Newbie Mafia 3 | Jungle Republic | Ovah. Who won?

[Delvro]

Of course, there's not really any way to search for wolves instead of mafia, so why don't we get off that and just go after scum in general.

I really disagree about this, and think that it would be really naive to simply lump up scum and mafia into one group. I think it is entirely possible to determine whether someone is a wolf or a mafia, and I'm willing to bet that the success of the town depends on it.

Instead, you completely took out the parts I was refferencing and tried to make me out as the bad guy, and didn't even acknowledge that you took a good chunk out. Although this would be a good time to demonstrate a finger of suspicion (FOS: formal showing of suspicion without use of a vote), I feel it is a better opportunity to lynch scum. unvote Eric vote: mayling[\b]

Raptor took the words RIGHT out of my mouth.

Ugh... defensiveness...

You've been pushing hard on Mayling when I honestly see no reason for it... and your accusations put her in a "darned if you do darned if you don't situation"... I mean come on, do you expect Mayling to just ignore you? She simply pointed out that your accusations are a little strange...

On that note, I think everyone here is mature enough not to take the things said personally. I'd be really surprised if that became an issue.

Anyway, Roniker's comments about not wanting to discriminate between the two anti-town groups, as well as his hounding of Mayling (it was more than just a vote) is enough to make me the boy who cries wolf.

VOTE RONIKER

 

[Mayling]

"OMGUS???" is what this looked like when i read it.

Raptor took the words RIGHT out of my mouth.

You've been pushing hard on Mayling when I honestly see no reason for it... and your accusations put her in a "darned if you do darned if you don't situation"... I mean come on, do you expect Mayling to just ignore you? She simply pointed out that your accusations are a little strange...

I thought his vote on me was a lil bit of a "OMGUS" too, but I didn't want to vote back in worries that it would seem like an OMGUS on a OMGUS.

Anyways, I'm glad two other people noticed that, too, so it looks less "OMGUS"y when I

VOTE: Ronike

 

[Ronike]

*sigh*

give me an ironclad way to determine who is wolf or mafia.

As for the aggresiveness, frozen already explained that. It gets scum to either crack, or slip up.

 

[Ronike]

God you're kidding me...

I wasn't voting out of Oh My God yoU Suck, I was voting because he did the scummiest thing I can think of

replace all he with she. Sorry, hard to edit on my phone.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Focusing too much on who's a wolf or mafia, especially on Day 1, is going to be extremely hard to do without mass amounts of WIFOM, and will only make you look like Mafia. After all, Mafia will be actively trying to get rid of the wolves, as they pose more of a threat to them than town does.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

3rd Vote Count

----------

Xiivi (1) - Tom
Mister Eric (2) - frozenflame751, Ronike
-Hilt- (3) - Mister Eric, Xiivi, Tandora
Ronike (2) - Delvro, Mayling

Not voting (4): Cello_Marl, soaring-raptor-blast, Sold2, -Hilt-

----------

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch!

 

[Ronike]

Oh, my vote was messed up, huh?

Unvote: Eric Vote: Mayling

 

[DtJ S2n]

I really disagree about this, and think that it would be really naive to simply lump up scum and mafia into one group. I think it is entirely possible to determine whether someone is a wolf or a mafia, and I'm willing to bet that the success of the town depends on it.

You've been pushing hard on Mayling when I honestly see no reason for it... and your accusations put her in a "darned if you do darned if you don't situation"... I mean come on, do you expect Mayling to just ignore you? She simply pointed out that your accusations are a little strange...

Anyway, Roniker's comments about not wanting to discriminate between the two anti-town groups, as well as his hounding of Mayling (it was more than just a vote) is enough to make me the boy who cries wolf.

VOTE RONIKER

Alright guys I finally got caught up. Sorry for my inactivity.
Greg, or Delvro as the dGamers might know him as. I honestly think you're reasoning for going after Ronike is pretty frail.

I don't see anything particularly wrong with lumping up "scum and mafia". I feel that there are ways to tell the difference between the two, but I also feel that if you concentrate too much on doing it, you're making everything more complicated, and making everything easier for a mislynch. I do have to ask you now though. "Scum and Mafia." Why do you refer to the Mafia by their actual name, but you called the Werewolves scum? That's just odd, to me.

Also, I agree that Ronike may have been harsh, but he's doing his job. Personally, as someone who enjoys playing an aggressive style when needed, I feel he's doing a great job of scumhunting. Mean, true, but effective, also true. I feel he's more pushing for information, than he is for a lynch. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Vote Delvro

I have two questions for you Greg. The one in my second paragraph, and also why do you trust Mayling so much? I feel that you're not looking at(or outright ignoring) the possibility that Ronike is actually right.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

Tom has been prodded

 

[Delvro]

I have two questions for you Greg. The one in my second paragraph, and also why do you trust Mayling so much? I feel that you're not looking at(or outright ignoring) the possibility that Ronike is actually right.

s2 you have completely misunderstood me. I am NOT defending Mayling nor do I trust her at all. It's not a question of Mayling's innocence here, it's a question of Ronike's making an attack without the evidence to back it up (except little quips and his "you're defending yourself" trap). All I did was call him out on it. It has nothing to do with Mayling, I would have done the same had he made a weak argument like that on anyone else.

You, on the other hand, are quite clearly defending Ronike, and I would like to ask you why. Can't he defend himself?

Also, when I refer to scum I mean "Both Mafia and Werewolves". Perhaps you missed the post where we established definitions for that. When I say scum I don't mean just werewolves... that's dumb. The "scum and mafia" comment was a typo.

 

[Xiivi]

give me an ironclad way to determine who is wolf or mafia.

Let's rephrase this as:
"Please explain the thought process behind distinguishing between wolf and mafia on Day 1."
and ask Delvro to answer.

 

[Cello_Marl]

I realize that some of my responses are to somewhat older comments, but I wished to address some of the points made.

Regardless, do you have any backup to this subconscious theory?

There was nothing I saw concerning you that was concrete. But, as an example:

FrozenFlame has modded two games here; Trigun Mafia and Bad Idea.
In Bad Idea, he only wanted people with at least two games worth of experience.
This is completely understandable, considering the content of the game. However,
it does also imply that he would prefer committed players, i.e. ones that stuck around until the end; Ones that are committed.
In Trigun, he much more explicitly stated that he didn't want people who couldn't commit.
To this end, he states:

I'm not posting a How to Play section in here. Either do the reading or don't play...If you aren't going to be an active contributor please reconsider playing this game. I will have a fairly strict policy regarding inactives here. I will not hesitate to replace someone who couldn't give a rats *** about the game with an eager replacement.

