Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[spider_sense]

i heard ganon grab the ledge though since only ganon makes a weird loud sound when he ledge grabs.

my answer would be that one of Mexican's up-b hitboxes phantom'd me. then i grabbed the ledge with my own up-b, and i let go of ledge within a few frames.

Bizzarro Flame is just so technical he can up-b twice.

 

[mers]

Maybe I'm thinking of something else, but can't you not release the ledge until like 8 frames after you grab it? That's why when you try to ledgedash really quickly after grabbing you end up just jumping from the ledge.

 

[n0ne]

that happens to me alot too. i play a really good dk over here and he does that to me too. but ledge has nothing to do with it.
Its from one of DKs Up-b mid to last hitboxes. Ive died lots of times because of not noticing because no sound is heard, and neither is there and knockback

 

[Oracle]

What is you guys' opinion of the tipman spike? I use it a lot, but never see players like kage or linguini use it much.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

its amazing, but at higher levels, its tough to apply.

fox/falco - usually recover straight to the edge these days. often times, down angled ftilt becomes easier to use in these situations, like when they're above the ledge, and up b straight to it. if they're recovering above the edge, its often more applicable to bair them back off, cause with good di, the best an uair will do is sent them back to the edge.

falcon - usually just as effective to fair or bair him back off when he recovers high. falcon's rarely recover low on purpose vs ganon because they know they'll just get dair'd or tipman'd.

sheik - is just plain hard to edgeguard with any move. if you approach her, she'll just up b to the ledge and stuff. i need to work on edgeguarding her myself.

peach - uair is useful, if you find a way to get under her in range while she's recovering. bair usually does the trick as well at higher levels.

more or less smart opponents need to be hit with stronger stuff/things that take more space/cover more options.

at least thats my opinion...

 

[Manondorf]

sheik - is just plain hard to edgeguard with any move. if you approach her, she'll just up b to the ledge and stuff. i need to work on edgeguarding her myself.

From what I've seen, the most effective means of dealing with sheik is edge hog, to force her to land on the stage, then edge hop to (whatever).

 

[Bl@ckChris]

yeah, but the more you play and watch good sheiks, the less that appears to work. either they upb to the ledge and then straight up to force you to the stage and then fall, or you wanna wait till u see them appear so that doesn't happen and they dsmash before you get there, or they upb to the platform which becomes a pain to get to before they end lag...i understand the concept, certainly, but its just like people understand the concept of edgeguarding ganon (really, our recovery seems so simple) but due to our air control, we force a lot of people to miss.

the deeper you go, the less answers there are.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

very separate post:

how do you get around foxes fullhop nair? I never knew that approach would destroy ganon so much but it does. Retreating fair fails cuz they come in from the top, uair oos or in general doesn't seem to beat it cuz theirs comes out afterwards giving it priority, bair only works if you're already above him cuz of it's angle. I can't run away cause it covers so much space if they do it while running.

my best bet has been to camp platforms. But the problem still exists. Sometimes I'm able to grab cuz at least the fox I'm used to doesn't fullhop a ton. So I'm guessing he misses the l cancel on shield, but that's not an option at a higher level.

should I try to roll under it as long as it's not too predictable?

 

[n0ne]

yup. edgeguarding sheik is troublesome.. U have to kind of see what angle she is coming from to be able to tell if shes aiming for the ledge, stage, or above the ledge. Angle AND distance.
i sometimes do a ledgehop up air while getting back on stage at the same time. It covers various options sheik has at the same time.

And yes. Foxs fullhop nair is SO GAY.
Its even worse when the dont fastfall it. it stays out all day long.
What I do is CC to ftilt. Or a CC to smash attack. This kind of makes the Fox a bit afraid of trying to do it again. But thats just a mindgame. If the nair does not hit you , thus not enabling you to CC then... u are already crouched anyways so u can do whatever u want.

I really dont like to talk about stuff fox has against ganon because people that use fox and dont know things like the fullhop nair will start using it more and **** us ganons with it... Apart that Fox will always **** ganon.. IMO. I dont have trouble vs Falcos.
I just switch to Falcon and techchase Fox to death.

 

[Bizzarro Flame]

When fox full-hop n-airs, you should just short-hop u-air which has a lot more priority.

I never had a problem with full-hop n-airs from fox after figuring it out.

You just gotta pay a lot of attention to fox rather than your own character

 

[Pr0jecT]

hey guys. Any other Ganon's going to ROM3 or TO6?

I'd like to do double ganon team's

 

[-ACE-]

Some of you guys might want to read my write up on Sheik in the Ganon Edgeguarding 101 thread. And the Tipman spike still ***** to this day. I also don't know what you mean about Kage and Linguini not using it much... It's still the best overall edgeguarding tool Ganon has imo, regardless of difficulty. It hits sweetspotters and it's close to impossible to tech for most characters. It's not the answer for every dilemma, not even close... but yeah, still great.

