Ness Question and Answer Thread, Ask Ness questions Here!

[Luco]

You sound as if you want to make the pika MU better! You know it's a 0 right?

 

[Tikao]

Yeah , Ness-Pika -> 1 ( in Ness's favor)

 

[Luco]

Yeah , Ness-Pika -> 1 ( in Ness's favor)

O.O

I dunno if it goes that far. Umm, uhhh... gonna ask around, like I did for marth.

 

[Nido]

Just throw out a PK Ground for the OHKO unless Pika is holding a balloon

Edit: I'm ****ing stupid

Edit 2: Lucas taught him after stealing from Kumatora AGAIN

 

[Tikao]

Pika's damage is based on his grabs + follow-ups and his neutral-b , his neutral-b is just healing for us , and he has like on of the smallest grabranges in the game ...if we force him to approach , we can outrange every of his attack with our fair , realy hard for him to get a grab ( and Ness's should already be good at avoiding grabs ) ... it's hard for him to start some combo's

also , he isn't like , he could kill us early , his fsmash sweetspot , which is short-ranged ( we can outrange it) , his nair , which should be hard against our fair , and at high % , there shouldn't be a true combo into nair , his usmash and utilt (utilt 20% later) ... just above him

also , Pika is a light charackter ... we can kill him earlier than others ... like our b-throw should kill at 100% , if we are at the edge , and the b-throw throws him offstage ... maybe even 95% with bad DI ... not realy sure about the kill % of that , he just dies early (b-throw / bair / uair / nair / some spaced fsmashes [not that often , hard to hit with them ] / even [at the edge] some non-sweetspottet dair's xD)

 

[Nido]

To be fair, Pika's Nair is super sexy and it kills be aware of it

 

[Tikao]

yeah , it's very sexy , but pika has a hard timeto hit with nair only , so he musst string some combo's like uair->nair ... Ness's fair is just awesome against that , but when he strings some combo's , we can just get some serious and maybe mortal damage to nair or something

 

[Nido]

It isn't as sexy as Ganon's Uair though, that thing is why I semi-second Ganon

 

[Luco]

Well, apparently it's 0 because we out-space him and he can't camp us, but if he grabs us we get the short end of the stick and apparently he destroys us off-stage.

 

[Tikao]

nah , we shouldn't be grabbed , it's way harder to don't be grabbed against donkey etc. ... and it's a -2 MU , if he grab s us , we're dead , so we must avoid this (ness basic's) ... a Ness , who knows the MU against pika shouldn't be grabbed , like against donkey , except than , if pika grabs us , it's realy not that bad like if donkey grabs us (donkey is only an example) ... and pika doesn't destroy us offstage ... if you recover right , you shouldn't be gimped by pika ... it's a +1 in ness favor imo xD

 

[Luco]

nah , we shouldn't be grabbed , it's way harder to don't be grabbed against donkey etc. ... and it's a -2 MU , if he grab s us , we're dead , so we must avoid this (ness basic's) ... a Ness , who knows the MU against pika shouldn't be grabbed , like against donkey , except than , if pika grabs us , it's realy not that bad like if donkey grabs us (donkey is only an example) ... and pika doesn't destroy us offstage ... if you recover right , you shouldn't be gimped by pika ... it's a +1 in ness favor imo xD

One spacing error with, say, Fair or Nair and you get grabbed when versing a good Pika... (Oops, sorry, mis-read what you were saying about a -2 MU)

And one grab chain gets you to 40%. If you're near the edge, he can also get you off-stage and that's apparently a really bad position to be in.

 

[Tikao]

And one grab chain gets you to 40%. If you're near the edge, he can also get you off-stage and that's apparently a really bad position to be in.

yeah , at 0% , if he gets a grab , he could get 40% (which is realy the maximum at 0%)
later , he can't make that much damage at the end , he can just string something like uair-nair at the end , which shouldn't be true at kill% , yeah , and everyone can get you offstage , it's always a bad position for ness , but Pika isn't that good at gimping us , when we recover right , there are a lot of other char's , who can gimp us easier ...