Yet, in this game:

As has been said though, replacements can make getting reads on players very difficult, and are especially tumultuous late in the game...though often necessary, {they} do not make for healthy mafia games.

The reason I'm posting examples from games in which he modded is that it offers a clear and unbiased view of his opinions. He clearly does not appreciate inactives who may cause a game to collapse. Yet, here he suggests that removing lurkers may be unhealthy for this game.
I have to wonder what the reason for this is.
It may very well be to clog up the game with other people that he can easily thrust suspicion onto.

It would make more sense from my eyes for one to consciously accuse someone of being the other faction if they are scum.

You are right, of course. You would have plenty of time to think about your plan of action before committing to it.

Keep in mind it's always easy to attack the most vocal players, since they are the ones who put themselves out there after all.

I was unconsciously thinking, "Something to actually pick apart." At this point, these pressure votes are helping to bring people out from the shadows, but we should all make sure we receive responses that satisfy any questions, concerns or complaints each of us have. I think we should start pursuing these much more assertively, by group voting to L-2 or L-3 for each person. Going down the list as the mod has it:

I'm sure Tom's vote on Xiivi isn't serious, and Xiivi's responses address any major concerns I had, so we can skip him, if there are no objections.

Mister Eric's lack of a vote and style were explained, sort of, but I don't know if anyone else had anything else they wanted him to say. I'm still a little curious about that little rhyme, but I guess it's not that substantial.

The votes for Hilt were the most numerous, but they were mostly based on his not speaking much. He brings up a good point:

Focusing too much on who's a wolf or mafia, especially on Day 1...will only make you look like Mafia. After all, Mafia will be actively trying to get rid of the wolves, as they pose more of a threat to them than town does.

Delvro's riding the wolf thing pretty hard in his conversations with Ronike. Actually, I've been doing it myself, too, but I'll admit, in hindsight, my wolf insinuations against Xiivi were a bit farfetched. About Delvro's suggestion that we'll be able to distinguish the types of scum; how could we go about that?
We certainly don't have an "ironclad" method of doing so, but their choice of nightkills will be of use in that determination. Will they kill the experienced players because they can guide town toward effective scum hunting? Will they go for lurkers? If I were one, I'd go for the talkative experienced players. In any event, unless we lynch one of them for some reason, we'll have at least 3 IC players left. Unless they are ALL mafia, then we'll have at least one person who can inform us of important parts of the others' playstyles. Even then, if they were all mafia, they'd still help us get wolves.

Ronike, Mayling, and Delvro are providing ample information. About Delvro at least.

I think we've done all we really can by pressuring those that are active.

In other words, we should move on to Tom or Raptor, since S2 has joined us.

...why do you trust Mayling so much?

I don't think he's trusting of her rolewise, as much as getting a little riled up.
It's Greg. It's the way he is, not the way he plays.

You've been pushing hard on Mayling when I honestly see no reason for it...
...as well as his hounding of Mayling (it was more than just a vote)...

You're coming off as taking that a bit hard, Greg.
Seeming emotional when you make your vote will just take credence away from your
reasoning. Is there anything else you can offer other than this "hounding" of May?

Why do you refer to the Mafia by their actual name, but you called the Werewolves scum? That's just odd, to me.

s2 you have completely misunderstood me. I am NOT defending Mayling...I would have done the same had he made a weak argument like that on anyone else.

You, on the other hand, are quite clearly defending Ronike, and I would like to ask you why. Can't he defend himself?

Perhaps you missed the post where we established definitions for that. When I say scum I don't mean just werewolves... that's dumb.

This is a really unprovoked response. In addition to the fact that I think you are lying about defending anyone else with such tenacity, or at least mistaken, I think you're overreacting to a simple question. He didn't even vote for you.

Also, when I refer to scum I mean "Both Mafia and Werewolves"... The "scum and mafia" comment was a typo.

This typo, which I do believe it was, just implies that you were too heated to re-examine your post properly. You didn't properly cover your tracks; Are you suggesting we should just let that go? Even if you are town, lynching you now will whip the rest of us into shape, and prevent a mislynch at a crucial time.

I'm going to go ahead and vote for Delvro, but we do have 10 more days to gather information if we want to, although it may be wiser to think of it as 6 or 7 so we don't accidently go over time. If most of you think we should pressure Tom and Raptor before we conclude the day, we should. I think it's a good idea.

Vote: Delvro

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Concerning Delvro:

First of all, if you're going to assert that there is a way to concretely distinguish Werewolves from Goons when scumhunting, you need to spell that out. You can't criticize Ronike, myself, or anyone else for that matter for claiming that your claims are unreasonable without providing evidence to show that your claims have merit.

Furthermore, I tend to agree with most of what Cello said about your recent play. He put it best when described your post as an "unprovoked response" and an "overreaction." Not sure if you're simply being an overly vindictive townie or scum feeling the pressure.

@ Cello:

The point you brought up concerning my attitude toward inactives is a grave misinterpretation of what I've said. Neither inactives, nor replacements are healthy for any game of mafia. Ideally, no mafia game would have to deal with such ordeals. However, realistically, inactivity does plague games. The point I was trying to make was that though replacements are by no means good for a game, they are better than inactives. This is the reason why we have them after all.

I in no way meant to suggest we not replace inactives. I was simply stating that both inactives AND replacements make for less than ideal games.

You seem to be digging quite hard to question small things. Not sure what your motivation is in throwing so much doubt on players is. IGMEOY.

But for now, since you (Cello) basically took the words out of my mouth concerning Delvro, that's where I'll be placing my vote for now.

Unvote: Mister Eric Vote: Delvro

 

[Delvro]

So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.

I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.

How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.
I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.

Is there anything else you can offer other than this "hounding" of May?

Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.

This is a really unprovoked response. In addition to the fact that I think you are lying about defending anyone else with such tenacity, or at least mistaken, I think you're overreacting to a simple question. He didn't even vote for you.

Huh? He DID vote for me. Anyway, perhaps my response was a little too heated. The reason for that is cause I feel that s2 is being a hypocrite -- he attacked me for defending Mayling (which I felt was more of an attack on Roniker), but at the same time he was defending Roniker with very little justification other than "hey Greg you're argument sucks". Which I don't think it does.

