Megaman X: Day of Death. ~ EVERYBODY DIED. SCUM WINS. GAME OVER.

[Raziek]

Public Mental Note: Rajam now viewing the thread.

 

[Gova]

1. Inferno3044 ()
2. JTB ()
3. Overswarm (3) Rajam, Boat, Xatres
4. Red Ryu ()
5. Circus (2) Nich, Raziek
6. Analytical Buttheads ()
7. Rajam ()
8. Nicholas1024
9. Xatres ()
10. Terywj (2) Circus, FF
11. Raziek ()
12. Boatchouli (2) RR, Inferno
13. Frozenflame751 (1) OS,


Not voting - JTB, AB, Tery

With 13 playing, it takes 7 to lynch!

Deadline is September 20th at 11:59 PM EST (GMT-5).

 

[Xatres]

Public Mental Note: Rajam now viewing the thread.

Bout time. Maybe he'll finally answer our questions. XD

 

[Nicholas1024]

Wow, I see 9 different players in this game viewing the thread right now. If people cooperate we can get the lynch in no time. (And is anyone else amused that OS of all people has the most votes right now?)

 

[Xatres]

Not really, two of the votes are from people who haven't been around the thread for days... :-/

 

[Nicholas1024]

I know, but it's amusing to see.

In more important news:

Xatres, your opinion on Circus?

 

[Xatres]

Rereading, thoughts on Circus impending...

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Unvote
Vote: Circus

Circus is being very Opportunistic, I agree with this.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Here we go! Figures my campus Internet would go down halfway through. It's stupid.

1. Inferno3044 - Town
Support: Solid points for the answers provided when I asked. Otherwise I can see town intent for the majority of his posts. While I do hold some disagreements on the opinions of the definition of a player being defensive, that would be a mistake to justify any sort of alignment, especially from that alone as my only "issue" with Inferno.
2. JTB - Null / Leaning Mafia
Support: I've been null on JTB's "content" although some of it had some good points (justification against FrozenFlame, post #368 for example) but JTB has been active in other games except this one. I wouldn't select him as a lynch target for today per se, but.
3. Overswarm - Town
Support: I fail to see how Overswarm isn't town? I mean, the detail and extent of his posts is absolutely incredible and I sound like I'm buddying, but in reality this is the first time I've played Mafia with this many veterans and I'd like to believe I picked up a lot from watching Overswarm play. Also, I completely disagree with Xatres' newly posted stuff, but that's for another time. More on that later when it's Xatres' turn.
4. Red Ryu - Leaning Mafia
Support:
5. Circus - Null
Support: This slot confuses me. On one hand, I guess some of the points brought up make sense (more specifically against my case, even though I was completely unaware or disagree) but at the same time Circus seems to be hypocritical in calling others opportunistic while showing characteristics of the similar format. For now, I don't know what to make of that, as I have experienced being called opportunistic in various games under different alignments. I'll have to read back on some of the other games I've played in.
7. Rajam - Null
Support: Rajam has not posted much at all, similar to my opinions on JTB. There really isn't much else I can say about Rajam. Wouldn't be surprised if Rajam was just a lurking Mafia, though.
9. Xatres - Leaning Mafia
Support: Hm. I believe there's some of the absurd stuff Xatres has been posting. More exclusively, the argument versus Overswarm. Mainly, the information seemed unreliable and hashed. I really don't think using the so-called "scumslip" could be effectively used as part of a wagon at all (addressed in point #3) and the reason was trash to begin with. Furthermore you're just implying you wanted to use this slip from the very beginning and seems like a lack of effort on your end.
11. Raziek - Null / Leaning Town
Support: I used null on Raziek until more recently. I like the way Raziek posts and I can see where he comes from for various posts which I would cite but pathetic excuse for campus Internet begs to differ. Also I've seen Raziek's Mafia team play from my hosting of Disco UPick 3 and I'll be keeping a close eye on that and making theoretical comparisons in the future.

I've got the people missing from this list on hold.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Rajam, I see you please catch up and comment as soon as you can.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Here we go! Figures my campus Internet would go down halfway through. It's stupid.

4. Red Ryu - Leaning Mafia
Support:

So...there is no reason for this?

 

[Rajam]

:o sorry guys, Independence day (which is more of an Independence week) + "unexpected" job => I had and I'll have very little time for Mafia, so my activity will be even lower than usual.

