Marth Q&A-Ask your questions here!!

[JBM falcon08]

tell me how do i get out of this against falcos.

you are coming back to the stage to get back on, and falco is light sheilding the edge, you can get up perfectly fine, but once you get up, you hit falco down, he ledge hops in front of you and bairs you back off the stage.

how n the heck do i get around that??

 

[Randizzle]

i don't think there's anything you can do to get around that considering how long it takes the up+b to cool down. I guess I just DI and hope for the best.

btw, great playing those marth dittos with you at FC jbm.

 

[JBM falcon08]

yeah gg man i had alot of fun playing with the two of you, i got alot of experience against fox and falco and fc, i really just wish i would've been ready for them b4 my singles first pool.

 

[Emblem Lord]

There is nothing you can do about it. Just DI up and towards the stage.

 

[Aesir]

good counterr picks against samus would be? Lol >_>

 

[Adi]

good counterr picks against samus would be? Lol >_>

Yoshi's Story.

 

[purekorea]

What throw is used in the DI trap against floaties? bthrow or dthrow? It's the one where you predict them DIing away from your fthrow and tricking them.

 

[ArcNatural]

That would be downthrow, only time I find back throw useful is on 150%+ spacies.

 

[Andrew Ott]

Backthrow has a similar but probably lower trajectory than down, but it takes too long to recover from, denying most chaingrab attempts. It's good for setting up fast fallers for a D-tilt, off the stage or no.

Oh and this mindgame vs Marth works a bunch: Grab and downthrow. At this point most people DI forwards, so now, you turn around, grab and F-throw. If they don't DI away, dash grab into an Up-throw. By now they'll probably DI away from you expecting another F-throw, and if they're near an edge with decent damage a spike or tipper is pending. ^.^

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^You know if they DI either the f-throw or the d-throw down at all then that doesn't work right?

i figured it would have made more sense to put this in the ice climber section. but then i thought they wouldnt want marth users knowing what to do against them cause they want to be able to beat them. haha

I think you DI the thow away and down and DI the dair away. I read it somewhere in the melee section when someone was explaining double stick DI.

tell me how do i get out of this against falcos.

you are coming back to the stage to get back on, and falco is light sheilding the edge, you can get up perfectly fine, but once you get up, you hit falco down, he ledge hops in front of you and bairs you back off the stage.

how n the heck do i get around that??

You could hold the c-stick down and towards to try and tech it and hold the control stick towards and up in case ASDI isn't enough to allow you to tech so you can survive the hit.

 

[Aesir]

Quick question, actually more like I dunno...>.>

anyway;

I need counter picking help >_>

against sheik what are stages that marth does well vs her on.
same for falco.
and samus. >_>

/GO

 

[Randizzle]

i like yoshi's story or rainbow cruise against sheik, bf or fd against falco, and ys against samus.

 

[Aesir]

^ Thanks I'll try RC against sheik. I usually try YS or mute city, but I can't always relay on those >.>;

 

[Dark Sonic]

I wouldn't go FD against falco unless you're decent at getting around lasers and are confident in your chaingrabbing, I generally like YS better against Falco because my platform game is better than my chaingrabbing.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Rainbow cruise? WTF? Marth does bad on that stage anyway and Sheik does well there.

I would just go to Battlefield, Yoshi's Story, and Mute City.

 

[Randizzle]

I personally don't find rainbow cruise to be a terrible Marth stage at all. I usually don't have any trouble moving around on the stage and find that the platforms can be pretty useful for continuing some combos. Maybe it's just a weird personal preference i have, but I've had decent experience on that stage against sheik.

But yeah, mute is another good choice against sheik. I'm often a bit reluctant to go with BF since sheik also performs pretty well on that stage, but the stage probably still helps marth more than it helps sheik.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth does bad on moving stages that don't have a solid platform throughout the whole stage that he can base his gameplay around or stage a good offense.

 

[Randizzle]

certainly, the offensive game changes a bit, but i'm certain marth can still manage very well in the different portions of RC. Also, i feel that sheik probably has more difficulty getting around on that stage. But don't get me wrong, I'd easily go with YS first against a sheik before RC.

This very well might just be a personal preference more than anything else.

 

[JBM falcon08]

Mute city is the ultimate stage cp against sheik imo, but BF and FD are good too.

 

[Andrew Ott]

^^You know if they DI either the f-throw or the d-throw down at all then that doesn't work right?

Hence why I said, "If they don't DI." ^.^

The whole idea of mindgames is to do stuff that is possible to get out of but that people don't expect. If it's failsafe it's usually cheap and there's only a few things like this.

And LOL our locations are almost exactly the same.

 

[Dark Sonic]

Hence why I said, "If they don't DI." ^.^

The whole idea of mindgames is to do stuff that is possible to get out of but that people don't expect. If it's failsafe it's usually cheap and there's only a few things like this.

And LOL our locations are almost exactly the same.

Yeah that's if they don't DI, but the generic DI (the one that escapes all the stuff Marth can do after a F-throw) is away AND down. They'll probably DI the second throw down instinctively anyway because they think you're trying to chainthrow them. Even if you actually aren't trying to chainthrow them, they've already got half of the DI for the other throw in place already and will still be able to reach the ground before you can grab them out of that D-throw you mentionned.


LoL. Locations FTW.

 

[lillight3]

does anyone know how priority marth's up air is? i just cant seem to find any real use for it except after a F-air if your too close that you wont tip again with another one.

 

[lillight3]

does anyone know how priority marth's up air is? i just cant seem to find any real use for it except after a F-air if your too close that you wont tip again with another one.

 

[Aesir]

Rainbow cruise? WTF? Marth does bad on that stage anyway and Sheik does well there.

