Meta Knight Q&A Thread

[Kaffei]

don't underestimate jab. It can be combo'd into dsmash or ftilt which is nice.

bs .

 

[Player-4]

bs .

I do it lol. I mean I'm not saying to use jab to setup for that stuff but if you do use jab by accident, make it work and ftilt or dsmash to finish it off.

 

[LordAizen]

All right I guess I'll lay down the basics.

Jab - useless, unless you do trap someone in between 2 jabs in teams (lmfao)

Ftilt - great in the ditto, good move overall, comes out really fast, long range (probably mk's biggest disjoint)
dtilt - 1/3 chance of tripping, can combo into itself, long range
utilt - not that useful, but it has it's uses. It has a tipper that can kill but it's still not very useful IMO

fair - you can follow up with this sometimes pretty good spacing tool. I don't really know how to explain
bair - it's like fair, but the hitboxes are a tad smaller, and this move is slower. you can auto cancel the 2nd hit and go into a ftilt or something
dair - good spacing tool, you can dair camp vs a lot of chars which is relatively a safe approach. does 9% with a tipper and 7% without tipper. tipper also has more kb
uair - juggle; 2 frame move
nair - pretty good OoS move, can do 20% rarely (which is actually 2 separate hits) can also kill

fsmash - start up is slow but it has like no end lag so it's pretty good vs spot dodge happy players. kills
usmash - useless
dsmash - 5 frame move, kills well when fresh. this is probably ur main kill move. The back side of dsmash does more damage and KB btw

Tornado - this move is amazing for juggling. can do up to 22% but that's super rare. you should get around 11% on average. This move has a lot of priority and beats a lot of projectiles. Everyone hates nado lol
Shuttle Loop - Best up B in the game IMO. OoS it's pretty good, it can kill sorta if it's fresh. Auto snaps ledges, auto cancels too. Goes into a glide, has insane KB if you aerial it etc
Drill Rush - useless mostly as an attack, great for recovery though
Dimensional Cape - useless mostly as an attack, pretty good for recovery (also you can do extended dimensional cape but that's banned)

Glide attack - really choreographed but does 12% and kills. EDIT: clash priority? (what stingers said below lol)

MK can recover with glide, 5 jumps, and all his B moves. Mix them up
There are much better MKs who can give better advice than me but these boards are dead mostly... :/

I'm sorry to be a burden again but what are tilts?

 

[Player-4]

I'm sorry to be a burden again but what are tilts?

Lol.

When you hold down on the control stick and push A, that's down tilt. MK makes a sort of jabbing motion on the ground with his sword and creeps forward a little as he does so.

When you hold left or right, you can be walking (not running) and do a forward tilt. This will make MK do 1-3 swiping motions, the first on the ground (it kinda looks like down tilt), then a mid ways swipe, and then a final swipe he does toward the sky. You can determine how many times he swings his sword depending on how many times you press A while holding forward.

Finally, up tilt is where you just hold up and push A (it's a lot easier with tap jump off). This makes a thrusting motion where he thrusts his sword above his head.

 

[Orion*]

jab has situational uses, especially because people dont know how to react to it. its not that bad of a move you generally just have better options.

side cancels are overrated imo, but i think everyone should know how incase you randomly side b and are forced to

 

[LordAizen]

I added my friend code to my profile thing if anybody wants to battle me so you guys can see how I play with Meta Knight and give me tips.

 

[Clel]

Quiz time!

MK Ditto - you're recovering to the stage and your opponent begins doing an Fsmash wall as you grab the ledge, and if you land on the stage anywhere in front of him you'll get fsmashed so you can't do that but at the same time he's far back enough so you can't ledgehop fair him. Nadoing above the Fsmash so it still hits him would be an option but he can let go of the fsmash and shuttle loop off the ground to beat it. He can do the same thing if you glide to beat the fsmash.

What are ways to get around it? I really just want some ideas on what to do, cause I pretty much nado back and agree to the shuttle loop but I need to stop doing that if I want to hit the next level of ****!!!

 

[SKidd]

Dear MK boards,

Could your forum be any more active?

 

[LordAizen]

So does anybody want to battle me so I know where I need to improve?

 

[Exdeath]

Quiz time!