This typo, which I do believe it was, just implies that you were too heated to re-examine your post properly. You didn't properly cover your tracks; Are you suggesting we should just let that go? Even if you are town, lynching you now will whip the rest of us into shape, and prevent a mislynch at a crucial time.

Do with you want with the typo. But I'm not the only person to have done something like this. You youself point out Xiivii's excessive usage of the word "wolf" rather than "scum", and he has yet to respond to it. However, I don't deny the possibility that you are right.

However, I think the real reason that me and Xiivi have made these typos is because I play a game called "mafia" all the time in which there are mafia and wolves do not exist. Perhaps Xiivi plays a game called "werewolf" in which the only anti-town group are wolves.

 

[Delvro]

Someone stated earlier that Roniker tends to hunt aggressively for wolves. I'm beginning to think that this may have been a simple case of overzealousness. His OMGUS vote still makes me suspicous, but I'll unvote for now.

UNVOTE

Also, I think Xiivi is right... the group as a whole, myself included, are jumping down people's throats because there are only so many people posting. There are a fair amount of people lurking in corners at this point, and I'd really like to see those who have not contributed to do so.

 

[soaring-raptor-blast]

Where you been, whiz? =D

Or have you been doing your usual scum lurking and are carefully covering your butt? XD

lol hello tandora!

I don't lurk >.>

I hunt and peck

peck peck peck

this type of game should be easier for me cause I got lotsa time to peck out my thoughts ^_^

I'm going to go ahead and vote for Delvro, but we do have 10 more days to gather information if we want to, although it may be wiser to think of it as 6 or 7 so we don't accidently go over time. If most of you think we should pressure Tom and Raptor before we conclude the day, we should. I think it's a good idea.

Vote: Delvro

If it'd be easier to ask me some questions or something, rather than pressure voting me, I'll gladly answer any questions or offer my thoughts on whatever. I AM here now btw, so it shouldnt be nessecary ....well.... unless you just want to. O_o

 

[Ronike]

So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.

We are attacking you because you are attacking myself and others for putting down your strategy when you haven't actually put forward a strategy. You've put foward an idea, that while it WOULD be the best possible way, is feasibly impossible.

I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.

Good for you. That still doesn't change the fact that it is impossible to do this on purpose.

How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.

Player Reactions: I can see where you can differentiate scum from town this way, but how EXACTLY would you distinguish mafia from wolf? Kill the people that lynch a mafia member? That's a ridiculous idea.

Voting Patterns: Yes, the mafia has 3 and wolfs have 2. Here's the thing: if the mafia does their job well, only two of them should ever have to be on a lynch. Their job is to manipulate the town and wolves into lynching someone. So then we have two mafias voting similar and two wolves voting similar. Thats not even counting the fact that we have several inactives, so the mafia may have NO choice but to only have two people on a lynch

Night Kills: Yes, this is the sole piece of evidence we have on wolves that we don't have on mafia, however, it is general very hard to determine which player was responisble for a particular players death. Some mafia just kill randomly, some go to frame someone (which is where this train of thought would be particularily bad), and others may go for the threats (i.e: the experienced player). Not even to mention that we don't even know each other that well in this kinda of scenario, let alone well enough to know who would have killed said person.

I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.

Its not impossible to tell, just too difficult to tell to be worth doing.

Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.

First off, its RONIKE!!! Row-Nigh-Kuh. No r at the end... grrr...

Second, yes killing a wolf would be nice, but how do we go about doing that on purpose? You STILL haven't given us an answer.

Third, How does saying I want to get all the scum killed scummy? Thats the town win condition, I like to win.

Honestly, I've had enough of this. I'd vote for you, but you've already got a considerable wagon going, so instead I'll give you one more chance to convince me not to vote you. Answer some of these questions and the HOW question why don't you?

 

[Mayling]

I want a smiley like Tanny.

I went through this entire thread, where the game began, to try and analyze our actions as a whole. Sorry if this is quote-riddled, messy, or hard to read. Since there's so much bulk, it's going to be a long post... Also, I dig back up the Ronike v. Mayling thing because I felt it is one of the causes of the Delvro case and needed to be thoroughly analyzed now that the discussion was finished.

VOTE PROCESS OF PLAYERS/RVS SHENANIGANS:

Vote Frozen for using who instead of whom.

Vote Hilt for being a grammar nazi and for beating me yesterday.

Oh wow you guys talk a lot and make a lot of good points, considering it's still early in Day 1. On AiB mafia, we'd still be "lol I'm tony the tiger," "lynch tony the tiger guys." I'll say I'm impressed.

I can't really make a convincing argument for anyone myself yet, but I like all the discussion going on. I'll tell you guys when I notice something.

Unvote: Hilt

Eh, I understand the necessity of RVS, I just would rather have another medium. Maybe like that movie Clue, we can all make introductions in character about our roles. "I'm Miss Scarlett, I'm a hostess,....nothing suspicious here."

me is not a big fan of the random voting process.

Alright, so something I noticed out of these posts is that S2 was similarly being lurky/inactive/whatever you wanna call it, like Eric was. S2 even said "I'll tell you guys when I notice something." (* To me* this corralates to Eric "Until I have more information.")

but Ronike didn't jump onto S2 like he did Eric. Whether or not it was because of Tandora's lead, or because they're scum buddies, I don't know. The only thing to further the argument of their buddying scumminess is that later S2 tries to derail Delvro's attack on Ronike onto Delvro. Something I've noticed of s2 is that he likes to defend his scum buddies. It, in fact, got him lynched and flipped as mafia just two nights ago (in aimafia).

A current thought process I noticed is that the newer players (tandora, raptor, eric) didn't like RVS. Just because s2 participated in RVS, he didn't get rap for saying "I'll tell you guys if I notice anything." even though, at the time, he hadn't really participated in much. I think the new guys, Eric, in particular, just didn't understand the necessity of RVS.

Here is a quote, from Raptor, as well:

I agree with this. I'm definateley not a fan of the random voting stage, and I dont plan on participating in it. Silly, sporatic votes may help get people talking but I'm uncomfortable making them for reasons like "the players avatar" and such. so dont expect a random vote from this guy.

So I guess my question, to Ronike, is:

Why did you jump onto the Eric bandwagon, but said nothing to S2?

