Le Lazy Lurking Link's Listen/Laugh Lounge ♪~ (^ 。^=)

[Huggles828]

Hmm. I think learning a lot of techniques just to survive as Link can still help though. He's played entirely differently and many of his ATs aren't really all that applicable to other characters, it's true, so it takes time to go from one character to another when playing, but I don't feel like it makes you a worse player per se. Just makes it harder to seamlessly transition from one character to another in back-to-back matches because he's so unique. Now maybe you'd be better off just maining another character if you wanted to get better in the same amount of time, but hey, we play Link because we want to, when it comes down to it, not to gain any competitive advantage.

 

[Ryos4]

Actually i don't agree with that. I change characters after every match with no problem. Its usually beneficial to me as well. My opponents cant get a read on my style and cant counter pick me. Though its true all of my characters have similar approaching and defensive styles, each character tends to have a quirk that makes them different over all.

But really i dont play them for competitive reasons either. I just really cant stand playing the same character over and over, its so boring.

Edit:

This is interesting. I happened upon a match with another person who apparently goes by Negi. And also playing Link in a doubles match. lol. I think it might be the same guy that i saw a vid of before who was playing Pit.

Anyway its an interesting match up with Link and Sonic Vs Rob and Marth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62OjsFhQ5-M&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62OjsFhQ5-M&NR=1

 

[Rizen]

Just makes it harder to seamlessly transition from one character to another in back-to-back matches because he's so unique.

Actually i don't agree with that. I change characters after every match with no problem.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62OjsFhQ5-M&NR=1

I'm halfway on this^. If you know other characters you can go back and forth, it does require a different mindset so you must reeeally know both characters.

Link's game:
ATs to learn:
Anything involving Bombs, including Fsmash and Zair
Landing canceling moves
Ledge stall options
Z edge hugging
Jab canceling
Quickdraw
Maybe another...

The rest is good spacing/timing/buffering, using the best option, reading the opponent, making moves count, and DI.

 

[swordsaint]

links a heavy cross up character

and he also needs to read approaches well so he can cut them off with projectiles and zair and then follow up with epic mindgames

 

[Rizen]

^Jabs too.

 

[swordsaint]

im going to tell you guys right now

use less arrows...they suck giant monkey balls - they get perfect shielded and punished

 

[quirkynature]

^True. But against projectile-less characters, spamming arrows while SH and FH makes a great forced approach.

In a FFA with 4 characters, an arrow will hit somebody, at least, so they're not completely useless. Against a character with a reflector, they'll hit Link back, but my criteria of hitting "somebody" is met.

 

[Ryos4]

I like arrows when used with an arrow cancel. As i said somewhere, it works great at preventing people from following up attacks at low%. As it both prevents you from stumbling with little lag thx to an arrow cancel as well as possibly doing damage to them, if not causes them to stop because they need to shield or spot dodge.

Plus a simple arrow can sometimes mess someone up enough that you can easily get jabs, smashes, or maybe even a grab.

Arrows also work great when used combined with another projectile. SH bomb and arrow cancel can do around 13% damage if both hit. Arrows can shield poke allowing bombs to hit, or bombs can hit allowing arrow to follow up. If fighting someone with projectiles or reflectors. A boomerang followed by an arrow is pretty safe since if they do reflect your boomerang it will cancel your arrow so as to prevent the arrow from being reflected.

Its amazing how much more craziness you can cause with 3 projectiles instead of just 2.

 

[Scabe]

I like arrows, they're good for hitting opponents that are far away and can somewhat force them to approach. People that are approaching is good for Link. He's got so many tools to keep them away. Once they get close you've got bomb combos.

I believe that arrows should be shot with a short hop. It's quick, you don't get landing lag and it shoots a fair far distance.

Arrow cancels are okay when they don't see it coming like back air into arrow cancel. But only if the arrow is at the peak of it's distance. If their really close and you shoot it, you'll get punished in your landing lag since arrows don't give too much stun.

I think there's heaps of potential to Link's spam game, I just don't think we've found anything solid yet.

