How to get way better with Marth

[Pr0phetic]

My metagame is current, just have to put it together.

And yes all of this will greatly improve your game, I need to learn shield conservation a little more, Backlash ***** me one time, I've gotten a lot better with it, more in person matches pl0x!

 

[∫unk]

Everyone to who this thread pertains: Please stop rolling behind people constantly. It's predictable and punishable. Don't roll with Marth at all for now.

Especially when I spawn I just walk up then charge f-smash the other way and it hits almost every time LOL

 

[Shaya]

Everyone to who this thread pertains: Please stop rolling behind people constantly. It's predictable and punishable. Don't roll with Marth at all for now.

Especially when I spawn I just walk up then charge f-smash the other way and it hits almost every time LOL

It's the ultimate bad habit junk, you're asking the impossible to break it's clutches on mine and everybody elses' souls:embarrass

 

[Remzi]

Junk:

Can you please explain this:

Take note of every single time they roll behind you (a significant weakness of Marth)

 

[∫unk]

what part confuses you?

 

[Remzi]

Are you saying Marth has trouble punishing people rolling behind him? If so, then why?

 

[VietGeek]

Are you saying Marth has trouble punishing people rolling behind him? If so, then why?

If they roll behind you they'll be right in front of your face if you try to do a turnaround punish.

So if your DB doesn't go through the roll (which good rolls will probably not get penetrated), it'll hit a shield and they can grab and anything they can normally do OoS simply because you're face to face.

DS is risky.

Bair can lunge too high at times.

Unless you can predict when they roll behind you, you'd be forced to fall back or get punished. Both answers lead to you losing out somehow.

Which is why you need to observe rolling habits.

And yes Bengal, I type with my ***. I don't think about these things.

 

[∫unk]

Yes because a weak point of marth is behind him especially if they roll while you're in the air and already threw out an f-air

DB can get powershielded if you don't hit in their vulnerable frames or they can just space the roll so db1 doesn't hit at all.

Edit: Vietgeek got it spot on. +1 month metagame for TES

 

[Steel]

strategic rolling ***** marth. only time you can beat it is when you are forcing the reaction with a dtilt and are ready for the roll

 

[SeanxFayt]

whats OOS? >_<

 

[Shaya]

Also unlike any other character in the game (almost), especially within the top and high tiers, Marth doesn't have a dsmash he can spam or at least get away with it unpredicted. Only the first strike is fast as well...

 

[magikguy]

whats OOS? >_<

out of shield

 

[Fizzle]

Full hop aerials:The reason why this works is because the opponent will still be horizontally spacing and will most likely do a short hop aerial and at that point you can ff and n-air or f-air them.

Um, couldn't they just roll under you and utilt or something? Works really well for guys like Lucario, Snake, and DDD. RoyR tried this against Azen at hobo 11. Granted, he was using it pretty often, but I don't think it's wise to expose Marth's weakpoint (dair) often at all.

It's always a good idea to mix up your fairs, but telling the new folks to use more full hop aerials isn't so good imo, considering they're bound to read this guide and replicate it word for word. Full hop aerials with Marth need to be used sparingly and at the right times, which comes with experience.

Still a great guide though.

 

[VietGeek]

This isn't for Marths that just opened the Brawl box and is just learning the basics.

This is for those caught in-between in a plateau of transitioning to higher play and already have a strong grasp on the basics of the Marth metagame.

 

[∫unk]

the bigger problem in that set was that roy r couldn't land a kill move for ****

he tried being patient then azen got to 200%

he got impatient and got hit a lot trying to kill him

 

[DJMirror]

a really good guide imo and i'll try to stop rolling behind you the next time we play

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

This is good. I'm glad you mentioned the rolling behind, because that has seemed to be what gets my marth the most. that and spamming his forward smash =\ I'm going to practice some of this. Thanks

 

[Remzi]

If they roll behind you they'll be right in front of your face if you try to do a turnaround punish.

As is the case if any character rolls behind any other character in this game. That doesn't mean punishing that roll will be difficult to do.

So if your DB doesn't go through the roll (which good rolls will probably not get penetrated), it'll hit a shield and they can grab and anything they can normally do OoS simply because you're face to face.

They ARE vulnerable for a slight amount of time after their invincibility frames run out. Dash to turnaround DB works almost everytime if you can react fast enough. This move is as good it gets as a roll punisher besides some dsmashes. If Marth has trouble punishing rolls, then we can say the same for every character who DOESN'T have a top notch dsmash in terms of speed.

DS is risky.

Agreed, not necessarily difficult to pull off though.

Bair can lunge too high at times.

If it lunges too high, then the player is at fault, it is not a character flaw.

Comments in red.

Anyways, Marth has nice range on his pivot grab, so that works as well.

Honestly the only thing keeping Marth's roll punishing game from being one of the best is his lack of a quicker dsmash as shaya said. Other than that, I'd say Marth's roll punishing game is pretty solid. Especially since he has a great tool in forcing a roll via dtilt.

 

[VietGeek]

You win Bengals.

Talk to Junk.

I don't debate. Debating is for smart people.

 

[∫unk]

As Steel said, strategic rolling ***** Marth

When you've already committed to an aerial them rolling behind you is the most common situation but also if you just don't expect it because they're smart with their rolling.