@mod: If possible I'd like a replacement. I'll still play as long as I don't get replaced though, which means I'll play until I die or endgame if it comes to it, so it's not urgent. Sorry about the problems

All this said, I'm very behind in the game, around page 6 ~ 7 / 16. (40 ppp) + some other random posts, so I won't be able to give much "updated" reads. I still think OS, Xatres and Ryker are scum, in that order, and the rest are just null. No town reads so far... maybe Nich, but nothing strong. I also suspect a little more on some players which posted during these first pages of the game but didn't say anything really, like Red Ryu, JTB, Circus. I think I was reading now Terywj's first "relevant" post in the game.

Raziek, I'll answer your questions now, but as I said earlier, I don't see where's the WIFOM in my case. If you already answered that, please link me to the post.

@Xatres: which are your questions?

 

[Nicholas1024]

Hey, Tery, did you read my case on Circus?

 

[Circus]

Unvote
Vote: Circus

Circus is being very Opportunistic, I agree with this.

I'm being opportunistic? My brain is going to explode.

Will be bulldozing Nich's wall-o-**** in a moment. Also, expansion on why Tery's the play, though I feel like it should be obvious to anyone paying attention.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

So...there is no reason for this?

You were supposed to be part of the group I shifted over on hold. I realized this after I posted.

I am okay with placing my vote on Xatres for now.

Vote: Xatres

 

[Xatres]

@Rajam: We're long past my questions being relavent, but look somewhere in the middle of the thread, just before the AB wagon. Me and Raz asked you the same questions repeatedly, which you repeatedly ignored.

@Nich: I think you make a good case, but I'm not sure if I want to get behind it at the moment. Especially with Circus's response incoming.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Hey, Tery, did you read my case on Circus?

I've got the people missing from this list on hold.

I will bring this up when I cover that.

 

[Xatres]

@Tery: I disagree with... a lot, on your list (including me, obviously). I'd like to see the rest of it (including the blank spot you left for Red Ryu, before I give a proper response.

 

[JTB]

I apologize for my lack of content, I recently started a new job and I've been going to training for pretty much all day every day. I will be on for these last hours, just give me some time to read up.

Sorry to Soup and the players in this game for not claiming that v/la earlier.

 

[Inferno3044]

Inferno, opinion on Circus, NOW.

I'm not 100% sure. He has given posts showing himself trying to get things going as a townie, but I feel like he has been a little bit of a hypocrite mosting regarding myself for jumping on wagons when he has jumped on wagons himself. I sense some good direction in some of his motives (especially with avoiding a NL), but jumping on wagons seems little opportunistic. So null atm, but I think he should be cop'd.

@Tery - is your case on Xatres mainly for his case on OS? Also I noticed that you have no stance on Frozen.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

@Tery: I disagree with... a lot, on your list (including me, obviously). I'd like to see the rest of it (including the blank spot you left for Red Ryu, before I give a proper response.

I don't know why you thought it was necessary to add "(including me, obviously)" part at all. Just makes you sound defensive after hearing my opinion and trying to save yourself.

Also funny why you mention Red Ryu when I already explained that was a mistaek.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

@Tery - is your case on Xatres mainly for his case on OS? Also I noticed that you have no stance on Frozen.

I've got the people missing from this list on hold.

People these days.

Also, Soupamario, I hit the edit button accidentally en route to quote my post.

 

[Analytical Buttheads]

F*CK ALL OF YOU!

Tery or Boat, NOW!

 

[Raziek]

Because angry yelling gets **** done.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Can we actually get our options narrowed down?

Cause Tery, I wouldn't mind per say, I'd much prefer Boat and Circus honestly.

 

[Raziek]

Then narrow it to Tery, Boat, or Circus.

I personally agree with the point Nich made regarding actual connections from a Circus lynch. I'm hoping he has a post coming (Circus), since he hasn't exactly defended himself yet.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

F*CK ALL OF YOU!

Tery or Boat, NOW!

You're very narrow-minded.

 

[Xatres]

Unvote
Vote: Circus

Circus is being very Opportunistic, I agree with this.

Lol, I don't know why I keep thinking you're mafia, but when I read this I went back and checked EVERY vote looking for a pattern of you riding a wagon. Couldn't find it. In fact, you've been very unopporunistic, which is great considering how many bad wagons we've had.

I'm thinking you are town, RR, despite what my stupid guts keep saying.

Unvote.

Vote: Circus

I'm going out to dinner with some friends, but I should be back for the final hour. Putting my vote on Circus in the meantime, because I trust Nich and RR right now.

 

[Nicholas1024]

DGames must be having a secret yelling and cursing competition I don't actually know about.

It's the only explanation.