 

[Nido]

Wtf Pika can't Dthrow us to 40% and Fthrow goes way too far to get 40%

 

[Luco]

Wtf Pika can't Dthrow us to 40% and Fthrow goes way too far to get 40%

It's something like that.

...

You DO know the pika Dthrow chain-grab right?

It at least gets us to like 30...

Anyway, apparently pika can gimp us really hard. His aerials are really good when we want to recover and if we get in that low position, we're doomed.

 

[Nido]

Just had a go vs CPU 9 Ness gets to 29 ish + Fthrow > Usmash = ew

 

[Luco]

Just had a go vs CPU 9 Ness gets to 29 ish + Fthrow > Usmash = ew

... And that's un-practiced. Cassio, ESAM, etc would probs be able to get a few more grabs in because of timing. And imagine what it would be if Ness has no second jump?

 

[Nido]

I did it perfectly buffered :/

 

[Luco]

I did it perfectly buffered :/

Oh okay then.

Okay, i'm gonna jump off, i'll keep discussing later.

It's a refreshing change to discuss Ness' MUs, lets keep doing this for a bit. :D

 

[Nido]

Worst case scenario for Ness is
0% caught in the double jump by a grab and CGed at the ledge > Fthrow = stock everytime

 

[Luco]

Yea... I dunno, I think 0 is kinda accurate for now.

Anyway, night guys!

 

[Nido]

But to be ***** offstage, we have to be offstage, which mean they get past wall of Fair... That's hard to do, I can agree with 0 and 1 I'm on the fence here

 

[Tikao]

even perfectly buffered , pika can't even string a dthrow or ftrow against ness ... the best combo he could do does 29% (if everything is fresh and hit's perfekt [dthrow->utilt->nair , maybe he can get an uair between utilt an nair , so it could make 35% , but not sure if the nair would connect ( so it would be true)

if we space right , it's an +1 for Ness , pika has a realy hard time getting that grab and get us offstage , because of our fair, but 0 isn't that wrong , but its a +1 imo

anyway , we should realy discuss more MUs ... and ask their mains (ask pika mains etc.) ... but i don't think they would say it could be a +1 , only because ness is like low-tier xD ... also , the most don't know much about ness xD ... maybe a +0,5 (my lovly half-stepps xD) ... but for me a +1 (because those halfstepps doesn't exist xD) ... maybe a +0,75 , if there would be half stepps , i wouldn't be sure , if it should be a +0,5 or +1
enough about pika ... xD , and good night Luco :3

 

[Nido]

WHAT ABOUT ME TEACOW??
MAYBE I WANT A GOODMORNING

 

[Tikao]

only luco said he goes to sleep sorry D: ... good night Nido :3 (it's already confusing with dat time thing ... its 14:59 right now in germany xD)

 

[DellSmashman]

You shouldn't really use decimals.... it's doesn't really make sense. Just go with a 0 or +1, whatever you feel that is more accurate.

 

[Tikao]

it's like between some MUs , i wanna make sweet love to half-stepp-MUs , but they don't exist D:

 

[Nido]

There's something about Teacow saying "make sweet love" that makes me shudder.

 

[Tikao]

it's my way to say , that i like something like MUs etc. ... hehe

 

[Kokomaniac]

How often do you all use dair, I use it a lot because its awesome

 

[Luco]

Talked to ESAM, he says it's either 0 or +1 Pikachu's favour. I can discuss it with him further but our Fair wall can be gotten past (albeit with some difficulty) and once in Pikachu can deal some damage and get us off-stage.

 

[PK Jibaku]

Question. What are Ness's good stages and bad stages? ._. I just want to know what everyone thinks.

 

[Luco]

His good stages are like, Brinstar maybe PS1. Bad stages are Yoshi's Island and Lylat cruise. The rest are pretty meh, though I personally enjoy smashville.