THE DELVRO/RONIKE MAFIA/SCUM/WEREWOLF DEBATE

With two anti-town groups out there, I thought it would be a good idea to set up some universally used terminology, so that we don't confuse each other with our different usage of the same words. Somethink like:

Townie: Pro-town aligned + Seer
Goon: one of the mafia members
Werewolf: The other anti-town group that makes night kills
Mafia: the name of the game we are playing, not to be confused with a Goon.

Also, I don't think this is anyone's first mafia game. Most of us here, while he haven't been playing for years, know how the game works and what things mean. Most people have played at least as much as I have. Using the noob card whenever someone makes a booboo seems, to me, like an easy excuse to let a wolfy off the hook, and it will make me suspicious.

TBH, there is almost no reason to distinguish between a wolf and a mafia member, or any such thing. Town needs to be killing all scum, and probably shouldn't need to individually hunt for wolf or mafia. Scum is the general word used.

Also, an interesting anecdote, I've never played in a wolf game, but games with multiple scum teams are common, and the above is the norm.

Of course town wants to be killing all scum... but let's not forget that wolves have a chance of night-killing mafia members.

IMO The best case scenario would be :
Day 1 kill a wolfie --
Day 2 + 3 kill some mafia -- during this time the other surviving wolf might kill mafia too
Once some mafia are dead kill the other wolf

Of course that's all assuming that we'll be able to distinguish between mafia actions and wolf actions. But still, that's the preferred situation in my eyes.

No, it IS possible to discriminate suspected scum into the two separate groups, and we do it by observing the actions between two suspected scum. How are they talking with each other? Do the actions between them seem scripted? Are they ignoring each other? Etc etc....

We can't say for certain that "person x is mafia and person y is wolf" but we CAN say whether "hey these guys are in the same group" or not.

I honestly think that separating the two groups is crucial. After all, there are 5 (!!!!) anti- town roles. There are only 7 town. We can't afford to just chase after whoever.

I really disagree about this, and think that it would be really naive to simply lump up scum and mafia into one group. I think it is entirely possible to determine whether someone is a wolf or a mafia, and I'm willing to bet that the success of the town depends on it.

So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.

I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.

How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.
I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.

Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.

However, I think the real reason that me and Xiivi have made these typos is because I play a game called "mafia" all the time in which there are mafia and wolves do not exist. Perhaps Xiivi plays a game called "werewolf" in which the only anti-town group are wolves.

We are attacking you because you are attacking myself and others for putting down your strategy when you haven't actually put forward a strategy. You've put foward an idea, that while it WOULD be the best possible way, is feasibly impossible.

Good for you. That still doesn't change the fact that it is impossible to do this on purpose.

Player Reactions: I can see where you can differentiate scum from town this way, but how EXACTLY would you distinguish mafia from wolf? Kill the people that lynch a mafia member? That's a ridiculous idea.

Voting Patterns: Yes, the mafia has 3 and wolfs have 2. Here's the thing: if the mafia does their job well, only two of them should ever have to be on a lynch. Their job is to manipulate the town and wolves into lynching someone. So then we have two mafias voting similar and two wolves voting similar. Thats not even counting the fact that we have several inactives, so the mafia may have NO choice but to only have two people on a lynch

Night Kills: Yes, this is the sole piece of evidence we have on wolves that we don't have on mafia, however, it is general very hard to determine which player was responisble for a particular players death. Some mafia just kill randomly, some go to frame someone (which is where this train of thought would be particularily bad), and others may go for the threats (i.e: the experienced player). Not even to mention that we don't even know each other that well in this kinda of scenario, let alone well enough to know who would have killed said person.

Its not impossible to tell, just too difficult to tell to be worth doing.

First off, its RONIKE!!! Row-Nigh-Kuh. No r at the end... grrr...

Second, yes killing a wolf would be nice, but how do we go about doing that on purpose? You STILL haven't given us an answer.

Third, How does saying I want to get all the scum killed scummy? Thats the town win condition, I like to win.

Honestly, I've had enough of this. I'd vote for you, but you've already got a considerable wagon going, so instead I'll give you one more chance to convince me not to vote you. Answer some of these questions and the HOW question why don't you?

Delvro, Ronike, if you look at your argument as a whole, it's a tad bit silly don't you think? Both of you are trying to go for scum the best way you guys know how.

For Delvro, he wants to get rid of one werewolf, then mafia, then werewolf.

Ronike wants to get rid of all scum.

Just because you guys think the other tactics is stupid, doesn't mean the other one is scum.

After all, not only is this the first game for some of us, it's the first game for all of the newbies with two fractions. It's strange and bizarre. What I got from Delvro's posts is that he had this grand master plan of percentages and was using that to try and help town win.

What I don't understand about Delvro is that he wanted to leave one werewolf alive. I understand that the werewolf could potentially kill a mafia, but he could just as easily kill a townie too.

As far as Ronike goes, I don't understand why he wants to lynch Delvro so bad simply because he is trying to do what he thinks is best for town. After all, hasn't Delvro mentioned the "HOW" to differentiate already? (just cause it doesn't make sense in your mind, Ronike, doesn't make Delvro scum.)

Looking at this as a whole, you guys are just going back and forth deciding on what best tactic to use... in the end, you concluded that the other one was scum. But just remember, what started the argument is that you were both just trying to be pro-town in your own way!

Alright guys I finally got caught up. Sorry for my inactivity.
Greg, or Delvro as the dGamers might know him as. I honestly think you're reasoning for going after Ronike is pretty frail.

I don't see anything particularly wrong with lumping up "scum and mafia". I feel that there are ways to tell the difference between the two, but I also feel that if you concentrate too much on doing it, you're making everything more complicated, and making everything easier for a mislynch. I do have to ask you now though. "Scum and Mafia." Why do you refer to the Mafia by their actual name, but you called the Werewolves scum? That's just odd, to me.

What fished up from the argument was more scum points for S2, from me.

S2, if you read through the thread, you'd see where Greg points out his terminology and why he differentiated between the two. If you were really pro-town, why wouldn't you read the thread thoroughly and completely, so you could scum-hunt at its best?

It seemed like a feeble attempt to redirect the attention onto Greg.

You say his differentiating Scum and Mafia was odd... but he already explained why he did it.

ALSO,

In addition, there is no reason for you to be calling other people particularly bad or what not at this or any stage really. All it does is promote negative feelings for each other, which goes against the main reason for playing these games: fun.

