Smash involves falling, but Mewtwo, Dark Samus, etc.
Give us The Baby!

But back to important big characters, can I get a Wispy Woods?

Mother Brain would be something like this:

(Her scuttling around on mechanical spider legs would be cool, just like Porky's Machine.)

 

[Aetheri]

So weird dream story time.

I dreamt that Pokken Tournament received a few new Pokemon characters. Niether of which were Sword and Shield Pokemon.

Metagross and Tentacruel were the new fighters (honestly not too terrible of picks for the game if ask me) BUT there was an extra couple of "special" fighters that came with them. Fusions. One was a fusion of Metagross and Tentacruel (it probably does not look like what you're thinking), the other...an eldritch horror that was a Fusion of Gengar and Mewtwo.

 

[Deleted member]

If games take up such a huge portion of your lives to the point of getting depressively upset over something not turning out well, then perhaps its time to start expanding your horizons. Games are, and always will be, escapism. Being a fan of something is one thing, but to fall into depression or get sick to your stomach because you feel you 'have to' defend a character is way too much. If your escape can bring on moods like this, then it's not really an escape anymore. Find more than just games to add to your hobbies that way when one fails, you can check into another because this lifestyle some of you are describing is not healthy no matter how you think you can justify it. It is easy to walk away and there's nothing wrong with taking a break for awhile; don't let anyone ever say otherwise.

 

[MattOnwheels]

If games take up such a huge portion of your lives to the point of getting depressively upset over something not turning out well, then perhaps its time to start expanding your horizons. Games are, and always will be, escapism. Being a fan of something is one thing, but to fall into depression or get sick to your stomach because you feel you 'have to' defend a character is way too much. If your escape can bring on moods like this, then it's not really an escape anymore. Find more than just games to add to your hobbies that way when one fails, you can check into another because this lifestyle some of you are describing is not healthy no matter how you think you can justify it. It is easy to walk away and there's nothing wrong with taking a break for awhile; don't let anyone ever say otherwise.

Again, this is not a correct fix to the problem I was talking about. Its far more complex than just choosing to take a break, but I'd like to end the conversation.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Figure I post this. If true a Pokemon rep could be next.

 

[MattOnwheels]

Figure I post this. If true a Pokemon rep could be next.

No offense to the pokemon fans, but it would do nothing for me personally. Still, I can imagine Poke'fans are hype.

 

[Will]

Figure I post this. If true a Pokemon rep could be next.

I literally called this last week.

YouTubers crash through the windows at the sight of this news. They immediately boot-up the AE.

"What's GOOD YouTube, it's ya boi 10k Subscriber Big Shot! Today, Pokemon confirmed for Smash through the Online trial?!"

 

[DarthEnderX]

Also I'm just waiting for all the Andross/Mother Brain fans to crawl out of the woodwork in support for them in Smash.

I've supported them for a long time...as Bosses.

 

[PLANTMAN]

Figure I post this. If true a Pokemon rep could be next.

No a Pokémon rep is not next. Because the Pokémon rep is a lock for cp11. gen 8 that is

that’s how logic & business works

 

[Will]

Bro if I can call what videos YouTube speculators are gonna make content or shoddy theories of next, maybe you shouldn't trust it. Because I'm definitely not a trustworthy leaker with valuable Smash information.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I think the only plausible Gen 8 Pokemon I'd like are Rillaboom, Sirfetch'd or Urshifu.

The rest don't do much for me.

 

[WaddleMatt]

Can you imagine the uproar if the next Smash DLC isn't just a character from a recent game but from a ****ing recent DLC. Just feels scummy as **** for them to put a Pokemon from the DLC in.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Can you imagine the uproar if the next Smash DLC isn't just a character from a recent game but from a ****ing recent DLC. Just feels scummy as **** for them to put a Pokemon from the DLC in.

I dunno if its scummy exactly.

We've had characters chosen before their main games all the time. Especially with Pokemon.

Ironically, I think Incineroar is the only one who had his game come out before the decision to use him was made.

 

[Flyboy]

So clearly because of the Splatoon 2 trial we're getting Off The Hook as a duo fighter, right?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

If the next fighter is s Pokemon. Is this a indicator that this pass will be all 1st party or at least most of it? Especially given Nintendo is choosing.

 

[Will]

If the next fighter is s Pokemon. Is this a indicator that this pass will be all 1st party or at least most of it? Especially given Nintendo is choosing.

I don't know man, that's a pretty big "if" considering we're riding on a ****ing trial run to supposedly connect the dots.

 

[Perkilator]

I know this is off topic, but I feel like if Fire Emblem character’s renders had more dynamic poses and variation, people wouldn’t think they’re all so similar.
They have some of the most boring renders in the game. Most of them are just standing there with their weapon. The only dynamic posing is with M!Robin and F!Corrin, and even those aren’t that unique. Seriously, what’s up with that?

I'm not really their renders should be that big of a deal, considering that changing them has no effect on their movesets.

 

[RileyXY1]

Besides, it's not even Sword and Shield that is getting a free trial. It's Pokken Tournament DX.