 

[Ryos4]

Another random tangent.

As doomfire was talking about Smashville being to small for him against a DK. I find big flat stages really hard to work with. I mean sure theres tons of room to run around and spam. But its alot harder to work creatively. Not to mention since you have just one big platform. Attacks like falco blaster, roll out, and even stuff like luigi's down special can be a bit overpowered in terms of approaches or just camping. Link being as big and slow as he is makes him a huge target for spam.

My 2 favorite stages for Link are actually Yoshi's island and Battlefield. Smaller stages with platforms makes it much easier for me to control the stage and string attacks more effectively. It also allows me to deal with people who play super defensive against me. Which are most players, just because it seems rather hard to deal with all the pressure i put out with Link and still be aggressive.

Anyway on to the discussion portion. What stages do you other Link players favor?

 

[Rizen]

Link needs all 3 projectiles and Zair to successfully spam. Ledge stalling arrow's is a great mind game if the opponent's far away.

Stages:
Brinstar's my best stage because Norfair's banned. It works with the gravity factor on every move Link has (excluding boomerang). Link can move around, landing cancel, and control the stage from anywhere. The low ceiling and acid benefit Link's weight, ability to star KO, and poor horizontal recovery.

PS1's good too. It's the right size and terrain for Link's spamming. I prefer this over FD.

Link likes bumpy terrain and has long but not super long or fast spam. FD limits Link but it's nice and big and a neutral. Halberd's like a better FD if you can survive toe start.
Besides Norfair, Link has no best stage it depends on the opponent.

I counter pick for:
Olimar-FD Link needs the camping room.
Characters who need to approach, spam on a flat plane (Falco, Fox) and/or who don't have multiple jumps-Rainbow Cruse.
Most lighter floaty characters/chaingrabbers- Brinstar.
Forcing approaches-Halberd, FD, Jungle Japes
No distinct stage weakness characters/Link has better stage control- PS1, Halberd, maybe Jungle Japes.
MK-Jungle Japes, FD.
When Link's forced to approach-Brinstar, Battlefield, Castle Siege.

Green Greens, Norfair, and Cornaira are good stages banned in my region.

 

[swordsaint]

Reading you stage list, I'm going to tell you right now that you guys don't have a good understanding of falco and how to maximise your chances of winning.

I use Falco, play scabe almost every tournament. And I can tell you firstly that arrows SUCK. At the very least they do against Falco and are worthless. Easily dodged or blocked as well as punished. you guys say it slows us down because we have to shield, but seeing as its so easily perfected shielded, it doesn't slow us down enough - and in either case (at least for falco) we can easily enough jump out of shield and aerial/laser/phantasm the lag. hell, if we WANTED to, we could phantasm straight through the arrow using the priority our phantasm gives. most character can plain out beat the arrows without needing to slow down.

back on to the stages...Falco seriously won't care about Raindow Ride...We don't hate it as much as people think. And we don't 'spam' on a flat plane, rely heavily on approaches. We dont' have multiple jumps...no...but the various platforms make it super simple to avoid gimps or recovery punishes...especially on as slow a character as link. We won't need to recover to a stage where link is waiting. We can go the other way for a safe landing and THEN move to link when we're safe.

The thing is guys, we dont...or at least arent meant to laser as much as people think. Lasering a lot means we might miss other better others and get punished ourselves. we keep them to a bit of a minimum so we're safe. Lasers are meant to cut jumps, and limit your options for better follow ups. I'm telling you now, falco doesn't require a flat plane to use his lasers properly.

Against Falco, you're gonna need as small a stage as legal in your region. Against falco its your best bet. Dislike it a lot against Link. Falco loves room, but he doesnt love it because he wants to spam. He wants space to reset himself, space heavily, cg and room to phantasm. Not to spam.

 

[Ryos4]

I'm pretty sure everyone knows which stage is the best for Link and what not. I was just asking as a personal preference. Its no fun to play Links best stage over and over. But then again atleast its more interesting then FD.