I didn't particularly catch that in his post.

Ugh... defensiveness...

Look, this isn't a personal argument, dont try to make it one.

*sigh*

give me an ironclad way to determine who is wolf or mafia.

As for the aggresiveness, frozen already explained that. It gets scum to either crack, or slip up.

God you're kidding me...

I wasn't voting out of Oh My God yoU Suck, I was voting because he did the scummiest thing I can think of

replace all he with she. Sorry, hard to edit on my phone.

Good for you.* That still doesn't change the fact that it is impossible to do this on purpose.

*pointing this out as unneeded sarcasm.

Looking through the posts Ronike, I noticed that so far, you are the one who was trying to "keep peace." (first two quotes) Despite this, as you can see what I've bolded, you're either getting super frustrated or being plain cruel to us newbies. You, on one hand, say we are newbies and we shouldn't judge others cause of that. However, at the same time, you expect us to play like super pros... And get frustrated when we point out the holes in your logic. Whether or not people believe the vote was an "OMGUS" (that's up to the others to decide...actions speak louder than words) .. when it was pointed out you got defensive/frustrated with it. Why are you getting so upset? o_o

Furthermore, despite saying this...

again, aim mafia and forum mafia is very different, and swf forum mafia and mafia scum forum is very different as well. Here, we tend to take our time with our days when possible and come to lynch the scummiest player. Thus it is not enough to just have a single wifom point to get someone lynched

you are now more than willing to lynch Delvro...despite the fact we still have a good ~8 days left... Sure, you say you're going to "give him one last chance to defend himself" ... but that could just be protecting your scummy self from looking like you're hammering him. Besides, your attack on Delvro is, again, sort of silly. From what I see, he's a mafia* player trying to adjust to two conflicting fractions.

*(the game, not the fraction)

Honestly, I've had enough of this. I'd vote for you, but you've already got a considerable wagon going, so instead I'll give you one more chance to convince me not to vote you. Answer some of these questions and the HOW question why don't you?

Here's some more proof about Ronike's frustration.

What's so bad that's happening that you've had enough of?

What bothers so much you feel the need to choose the diction you are? (Ugh.../God you're kidding me.../Honestly, I've had enough of this...)

What I take from this is that Ronike got his hand caught in the cookie jar and is trying desperately to claim his "over-zealousness" is him trying to be pro-town.

***I just understood this quote:

Look, this isn't a personal argument, dont try to make it one.

It was in response to the "pro players" comment.

The thing I don't like about these "pro players" is they take your words and twist it to the extreme.

You're right. Scratch that. Replace "pro players" with "Ronike."

Sorry about that, other pro players.

Anyway, I do have to say, sorry if someone I offended you. However, whether or not you're intentionally misinterpreting me and thus intentionally trying to twist my words is where your scum-ness lays. It's now up to the others to decide which one of us is telling the truth, or if we both happened to misinterpret each other and went at each other's throats for lack of better suspects.

FROZENFLAME

I was already thinking this when looking through the thread, about making an attack on Frozenflame. that's when I saw Hilt had already mentioned it. He said FF's actions have been mostly "active lurking" ... when I say this, I mean he has been contributing helpful general information... and agreeing only with others. He has really offered his own suspicions or attacks on anyone, until after hilt questions them. However, he doesn't acknowledge what hilt has said about him, and instead goes on to make opinions on two other players.

Delvro's riding the wolf thing pretty hard in his conversations with Ronike. Actually, I've been doing it myself, too, but I'll admit, in hindsight, my wolf insinuations against Xiivi were a bit farfetched. About Delvro's suggestion that we'll be able to distinguish the types of scum; how could we go about that?

You're coming off as taking that a bit hard, Greg.
Seeming emotional when you make your vote will just take credence away from your
reasoning. Is there anything else you can offer other than this "hounding" of May?

This is a really unprovoked response. In addition to the fact that I think you are lying about defending anyone else with such tenacity, or at least mistaken, I think you're overreacting to a simple question. He didn't even vote for you.

i'll be honest here....I JUST DONT KNOW WHERE THIS COMING FROM.

I don't see where "riding the wolf" thing is a bad thing. So Greg wants to get rid of wolf, big deal? That's what we're all trying to do right? Sure, there may be NO FEASIBLE POSSIBLE way to go for wolves specifically instead of scum in general, and here's where I would call Greg a mafia, except he wanted to "keep one wolf" alive so that wolf could possibly feast on mafia.

Furthermore, I don't see how it was an unprovoked response... he's responding to an argument. If someone brings up something to me, scummy about me, I'm going to try and defend myself against it. That's what I saw Greg was doing.

So I would really like some clarification about why you guys think Greg's repsonse was unprovoked. I don't think it was in the least (especially going back and seeing what I saw about s2.)

I worked on this post for three hours. I hope everyone reads it! Also, sorry about the quotes, but I was afraid I might "edit" something out to make someone look scummy, that's why I kept them in!

 

[Ronike]

I jumped onto the Eric bandwagon because he specifically said that he was planning on lurking. Not that he was gonna be busy, not that he would try to post, but actually just lurk. I figured s2 (and all the others) were just busy, but I would prolly eventually have gotten on their case had discussion not moved on from inactivity.

On Delvro, here's the deal: in a game where we have limited time to determine who is evil in our group and who is good, he wants to further spend or time trying to confuse the issue by making us determine who is a specific side of evil. It just will waste time.

And no, he hasn't mentioned specifically how to differentiate. He said "Well, the same we find scum" basically, which doesn't work as I already said. So if he still really believes in his argument, he needs to convince me, which he hasn't.

As for why I want to vote for him, like FF has said, votes can be used for more than just getting someone lynched. I want to put pressure on him to answer the question of who to do it SPECIFICALLY (thusfar he has answered a general way to do it) or realize that differentiating (tho ideal) is next to impossible.

I know most everyone here is new, but I'm not gonna let people pull newb johns. Otherwise, we're never gonna catch scum. And honestly, if you're gonna keep playing, you're gonna run into harsh play eventually, if not from me, then from Kevin or Omni. It'd be better if you know how to react instead of being blindsided.

I'm getting frustrated because even when the vets explain what certain terminology is, you still are trying to use it incorrectly to get me lynched. In addition, you took a completely impersonal argument and made it into a personal one.

As for the "I've had enough of this", its less frustration, more letting Delvro know that I notice he's been skirting the questions asked of him.

