Meta Knight Officially Banned!

[Smooth Criminal]

He was not broken, he just was a tough match up but you lazy holigans can't just get better to beat it. So, you had to recure to this nasty low blow.

Hooligans*

(Dunno what "recure" is. Resort, maybe?)

Gambe, bro, you're not doing any of us anti-banners here a favor with comments like this.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Gambe17]

I hosted an MK ban tourney this weekend that had 41 entrants (like 2x the normal amount NC tournaments get)

so yeah...mk ban does increase entrants, lol

Yea sure, it does increase entrants on scrubby states because theres not as high competitive level as to say a NJ/NY?

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Yea sure, it does increase entrants on scrubby states because theres not as high competitive level as to say a NJ/NY?

Actually the Carolinas are a fairly competitive pair of states in relation to Smash, both in Melee and in Brawl.

Don't get it twisted.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Conviction]

Is smashchu still comparing us to other games?

 

[Ripple]

YO, I'm back. any more people quit/come back?

 

[CaptainKirby]

Meta Knight: Victory...is my- *reads thread* ...memory.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

He is.

Believe it or not, I kind of agree with Smashchu on some points (for a change).

It's kind of like what Thiocyanide said about the nature of the ban, but only inverted. Smashchu has the right idea, but it's coming out in the wrong way and at the wrong time.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Conviction]

Nc saw a double entry amount at a local with mk banned.

 

[Gambe17]

Actually the Carolinas are a fairly competitive pair of states in relation to Smash, both in Melee and in Brawl.

Don't get it twisted.

Smooth Criminal

SC > NC
/10chars

 

[Mithost]

I don't want to argue, I just wanted to know why people would rather have one character dominate the metagame then have characters like wolf, peach, olimar, ROB, and Dedede extend the high/top tiers. Can someone explain this to me? :S

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I wasn't even talking about that, Iblis.

I was talking about presenting these kind of arguments before the URC decided to make a permanent decision. That's all.

And it's **** like that Gambe that leads me to believe you're a troll. Say "hello" to my ignore list.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Conviction]

Lol no you're stupid. Nc is better. I live in that region

 

[Conviction]

@smooth: sorry I'm having a hard time responding with such a fast moving thread on my mobile. I'm not disagreeing with you and my last post wasn't directed at you XD

 

[Gambe17]

I wasn't even talking about that, Iblis.

I was talking about presenting these kind of arguments before the URC decided to make a permanent decision. That's all.

And it's **** like that Gambe that leads me to believe you're a troll. Say "hello" to my ignore list.

Smooth Criminal

Ok, then! **** you, Goomba!

Lol no you're stupid. Nc is better. I live in that region

Really, really, reallyyyy??

 

[cHp]

^
You know, a lot of people are actually open minded about what anti ban might have to say and you're just ****ting all over their integrity

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I don't want to argue, I just wanted to know why people would rather have one dominate the metagame then have characters like wolf, peach, olimar, ROB, and Dedede extend the high/top tiers. Can someone explain this to me? :S

Riddle me this. How is it variety when it's the same characters, in that spread you listed, placing in the money all the time?

Short answer? It's not really variety. In the short-term (and comparatively-speaking to Brawl's metagame for the past few years), it is. But what if after a while that wasn't the case and that if it indeed just was those characters placing at tourneys?

It's a pratfall that all fighting game communities fall into regardless of whether it's Smash or any other fighting game you can think of. Some characters are better than others and, with the right players, they can be taken further than their more inferior counterparts. That's not to say that really good players playing bad characters can't win, it's just that the really good players playing the really good characters have a better chance at placing high because they (effectively) have the better tools to do so through their character choice.

Competition itself is a really, really muddy thing; you can't really pin down EVERY eventuality because things happen. Could be luck, could be a lack of skill...really, it can be anything. There are few constants, though, that'll improve your odds of winning. Character selection is one of them.

*shrugs.*

Who knows what kind of technology this will yield for Brawl? I may dislike the nature of this character ban, but it could open up a lot of interesting avenues.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Flayl]

I don't want to argue, I just wanted to know why people would rather have one character dominate the metagame then have characters like wolf, peach, olimar, ROB, and Dedede extend the high/top tiers. Can someone explain this to me? :S

Because there's a line between a character being the best in the game and the character being too good. It seems the US has finally reached a consensus that MK passed that line. He could dominate tournaments (depends really on the definition of dominate) to a degree and not be bannable.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Because there's a line between a character being the best in the game and the character being too good. It seems the US has finally reached a consensus that MK passed that line. He could dominate tournaments (depends really on the definition of dominate) to a degree and not be bannable.

This, too.

>_> Thanks for addressing that Flayl.

Lol.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Flayl]

You basically said what I said but with more insight lol, it's what I get for tabbing in between posts.

 

[JayBee]

Brawl is amazing without MK.

Its as simple as that fellas. Justice has been served.

 

[Black Mantis]

SC > NC
/10chars

Looooooooooooooool

Now I know you're trolling.

If NC is scrubby then mm some NC players at Apex.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

I think we should have more polls and URC decisions. Maybe they should make a poll on banning Brinstar and RC. Lets see what the community thinks about those stages.

 

[Ralph Cecil]

I think it'd be kind of split. Anyone i've heard talk about it hates on of the two, but doesn't mind the other lol.

