Marth's weaknesses

[GPEternity]

how is it harder to punish when it has more lag, same reach and can be blocked/dodged just as easily?

 

[Emblem Lord]

If you do a retreating Bair you are moving away from your opponent and thus you are alot safer.

 

[GPEternity]

but i mean how is it harder to punish than a retreating fair?

i never said he was slow, hes not slow by any means. but hes not so fast that you can afford to make mistakes where by contrast, characters with excellent recoveries or heavier opponents have a better margin for error even if they are slower than marth.

 

[ChivalRuse]

EL, you mentioned that untipped fsmash isn't worth crap and you hardly use it anyway. So what do you use for kill moves?

And a few other questions:

How useful is utilt as far as KOing?
Does neutral-b actually boost recovery momentum?
In what situations is dtilt useful (auto sweetspotting seems to make it less useful as an edgeguard tool)?
Does SH out of shield > dancing blade work after blocking an attack?
What is Marth's longest reaching move, aerial included, other than fsmash?
What is uair's utility, and is it even worth using? (I.E., does it combo into anything?)

Thanks in advance.

 

[Inui]

Retreating b-air has no lag. Wtf are you talking about? Just autocancel it and be smart. B-air has giant range, too.

 

[meepxzero]

Ive concluded all of marths moves are ****ty except for fair, dtilt, forward b, and retreating bair (against everyone but small characters otherwise this is useless as well). As much as all u marth mains wanna sugar coat how well ALL of marths moves are those are probably the 3-4 you need that are safe and spammable with forward b bein an exception but even thats spammable if used wisely. Every other move requires the opponent to make mistakes, which completely varies depending on the skill level of your opponent. Im not gonna bother arguing this, because the more **** i incorporated with my marth the worse he has gotten. Keep it simple and marth has no real weaknesses.

 

[Emblem Lord]

The fact that Marth has little room for error has nothing to do with his speed and everything to do with his average recovery and below average weight.

I kill with U-smash mostly in juggle traps.

Neutral b does boost your momentum.

I use d-tilt as a poke move and to apply pressure to shielding opponents.

Why you would SH dancing blade out of shield is beyond my comprehension.

Shieldbreaker has the most range. For aerials I would say Fair and Bair have the most range.

Uair is great for juggle traps and forcing reactions when your opponent is in the air.

Check this link if you want to know what a trap is. http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=183969

 

[Inui]

Meep, you're right about some things, but Marth actually does have a good overall moveset. He's just not Meta Knight.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Meep I disagree completely.

No matter how you play it will not give Marth safe kill moves or great recovery.

He has weaknesses no matter what.

And overall Marth's moveset is good, compared to the majority of the cast's move list.

 

[Judge Judy]

Meep I disagree completely.

No matter how you play it will not give Marth safe kill moves or great recovery.

He has weaknesses no matter what.

And overall Marth's moveset is good, compared to the majority of the cast's move list.

And this is coming from Emblem Lord so you know that it's right on the money.

 

[GPEternity]

MK for banned tier?

How reliable is marths u-air for standing opponents? A FF uair combos quickly into utilt usmash and fsmash at lower percentages and tacks on some nasty damage for just 2 hits but how often do that really happen in your experience?

 

[Emblem Lord]

Don't use it on grounded opponents. You have better options.

But I'll mess with it vs my buddy tonight and tell you my results.

 

[meepxzero]

just limit ur moves with marth and i garentee ull do a lot better. brawl is a really simple game lotta moves can be used in many different situations. Look at snake and his ftilts or mk and his dsmash spam. Not saying to trash the rest of his moveset its just feasable to use at all until the opponent makes errors.

 

[ShadowLink84]

I swear this makes me want to have Marth as my secondary. Just cause I enjoy reading what Emblem says. And then I could apply it, making it valuable. >_>

Would the Uair be considered unsafe? Due to its cooldown period?

 

[meepxzero]

its safe to the point where a certain snake can airdodge through it and utilt u....

Yah im gonna b the marth rebel lol cuz im bored

 

[Emblem Lord]

If you space your Uair well enough Snake can't airdodge through it in time to land and hit you before you could recover and hit him.

The key is timing and fast falling the Uair.

 

[Remzi]

MK for banned tier?

How reliable is marths u-air for standing opponents? A FF uair combos quickly into utilt usmash and fsmash at lower percentages and tacks on some nasty damage for just 2 hits but how often do that really happen in your experience?

might as well fair

 

[GPEternity]

i say uair because launches them upward which is a much better position for marth than knocking them back with fair in most cases. i'd like to know if its use as a launcher has any merit because it is a relatively fast attack even though it doesn't have the same sideways reach as marth's other aerials

 

[Shök]

I think you guys covered all the weaknesses.