And the ugh defensiveness wasn't about you defending yourself, it was about you making the argument personal in almost all your responses. That's not a good way to play. Its annoying and makes you make slips.

 

[Mayling]

I'm getting frustrated because even when the vets explain what certain terminology is, you still are trying to use it incorrectly to get me lynched. In addition, you took a completely impersonal argument and made it into a personal one.

What did I say?

Where did I do this?

Are you talking about the OMGUS vote? o_O two other people mentioned that before I did.

If I honestly made the impersonal argument into a personal one, I want to know. I feel I didn't make a personal attack, but if you feel I did then it needs to be pointed out so I don't do it again in the future. Also, I should know because if I did, then maybe I need to be replaced if I personally attacked you.

If you're referring to this quote:

The thing I don't like about these "pro players" is they take your words and twist it to the extreme.

perhaps it was a little wrong, but I too was getting frustrated. After all, from MY POINT OF VIEW, you were twisting my actions to make me look like scum. Because of that, I thought you were scum. Also, if you DID intentionally twist my actions to make it look like I was "editting" the post... then it's probably a good lead that you're scum. Again, I still think it's possible that you got your hand caught in the cookie jar and are just trying to get out of it.

Considering that, it wasn't a personal attack AT ALL. It, from my point of view, was what you were doing... twisting my words. (And yes, if you are a wolf, then technically you're going to twist my words so that you can get a lynch on me... I know that... but that's why I was pointing it out... cause I thought you were a wolf.)

When I tried to clarify myself, you were just like "Nope. Nope. can't take it at face value, sorry." Well, why should I take anything you have to say at face value either?

As for the "I've had enough of this", its less frustration, more letting Delvro know that I notice he's been skirting the questions asked of him.

And the ugh defensiveness wasn't about you defending yourself, it was about you making the argument personal in almost all your responses. That's not a good way to play. Its annoying and makes you make slips.

The ugh defensiveness wasn't about me defending myself? <.<

Then why wasn't it "ugh... you're making this into a personal argument."

You DID do that, the post AFTER. But the "ugh defensiveness" remark was still made.

That just makes zero sense to me... and once again looks like you're trying to cover up yourself.

I know most everyone here is new, but I'm not gonna let people pull newb johns. Otherwise, we're never gonna catch scum. And honestly, if you're gonna keep playing, you're gonna run into harsh play eventually, if not from me, then from Kevin or Omni. It'd be better if you know how to react instead of being blindsided.

Actually, there's a reason why there was a "no jerks allowed" clause at the beginning of the game...cause we didn't want any jerks to play. No, I'm NOT going to play with a jerk, because that makes the game unenjoyable for me. If people are going to take a game of mafia to the point of being hurt/harsh/personal argument, it no longer becomes a game that is enjoyable and one of the players shouldn't be allowed.

That's why if your "personal attack" statement is feasible, and I am making the game unenjoyable for you, either you or I should be replaced. Since I supposedly made the attack, I am more than willing to drop out.

Also, I'm not saying you are a jerk Ronike. But just remember there is a "no jerk" clause in this game for a reason. (Specifically, and apparently ironically since I am being a jerk, I requested it.)

 

[DtJ Hilt]

@Mayling, I can confirm that Soldier 2 loves aggressive play, as he's talked to me about it quite a bit, haha. I won't go too much into it as it deals with his personal playstyle. If he wishes to go more into it, that's his choice to make.

I do however like your points about S2, it stood out to me a bit more than the other points in your post, however I do like the effort put into it all.

I have a question for you, though, that I've been wondering. How do you feel about Greg's plan and order in scum hunting? What's your opinion on the idea in general?

 

[Mayling]

@Mayling, I can confirm that Soldier 2 loves aggressive play, as he's talked to me about it quite a bit, haha. I won't go too much into it as it deals with his personal playstyle. If he wishes to go more into it, that's his choice to make.

S2 has talked to you about it... sure, he may THINK he has an aggressive style, but having played with him.. I don't recall SEEING it. That's my point.

I'm talking about what we've seen, not what S2 has said about his own personal play.

I can say all sorts of things about my own play, but without someone to confirm it true... then it's pointless and may be a lie.

I have a question for you, though, that I've been wondering. How do you feel about Greg's plan and order in scum hunting? What's your opinion on the idea in general?

I don't think it's feasible to distinguish wolf from mafia, except maybe with who they kill at night... even then, the possibility of "night kill setups" comes into play. I think in general it'd be better to scum hunt, but I don't think lynching a person for trying to do what they think is best for town is a sound plan of action.

If I had to choose the killing order, we would wipe out both wolves, because then the seer could role claim... and because town wouldn't be at risk of getting chopped at night.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

S2 has talked to you about it... sure, he may THINK he has an aggressive style, but having played with him.. I don't recall SEEING it.

I do. If your question is if anyone has seen him play with an aggressive play style, then yes. I have seen him play with one on numerous occasions. However, I'll let him speak for himself form this point on. I have no intention in trying to defend him, just meaning to answer your question.

 

[Ronike]

Believe me or not, but that's what I meant by ugh... defensiveness in a nutshell. More literally it was the fact that you took me attacking you personally (thus turning it into a personal argument) instead of as it being a part of the game.

And seriously, I didn't twist your words. You twisted mine, so why am I getting attacked for this?

Ok, look at it this way: say I took the argument about frozen not revealing his scumtells and suspicions and I went through and only quoted where he revealed his suspicions and pretended this was how he was always talking and then attacked you for thinking he wasn't contributing. Wouldn't you come after me for editing the quotes against you? Because that is essentially what you did to me.

Also, you aren't making the game unfun for me. Like I said above, personal argument was probably a bad choice in wording. It was more that you took my arguments against you and took them as though I were attacking you personally. Thats not an example of a breaking the rules sort of personal argument, but it is a bit of a scumtell, so I'd still avoid it.

Unfortunately, sometimes people are going to be harsh. Its a very nice way to make scum crack. If you don't believe me, I direct you to Trigun Mafia day 5. Eor got under my skin the entire day, which eventually culminated me in getting so fed up that I claimed scum. Seriously, being harsh is a good way to get scum to slip up, and I'm not going to stop or apologize for it.

