You add absolutely nothing to the conversation. Stop posting.
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Is Brawl more balanced than melee? **Take 2**
- Thread starter The Halloween Captain
- Start date
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AfroQT
Smash Master
cutter
Smash Champion
Thank you.
I'm kinda surprised at all the people here who are into Pokemon. Considering this topic is about balance, I'll just show you guys a really gay imbalanced card because I want to switch the topic from Pokemon to MTG!
Historically, MTG has been a poorly balanced game. It has gotten a lot better though over the past couple of years.
Listen here Yuna, and listen well.
This will be, my last post directed to you.
Your word, isn't fact.
You aren't God.
You aren't God.
You.
Aren't.
God.
So when you waltz into a thread, and state your opinion, yeah, I said opinion, that does not mean it's fact.
Remember where you are.
Remember what this thread is called?
Go ahead and take a look, Don't worry, I'll wait.
Now tell me. Is this a thread to discuss a fact? Or to hear both sides of the OPINION?
If the question was, Is Green actually Blue? Then yeah, there is a right answer.
But when the question is open for both sides to debate? It's called an opinion on either side.
You can't debate Green being blue, can you? Actually, I'm sure you've got an Essay or two you've written on the matter.
There is no right or wrong, people will go both ways in every debate you come across.
To me, your words are now meaningless.
Because you think you're something other than human, it seems.
Go ahead, contradict this post, tell me that I'm wrong, that I don't read your stuff, that I don't yadda yadda yadda yadda.
Cause at the end of the day? I'll know that regardless of what goes down here in the pixelated world we call Smash World Forums, I'm still an intelligent person, no matter how much you may want to contradict that. I know that my opinions are still valid, no matter how many times you want to reject that. I know that I'm a prominent debater, no matter how many times you choose not to accept that. And Finally, I know that one day, I'll reach brawl's Peak, and become the best in the US (Cue Anime music... Now.) Because I've got tact, wit, and skill, no matter how many times, you might forget that. (Continue Anime music for about thirty more seconds, and Scene.)
This will be, my last post directed to you.
Your word, isn't fact.
You aren't God.
You aren't God.
You.
Aren't.
God.
So when you waltz into a thread, and state your opinion, yeah, I said opinion, that does not mean it's fact.
Remember where you are.
Remember what this thread is called?
Go ahead and take a look, Don't worry, I'll wait.
Now tell me. Is this a thread to discuss a fact? Or to hear both sides of the OPINION?
If the question was, Is Green actually Blue? Then yeah, there is a right answer.
But when the question is open for both sides to debate? It's called an opinion on either side.
You can't debate Green being blue, can you? Actually, I'm sure you've got an Essay or two you've written on the matter.
There is no right or wrong, people will go both ways in every debate you come across.
To me, your words are now meaningless.
Because you think you're something other than human, it seems.
Go ahead, contradict this post, tell me that I'm wrong, that I don't read your stuff, that I don't yadda yadda yadda yadda.
Cause at the end of the day? I'll know that regardless of what goes down here in the pixelated world we call Smash World Forums, I'm still an intelligent person, no matter how much you may want to contradict that. I know that my opinions are still valid, no matter how many times you want to reject that. I know that I'm a prominent debater, no matter how many times you choose not to accept that. And Finally, I know that one day, I'll reach brawl's Peak, and become the best in the US (Cue Anime music... Now.) Because I've got tact, wit, and skill, no matter how many times, you might forget that. (Continue Anime music for about thirty more seconds, and Scene.)
Well, maybe not the best in the US. But I will be much higher than I am now. Just for the sake of the Anime, I had to say that. XD
Ulevo
Smash Master
So... shouldn't this thread be in the debate hall? I don't see anything tactical about this thread at all. It's just a waste of space.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
not as broken as yawgmoth's but holy **** it would definitely boost dragon decks.
TK Wolf
Smash Ace
I still think that once all matchups are determined and correct, you can look solely at the matchup charts and determine which game is more balanced.
cutter
Smash Champion
Pffft; even Tinker is more broken than that thing
@ Ulevo: I would just rather have this thread be closed instead.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
That depends on the context.Pffft; even Tinker is more broken than that thing
@ Ulevo: I would just rather have this thread be closed instead.