 

[DippnDots]

Killing people with your tippy toes is pretty baus

 

[Linguini]

hey guys. Any other Ganon's going to ROM3 or TO6?

I'd like to do double ganon team's

Other ganons??? your no ganon!!!

but yeah im going to TO6 and maybe ROM3

 

[Pr0jecT]

emilio you dont even know looool. I secondary ganon now, im getting pretty good with him too. me and smashmac won a set going double ganon at apex. we should double ganon team mm kids :D

 

[sleak-]

can ganon win tourneys? lets say if mango picked up ganon would he be able to go far

 

[Divinokage]

Ya I think it's definitely possible. I almost did it once but you really have to play consistent.

 

[spider_sense]

I'm going to Tipped off 6, and I agree with Kage. I think a Ganon main can do very well at a national tournament, he just has to put in ALOT of work.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

a lot of work, and have a lot of techchases go very, very right.

i'm also going to TO6.

 

[StealthyGunnar]

What's the best way to get past falco's lasers?

I went to a tourney today and played some friendlies against this really good falco player. He controlled the stage so well with his lasers. Even with the platforms, I couldn't get near him.

 

[Bizzarro Flame]

either power-shield or double jump/use platforms to get over the lasers

or if you feel like being a jerk, then tilt your shield diagonally up-wards towards falco so he can **** up his l-cancel, then shield-grab

 

[StealthyGunnar]

alright thanks!

 

[Divinokage]

either power-shield or double jump/use platforms to get over the lasers

or if you feel like being a jerk, then tilt your shield diagonally up-wards towards falco so he can **** up his l-cancel, then shield-grab

I hope you don't intend to use this tactic vs top Falcos. =P

 

[Bizzarro Flame]

works against larry's and falcomist's falcos so far.

maybe i just activate my shield-grab within the first few possible frames because i've been doing it like forever

 

[Pawls to the Wall]

or if you feel like being a jerk, then tilt your shield diagonally up-wards towards falco so he can **** up his l-cancel, then shield-grab

Wow that's genius. I can't believe I never thought of doing that.

 

[jyin94]

dair + fair = <333

 

[StealthyGunnar]

If you wanna mimic CF, it's all about dair, over B (forgot what's called), Fair

 

[n0ne]

Ive been starting to train "the butt-grab".
You know, when someones kind of behind you, and u throw a grab then somehow they teleport into your hand?

Works beast vs Falcon and spacies. Dorf`s grab f"ucks them up soooo much.

Ganon CAN win tournies. Except vs a gay fox or sheik.
hey , are these 2 his worst matchups? I dont remember.

 

[VGmasta]

either power-shield or double jump/use platforms to get over the lasers

or if you feel like being a jerk, then tilt your shield diagonally up-wards towards falco so he can **** up his l-cancel, then shield-grab

That's an interesting strategy. Some Falcos NEVER miss an L-cancel (DaShizWiz?), but I guess it's work a try for the most part.

Ganon CAN win tournies. Except vs a gay fox or sheik.
hey , are these 2 his worst matchups? I dont remember.

I don't know about that. Falco might be tougher than Fox for Ganondorf. It's much harder to land a grab or a hit at all on Falco than on Fox.

 

[Pr0jecT]

I'd say Fox is harder than Falco

 

[-ACE-]

Fox and Sheik are the worst. Same tier imo. Then comes Falco.

 

[n0ne]

yup. I thought the same. Maybe bacause of foxs up smash, up air, and shine ******.
As opposed to Falcos, although gay lasers, while he shoots a laser he cannot shield, and in a sense, makes him harder to hit.

 

[Linguini]

It's very possible for ganon to win tournaments. But you have to travel consistently, learn all your matchups to an extreme level, and put time into character strats.

I'm going to TO6 and i'll be training for it. Expect some ****.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

linguini i'll be cheering you on throughout your run.

except vs dr peepee in like winners semis or something. that's got some serious conflict of interest. i'll just scream in general lol.

i really wanna make it out of pools for this. but seeing how like all of NC got fourth in their pools at pound 4 makes me realize how tough it is to do so. i think i might have what it takes to rise up. it just won't happen for real in about another 6 months; maybe pound 5 i'll do some odd damage nobody really expects.

 

[spider_sense]

We Florida Ganons are gonna murk, so be on the lookout for Guini and I. =)

 

[Bl@ckChris]

yeah...me and jim are NC's ganons. idk if jim'll come to TO6 or not. he might get a ride with pp if he wants to go.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Spider, how could you forget about me?

Also, serious question guys; How do I beat link?

 

[Divinokage]

Fox and Sheik are the worst. Same tier imo. Then comes Falco.

For me it's the opposite... Fox and Sheik aren't too bad.. but I hate Falco the worst lol.

 

[unknown522]

kage, what made you change your mind?

Also, IMO: the worst is sheik then falco then fox. But I don't really play ganon much. Except in teams.....when jiggs isn't on the opposing team.

 

[Divinokage]

Ok... I lost to 3 good Falcos recently.. lol.