 

[Scabe]

You know guys we have a pretty empty stage thread

I think I could use my Mod powers and transfer these posts there, since I think this is some pretty good information.

For counterpicks I usually just pick stages that I'm comfortable with and that might be bad for the other character.

I really want to start using PS2. It seems like a pretty good stage once you get use to the hazards.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Reading you stage list, I'm going to tell you right now that you guys don't have a good understanding of falco and how to maximise your chances of winning.

I use Falco, play scabe almost every tournament. And I can tell you firstly that arrows SUCK. At the very least they do against Falco and are worthless. Easily dodged or blocked as well as punished. you guys say it slows us down because we have to shield, but seeing as its so easily perfected shielded, it doesn't slow us down enough - and in either case (at least for falco) we can easily enough jump out of shield and aerial/laser/phantasm the lag. hell, if we WANTED to, we could phantasm straight through the arrow using the priority our phantasm gives. most character can plain out beat the arrows without needing to slow down.

back on to the stages...Falco seriously won't care about Raindow Ride...We don't hate it as much as people think. And we don't 'spam' on a flat plane, rely heavily on approaches. We dont' have multiple jumps...no...but the various platforms make it super simple to avoid gimps or recovery punishes...especially on as slow a character as link. We won't need to recover to a stage where link is waiting. We can go the other way for a safe landing and THEN move to link when we're safe.

The thing is guys, we dont...or at least arent meant to laser as much as people think. Lasering a lot means we might miss other better others and get punished ourselves. we keep them to a bit of a minimum so we're safe. Lasers are meant to cut jumps, and limit your options for better follow ups. I'm telling you now, falco doesn't require a flat plane to use his lasers properly.

Against Falco, you're gonna need as small a stage as legal in your region. Against falco its your best bet. Dislike it a lot against Link. Falco loves room, but he doesnt love it because he wants to spam. He wants space to reset himself, space heavily, cg and room to phantasm. Not to spam.

I love this post, can I offer you a seal of approval?

 

[Rizen]

hell, if we WANTED to, we could phantasm straight through the arrow using the priority our phantasm gives.

^Not true. And a good Link should not spam arrows like that.

Reading you stage list, I'm going to tell you right now that you guys don't have a good understanding of falco and how to maximise your chances of winning.

back on to the stages...Falco seriously won't care about Raindow Ride...We don't hate it as much as people think. And we don't 'spam' on a flat plane, rely heavily on approaches. We dont' have multiple jumps...no...but the various platforms make it super simple to avoid gimps or recovery punishes...especially on as slow a character as link. We won't need to recover to a stage where link is waiting. We can go the other way for a safe landing and THEN move to link when we're safe.

Falco has the advantage of forcing Link to approach, RC takes that away- same goes for long chain grabs. Falco's the best camper in the game, he punishes off balance approaches. No mater what Falco will have the advantage in this MU. RC's a good counter but-

When Link's forced to approach-Brinstar, Battlefield

^This is where I'd CP Falco.

Characters who need to approach, spam on a flat plane (Falco, Fox) and/or who don't have multiple jumps-Rainbow Cruse.

I didn't mean RC was the best CP vs Falco, I was showing how the spam improved for Link as opposed to flat stages like FD.

 

[Huggles828]

Haha, even the social thread is becoming strategy discussion! Awesome!

Of Link's three projectiles, arrows are probably the least useful, in my opinion. Against Falco, they're only useful situationally, like gimping him (you might force him to dodge/reflector to avoid them and put him in a bad position, otherwise I think they're really only useful as a mindgame, like a surprise landing cancel).

I'm really pretty crappy as Falco, but when I do play him (via random), I totally agree with Swordsaint, I often find myself not really spamming his lasers all that much unless my opponent is hiding all the way across the stage and I want him to approach me. The mere threat of having them if the opponent leaves an opening to use them is often enough; usually I just fire one or two lasers at a time to throw my opponent off-balance and follow up with another better option.