=p
for yu-gi-oh this card would be banned before it was shipped.
Unfortunately they missed DAD.
How so? How is "Top" a misspelling of "High"? It's a mistyping, if anything. It's still only a minor thing. The major thing here is that he believed that Peach had gone to either the Top of Mid or the Bottom of High when she's barely in Lower Mid.
You're so desperate to prove me wrong you're trying to prove me wrong on the minor things and not the major ones (as usual). Whether or not Sky truly doesn't know there's an entire Tier between Mid and Top is a minor thing. The major thing here is that he was wrong on Peach's tier place, the character he mains and he didn't even bother to fact check berfore posting this entirely inaccurate argument he must've pulled out of thin air or relied on flawed sources in order to believe it to be true.
This shows us several things:
* He doesn't know where Peach is on the tier list
* He doesn't fact check
* He has no qualms stating things he's not sure of or has even bothered to fact check (even when fact checking is very easy) as facts
* He relies on flawed sources for his facts/He has a bad memory and yet he relies on it for facts and doesn't fact check
Whether or not he knew High comes before Top is minor in this case.
I'm wrong on occasion... about minor facts and minor things. My bigger arguments and main arguments are oftentimes not "wrong", possibly "flawed", but almost never proven wrong.
I concede whenever I'm wrong. But it doesn't really matter if I'm wrong about a small tiny thing when I'm still right about a bunch of other things which matter more, now does it?
You aren't reading any of my posts before "replying" to them. I have never claimed any of this. I have openly stated that none of this is true and that I do not believe any of these things.
No, but when I disprove your opinions or facts with facts, then I have refuted your facts. I do not state my opinions to refute other opinions or facts. I use facts to do that.
This is a thread to discuss facts. This is something verifiable. Even opinions can be fact-based, but this thread is specifically hear to discuss the facts.
Not really, opinions are welcome, but this thread is about facts.
There is a right or wrong when it comes to the subject of this thread. It's just gonna take a lot of time to compare the two games enough to prove the other side wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt. I'm proving the other side wrong step by step, successively getting there.
Because I disprove your words? Like how we didn't know Olimar and Falco have evenish match-ups against MK 'til just recently (when we've known that for months)?
No, I'm quite human. I'm wrong all the time. Why are you ignoring me saying this?
Because I had the audacity to point out how you were wrong a few times?
I have never implied you weren't intelligent/are unintelligent. I have never argued your level of intelligence. I just proved you wrong on very specific things.
That is in no way a condemnation of your overall intelligent. It's merely a condemnation of your grasp of the those specific facts. You were wrong. Just admit to it.
I have also never argued your opinions are wrong. I've argued they might be misguided because they might be based on flawed facts. The only things of yours I've argued were wrong are your facts.
You're a prominent debater? Then how come I barely see you around? Do you mean in other parts of SWF? If you are a prominent debater in others parts of SWF, then I'll conceede to that.
What does this have to do with this debate? When did we ever argue people's skill in Brawl? In fact, I've argued one's skill to be entirely irrelevant when it comes to one's credibility as a debater of Smash matters.
Ulevo
Smash Master
Me too.Pffft; even Tinker is more broken than that thing
@ Ulevo: I would just rather have this thread be closed instead.
I'm just trying to emphasize the fact that we shouldn't be clustering our boards with threads dedicated to opinion based, chaotic, non productive, [insert more reasons for Yuna to argue here] topics.
This whole discussion is completely arbitrary, opinion based, and serves to come to no conclusion or end. It is simply for the sake of conversation, the sharing of opinions, and debating (which unfortunately leads to useless dreck and name slandering/credibility contest).
Why doesn't it belong in the debate hall?
We should be focusing on things like why x move does y function under z circumstances, and the uses therein, not arguing why Brawl is/isn't better than a game these boards aren't even dedicated to.
What trash.
Chum
Smash Apprentice
I liked it more when it was unbalanced, after affinity cycled out of standard it got less fun for me.
Bup-bup!
This subject-matter can be entirely fact based. A lot of people just make sweeping judgements and use their opinions and interpretations alone when arguing the subject matter.