 

[Xatres]

I don't know why you thought it was necessary to add "(including me, obviously)" part at all. Just makes you sound defensive after hearing my opinion and trying to save yourself.

Also funny why you mention Red Ryu when I already explained that was a mistaek.

You're reaching, really really far. I'd be open to lynching you toDay too, if it comes down to it. We'll see where the game is in two hours. For now, I gotta peace out.

 

[Analytical Buttheads]

You're very narrow-minded.

3 Hours left, how the hell are we supposed to get a lynch with everyone proposing an off the wall alternative?

DGames must be having a secret yelling and cursing competition I don't actually know about.

It's the only explanation.

Cause otherwise you people don't notice.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Claiming that I'm reaching "really really far" with no viable supportive statement looks pretty pointless to me, Xatres.

 

[Nicholas1024]

AB, in case you haven't noticed, Circus has 4 votes already, me/Raziek/Red Ryu/Xatres. That's over half what we need to lynch.

 

[Inferno3044]

I'd rather it be 2 choices, but if we have to do it with 3 then let it be.

Anybody not on Boat, Tery, or Circus move now.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

1. Basic logic, it's impossible to prove a negative, so it's the null hypothesis, that something does not exist. Otherwise I can claim i have a unicorn in my backyard. You have to prove something happened, not that it didn't happen. So if you intend on claiming that it matches my meta, PROVIDE A SIGNIFIGANT POOL OF EXAMPLES!

What was this in reference to specifically? I seriously don't know what you were getting at.

~Gheb reporting in again [next couple of posts will all be from me].

Frozen, I obviously don't think you're bad at mafia. But you have been playing outstandingly bad in this game and if you're being honest to yourself you can't really deny that. Circus hit the nail on the head when he called your vote on our playerslot "disgusting". Did you actually think that longass post OS posted had any kind of merit in it? I consider you one of the players that are actually smart enough to see through the "write as much as possible to make superficial dumbfvcks happy" crap that OS pulls ALL THE TIME.

I disagree entirely. I've been playing reserved this game and deliberately closed handed. If you interpret that as "bad" play then whatever, but I disagree wholeheartedly. Calling my vote disgusting is bull**** from my perspective is bull****. I agree from your position, if you don't believe my RL johns, the timing of the vote looks scummy as hell. However, the fact that I was CONSISTENT with my stance on you guys and absolutely clear that I was ok with you being lynched or AT LEAST pressured into claiming makes me utterly disagree that my vote was incredibly scummy.

The length of OS's post had nothing to do with my support of his position. The fact that I was going to ****ing ignore the long part and ONLY quoted the short part should be evidence to that. I'm sorry that you hate OS's points so much but I'm against you on this one. I thought that OS's analysis of adumbs meta was pretty good. He turned out wrong but hey, people can be wrong in mafia. It happens. I think it's pretty ridiculous that you're taking my agreement with OS's original stance on you guys and saying that that reflects poorly on me as a player but I guess your anti-OS sentiment knows no bounds.

Again, I wasn't swayed by the length of his post AT ALL. I seriously had similar thoughts regarding adums very general meta that OS pointed out in the short version. I was wrong. I'm terrible at meta. Sorry for agreeing with someone who I know has far more meta experience with adum and who happened to have similar sentiments to mine.

Regarding frozen:

I don't actively support his lynch at this point for I feel that his responses to the accusations have been stronger than adum's points. Once again I'd like to remind you that it does not excuse how carefree you've been playing up to this point. If you look at it from the outside how would you have looked at yourself? You have hardly been of any use - RL johns or not - and what you have offered us did not do you a lot of favor either. I mean it took a wagon to L-2 for you to actually take part in any relevant discussion and to even present your own suspects. That alone makes me think that there's a good chance that you're going to be a liability - something I wouldn't say to you on many occasions.
If you were lynched toDay I wouldn't complain about the result at all regardless of your flip - even though you're not my primary suspect and I won't actively push your lynch atm.

I seriously disagree with your contention that I haven't offered any suspects all game. That's like a serious ****ing lie right there. I listed people who I was ok with lynching in pretty much every post I've made in this game before the wagon on me started, and even after then to a lesser degree (mostly because I've been doing a lot of refutation).

Like seriously, I may not have been offering gigantic cases against people but you're just straight up bull****ting if you ACTUALLY believe I haven't been offering lynch candidates all game.

Anyway, as far as lynch candidates now are concerned. I'm actually starting to favor Boat over Tery now, simply because Tery is here and actually contributing when Boat has literally not made a single concrete stance all day, has not contributed anything, and is absolutely perfect mafia NK bait for tonight so we literally get jack **** from his night kill. We're not going to be able to get much out of this lynch anyway in terms of pre-lynch analysis, so I'd rather just remove the liability.