I can't think of anymore

 

[ChivalRuse]

Thanks for the reply and for the link.

As to why you would SH out of shield to DB, it seems like it might be useful against opponents with projectiles. Because you can SH and move forward, you could shield a projectile, SH out of shield (because dropping a shield and then SHing takes longer than simply jumping I believe) and DB in your opponent's face.

Just a thought.

I'll check out that thread on traps and brickwalls. It looks promising.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

^I've heard that Chuck Norris joke so many times. When Chuck Norris jumps in a pool he doesn't get wet, the water gets Chuck Norris.

 

[J-Money]

now that everyone auto grabs the ledge, marth's edgeguarding game is reduced to back airs off the ledge

 

[Emblem Lord]

Errrrr. No.

 

[ADHD]

Errrrr. No.

But u r teh graet emblum lowrd i r not c hao u kan loose wit dis graet-ness

 

[The Star King]

I would love to know how Snake does 12% damage by laying someone on the ground and Marth does 4% when he smashes someones head right into the concrete. It's...just not right. It's lame and stupid and I hate it.

You forget that Snake snaps their necks as well. Getting your neck snapped tends to hurt a little.

 

[Jibbles]

But still, Marth smashes someone's head on concrete and whatnot. Don't you think it will be painful to have some 16 year old person who is powerful enough to swing a sword without breaking his arm (FSmash) smashing your head on concrete? Your neck would probably break too if he does it hard enough.

EDIT: 19 >_>

 

[Emblem Lord]

16?

Marth is about 19.

 

[GPEternity]

If marth can uthrow you 20 feet into the air, he should be able to throw you into the ground hard enough to do at least 10%

And if it only does 4%, his up throw should only be a little above him so he can combo.

Yay illogical programming.

Oh, the stun on his dancing blade is crap. It doesn't combo if you space the attacks out, thats bull.

 

[alchfilosofer]

16?

Marth is about 19.

17 in FE1 and FE3 book 1, he's 19 in FE3 book 2

 

[Pierce7d]

Eh, I've been gone for a few weeks (what's up EL, Neo, Viet, Backlash, 2ndsteel, ike is solid, Ulevo, Roy, Junk, Ran, TYL2 and sorry if I missed you. Where's TKD?)

Kinda late to add to this thread, but I can help you with your finishing issue. At higher percentages, you can get off a **** amount of grap hits in. Just grab your opponent once, and punch the mess outta them. This'll let you kill with Dancing Blade.

 

[Kinzer]

Marth is a lightweight

Peach is heavier then Marth. Nuff' said.

This made me lol.

 

[Nibbity]

Maybe Peach put on a few pounds, it's been decades, let's not hassle her. I feel bad enough as it is.

 

[Doodx]

No Combos!!!!

 

[Emblem Lord]

lol.

Where have you been these past 4 months?.

 

[ChivalRuse]

^I've heard that Chuck Norris joke so many times. When Chuck Norris jumps in a pool he doesn't get wet, the water gets Chuck Norris.

I'll change my sig when I get a chance. Yeah, I've heard that joke too.

Chuck is too good.

 

[JJR.O.B.]

Peach is heavier then Marth. Nuff' said.

Wow peach needs to get excersising

 

[kidniteman]

hmmm marth does have weak grabs but there good for comboing

 

[Dynomite]

his neutral B is hard to hit off of people and has a bad recovery time and leave him open for even a side smash by ike or snake.

 

[Jibbles]

his neutral B is hard to hit off of people and has a bad recovery time and leave him open for even a side smash by ike or snake.

How the heck is that a weakness? It's just a single move which isn't used a lot (2-3 times a match on average or so). It's not even true in the first place. Shield breaker has lag but it seriously isn't laggy enough to be punished by Ike's FSmash

 

[Pierce7d]

hmmm marth does have weak grabs but there good for comboing

QFT to a degree.

Marth has Fthrow to Fsmash, and Fthrow to Fair SOMETIMES, but tbh, I'd probably prefer stronger grabs.

his neutral B is hard to hit off of people and has a bad recovery time and leave him open for even a side smash by ike or snake.

QFF

It's actually not that punishable if spaced properly. Also, you have to know HOW to use it, not just throw it out randomly like another smash attack. And no, SB does not have enough lag that you'll get hit by Ike or Snake's Fsmash, unless they already started the move behind you, and you threw it at nothing in the opposite direction.

How the heck is that a weakness? It's just a single move which isn't used a lot (2-3 times a match on average or so). It's not even true in the first place. Shield breaker has lag but it seriously isn't laggy enough to be punished by Ike's FSmash

True, except the part where you said it's not used a lot in a match, which is also true unless your me. I have loads of SB tricksies.