Funnily enough, this subject was abandoned for months 'til a certain someone sniffed up a few "new facts" and thought it was enough to open a new thread because these new facts apparently presented something new and until then unheard of which would revolutionize the subject matter.
I've left this thread alone for days upon end. Sometimes even a week or so. It just goes on and on and on because people feel a need to just add their "2 cents" without reading anything that came before it. But if no one's around to correct the lies/mistakes/flawed arguments, less knowledgeable people will think it's the truth and spread it further, thus contaminating the boards further.
So at least with someone here to counter-argue (and this goes for both sides of all debates), it will not be a one-sided blabbering of "facts" which might be entirely made up or wrong.
AfroQT
Smash Master
Lets fight to the death and whoever is alive at the end decides which is more balanced.
I think that logically, that's best.
I love how unintelligible the masses are.
Where've you been for the last 98 or so pages?
GTN4 Isn't Sh*tty.
Itachi's 0-Death subsist on you hitting his special.
Just don't do it Imo. =/
I've won tournaments with Lee, facing stupid Itachi's. It still works.
AfroQT
Smash Master
You do not need to be the world's best Smasher in order to debate Smash. All you need is a deep grasp of Smash's finer aspects. I have proven time and time again that I possess this.
Let's play "Guess the chraracter!"
Y -> u.BY -> u.B -> u.BY -> u.B -> u.BY -> u.B -> BBX
Y. -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.B -> j.X -> dash -> AAA -> wakeup X/wakeup j.B okizeme
Y -> j.B -> d.BAY -> d.BAA -> X
Y -> f.AY -> f.AY -> f.BBBABBX
Y -> f.AY -> d.AY -> d.AY -> d.AY -> d.AY -> d.AY -> d.AY -> d.AY -> wakeup X
AfroQT
Smash Master
That sounds like me.
Pay attention. ****ty design. The game itself is quite good, the design, not so good. Read entire posts before replying to them.
Yes, and? Once he hits you with it, you'll die and end up with 0% chakra.
You've won tournaments as Lee facing bad and/or stupid Itachi-players. Itach is one of Lee's worst match-ups.
And nobody cares what you can do against bad players.
AfroQT
Smash Master
Im the best player ever. I use Afro_Thundah.
Ulevo
Smash Master
Yuna... exactly what is the point in liberating the "truth" from the "lies" in a cest pool of a discussion? It's like you're trying to be a logical hero in the world of stupid, when the best solution is to either lock the thread (hello fellow moderators) or to leave the fire alone by not feeding it. I'm perfectly aware you didn't revive the thread (as you've pointed out already), but going along with the argument at hand doesn't make your hands any cleaner than those you are pointing the finger at, or anyone else in this thread who continues to blabber on about supposed "facts" or their "opinion".
Because, as I've already stated it, with or without me, this thread rages on. Now if it gets locked, yay. But since it hasn't yet been locked, with or without me or anyone arguing "my" side, the thread will continue. And if no one's here to clear up the facts, flawed facts will keep being circulated.
The ones circulating will believe they are right, continuing to circulate the flawed facts. New people who don't know any better will think they are right, join them in circulating the flawed facts and we'll be worse off than before. But if someone is here to clear up the facts, maybe some people will be "saved".
Ulevo
Smash Master
Well Yuna, they say the only cure for stupidity is death. I don't see this case as an exception.
If you feel the need to take on the noble task of clearing up "facts" in this thread with your "facts", then go on ahead. I personally think it just prolongs the life expectancy this thread has, especially with how rigorously you argue with members.
C'est la vie.
If you feel the need to take on the noble task of clearing up "facts" in this thread with your "facts", then go on ahead. I personally think it just prolongs the life expectancy this thread has, especially with how rigorously you argue with members.
C'est la vie.
Oracle
Smash Master
I should back up yuna on this.
tournament results are not the end-all of tournament viability simply because certain characters are more popular in different areas. For example, if there are a lot of fox's in the midwest, then chances are fox is going to win most of those tournies, especially if there isn't a really good marth to put them in their place.
tournament results are not the end-all of tournament viability simply because certain characters are more popular in different areas. For example, if there are a lot of fox's in the midwest, then chances are fox is going to win most of those tournies, especially if there isn't a really good marth to put them in their place.