MK Ditto - you're recovering to the stage and your opponent begins doing an Fsmash wall as you grab the ledge, and if you land on the stage anywhere in front of him you'll get fsmashed so you can't do that but at the same time he's far back enough so you can't ledgehop fair him. Nadoing above the Fsmash so it still hits him would be an option but he can let go of the fsmash and shuttle loop off the ground to beat it. He can do the same thing if you glide to beat the fsmash.

What are ways to get around it? I really just want some ideas on what to do, cause I pretty much nado back and agree to the shuttle loop but I need to stop doing that if I want to hit the next level of ****!!!

Ledge release>Uair if they're close enough for it to hit. Ledge release>Up-B.Your opponent can either immediately release Fsmash, in which case you should can either predict their option or cancel the glide (before you're in Fsmash range, obviously) or they will continue charging it, in which case it's a free glide attack. Glide attack out-spaces Fsmash from above, and if you jump properly, it spaces it perfectly. Alternatively, ledge release jump back and into a glide. Ledge release>SHAD onto the stage is good as a mix-up. In general, Fsmashing at the ledge is a bad idea when the opposing Meta Knight knows how to deal with it. Meta Knight has no movement when Fsmashing or charging Fsmash and several of Meta Knight's ledge options beat it with invincibility and/or range.

 

[Kaffei]

They will most likely stand a roll’s length away and charge a Fsmash. This is the best spacing because it out ranges a ledge hopped F-Air and a get up attack. If they’re pretty close to the ledge while charging an fsmash, use a get up attack. They have to time it perfectly to hit you before the attack comes out, and if they are over 100% and you hit them with the get up attack, they can’t retaliate.

Top Meta Knights like to plank for a little bit (while throwing U-Airs), wait for the other MK to do something like F-Smash or a tilt, and nado through them while they are off guard. It’s especially effective if they keep charging smashes since they’ll most likely charge another one and you can catch them off guard and hit them with a nado before they release another F-Smash. However, if you become predictable, they can just GSL, which is great vs Tornado, even OoS. Also, GSL will hit them if they're near the ledge, even if they aren't above it.

Seibrik likes to ledgedrop, hold down (so he wont grab the edge), jump on the very tip of the edge of the stage and F-Tilt. DoJo likes to do something similar only with an airdodge into the ground and buffer an F-Tilt. This is very useful if you time it correctly.

However, anytime you touch the ground, you have at least 2 frames of landing lag, which CAN be punished by pretty much anything, usually F-Tilt or D-Smash. This means air dodging into the ground will never work, which is why when you're juggling MK (or anyone, really), you should stay within D-Smash range when they're trying to land, and make sure you D-Smash right as they hit the ground so it's as if they land on the hitbox.

On side note, U-Tilt beats Tornado from the sides (Like Marth's U-Smash), but it's not really that useful.

 

[Ragnar0k]

Utilt *****. I like how long the hitbox lasts.

 

[-Ran]

I ***** all his mains in tourney before (Snake at a previous Hobo and Marth at this Hobo) so he has to fall back on MK.

Ouch. Beating someone at high percent isn't '******' their character. You beat my Marth because I failed to do the grab release to spike. This was after I threw you from the left of Battlefield to the right of the stage, reading every air dodge, spot dodge, shield, and attack you made. I just missed the spike due to my sweaty fingers. =p

When you played my Snake, back in February, it was after I came back from not playing for two months, after a time where I hadn't used Snake for two months prior since I had been focusing on my Marth. My Snake still hasn't really recovered from that break, haha. I think it's time to get him back attention, but that might just be because I'm playing Peace Walker. Lol.

The MK ditto was brought on due to the extreme heat, and my experience playing against Lee. I typically resort to MK against Lee as a break to avoid getting gimped with Marth or Snake during the times we practice. I two stocked you cleanly in the first match, and since I was unaware of many of the tricks on Delfino for MK [only having played him on Neutrals] it was then closer. Even if you had shuttle looped me instead of drill rushed, I was prepared to DI it properly since I knew that's what you were going for. Your SL was also decayed due to two or three uses that life, if memory serves me correct. Then again, I can't remember much from Saturday at this point from the heat.