Unvote
Vote: Boatchouli

I'll be at a comp until deadline but I won't be viewing the thread at all times. I'll be checking in periodically.

 

[Nicholas1024]

Frozen, did you read my post on Circus? What's your stance on him?

 

[Inferno3044]

@AB - if you had a vote, who would you put it on?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Frozen, did you read my post on Circus? What's your stance on him?

I did but I'm gonna refrain from comment atm because I don't wanna muddle discussion or get us sidetracked. We need to narrow a lynch.

I still think circus is scummy but we'll discuss that later. There are better plays today.

 

[Raziek]

I did but I'm gonna refrain from comment atm because I don't wanna muddle discussion or get us sidetracked. We need to narrow a lynch.

I still think circus is scummy but we'll discuss that later. There are better plays today.

We have 4 votes on him already, who do you suggest is a better play? Boat is a wasted lynch. He needs to be force-replaced.

 

[Circus]

Not counting AB who couldn't vote, there were 5 people on Frozen's wagon before he even had a chance to respond.

Those 5 people are OS, Red Ryu, Circus, Inferno, and Raziek.

OS is OS, I had a town read on him beforehand (even if his actions in this regard have shaken it), and it'd take a minor miracle to get him lynched today even if I was super-confident in him being scum.

Red Ryu, Inferno, and Raziek are all closer to the new/bad player end of the scale, and therefore are likelier to sheep when the wagon is led by OS and AB. (Not that I don't plan to confront them over their actions, but they're not my target just now.)

Who's that leave? Circus. Who is one of the players in this game you would NOT expect to sheep. Let's take a close look at his actions, starting with OS's case (when he actually posted it) on AB.

Are you kidding me? You might as well just say that you picked me completely arbitrarily. "OS is OS and the rest are noobs" are not good reasons for disqualification and you should know that.

You are also acting like you already know Frozen is town. Care to show me where that was established? Looks like you're trying to hold my vote on Frozen against me as if it's already clear that he flipped town. If you're trying to frame me, you're jumping the gun quite a bit.

He seems to be favoring the AB wagon, but he hasn't actually joined it. I won't bore you with the quotes (Because seriously, it took FOREVER to get the case across in Time Travelers and I don't have that kind of time before deadline), but Circus had displayed an odd lack of push through the whole game before this point. Seriously, can anyone name a notable push he made? Or even a vote he made before Frozen (without looking back through the thread?)

I've had my vote on Inferno for most of the game. His extra safe and sheepy play has been bothering me all game, and I've been pointing out examples of this as I see them, but a large portion of my time spent on this game has also gone toward trying to figure out OS and whether or not his reads were going to be things I would support or fight. OS made himself town mob leader pretty early on, and that naturally caused me to focus not only on people that I found scummy, but also on what common ground I could find with OS since I knew he would be leading the lynch later on regardless of my own reads.

Also, your analysis that I was in favor of the AB wagon is simply false. You bolded one line out of that post that showed why I considered AB's lynch decent, but it was surrounded with reasons I had for doubting OS' read. I was willing to lynch AB because we were getting close to deadline, but I was still open to other avenues, which is why my vote didn't go on him. You're cherrypicking parts of my posts.

Wait a sec, now he was saying AB had (or nearly had) his mind more or less changed before the color stuff? Circus, what changed your mind on AB?

Nothing changed my mind about AB. I never found his play overly scummy, and his defense was convincing. The only things that really changed were my view of Frozen and my willingness to lynch AB. You are misreading me, or mischaracterizing me.

THIS is where my main problem with Circus lies. Seriously,

Why did you think Frozen was scum?

I'm not buying the no-lynch explanation, because here's the vote count right after AB received his mod punishment.

You don't have to buy the no lynch explanation, since that's not the explanation I gave. The no lynch simply factors into the way I'm manically vote hopping because I want a lynch, which means I'm much more willing to compromise and lynch people that I do not find ideal.

The explanation that I actually gave for my vote on Frozen was how opportunistic his vote on AB looked, after being completely absent from the game for four straight days. I've already explained that pretty well, I think, if you've actually been reading my posts.

Circus was just the third vote. (Fourth if you count AB, but since everyone thought he'd be modkilled... yeah.) There was next to no suspicion on Frozen aside from the recent THREE votes. There had already been a nice big Tery wagon, who Circus has obviously and repeatedly stated as the best vig/lynch choice and very scummy.