Smart players rarely roll around in a neutral situation where you can react and punish easily.

Honestly I'm bad at theory debates I just say what works and what doesn't work.

 

[Steel_Samurai]

This is great stuff for me
Little things to work on since I've gotten the basics down
Great guide idea

 

[∫unk]

Anything else people want to know about? If not this thread is kinda done. That's a lot of stuff to work with

 

[Ken Neth]

Dang, nice job, Junk! This thread is way helpful. I just barely started picking up marth and I can improve on some of these things.

 

[feardragon64]

Hey junk, I was wondering if you could say a bit about platforms or if you have anything noteworthy to say about them? I've played final d far too often and don't really know all of the in's and out's of maximizing platform usage. Using platforms on battlefield aggressively, or defensively? Anything you've got that you feel like adding. If not sa'll good. Thanks in advance.

 

[Steel]

fear there's like 2-3 marths that have platforms well incorporated into their game son, junk hasn't seen the light yet XD

 

[∫unk]

nah platforms **** with marth look at neo and steel's vids

that's definitely one part of my game I need to improve on

it basically puts you out of harms way while you can **** any time

just be careful if they're below you the tendency is to drop down f-air but ppl are just not holding shield up and baiting you into it so they can powershield when you drop down so now you've done a terribly spaced f-air on their shield

edit: ec overall is ahead in abusing platforms imo but ec doesn't have that socal mindgames and norcal DI

 

[Remzi]

As Steel said, strategic rolling ***** Marth

When you've already committed to an aerial them rolling behind you is the most common situation but also if you just don't expect it because they're smart with their rolling.

Smart players rarely roll around in a neutral situation where you can react and punish easily.

Honestly I'm bad at theory debates I just say what works and what doesn't work.

Well, I can't really argue with that. So all I'll say is that pretty much ANY character has trouble punishing a roll behind them after an aerial unless their bair has a long lasting hitbox like GW or ROB. Also, if the Marth does a FF Fair he is still in good shape to punish the roll, granted thats not always the case.

 

[∫unk]

no other characters have a ****load of solutions

marth has to give up stage control or jump away which isn't good for him at all but doesn't really matter for some characters especially high/top tier

 

[SuSa]

Listen to this guy, he's good. Real good.

Nice guide Junk

:mewtwo:

 

[feardragon64]

lol figures. Guess I'll pay more attention to platform use in their vids now. I didn't realize it until recently but I'm ridiculously horrible in the situations like the one you described. I was playing earlier today and someone was below me while I stood on the platform...and I stood in shield for like 5 seconds before doing anything >> Just constant shield and like two spot dodges. I was trying to figure out a way to get control back....and I eventually just ended up jumping and resetting the situation X_X

 

[SuSa]

On ledges, can't you ledgedrop fair/bair? Or is that far to risky because you can get shield grabbed...

My Marth isn't exactly 'good' or 'pro' but I think it's fairly decent, and I don't like jumping away or anything =p ( I can never be a good or pro Marth because I'm "in your face the entire match" aggressive... I can only go defensive if my strategy is completely backfiring. My name id Havokk, and thats what I cause when I go offensive )

Or how about ledge-drop to dancing blade? ledge-drop to nair?


Ledges are normally my friends for many of the characters I use (lol all...) but I have certain characters that completely depend on my ledge and platform games. (My 2 pikmin Olimar, aka Duomin, my Toon Link, Sheik, and a few others I'm to lazy to list right now)

 

[Steel]

since when are good marths defensive havok?

 

[SuSa]

"Patience is the key."

Believe it or not, I've faced Marth's who camp with fair's and wait for me to approach.

Obviously doesn't work against all characters =p, but it ***** my Snake. /I'll john with 'first good marth I've ever faced and I had no idea how to approach or defend, no joke'

 

[Steel]

with snake? just camp back. also your dash attack ***** retreating marths if you can time it correctly

 

[SuSa]

I can't time DA correctly, ever =p

And believe me, I tried grenade camping.... cooking, etc. I got a few hits in when he decided to approach, but as I said. Defending against a awesomely (not perfectly) spaced fair is pretty hard xD I had to wait and bait to get my attacks in, I had to forcefully change my playstyle, and I disliked that and started messing up a lot more then usual. (my playstyle is 'weird but highly efficient' people tell me <.< I'm like every other Snake, but somehow different... lol)



I can't remember all the Marth's I've faced... your name seems familiar, but I don't think I've brawled you (it'd be online of course), and my first offline match vs a Marth was against Junk, in tourney. I don't think it was you... I think it was Bengalz (sp?)...

God, it's been so long I can't even remember..

 

[Steel]

you probably heard my name from junk im guessing. and i would definitely wifi you if wifi wasn't made of fail.

 

[VietGeek]

Either that or your cyan name is just that special.

Panda totally knew what he was doing when he picked the color.

 

[Steel]

viet i demand an update of your tier list

 

[VietGeek]

viet i demand an update of your tier list

You can't move up anymore if that's what you're implying.

Solid can't move down either until he shows me his vids.

Kadaj...lol.

NEO is between two Anime women so I'm thinking that's fair.

 

[Steel]

i cant? i capped out? ****