Don't get me wrong, it was a good match. I feel that everyone was making mistakes at the tournament due to the heat. I think that we were fortunate not to have anyone pass out due to heat exhaustion. Seriously, it could have been bad. If you still feel wronged by the match, feel free to money match me next tournament.

Ps: Someone directed me here. Can't really name search my user-name. Lol.

 

[iFudge]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCV14-rIQqE&feature=related#t=1m40s
what kind of nair is that rar?

 

[Player-4]

The only time you had me in a GR was at 13% which wouldn't have done a thing. And trust me you were dead from SL from where you were on Delfino, an in air SL would have kill you that close to the blast zone, not matter how decade it was.

Maybe saying I ***** your Marth was an exaggeration but after the first stock I had it figured out and clearly took control.

I don't understand your reasoning behind you saying you switched to MK since I didn't gimp your Marth once, and switching because of heat, what the hell is that? I killed all your stocks through damage racking and smart playing, not dumb gimps. Also, if you had been practicing your Marth so much, why did you go Snake against me back at Hobo 23?

But yeah, I do feel wronged out of my match. I played like **** that whole tourney, I won't lie about that. But I shouldn't have lost that set against you. Especially on Delfino.

So yeah, I'll MM you at Hobo 26.

 

[*JuriHan*]

so MK can win you sets, have no bad matchups, 748378 ways to recover, counterpick anyone, the bess,


but...

can he cure AIDs? I won't use him unless he can do this!

 

[-Ran]

I don't understand your reasoning behind you saying you switched to MK since I didn't gimp your Marth once, and switching because of heat, what the hell is that?

But yeah, I do feel wronged out of my match. I played like **** that whole tourney, I won't lie about that. But I shouldn't have lost that set against you. Especially on Delfino.

So yeah, I'll MM you at Hobo 26.

You weren't the only person playing bad that day. I switched to MK because I wasn't playing smart with Marth because I wasn't focusing properly. Everyone was sapped by the heat, and so I just didn't feel like using my Marth when I knew I'd be able to use less effort and win with MK.

The reason I had gone Snake previously against you, is because I've never enjoyed the Marth vs Mk match up. Mk out ranges everything that Marth has on the ground, and the only thing that Marth has against MK in the air is perfectly spaced Fairs. Everything else MK can deal with on reaction, and if the MK is in the lead, they just have to camp with tornado to bait either a counter or dolphin slash which yields easy damage percentage. I just hadn't realized at the time how rusty my Snake had become from not using him for four months.

$5 dollar money match accepted, after the tournament. Ac required. =p

 

[*JuriHan*]

this thread fails! No1 answered my question111!

 

[LordAizen]

so MK can win you sets, have no bad matchups, 748378 ways to recover, counterpick anyone, the bess,


but...

can he cure AIDs? I won't use him unless he can do this!

Meta Knight is actually Chuck Norris with a mask so of course he can.

 

[Orion*]

Quiz time!

MK Ditto - you're recovering to the stage and your opponent begins doing an Fsmash wall as you grab the ledge, and if you land on the stage anywhere in front of him you'll get fsmashed so you can't do that but at the same time he's far back enough so you can't ledgehop fair him. Nadoing above the Fsmash so it still hits him would be an option but he can let go of the fsmash and shuttle loop off the ground to beat it. He can do the same thing if you glide to beat the fsmash.

What are ways to get around it? I really just want some ideas on what to do, cause I pretty much nado back and agree to the shuttle loop but I need to stop doing that if I want to hit the next level of ****!!!

glide attack. nado and wait for him to shuttle loop. jump over and dair it. you have a lot of options off the ledge and infinite time almost to wait for an opening

 

[Jem.]

Quiz time!

MK Ditto - you're recovering to the stage and your opponent begins doing an Fsmash wall as you grab the ledge, and if you land on the stage anywhere in front of him you'll get fsmashed so you can't do that but at the same time he's far back enough so you can't ledgehop fair him. Nadoing above the Fsmash so it still hits him would be an option but he can let go of the fsmash and shuttle loop off the ground to beat it. He can do the same thing if you glide to beat the fsmash.

What are ways to get around it? I really just want some ideas on what to do, cause I pretty much nado back and agree to the shuttle loop but I need to stop doing that if I want to hit the next level of ****!!!