 

[TheLastCacely]

inb4 the top mks drop the char, and not even use them for apex 2012, and then EU or Japan will body us... and then everyone will be like " America sucks"

 

[Mithost]

It's all about that all important line between a good character and a too good character, and the argument comes from anti-ban players saying the line hasn't been crossed while the pro-ban players say it has been crossed. In my opinion, the line has been crossed for a while. I know however that MK players do not think this, and that my opinion might not be right, and it might not be wrong either. The URC thinks the line has been crossed from what I've heard, and decided to ban MK based on it. There is not really a chance of putting MK back into the game unless something catastrophic happens with the metagame.

 

[Black Mantis]

inb4 the top mks drop the char, and not even use them for apex 2012, and then EU or Japan will body us... and then everyone will be like " America sucks"

This as well^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[Ralph Cecil]

inb4 the top mks drop the char, and not even use them for apex 2012, and then EU or Japan will body us... and then everyone will be like " America sucks"

DEHF won the last Apex with all of our MKs there so I doubt it'd make too big of a difference if our MKs did do that.

 

[Ripple]

I think we should have more polls and URC decisions. Maybe they should make a poll on banning Brinstar and RC. Lets see what the community thinks about those stages.

I guarantee half of the community hasn't even visited the stage discussion form or knows why certain stages are banned. most are very ignorant of the philosophy in mind

 

[DtJ S2n]

I think we should have more polls and URC decisions. Maybe they should make a poll on banning Brinstar and RC. Lets see what the community thinks about those stages.

One thing at a time, the metagame's already been through one huge change. And also if anything we should to go back and look at other controversial stages without metaknight. For example one of my huge qualms with Norfair was how good metaknight is at running away there. Realistically he can just run away until a lava wall comes up, and then well, he's also super good at interacting with lava wall.

 

[B.A.M.]

I guarantee half of the community hasn't even visited the stage discussion form or knows why certain stages are banned. most are very ignorant of the philosophy in mind

Sounds a lot like the empirical data on MK.............................



People should definitely read up on these stages though. I do think Brinstar needs to be banned.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

I guarantee half of the community hasn't even visited the stage discussion form or knows why certain stages are banned. most are very ignorant of the philosophy in mind

Just because you say that, doesn't make it so

 

[Ripple]

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dare to compare posts? it gives a clear indication that less people view stage forums

 

[SaveMeJebus]

dare to compare posts? it gives a clear indication that less people view stage forums

Depending on what happens, these things change. Make an announcement like " All stages except FD, BF and SV are banned" and I guarantee it will change. It all depends on what players want to see. They could also want to see why these things happened. Let me give you an example. Why are there more overall posts in the top tier character boards than there are in the low tier character boards? Because players are more interested in the top tier characters. All that could change though if a low tier finds a new game breaking AT

 

[Ripple]

Depending on what happens, these things change. Make an announcement like " All stages except FD, BF and SV are banned" and I guarantee it will change. It all depends on what players want to see. They could also want to see why they happened. Let me give you an example. Why are there more overall posts in the top tier character boards than there are in the low tier character boards? Because players are more interested in the top tier characters

stages will ALWAYS be less popular. anything the URC does with stages will be slow. it will cause some people to check out stage forums but nothing significant

 

[SaveMeJebus]

stages will ALWAYS be less popular. anything the URC does with stages will be slow. it will cause some people to check out stage forums but nothing significant

But why does that matter at all? We shouldn't make a poll and discuss this because of the reasons you posted above?

 

[Ripple]

But why does that matter at all? We shouldn't make a poll and discuss this because of the reasons you posted above?

yes, exactly.

people can't be ignorant of what MK does because people play as him.

but people are ignorant of stages because over half the community thinks certain stages are "gay" and refuse to play on them.

people refused to play on brinstar because of MK, same with RC to some extent.

people refuse to play on ps2 because transformations are dumb.

most people haven't play that stage in tournament at all

 

[SaveMeJebus]

yes, exactly.

people can't be ignorant of what MK does because people play as him.

but people are ignorant of stages because over half the community thinks certain stages are "gay" and refuse to play on them.

people refused to play on brinstar because of MK, same with RC to some extent.

people refuse to play on ps2 because transformations are dumb.

most people haven't play that stage in tournament at all

But players do play on those stages. I'm pretty sure everyone has been taken to one of those stages at one point or another (you can't always ban both) so players do know what they are talking about.

Players don't really have to worry about MK anymore.

 

[Ripple]

But players do play on those stages. I'm pretty sure everyone has been taken to one of those stages at one point or another (you can't always ban both) so players do know what they are talking about.

Players don't really have to worry about MK anymore.

yeah by MK. which is why most think it's dumb already.

I used the past tense, not the the present anyway.

 

[B.A.M.]

@Ripple: I was talking about the data like people actually understanding John #s data and Tuen's data, how the top non MK mains have done. Those things. You arent just going to get that because you've played against MKs. Which im sure you are aware since you work with the thread John #s posts his data in. Those things people ARE ignorant of. Whatever, Ive said this a hundred thousand times but that strawman keeps coming out and misconceptions over simple post are made.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/empirical

here you go so you understand next time what im referring to when I say empirical.


EDIT: I do agree more people need to get in the stage discussion thread.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

yeah by MK. which is why most think it's dumb already.

I used the past tense, not the the present anyway.

A lot of players just don't think those stages aren't competitive at all and they should be banned whether MK is legal or not