PS2 isn't a bad stage, but the treadmill part and the low gravity part of the stage drive me crazy. If those two parts were gone (especially the treadmill part) it'd probably be one of my favorite stages. I do like the music and "feel" of it over PS1 though.

 

[swordsaint]

There's a specific part of phantasm that will clash with arrows, but the phantasm doesn't end and keeps going. It's just after it starts. I should know, I main Falco.

I'm going to tell you guys right now, and I don't want you to be offended...but if you guys still have the mindset that Falco loves spamming/camping to force approaches. then you need some catching up to do.

Huggles is right - if we use too many lasers we lose the ability to punish other things with better attacks. The lasers are reliable, but partly they're a scare tactic.

I agree Brinstar is the best CP against Falco. There is a recent set of myself and Scabe that would somewhat demonstrate the potential it is.

You underestimate Falco's ability on Rainbow Ride btw. There is actually time to chain grab, and your heavy weight advantage is especially removed at the top of the stage. What I meant by "Then move to Link when we're safe" was more akin to "then line ourself up with the proper spacing to link" that way we're in a reset situation.

The fact Falco can recover and reset easier on Rainbow Ride against Link is one of the bigger reasons this isn't imo a viable counterpick. Link wants to be forcing falco to an edge, you arent doing that on rainbow ride, no matter how bad you think it affects falco...there's going to be somewhere against link that's safe, because links slow. also he's low tier

Neither character gets any real positive or negatives on this stage than any other. and any positives are given to both characters.

I might add that one very slight positive on this stage that you consider a negative is the moving stage lessening our chain grab.

true: It can make us chain grab less
false: it's a negative

reason being is, if we chain grab on the left hand side and its rising, we can spike you earlier because of the blastzone moving (it does move doesnt it?) and even if not, you have to scurry back up while falco keeps you down with his superior aerials.

on the boat, if get it here we can keep you on the boat and move over to the left quicker to edge guard when you try and come left too

at the top, we can probably throw you off the top, and if not, chain grab you straight off the left side or spike you through any gaps in the floor.

 

[Scabe]

Bah we really should save these posts when we talk about Falco and stages .

 

[Rizen]

There's a specific part of phantasm that will clash with arrows, but the phantasm doesn't end and keeps going. It's just after it starts. I should know, I main Falco.

I main Link.
Any move will stop phantasm after the first half, it's just hard to time. Range attacks will stop it except on the first few frames of attack. If phantasm goes through it's because the arrow was in starting lag or missed.

I'm going to tell you guys right now, and I don't want you to be offended...but if you guys still have the mindset that Falco loves spamming/camping to force approaches. then you need some catching up to do.

Huggles is right - if we use too many lasers we lose the ability to punish other things with better attacks. The lasers are reliable, but partly they're a scare tactic.

Of course you don't spam from close range. Falco forcing Link to approach is his best option. Falco can keep spamming and Link has a difficult time approaching without making himself open. That's why we pick small stages and avoid FD in this MU, so Falco can't spam us into bad approaches and CG.

You underestimate Falco's ability on Rainbow Ride btw. There is actually time to chain grab, and your heavy weight advantage is especially removed at the top of the stage. What I meant by "Then move to Link when we're safe" was more akin to "then line ourself up with the proper spacing to link" that way we're in a reset situation.

The fact [1]Falco can recover and reset easier on Rainbow Ride against Link is one of the bigger reasons this isn't imo a viable counterpick. [2]Link wants to be forcing falco to an edge, you arent doing that on rainbow ride, no matter how bad you think it affects falco...there's going to be somewhere against link that's safe, because links slow. also he's low tier

[3]Neither character gets any real positive or negatives on this stage than any other. and any positives are given to both characters.

As I said, this wouldn't be my CP. [1] Same goes for Link only more so. [2] Link doesn't like being forced to an edge either. Link's great at star KOing and heavier/more powerful than falco. Dair spikes and gimps are less of a threat. [3] Link gets some major positives on RC you're underestimating Link's abilities. But Brinstar and battlefield are better choices.

I might add that one very slight positive on this stage that you consider a negative is the moving stage lessening our chain grab.