I would just go to Battlefield, Yoshi's Story, and Mute City.

I thought mutecity was good for sheik aside from the recovering aspect?

 

[purekorea]

does anyone know how priority marth's up air is? i just cant seem to find any real use for it except after a F-air if your too close that you wont tip again with another one.

Uair is used for combing. It can set up for Utilts, Fsmash, grab, more Uairs and Fairs. Watch Azen and M2k they use it well. M2K does it on space animals where he uthrow>utilt>uair>fmash. Stuff like that.

I don't remember too well (been a while) but I think Kizzu uses it alot in his combo vids?

 

[Aesir]

he uses fair to uair to another fair to down air.

thats his usage of uair. Lol

 

[Emblem Lord]

Mute City is better for Marth. No edges for people to grab so an opponent off the stage is retardly easy. And cars don't mess up Marth as much because he is floaty.

 

[KyloWinter]

How do you use fair to break combos? I can't seem to time it correctly.

 

[Adi]

Well that's situational for each combo but generally just try to DI away and use the C-stick to F-air them.

 

[lillight3]

adi is right it is very situational depending on the kind of combo that you are caught in. do you have any specific examples so you can be better helped out Kylowinter?

 

[pockyD]

this thread is mad long so i don't know if this has been asked

how useful is shfair->waveland as opposed to a sh fair in place? the loss is you have to start your fair right away, but the waveland gives you some trixies if they aren't expecting it

 

[Emblem Lord]

Just what you said. Some extra trixies if they aren't expecting it.

 

[Andrew Ott]

Lol, Emblem Lord tells people that they answer their own questions alot. ; )

Yeah that's if they don't DI, but the generic DI (the one that escapes all the stuff Marth can do after a F-throw) is away AND down. They'll probably DI the second throw down instinctively anyway because they think you're trying to chainthrow them. Even if you actually aren't trying to chainthrow them, they've already got half of the DI for the other throw in place already and will still be able to reach the ground before you can grab them out of that D-throw you mentionned.

If they DI down during a Down-throw, I'd think that they wouldn't do much. I was thinking of more like F-smashing after that throw anyways, as opposed to another grab.

EDIT: Wait a second, I'm an idiot. In my original post I said Down throw then Forward throw, when I meant the reverse, Forwards then down. >.< Sorry. On that note, you're right, they could use the same DI.

And about Uairs, if you can land a Fair, Uair also messes with DI, and you can rapidly L-cancel into U-tilt>Spike near an edge on FFers.

As Marth, I seem to have alot of trouble against even semi-decent Ice Climbers. I'm up on counterpick stages but I seem to get grabbed altogether too much. Any help?

 

[Randizzle]

Moving stages really really hurt ICs, also go for stages that aren't completely flat and have platforms. That's the general rule against ICs.

 

[knightpraetor]

wait i'm confused now..down DI at low percentages will take care of forward and dthrows no? you'll land in time that is...and at higher damage they will have to di away, which is when you can start playing tricks on them, no?

though the window between when down di works and when they will naturally move out of range even without di and require techchasing is rather small no?

 

[ArcNatural]

For the ice climber question, dtilt ***** IC's. They don't have a great aerial game so the dtilt can generally stop many tactics. Fair to dtilt, nair to dtilt, etc. Once they get frustrated with the fact they can't approach it will open up to other tactics. Just remember to utilize the ISA frames on the dtilt or it is a waste and you will get grabbed. Marth has the upper hand in this match up as long as he stays defensive and keeps the pressure right in front of the ICs. Quick grab throws work as well, don't be afraid to grab ICs as long as you do it quickly. If you ever see nana get a little confused (i.e. not with popo) Fsmash her. Popo can't really do anything devastating alone other than smash attacks.

 

[Andrew Ott]

Ok, so it's defense and pressure at same time, I was thinking more like, "Run away trying to kill Nana, then kill Popo." XD

And to knight, DI away ALWAYS works no matter what, but it's hard to catch, and risky because if they do the opposite throw you DI towards them. DI down is risky all the time though, because after you land you get tech chased. I prefer DI away because at a high level, most people do that throw first.

If you're a space animal and you get f-throw tech chased by Marth, don't DI the second time throw, if there is one, because, for one, tech chasing is 50-50, and two, they will probably up-throw, and any DI is tipper city.

 

[Dark Sonic]

And to knight, DI away ALWAYS works no matter what, but it's hard to catch, and risky because if they do the opposite throw you DI towards them. DI down is risky all the time though, because after you land you get tech chased. I prefer DI away because at a high level, most people do that throw first

At lower percents you can still get f-smashed out of that DI. Down DI is mostly used at lower percents because it won't make you fall over yet and you'll simply land on the ground in a standing postitions. Since the throws send you at about 45 degrees away and up, the most effective DI would be away and down by about 45 degrees to get as far away from Marth as possible. At medium percents the Down DI isn't neccessary to escape and DI away is enough to get you out, but I use the Down AND away DI until then.

 

[Salaad]

For Marths chaingrabs...I don't know what to do when I Uthrow and they come back down (RIGHT above me....) I try to grab, but it won't. I have tried turning around.

Also: Are Off-the-Stage Shield breakers used a lot? Or any Aerials used off the stage? I like to do this to finish off my opponent faster, or should I just be edge guarding?

Ledge (Edge?) teching, when can it be used?

 

[knightpraetor]

so basically away and down is always best to use right? but down works ok at low percents and away works fine at medium percents..anyways i can just use away and down all the time can't I?

are you trying to say away and down at really low percents prevents you from landing on your feet and you tech from a tumble instead.

so down DI is better at those early percents so that you can just recover instead of getting techchased?