Just drop down and use your jumps and uair safely and regrab the ledge. He'll move eventually. Or full hop from the ledge and go above him, air dodge if he shuttle loops. Or you can do your idea of nado, but there is always the chance he has a good reaction time and lets it go killing you.

Orion: my only problem with that is glide attack and fsmash trade a good amount of the time. So if you're at kill percent, you just lost (even if he's at high percent, he'd die off the ceiling after you die off the side from the trade) its a risky "hope" to go for the glide attack

 

[Clel]

Thanks for the ideas people =) it really helps

Also I wanna hear what happens in that money match between Ran Iji and Player4!

so MK can win you sets, have no bad matchups, 748378 ways to recover, counterpick anyone, the bess,


but...

can he cure AIDs? I won't use him unless he can do this!

me and my friend beat swine flu with double meta

 

[Orion*]

Orion: my only problem with that is glide attack and fsmash trade a good amount of the time. So if you're at kill percent, you just lost (even if he's at high percent, he'd die off the ceiling after you die off the side from the trade) its a risky "hope" to go for the glide attack

the spacing is hard if you arent used to it but glide attack outspaces fsmash. once you learn it the its not "hoping".

although unless your opponent isnt a reading type of player not the best plan to use more than once, but that could be said for anything. the cool thing about glide is that you have so many options, ie, cancelling it and baiting the fsmash and then tilting them. or going back to the ledge, or going past the ledge below the stage.

your best option is still just to plank until your opponent does something stupid if winning is on the line

 

[LordAizen]

Alright i'm getting slightly better with Meta Knight but how do you guys control the Space Shuttle Loop? That's one thing I've been having trouble with.

 

[Orion*]

Alright i'm getting slightly better with Meta Knight but how do you guys control the Space Shuttle Loop? That's one thing I've been having trouble with.

control the space shuttle loop?

the spacing of shuttle loop? in the air, on the ground, are you talking about abusing the invince frames or the glide after. thats not clear lol

 

[RMelee]

Hello again Metas!=) Could anyone give me some insight as to which approaching methods are the best/safest/gayest in the meta knight ditto matchup? Now i don't claim to know anything but i attempted to figure this out today and i think these are the best ways to approach (as they seem to beat 60% - 100% of the opponent's counterattack options) but please feel free to correct (not flame) my ideas. Thanks!=)

Okay here's my top 4 theoretical approaches(cause "top 5" is spammed more than nado =P)

1st) dash into F-Roll - It places you behind your opponent; able to grab, tilt, or anything you want while they are facing the opposite direction waiting to be punished. As far as i can see, the only time this shouldn't work is when you abuse it and your opponent knows how to punish it.
2nd) dash into shield - This one blocks every counterattack besides grab (and they probably wont grab since it only punishes dash attack and this approach) and lets you punish with several options OoS.
3rd) dash into sidestep - Again this one negates any counterattack but is beaten by f-tilt and d-tilt.
and lastly...
4th) sh-fair - Seems to stop the opponent from getting any closer to you although if they get within grab range and shield it then you get grabbed or f-tilted.

Well that's what i could come up with and again please feel free to correct any mistakes you see or you can put forth any other approaches you think are better.

 

[ぱみゅ]

I need Matchup help. Like, A LOT.
I can't beat my friend's ROB (it's very aggro, and use to **** me in many silly ways...), and some tips for Pikachu (annoying as hell).

Everybody here has a lot of secondaries, and the MU thread either doesn't have summaries or are outdated (like ROB's...)

 

[Motel Vacaville of the West]

What do you do when Snake blocks all 3 hits of your F-Tilt, and you don't want to be F-Tilt by Snake?

 

[iFudge]

What do you do when Snake blocks all 3 hits of your F-Tilt, and you don't want to be F-Tilt by Snake?

if the first one doesnt connection either roll away, try to grab them. or just gtfo outta there. there's always the rare occasion that there think you'll roll away and punish. but you continue with f-tilt.