This thread will and already has lived on and prospered without me for prolonged periods of time. If it's not locked, it will keep on being posted in. That's the harsh reality.
Everyone wants to add their 2 cents, even if it's just to say "I think X is more balanced!" and leave it at that. This thread will live on and on.
AfroQT
Smash Master
Courage the Cowardly Dog was such a good show back in the day.
Masmasher@
Smash Lord
Listen since we are talking about characters being viable at the highest level of play why dont we do a process of elimination to show which characters certainly arent viable. I'll draw first blood with melee and take a safe poke
For instance take pichu. NO ONE CARES IF YOU WON A LOW LEVEL CLASS TOURNAMENT WITH PICHU. At the higher levels of play he becomes somewhat of a joke character. Now I'm trying to put this project back on track and this may seem a little shortsighted. SO if anyone thinks otherwise then tell me and I will gladly concede as i dont know if this basis holds enough water.
For instance take pichu. NO ONE CARES IF YOU WON A LOW LEVEL CLASS TOURNAMENT WITH PICHU. At the higher levels of play he becomes somewhat of a joke character. Now I'm trying to put this project back on track and this may seem a little shortsighted. SO if anyone thinks otherwise then tell me and I will gladly concede as i dont know if this basis holds enough water.
1048576
Smash Master
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2006
- Messages
- 3,417
Pichu is so friekin overrated. His f-smash ***** spotdodges and KO's very quickly. His aerial mobility is on par with Captain Falcon. His recovery is excellent, and his edgeguarding is good as well. His projectle's slowness is a benefit since it allows him to approach without fear of retribution. Pichu is pretty much the fastest character below mid tier. What's the drawback? Light? sounds familiar...
The lack of range can be avoided with his Falcon-like aerial mobility.
I've beaten a Sheik with Pichu that I couldn't beat with any other character, and yes, he knew the Chaingrab.
Anecdotal evidence ftl.
If Jiggs can win a tourney, there is no reason Pichu can't as well.
The lack of range can be avoided with his Falcon-like aerial mobility.
I've beaten a Sheik with Pichu that I couldn't beat with any other character, and yes, he knew the Chaingrab.
Anecdotal evidence ftl.
If Jiggs can win a tourney, there is no reason Pichu can't as well.
NES n00b
Smash Master
You mean underrated? He is a terrible character....at high levels of play. He has so many disadvantage and simple things like using Fox's uptilt destroys almost all of his options.
Doesn't mean he isn't an awesome character.....cause he is.
Masmasher@
Smash Lord
This^
I'm not trying to bash pichu at all hes cool to play as but hes really light. His attacks hurt himself (every percent counts) and he gets pwned by the top tier.
You know what looking back at my post that was a horrible idea. Maybe we should see what characters are viable by the frequency of the other characters they play that they are disadvantaged against and i dont mean soft counters i mean **** matchups.
Also we should really take a look at the characters attributes and see how they compare in with the overall current actual game/metagame. For instance in brawl captain falcon really doesnt fit (i'm assuming correct me if I'm wrong) brawl is really more defensive without the offset of being able to come with a great offensive game physics wise and some what a weak approach he has alot stacked against him. IM NOT BASHING. just saying ALOT of his **** matchups are by the top tier and he'll run into those frequently.
Thunder Of Zeus
*Rumble Rumble*
with the exception of MK, yes
Masmasher@
Smash Lord
YOU ARE SO LUCKY Yuna isnt here here i'll give you some advice and two quotes by him.
Heres a quote by me earlier on in the thread I'll bold the important part.
and heres Yuna. I'll bold the parts you need to pay extra attention to.
So actually contribute next time. k
Thunder Of Zeus
*Rumble Rumble*
lol I did the same thing. if you expect us to read 100 pages of comments before contributing what the purpose of the thread is, you're sadly mistaken.
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
What good is a "contribution" that adds nothing to the thread or was debunked 15 pages ago.
It's a discussion thread not an "spam with my 2 cents" thread.
If you wanna contribute, that's fine, but do it in an educated manner.
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