Marth Matchup Guide v0.4 (Last Update: 09/21/11)

[stelzig]

That last one matchup is questionable. I think Armada would still win it. lolz.

Armada didn't do that horribly with peach against hbox puff either (like he was even a full stock ahead most of game 1, then got rested on his last stock) so I would call that one questionable as well. It kinda surprised me that he completely gave up on the matchup, but maybe it really was just because he hates the character and wanted to time hbox out, lol.

 

[Archangel]

Armada didn't do that horribly with peach against hbox puff either (like he was even a full stock ahead most of game 1, then got rested on his last stock) so I would call that one questionable as well. It kinda surprised me that he completely gave up on the matchup, but maybe it really was just because he hates the character and wanted to time hbox out, lol.

I think he gave up after getting 3-0'd. Hbox was playing silly gay that day. Armada went YL to get payback i'm sure of it.

 

[BRLNK88]

There's no way Hbox's Sheik will be pro level by the time Apex rolls around. I wouldn't be surprised if Armada's YL could beat it. Plus Armada plays a decent Fox as well.

 

[OverLord]

Armada has a **** Sheik, and very good spacies.

 

[Archangel]

when you play the game for so long you can adapt to another character alot easier. Especially if it's an easy character like sheik. Ylink vs Sheik is like...70-30 so even if he's not great odds are he'll win in a close match. Young link can camp he isn't much of a fighter and sheik's needles are faster than anything he's got really so...idk I think Hbox could time him out. Especially if he planks.

Armada's fox could do work on him though who knows.

 

[stelzig]

I think he gave up after getting 3-0'd. Hbox was playing silly gay that day. Armada went YL to get payback i'm sure of it.

He got 3-0'd, but it's not like any of those 3 matches were clearly in hbox favour (maybe the last one, slightly). The first one even looked like armadas favour, which I already mentioned in my previous post. Even if he did give up because of that 3-0 I think it would have to do with his already very negative mentality towards puff as a character.

 

[BRLNK88]

when you play the game for so long you can adapt to another character alot easier. Especially if it's an easy character like sheik. Ylink vs Sheik is like...70-30 so even if he's not great odds are he'll win in a close match. Young link can camp he isn't much of a fighter and sheik's needles are faster than anything he's got really so...idk I think Hbox could time him out. Especially if he planks.

Armada's fox could do work on him though who knows.

That's certainly true, but the feeling I get about Hungrybox is he's the kind of player that chooses one character and just sticks with it. He can play other characters well simply out of skill and experience, but not super well. In the tight situations, the player (if skill is high enough) who has more experience with their character will almost always win.

 

[Heart Break Kid]

Marth v Falco is 85/15 in favor of Marth...c'mon guys learn the matchup already!!

 

[Archangel]

That's certainly true, but the feeling I get about Hungrybox is he's the kind of player that chooses one character and just sticks with it. He can play other characters well simply out of skill and experience, but not super well. In the tight situations, the player (if skill is high enough) who has more experience with their character will almost always win.

If your last statement is true then Hbox should not have lost to Armada. Mango should not have started beating people with Falco, Fox, C.Falcon...even Mario and Link. M2K switched to Marth in 07 and started winning tournaments. Sometimes switching has actually improved players and their overall placing. As for the Match-up to be 100% honest you don't need to be that good to beat Young Link with Sheik. The same way you don't have to be that good to beat Gaymanwatch with Marth. If you have the basics it's all you need. Counter-pick young link to Final D and your looking at probably a 4 stock against anyone .

 

[strawhats]

Yo Spam your sig is IMMACULATE

 

[Hellsinglover999]

Marth v Falco is 85/15 in favor of Marth...c'mon guys learn the matchup already!!

then teach us it

 

[the_CAM_factor]

i doubt it would be a 4 stock but i think it could be a decent match, definitely worth seeing.

 

[Archangel]

Yo Spam your sig is IMMACULATE

yeah it's true....

as for Falco vs Marth being 85-15 I think HBK was high when he posted that.

 

[JediSange]

yeah it's true....

as for Falco vs Marth being 85-15 I think HBK was high when he posted that.

To be fair, his vs Falco game is beast mode.

 

[Archangel]

yeah his set with Lambchops is legendary.

 

[BRLNK88]

If you take away Falco's lasers the MU still becomes... not 85:15 Marth.

 

[Archangel]

If falco had no neut B it would be 65-35 Marth.

 

[Dart!]

falcos lasers arent the problem, its the shine/dair combos that are really hard to DI out of imo.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Once you hit Falco, the matchup is 100-0 Marth.

So yeah, if you get hits on Falco as much as HBK, then I can see the matchup being 85-15 lol. That stric9 set still gives me shivers.

 

[knightpraetor]

i used to always think this matchup was even back when I could only powershield maybe 70% of the time..then there was leffen's legendary post, so I kind of think it's in marth's favor a bit now...

marths definitely don't have an excuse for losing if the falco is comboing for < 50 per shine though.

 

[Construct]

KP, do you disable lightshield for the powershielding stuff?

 

[knightpraetor]

no. it works, but falco is too good at piercing for me to be able to live without lightshield. that said I can't really powershield 70% these days cause I don't play vs falco enough..and i'm mostly training vs fox atm. I still get the occasional powershield though..and leffen's dashback is still pretty much guaranteed. If you have a regular falco practice partner i recommend learning the powershield...but then the falco will stop lasering so much and you will start forgetting how to time it.

dash back is guaranteed powershield though...counterpick FD, take half the space on the stage, and if he dares to laser you powershield wavedash out and put him under pressure...with no platforms he doesn't have any decent escapes except roll away, so you will get back any stage you gave up.

This all assumes you can CG on FD though, while we all know marths can't chaingrab cause they never play FD cause people always ban it (as they should)

 

[Archangel]

There are ways to chain grab on other stages at the opportunism moments and positions.

 

[knightpraetor]

a side note about powershielding. Low lasers suck balls...if your opponent uses them then just jump all over the place and hit him to pieces with nair.

high lasers also suck..crouch like a baller and wavedash around.

medium height lasers are the best...and these are like the easiest thing to powershield in the world. Last tourney I went to I played a falco a bit better than me and I was powershielding like 99% because his lasers were all the same height.

At the very least every marth should be good enough at powershielding that the falco has to choose to use those crappy low and high lasers occasionally..since if he does that he'll probably die more, more likely he will just tone back the number of lasers he uses.

 

[Tero.]

Lol. Ya know, I once wrote up like a 40 page essay on the MU's that I'm most familiar with but I never published it on the boards... it was on one of my old computers... wonder if its still there...

Yo Cactuar! Still waiting for that essay!

 

[Cactuar]

That document is long gone...

 

[Tero.]

Too bad :/

 

[Vestboy_Myst]

bump, this thread was very helpful. worth stickying imo
(and completing, if any marths out there can dedicate some time. some info is pretty out of date and could use a review as well)

 

[Espi]

"In progress"