 

[Player-4]

Hello again Metas!=) Could anyone give me some insight as to which approaching methods are the best/safest/gayest in the meta knight ditto matchup? Now i don't claim to know anything but i attempted to figure this out today and i think these are the best ways to approach (as they seem to beat 60% - 100% of the opponent's counterattack options) but please feel free to correct (not flame) my ideas. Thanks!=)

Okay here's my top 4 theoretical approaches(cause "top 5" is spammed more than nado =P)

1st) dash into F-Roll - It places you behind your opponent; able to grab, tilt, or anything you want while they are facing the opposite direction waiting to be punished. As far as i can see, the only time this shouldn't work is when you abuse it and your opponent knows how to punish it.
2nd) dash into shield - This one blocks every counterattack besides grab (and they probably wont grab since it only punishes dash attack and this approach) and lets you punish with several options OoS.
3rd) dash into sidestep - Again this one negates any counterattack but is beaten by f-tilt and d-tilt.
and lastly...
4th) sh-fair - Seems to stop the opponent from getting any closer to you although if they get within grab range and shield it then you get grabbed or f-tilted.

Well that's what i could come up with and again please feel free to correct any mistakes you see or you can put forth any other approaches you think are better.

Don't Dash Attack into MK. It's really REALLY unsafe. It's easily shield grabbed and Dtilted and Ftilted which are all of MKs best ground options, especially in the ditto.
Here's what you wanna do:

Smart SH fairs are good, like you mentioned. Whether they're retreating, stationary, or approaching. A semi safe wall is SHfair to Dtilt once you hit the ground. It's hard to combat and can get in your opponents head.

Spaced Ftilt is the best move in the Ditto. 95% of MK players will tell you this.

Dtilt is also really good. It also combos into itself along with Dsmash, Dash Attack, Ftilt, and grabs (on trips), at low percents.

If you do Dash Attack and pull it off at low percents, it's a free Nair, Uair, or Shuttle Loop.

Grounded Up-B is also really good in the ditto since it cuts through everything.

Uair pressure from below is really hard from MK to stop, since MK's Uair is faster than his own Dair.

Now rolling behind other MK's isn't too bad because you can usually get a free grab. But DO NOT spam it or do this at high percents. You're just asking to get Dsmashed.

Grabs are really important in this match up too. Always Dthrow. It leads to auto-combos like Fair, along with mind games like regrab or Fsmash if you read them.

Nair and Up-B OoS is also amazing when your shield is being pressured.

I need Matchup help. Like, A LOT.
I can't beat my friend's ROB (it's very aggro, and use to **** me in many silly ways...), and some tips for Pikachu (annoying as hell).

Everybody here has a lot of secondaries, and the MU thread either doesn't have summaries or are outdated (like ROB's...)

Tornado his ***. Smart torndaos are the key to this match up, along with staying in the air. You need to watch his Uair and Fair, along with his annoying Bair and Nair in kill percents but you win in the air. Juggle him. There's nothing he can do but air dodge, so juggle him and bait his air dodges and punish accordingly.

What do you do when Snake blocks all 3 hits of your F-Tilt, and you don't want to be F-Tilt by Snake?

Don't use all three hits on his shield. That's you're best option. Use up to the second hit of Ftilt then get out if he shielded both, otherwise you will be taking his Ftilt after you use that third hit of Ftilt on his shield.

 

[LordAizen]

control the space shuttle loop?

the spacing of shuttle loop? in the air, on the ground, are you talking about abusing the invince frames or the glide after. thats not clear lol

well practically everything lol. I can't really find it useful for recovering since it's hard to move in it and the only time I Find use for it is when their in high percents and I use it to kill them. I guess I don't know all of it's uses and it would be helpful to know everything about it.

 

[Exdeath]

Orion: my only problem with that is glide attack and fsmash trade a good amount of the time. So if you're at kill percent, you just lost (even if he's at high percent, he'd die off the ceiling after you die off the side from the trade) its a risky "hope" to go for the glide attack

Learn to space it better. Glide attack consistently out-spaces it from above. He's a stationary target, so it's not like your opponent can interfere. Like I said earlier, you can re-grab the ledge on reaction if he lets go of Fsmash early and if he waits then it's a free glide attack.