I do not recall this Tery wagon you're talking about. Sure, people expressed distaste for Tery, but there was never a wagon from what I remember.

I voted for Frozen because he was looking like the only reasonable option after AB claimed since he had garnered the most votes and I found his jump on AB scummy. We were 12 hours away from deadline. I consider that serious crunch time. The fact that we're still arguing about this and bringing up new options 3-4 hours away from deadline is absolutely bananas to me.

He picks one thing to reply to... and seizes on Frozen saying how a no-lynch would be better than his lynch, and contending that it's scummy. This shows an intent towards pushing the Frozen lynch through.

I picked one thing to reply to at first. I logged on, saw a mountain of new posts to read, and decided to tackle it in pieces, starting with the easiest thing I could respond to.

And of course I was intent on pushing the Frozen lynch through. I was intent on pushing A lynch through, as opposed to not lynching.

Circus, where have you made a notable push towards getting Tery or Inferno lynched?

I guess it depends on what you consider notable. I've been pushing them both all day, but my passion for it has been lacking until recently since we weren't in a ******** scramble for getting someone lynched toDay until right now. I will freely admit that most of my time has been spent trying to figure out how much I want to trust OS and how closely I'm willing to follow his reads.

There is no point to unvoting here if you're not pushing a wagon. You say yourself (I'll bold it in a couple quotes) that your vote on Frozen

Was there more to this? Looks like you forgot to finish writing something, because I don't follow.

Finally, something non-Frozen related. The points here are actually good, what bothers me is that Circus hasn't picked one to actively push for the lynch, he seems to just take the Frozen lynch for granted. If he really wanted a Tery lynch, he could have taken a major step in that direction by pushing it instead of Frozen's wagon, but he didn't. Why? (Scum explanation: Frozen's not getting lynched any time soon if it doesn't happen today, and Tery is almost guaranteed to be lynched at some point down the line. Pushing the Frozen wagon is a free mislynch for scum, and they can point the finger at OS for starting it.)

Again. 12 hours to deadline. We needed (and still need) 7 players for a lynch. In that scenario, you COMPROMISE. Trying to flip to some other player that late in the Day is normally a good way to fall into a no lynch. And hey, look what's happening....

I never pushed for a Tery lynch before because I just thought he was useless and that he should get vig'd. His post regarding AB's goof is what made me want him straight up dead for being scummy.

THIS. IS. SPARTA SCUMMY. Here's the points against it.

1) You claim you were in prevent no lynch mode. Fine, but you were only the third vote (fourth if you count AB). It was completely possible to push Tery over Frozen, considering

a) The case against Frozen is more or less "Frozen's vote on AB was bad due to meta stuff", which doesn't hold a candle to the case against Tery or Boat.

b) There had been more or less NO Frozen suspicion before that, but plenty of Tery suspicion.

c) AB wasn't even close to influential so far this game, for crying out loud he almost got lynched. Just because it's normally a good playerslot doesn't mean much compared to how they've played this game.

What are you talking about? Everyone was following AB. Of course I count AB's vote; he hadn't lost his voting privileges yet. Frozen's wagon was very much the wagon that was rolling down the hill toward the lynch, and Tery's was not. I still found Frozen very scummy. I still do think that Frozen's vote on AB is very scummy. I could have tried to push the momentum toward Tery, but why should I do that if I think Frozen is scummy too?

The only reason I'm on Tery now is because Frozen's wagon was losing steam anyway. I might as well push for who I really want. And also probably because Frozen's AtE worked on me a little bit.

2) If you were (and still are) in prevent no lynch mode....

Why on earth aren't you voting here?!? Seriously, unvoting and leaving your vote unused does nothing but RAISE the possibility of no lynch.

I took my vote off Frozen so he would stop shrieking about the predicament he was in and I could get a better idea of what I wanted to try to do without him filling up the thread with AtE. I said I would be putting my vote back by deadline if I didn't feel like trying to pursue something else.

3)You claim "Frozen's vote on AB was opportunistic". If anyone calls ANY vote on the Frozen wagon (aside from the first two) anything but opportunistic, they're borderline insane.

There is opportunistic and then there's doing what you have to do to make a lynch happen. Townies make concessions in order to keep the Day from ending in a no lynch and robbing town of information. If you had played or watched any game with me in the last few months, you would know that I am no exception to this. I'm on almost every lynch that happens in every game I'm in. Because I want to make sure it goes through, even if it's not my first choice for a lynch. Because seeing flips is CRUCIAL for town.