 

[Tandora]

Actually, there's a reason why there was a "no jerks allowed" clause at the beginning of the game...cause we didn't want any jerks to play. No, I'm NOT going to play with a jerk, because that makes the game unenjoyable for me. If people are going to take a game of mafia to the point of being hurt/harsh/personal argument, it no longer becomes a game that is enjoyable and one of the players shouldn't be allowed.

That's why if your "personal attack" statement is feasible, and I am making the game unenjoyable for you, either you or I should be replaced. Since I supposedly made the attack, I am more than willing to drop out.

Also, I'm not saying you are a jerk Ronike. But just remember there is a "no jerk" clause in this game for a reason. (Specifically, and apparently ironically since I am being a jerk, I requested it.)

I have to admit I've gotten pretty quiet these last posts because I feel the tone of the game has gone from "playfulness" to "personal attacks". I'm not sure how forum mafia tends to run, but if people are starting to get aggravated with each other on AIM, we can just finish a game and play again later. The longer game play of forum definitely requires a different mentality since we cannot get "Oh I was _____" quickly and go on.

I am definitely seeing a cliche division here. People who know each other's play style vs those they don't. I'd like to ask that we let go of the current arguments, but that feels counterproductive since we need to be scum searching.

However, I think the current topic has run its course and would like to try another tactic.

Would it be faux pas to guess why Greg is focusing on wolves based on his role? Especially if I think its a townie role? I don't want to flush him out in a bad way at this time, but I really think Greg may be trying to give us a hint of his role by being so concerned with wolves. Or WIFOM.

I think Matt's statements so far have been "Me? I'm harmless." So although adorable, I haven't really gotten a vibe of innocence from him.

Since you've welcomed questions, Matt, what's on your mind? I'd like to see some more of the lurking characters speak up about now. Hilt, Eric, and Tom feel free to speak up too. (If I missed a lurker, I was too lazy to see who is currently lurking.)

 

[Ronike]

Gah, this has been bugging me too. Go by forum names please. I have no idea who matt is and once you get to other game people won't know delvro is greg. Just go by forum names please.

 

[DtJ S2n]

I do however like your points about S2, it stood out to me a bit more than the other points in your post, however I do like the effort put into it all.

I however, do not like her points about S2, however it kinda does stand out, however. I thought you were wanting to be an English teacher, man?

S2 has talked to you about it... sure, he may THINK he has an aggressive style, but having played with him.. I don't recall SEEING it. That's my point.

If I had to choose the killing order, we would wipe out both wolves, because then the seer could role claim... and because town wouldn't be at risk of getting chopped at night.

I suppose we have different ideas of what aggressive play means. I agree that I am not Ronike aggressive, but by aggressive, I mean that if you feel someone is scum, you push really hard to convince everyone else. You look for small details that others may ignore, but add up. Things like that. As Ronike has said before, aggressive play is good, at least when you need it. It's a way of getting information.

Alright, so something I noticed out of these posts is that S2 was similarly being lurky/inactive/whatever you wanna call it, like Eric was. S2 even said "I'll tell you guys when I notice something." (* To me* this corralates to Eric "Until I have more information.")

------------------------------------------

What fished up from the argument was more scum points for S2, from me.

S2, if you read through the thread, you'd see where Greg points out his terminology and why he differentiated between the two. If you were really pro-town, why wouldn't you read the thread thoroughly and completely, so you could scum-hunt at its best?

---------------------------------------
I honestly don't see where these random votes for Delvro are coming from (especially in compilation with my earlier evidence of S2.)

Delvro defended me because he thought Ronike was hounding me about the Eric thing.
S2 defended Ronike. No one said anything about that yet (cept Delvro..and me now)
I defended Eric. Only person that said anything was Ronike, and that's only cause I "editted" to make him look bad.

Suddenly, Delvro defends me and a bandwagon lurched onto him?

---------------------------------------

Step by step, what I snipped out of Mayling's huuuge post.

1. I actually agree about this. I felt bad about not helping out yet, but I was busier than I thought I would be.

2. Oh but I did read through the thread! And that's why I pointed out that scum part! You guys used quite a lot of space about this terminology. Also, if I recall correctly, someone even mentioned how a player might subconciously use certain terms without thinking about it? Let me look back...

By the way, was there any particular reason you said werewolf specifically
and not some kind of bad guy in general?
I think a person trying to vote under the guise of the RVS might subconsciously
think in terms of his or her own scum type.

Oh and of course:

I like this logic.

Mayling's quote is in direct response to Cello's. Do I even need to explain this?

3. I voted for Delvro because I thought he was using a weak argument versus Ronike, a player I feel hasn't been doing much wrong. Also, I find this a tad hippocritical. Delvro defends you in a way, and gets a bandwagon on him, but now you say to bandwagon S2 for defending Ronike. A couple other reasons, I'm sure, but I feel it's mostly because I defended him.

 

[Tandora]

Gah, this has been bugging me too. Go by forum names please. I have no idea who matt is and once you get to other game people won't know delvro is greg. Just go by forum names please.

Matt = Soaring Raptor Blast. I apologize. I am used to AimMafia where most people use their chat names, their brawl names, and their IRL names.

And I think it would do you some good to leave out little things like "gah" and "ugh". They are coming off as really jerkish and totally unnecessary. You're typing, not speaking.

 

[Ronike]

Its a playstyle thing and its prolly not going away. I type what immediately comes to mind, and oftentimes it involves little ticks of my speaking habit, like mate jeez gah ugh. Sorry if it comes off jerklike sometimes, but it does a better job of conveying my emotions than simple "This has been bugging me too".

So in conclusion, sorry, but no.

 

[Mayling]

10charssssss

 

[Delvro]

All right, I'm not sure how this turned from a simple suggestion of town strategy (in the long-run) into some kind of war.

Ronike (and I'm sorry about getting your name wrong before), I already said many particular ways in which we can catch a wolf red-handed. I also said that it may not be possible to do so on Day 1, in which case we just hunt for scum. In NO way am I purposefully trying to confuse people (honestly I don't see how my proposition is that confusing to begin with), nor am I saying that we will FOR SURE be able to detect a wolf (minus the seer but I don't really want the seer to get involved in this). After all... if we COULD... then wolves wouldn't have much of a chance now would they?

And also please please don't point out that someone might be seer. You're just asking to get that person nightkilled. ;___;

If someone is suspected seer, chances are they will die. We have no doctor. And if they don't die, that's probably because they are mafia.

Also, the above post is a booboo... Mayling left work and I hopped on and immediately jumped to the mafia thread without realizing the account was still on. My Bad.