 

[Orion*]

1st) dash into F-Roll - It places you behind your opponent; able to grab, tilt, or anything you want while they are facing the opposite direction waiting to be punished. As far as i can see, the only time this shouldn't work is when you abuse it and your opponent knows how to punish it.

doing this sparesely is actually a good option, ksizzle got me into it recently. mks forward roll is ghey as hell lol

dash into shield - This one blocks every counterattack besides grab (and they probably wont grab since it only punishes dash attack and this approach) and lets you punish with several options OoS.

its also punished by doing nothing. but overall it is a very good approach, especially if youre good at powershielding.

dash into sidestep - Again this one negates any counterattack but is beaten by f-tilt and d-tilt.

ehhh. it Can work but i think this is generally just a crappy option. no reason to put yourself in that much risk tbh, theres probably a better move you could do in that situation every time

4th) sh-fair - Seems to stop the opponent from getting any closer to you although if they get within grab range and shield it then you get grabbed or f-tilted.[/qoute]

it beats most things but yeah ftilt or upB (kill move) will beat it so dont spam it. ntm its about 19 frames of cool down (iirc my frame data is generally correct feel free to correct me if its not) people will hit you after

I need Matchup help. Like, A LOT.
I can't beat my friend's ROB (it's very aggro, and use to **** me in many silly ways...), and some tips for Pikachu (annoying as hell).

Everybody here has a lot of secondaries, and the MU thread either doesn't have summaries or are outdated (like ROB's...)

if rob jumps at you tornado.
if robs running around the ground, dair camp him. when his shield isnt high tornado and itll shield poke. his only/best option is to fsmash the nado, so just start waiting for the fsmash because hes forced to sit there and charge it and then you just **** him in the end lag lol.

seibrik made some good points on beating pikachu on this board recently check and see if its still up

What do you do when Snake blocks all 3 hits of your F-Tilt, and you don't want to be F-Tilt by Snake?

1. (generally, not always true though there are some specific situations its good) dont ftilt snake
2. if you ftilt 1 and it hits shield. run away. the risk reward for fighting snake on the ground is awful rofl. if you are 100% sure you have a read tornado/grab or something but its just generally risky. if you have the % lead i would definitely just not deal with it

Don't Dash Attack into MK. It's really REALLY unsafe. It's easily shield grabbed and Dtilted and Ftilted which are all of MKs best ground options, especially in the ditto.

its very good if you read a dash or jump and can punish endlag so not necessarily. the move comes out very fast

Smart SH fairs are good, like you mentioned. Whether they're retreating, stationary, or approaching. A semi safe wall is SHfair to Dtilt once you hit the ground. It's hard to combat and can get in your opponents head.

its safe on like wifi? lmao people will run up and just either a powershield either move -> grab. dash attack your fair. or wait until after you fair and walk up and dsmash and because youre dtilting you will di down and die.

Spaced Ftilt is the best move in the Ditto. 95% of MK players will tell you this.

stage dependent imo

Dtilt is also really good. It also combos into itself along with Dsmash, Dash Attack, Ftilt, and grabs (on trips), at low percents.

it doesnt actually "combo" but peoples reaction time cant deal with how fast the followups come out so you have to guess what mk is going to do

Grounded Up-B is also really good in the ditto since it cuts through everything.

i wouldnt say its really good because its a situational move. it gets punished pretty bad imo, ntm it puts you above mk if you miss/get baited.

Now rolling behind other MK's isn't too bad because you can usually get a free grab. But DO NOT spam it or do this at high percents. You're just asking to get Dsmashed.

well if you know their gonna dsmash juust hold shield and upB oos for it -.- but yeah, i agree with this post lol

Grabs are really important in this match up too. Always Dthrow. It leads to auto-combos like Fair, along with mind games like regrab or Fsmash if you read them.

agree that grabs are important.
i agree that you should dthrow about 70% of the time.
situationally, since uthrow does more percent it is better
bthrow puts them off stage
fthrow at low/mid percents are good because people di up and you can just juggle them
dthrow does not actually combo into anything

well practically everything lol. I can't really find it useful for recovering since it's hard to move in it and the only time I Find use for it is when their in high percents and I use it to kill them. I guess I don't know all of it's uses and it would be helpful to know everything about it.

tbh i think its best used as a kill move unless you are abusing the glide attack clank / invinc frames on the SL. theres a LOT you can write about this move and i dont really have the time or energy to right now i have a final in an hour

Learn to space it better. Glide attack consistently out-spaces it from above. He's a stationary target, so it's not like your opponent can interfere. Like I said earlier, you can re-grab the ledge on reaction if he lets go of Fsmash early and if he waits then it's a free glide attack.

people are lazy in this game and dont learn to space lol

 

[Player-4]

its safe on like wifi? lmao people will run up and just either a powershield either move -> grab. dash attack your fair. or wait until after you fair and walk up and dsmash and because youre dtilting you will di down and die.