OH and delfino is a great stage for Ness. Opponent in water = they're screwed. :3

The more I look at it the more i hate myself for swearing so I changed it. But they're still in a terible position in water. <3

 

[Tikao]

depends on the MU ...

best stage should be delfino i think , ness+wasser+sexiest spike = <3 / the walkoffs can be great , because at early % , Ness's fthrow has great knockback , has the fastest grabs in the game , also a good dashgrab range , b-throw is also awesome , but that shouldn't be a secret , if you are near the blastzone , it kills even earlier >: D ... but your enemy could do the same against you , so watch out , walkoffs could easily kill you , too

brinstar is awesome too (can't say anything , it's banned here)

PS1 , but that depends on the MU , you can camp at some points with pkt1 , also dtilt infinite agaist some walls , don't pick it against chars , which totaly outcamp you (like tink) , also , watch out , the edge is confusing

PS2 can be very good , soooooo much damage at the air-transformation with pkt1 ... abuse that >: D ... some ice-sliding (fsmash / charged usmash , because the hotbox stays out and you will atack the enemy with that by sliding towards them xD ... can easily be outranged , but it's funneh ... also pkt2 range is increased ... it goes all over the stage in the ice-transformation , that's awesome , too , and most don't know that ... unexspected early kill >: D ... that electric-thing is also great , when you want to recover , they just can't stay at the edge of the stage

fd , bf and sf are also not bad ... depends on the MU too , against IC , you should avoid fd , against snake , bf can be bad etc.



bad stages

Yoshi's Island , you can be easily edgeguarded , if you just touch the wall , so you bounce away ... so gimping ness is much easier ... the floor isn't flat , so a some points (like at the edges for edgeguarding) you can't charge your usmash and dsmash , pk-fire can also fail , this little ghost-platform thing can just destroy your recovery , so gimping ness at YI is even easier ... it's his worst stage

frigate orpheon should be bad too , at the 1. transformation , ness is easier to gimp , cecause of the non-existiering edge at the right side , at the 2. transformation , the platforms , which randomly appear offstage , can also gimp you

lylat can be bad too in some MUs , the stage is tilting , so , when you must recover safe ... the platforms are also good for juggling , so , you can be juggled too (marf , tink etc.) ... also , the stage isn't falt when it's tilting , so you maybe miss with some pk-fires , or can't charge your usmash and dsmash ... but this stage can be good for you , this realy depends on the MU like against Falco , he has a hard time to recover here , the stage can interrupt his Chaingrab

 

[Luco]

Actually against snake, sometimes platforms are good. From Ness, most Snakes expect a patient playstyle that involves waiting for an opening, especially on say BF. I versed a snake main recently and just went seriously aggro and it completely messed with his play-style, he honestly used his weapons more against himself than he did against me. It's really weird. Trust in your shield, be wary of where everything is but don't be afraid to bait him. For instance, lets say you're in the middle of BF and he's on the edge, and there's a C4 on the platform between you. His 'NOW' animation takes some time, you can run recklessly at him, PS (or even just normal shield) the C4 and grab, something like that.

I dunno, I just find that on BF, you actually want to go a little crazy and stay mobile like all the time.

Also, everyone complains of going up the side of YI but I honestly don't find it that bad. It happens sometimes, I guess...

If you ARE taken to YI, try to recover right above where the ghost platforms appear. That way, if one does come up, you won't be dead. :D

 

[Mad Duck]

Wow,most of the people has Brinstar banned....
I feel like a chosen one having it legal (?)

 

[Nido]

Go ahead, run it in.

 

[Kokomaniac]

Smashville #1 because of the music

 

[Luco]

Wow,most of the people has Brinstar banned....
I feel like a chosen one having it legal (?)

I have it legal too. <3

 

[PK Jibaku]

Guys! I did this very important match today, and it was best 3 out of 5. The thing is, I have to beat him 2 sets in a row. I faced my friend that mains Diddy Kong and I won the first set. But then he ragequit and wants to stall the other set for tomorrow. I agreed to that and we're going to finish it tomorrow.

Anyways, I'm looking for tips when facing a Diddy Kong, can anyone please help me? I want to destroy him.

 

[Luco]

Is this like a tournament match??

Anyway, vs. diddy kong...

Don't slip on bananas, duh.

Someone better than I will have to go in to specifics. :o