 

[Mayling]

I still want a smiley like Tanny

Believe me or not, but that's what I meant by ugh... defensiveness in a nutshell. More literally it was the fact that you took me attacking you personally (thus turning it into a personal argument) instead of as it being a part of the game.

....What? Again, I still just don't get you. I didn't take you attacking me personally, so I would appreciate you not telling me what I'm feeling. To me, our debate was us going back and forth pointing out holes in each other's logic. I felt you were twisting my words, and if you are scum, then it's because you were trying to get me lynched. If you're town, it's cause you misinterpreted my actions.

I didn't turn anything into a personal argument, and unless if you provide quotes and reason why, then stop saying it.

And I think it would do you some good to leave out little things like "gah" and "ugh". They are coming off as really jerkish and totally unnecessary. You're typing, not speaking.

^qft

 

[Mister Eric]

I jumped onto the Eric bandwagon because he specifically said that he was planning on lurking. Not that he was gonna be busy, not that he would try to post, but actually just lurk. I figured s2 (and all the others) were just busy, but I would prolly eventually have gotten on their case had discussion not moved on from inactivity.

Just because I said I would watch doesn't mean I wouldn't speak or contribute.
I am, though, naturally an observant player over an expressive one. I'm trying to incorporate the two so bare with me. You make assumptions for the quiet but you jump the gun and to conclusions when I share my two pennies. Like I prompted from the very beginning, I'd love to answer questions. Right now, I am indeed very busy with school but I'm keeping up the best I can. If I'm continuously pressured, it only makes me paranoid and act unlike myself; that's how I am. Haha, I'm tired and rambling so I hope I'm making sense <3.

My vote for Hilt though remains because I feel I made it on legitimate reasoning instead of due to being pressured into it.

wowz im not making sense. nightnight.

Spoiler

fuq college.

 

[soaring-raptor-blast]

S2 has talked to you about it... sure, he may THINK he has an aggressive style, but having played with him.. I don't recall SEEING it. That's my point.

I'm talking about what we've seen, not what S2 has said about his own personal play.

I can say all sorts of things about my own play, but without someone to confirm it true... then it's pointless and may be a lie.

I think I understand the "aggressiveness" of S2's playstyle. I think he meant a very active, inquisitive, super-analytical play-style, rather than a "sit-back and go with the flow" type. I would confirm that his playstyle is aggressive by MY definition. a lot of that was directed at myself in the AIB smash mafia game so I have to agree with him ^_^

on another note, I definately see what you mean when you said "s2 likes to defend his scumbuddies" I was thinking the exact same thing actually. other than when he is mafia it really isnt like him to take up for anyone... from what I've seen anyway. I wasnt gonna point it out til later in the game because I wanted to see if I could catch him taking up for other people as the game went on... but since its already out there, might as well say I noticed too.

I am definitely seeing a cliche division here. People who know each other's play style vs those they don't. I'd like to ask that we let go of the current arguments, but that feels counterproductive since we need to be scum searching.

However, I think the current topic has run its course and would like to try another tactic.

Would it be faux pas to guess why Greg is focusing on wolves based on his role? Especially if I think its a townie role? I don't want to flush him out in a bad way at this time, but I really think Greg may be trying to give us a hint of his role by being so concerned with wolves. Or WIFOM.

I think Matt's statements so far have been "Me? I'm harmless." So although adorable, I haven't really gotten a vibe of innocence from him.

Since you've welcomed questions, Matt, what's on your mind? I'd like to see some more of the lurking characters speak up about now. Hilt, Eric, and Tom feel free to speak up too. (If I missed a lurker, I was too lazy to see who is currently lurking.)

I second the bolded phrase!

and thanks Tan, adorable is how I roll, lol.

so...my thoughts...other than what I mentioned at the first part of my post, I really dont have anything strong enough to base an arguement off of. I know there is quite a bit of needless arguing clogging up the thread, so let's be big kids and agree to disagree ^_^ kiss and make up guys.


but yeah. thats all thats on my mind ATM. I cant say i'm fond of the arguement on greg, OR ronike, S2 is the only one I've noticed really. if S2 dies later on in the game I would go "all in" on him and Ronike being scumbuddies.

 

[soaring-raptor-blast]

And I think it would do you some good to leave out little things like "gah" and "ugh". They are coming off as really jerkish and totally unnecessary. You're typing, not speaking.

yeah, thats no fun. that could hurt somebody's feelin's :'(

sorry I meant to include that in my last post (even though its already been addressed)

 

[Ronike]

Fine, I'll make you all a deal: I'll try to stop using those types of words if you all forget you know each other in real life. Seriously, if you defend each other for the smallest of accusations because some unknown guy is attacking your friend, the mafia will walk all over you. So please, leave your friendship and stuff at the door.

 

[Mayling]

I however, do not like her points about S2, however it kinda does stand out, however. I thought you were wanting to be an English teacher, man?

How do you know that's what he was trying to say? That definitely should be clarified by Hilt himself.

Fine, I'll make you all a deal: I'll try to stop using those types of words if you all forget you know each other in real life. Seriously, if you defend each other for the smallest of accusations because some unknown guy is attacking your friend, the mafia will walk all over you. So please, leave your friendship and stuff at the door.

Deal. I don't like these people anyway. Especially that Raptor guy. *tummy gurgles*

Unvote: Vote S2

If we're leaving the previous arguments at rest... what do we have to go on? I guess S2 is my biggest suspect right now. So, what I've already pointed out + pressure vote + it'll give a good read on Ronike.

 

[Delvro]

Personally I think s2 is scum if and only if Ronike is also scum. I'm certainly not AGAINST an s2 lynch but I'd be nice to get some input from him.

Also, all these lurkers are REEEALLLY beginning to hurt the town. After all... so far all the active people have pretty much chased after other active people. At this point... I'm half-willing to go for a lurker just so that it doesn't make the game fall apart down the road (as I have seen happen before).

 

[Mayling]

Can't I have a smiley like Tanny?

No one is really lurking.. it's not like we can require them to post just as much as us, just cause we're loud mouths. >.< I think they're all doing fine, except Tom... who is inactive, not lurking.

I miss Tom. Where u at

 

[Mister Eric]

Haha, if I was worried about friendships in rl, I wouldn't vote for Hilt ^_^
Yea like my jacket and shoes, I'm leaving my friendships at the door.