I said semi-safe. Nothing is 100% safe against MK lol. It's more to bait and punish. Kinda like charging full Fsmashes (kind of my trademark lol).

stage dependent imo

Ehh I guess. What stages do you not like using it on? I wouldn't see myself really using it on Brinstar, but I would on every neutral.

it doesnt actually "combo" but peoples reaction time cant deal with how fast the followups come out so you have to guess what mk is going to do

I don't think anything combos in Brawl, but like you said peoples reaction time isn't good enough to get out of Dtilt shenanigans. I don't know anyone who gets out of them and I play against a lot of top players.

i wouldnt say its really good because its a situational move. it gets punished pretty bad imo, ntm it puts you above mk if you miss/get baited.

Lol FF cancel it. It's unpunishable when done properly.

agree that grabs are important.
i agree that you should dthrow about 70% of the time.
situationally, since uthrow does more percent it is better
bthrow puts them off stage
fthrow at low/mid percents are good because people di up and you can just juggle them
dthrow does not actually combo into anything

Yeah I agree with that, and a follow up form Dthrow works 95% of the time.


Edit:

Are you the Lion that got punched by Inui?

 

[Orion*]

I said semi-safe. Nothing is 100% safe against MK lol. It's more to bait and punish. Kinda like charging full Fsmashes (kind of my trademark lol). [/qoute]

fair enough . people just get the impression sometimes that they can spam fair/dtilt and itll work and im like na chill

Ehh I guess. What stages do you not like using it on? I wouldn't see myself really using it on Brinstar, but I would on every neutral.

on stages with slants the range being put on a angle can be abused, and any stage thats a "platform" ie, haldberd, delfino, brins ftilt is not that great.

I don't think anything combos in Brawl, but like you said peoples reaction time isn't good enough to get out of Dtilt shenanigans. I don't know anyone who gets out of them and I play against a lot of top players.

i just dtilt -> ftilt every time unless i think theyre holding shield. lmao you cant punish perfectly spaced ftilt on block really so its very safe

Lol FF cancel it. It's unpunishable when done properly.

it gets dash attacked then. like you can you it as a good spacing move incase they dash or something, but its really not as safe as people think on block.

Yeah I agree with that, and a follow up form Dthrow works 95% of the time.

true fax

Edit:

Are you the Lion that got punched by Inui?

ye

 

[Clel]

on stages with slants the range being put on a angle can be abused, and any stage thats a "platform" ie, haldberd, delfino, brins ftilt is not that great.

What moves would you suggest to focus on more when it comes to those stages?

 

[Ragnar0k]

I don't understand why ftilt is any different on a stage where they can come through the bottom of it unless they actually are, and then ftilt wouldn't be good in that situation anyways.

 

[Orion*]

lmao if the other person is willing to not play gay, and you both just want to ftilt battle it out go for it, otherwise the stage is just camping uairs and seeing who can get underneath who. if you arent camping uairs your opponent will just do it to you and then you are in a crappy position. your best option is to run the ledge away from your opponent and then the situation just sets to netral.

if your opponent is drastically better under the stage than you, then technically you can just keep running to the ledge and fight them on stage but that will only work if your opponent
A. any of these -> wont camp you / is ******** / not playing to win
B. doesnt have the % lead

 

[Kaffei]

vs ROB just spam Tornado. His shield is weak!

 

[Ragnar0k]

replace actually in my last post with the word currently. Makes more sense probably. Even if they are though you can just up b or dair OoS to beat it. Or simply get on some platforms or the ledge like you mentioned. Just get away from them, their jumps run out fairly soon before they have to refresh them.