I never said that. The terrain and small platforms make avoiding grabs easier and shortens CGs. And the top's still a problem, but Link has advantages with star KOing at low %s and an up-throw that KOs.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Also due to recent events I'm questioning what I'm doing at MLG.

I've been practicing with Link constantly, then I play Lucario and do better. It's not even a tier list sort of ordeal, it's just playing Lucario since the release has made me know how to play him where as picking up Link still has me working on getting me game down.

Not sure what I'm doing anymore, I hate how I've practiced hard for weeks yet I go back to Lucario for a bit and still play him better despite my training.

I might be because I'm working on fundamentals rather than techs, or the fact Lucario as a year of practice ahead of Link.

The only reason I might go Lucario instead is the fact my practice while making my Link better hasn't done it to the point of making it better than my Lucario.

Still I'm going to try and play Link at MLG, but I can't deny of the characters I main, my Lucario is much better than the rest.

Still working on both until then, still I'll try to play Link, I'm not going to deny rep if I can.

 

[Ryos4]

Well you could start each set with Lucario and if you win you can pull out Link for the second match. Even if you do lose you can go back to Lucario as a backup. Or just start with Link and move on to Lucario if you lose.

 

[Scabe]

Go Lucario, and if when you don't stand a chance at all, try Link.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Use Marth

Whoever is more fun. You'll play the best with whoever you enjoy the most.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Use Marth

Whoever is more fun. You'll play the best with whoever you enjoy the most.

I like playing both.

Alright I'll see what I can do.

 

[quirkynature]

^If you like playing both, picking one will be favoritism. That's just an unfair advantage. Be fair.

Pick Peach.

 

[Huggles828]

Play with whoever you feel you'll do best with in any particular match, and who you want to play as. Don't feel like you're obliged to play Link for our sakes. The game is about having fun, after all :D

I think the fundamentals is important. Techs without fundamentals won't get you anywhere (aside from being super flashy). Once you have that down, start picking up techs to supplement your game.

 

[Kitamerby]

So what's your favorite band?

Mine's Link in Park

 

[quirkynature]

^LOL. Good one.

 

[Scabe]

Ahahah, nice one

 

[Huggles828]

Link in Park is great and all, but I can never understand what the lead singer is saying. It just sounds like he's yelling. It's like there are no lyrics at all.

 

[Scabe]

LOL Huggles. Man you sure are a funny dude.

 

[Scabe]

So guys I'll be gone for a couple days. I'm going to a tourney which doesn't focus on singles. Rather we team up in crews and fight! Also there'll be doubles and I'll be teaming up with DDD. I hope it goes well, but man I really suck at the game

Anyways be good and keep fighting evil.

P.S. I expect to see lots of contribution posts in here when I come back

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Expect to see your every thread in tatters, Scabe. I'll make sure of it.

Kidding?

More or less.

Link wears a pointy hat, the droop of which is remarkable hard to duplicate with a green fabric cone. Discuss.

 

[Huggles828]

Link wears a pointy hat, the droop of which is remarkable hard to duplicate with a green fabric cone. Discuss.

 

[RMZ]

^lol would have preferred a brain slug ref.

Hey fools. What up?

 

[Scabe]

Fools?

 

[Huggles828]

*Facepalm*

Apparently Link is now the easiest character to pick up and **** everyone with. My roommate just played Link for the first time and demolished me (I got one kill on him). My Link routinely beats his ROB and G&W 1 on 1.

*Slinks into corner*

 

[quirkynature]

*Facepalm*

Apparently Link is now the easiest character to pick up and **** everyone with. My roommate just played Link for the first time and demolished me (I got one kill on him). My Link routinely beats his ROB and G&W 1 on 1.

*Slinks into corner*

LOL! Can you imagine:

Tier list 5:

1-Link
2-Ganondorf
3-Zelda
4-Samus
...
1366381945786-Snake
1366381945787-Meta Knight

@_@

 

[Scabe]

Haha! Link mains have such good humor.