Pyrostormer
Smash Lord
Use the "Japanese Ledge Grab" rule. Its in tournament disscussion if you are gonna read about it.
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HERB discussion Thread *NEW STUFF FIRST POST*
- Thread starter Vilt
- Start date
KillerSOS
Smash Champion
Yeah more than... 70? ledge grabs in a match and you auto lose.
I like it as well.
I like it as well.
How does one keep count of the ledge grabs?
OmniOstrich
Smash Lord
At the end of the match press A and its one of the statistics the game keeps track of.
It counts ledge grabs too?
So then, does someone get disqualified if that number is over 70 at the end of a match?
So then, does someone get disqualified if that number is over 70 at the end of a match?
Dark Hart
Rejected by Azua
I think that ledge grab rule is ********.
Honestly.
Honestly.
Why is it ********?
Dark Hart
Rejected by Azua
"Hey let's disqualify someone if they grab the edge a lot."
You tell me.
You tell me.
Why else would someone grab the edge a lot if they're not stalling?
Dark Hart
Rejected by Azua
Because it's either a edge-guard heavy match or someone just like to grab the edge a lot. I personally like grabbing the edge a lot: Yes, for no reason whatsoever.
Why would you assume that someone is stalling just because they grab the edge a lot? That's a horrible way to show if someone's stalling. It's fairly obvious if people stall anyway. You don't to make a stupid rule that limits the number of times people can grab the edge to determine who's stalling and who isn't.
Why would you assume that someone is stalling just because they grab the edge a lot? That's a horrible way to show if someone's stalling. It's fairly obvious if people stall anyway. You don't to make a stupid rule that limits the number of times people can grab the edge to determine who's stalling and who isn't.
How would you determine it then?
Get a TO? The tourney is too big for that.
Get a TO? The tourney is too big for that.
OmniOstrich
Smash Lord
Its actually pretty hard to grab the ledge that many times if you do any on stage fighting at all.
7min=420seconds
420/70=6
That means you would have to grab the ledge once every six seconds to get that many, IF the match timed out. Even if you plank carefully you can stay off the ledge enough to not use up your 70 grabs.
lord karn
Smash Master
if you grab the ledge more than 70 times and you're not planking you'd probably lose before you get to 70 lol
Foxy
Smash Master
the rule sounds alright to me.
i don't see anything that could happen that would be stupid and unfair with it, it's pretty lenient.
i don't see anything that could happen that would be stupid and unfair with it, it's pretty lenient.
What about something like someone can only grab the ledge a certain number of times before they have to get onstage if their opponent is onstage, but they can grab it as many times as they want if their opponent is offstage. That other rule doesn't seem very effective to me.
It's ******** because it's so ridiculously easy to circumvent with the right characters. You just have to know when to re-grab the ledge and when not to. Essentially, it's caught up in the same problem of only banning a certain extent of it. If I can't go to the ledge every six seconds, what's to stop me from going there every 6.01 seconds? What if I go there every six seconds, but get three KOs in 6 minutes? Or spend the last minute just simply running away? I haven't broken this arbitrary rule literally, but I'm still breaking the spirit of it. I'm still planking.
Attempting to make a ban like that doesn't hold up. It can be circumvented.
Attempting to make a ban like that doesn't hold up. It can be circumvented.
What do you suggest then?
Zero_Gamer
Smash Master
Judges and accusations.
It worked just fine on DERP and Pheonix Wright.
It's not like there can really be a solid rule for this. The players should be competent enough to see and identify stalling and call for a judge. Which would lead into a warning and bring back the pacing or a plain DQ if needed (but not likely).
It worked just fine on DERP and Pheonix Wright.
It's not like there can really be a solid rule for this. The players should be competent enough to see and identify stalling and call for a judge. Which would lead into a warning and bring back the pacing or a plain DQ if needed (but not likely).
Here's the way I look at it. By and large, especially amongst the best players in the Smash Community, there is effectively a soft ban on the tactic anyway, stemming from the fact that most of them want to play the game as much as they want to make money at it. The real issue is the not-so-good players who will do it to improve their chances, because they can't possibly win by actually engaging their opponent. There's really not much that can be done about those people, except let them get beaten by the people who are good enough to beat it.
I feel like most of the people, who frequently interact with everyone else and has formed relationships in the community, have enough of a tie to the community to respect the soft ban, and pretty much everyone who is legitimately good at the game, and can beat the tactic when used by weaker players, is included in that number. Hopefully, this means that the only people who will use the tactic are weaker players who won't be able to win at the highest levels anyway.
It's far from ideal, I admit, and I'd love to be able to disqualify someone that stalls excessively myself, because I'm much more likely to be knocked out by the tactic, but that's an unrealistic goal. I think the existing soft ban is the most workable alternative, since soft bans are inherently vague, which is well-suited to the suppression of a vaguely defined tactic. Basically, as a sign of respect for one's opponent, and the community as a whole, it is hoped that everyone does not stall excessively.
I wish I could offer something more concrete, but I can't, and that's because there's no good concrete way to enforce this.
I feel like most of the people, who frequently interact with everyone else and has formed relationships in the community, have enough of a tie to the community to respect the soft ban, and pretty much everyone who is legitimately good at the game, and can beat the tactic when used by weaker players, is included in that number. Hopefully, this means that the only people who will use the tactic are weaker players who won't be able to win at the highest levels anyway.
It's far from ideal, I admit, and I'd love to be able to disqualify someone that stalls excessively myself, because I'm much more likely to be knocked out by the tactic, but that's an unrealistic goal. I think the existing soft ban is the most workable alternative, since soft bans are inherently vague, which is well-suited to the suppression of a vaguely defined tactic. Basically, as a sign of respect for one's opponent, and the community as a whole, it is hoped that everyone does not stall excessively.
I wish I could offer something more concrete, but I can't, and that's because there's no good concrete way to enforce this.
So I was right.
If a good player stalls me, I'm screwed.
Wonderful.
If a good player stalls me, I'm screwed.
Wonderful.
KillerSOS
Smash Champion
I like the Japaneese ledge rule personally.
Still allows a bit of a stall but not too bad.
Still allows a bit of a stall but not too bad.
Sorry, man. I don't mean to ruin it for you. Really, the best you can do is play a proper match, and hope your opponent affords you the same pleasure. Having only been a part of this scene a short time, maybe I'm not experienced enough to speak for the majority, but from snatches of conversation at tourneys, posts on the forums, and bits of personal correspondence, I feel like the majority of good players feel the same way about stalling as you do, if it's at all reassuring to hear it.
I certainly feel the same way.
I certainly feel the same way.
Vilt
Smash Lord
good **** Behr xD
mr.fizwidget
Smash Champion
so, in the crew battle, was flamy doing something that is banned in tourney play?
Vilt
Smash Lord
Check it bros.
Pools Top 2 or 3. Consider the amount of people there is on the list and the amount of more people showing up. I'm thinking Melee Top 3 and Brawl Top 2. My reasons should be obvious.
Pools Top 2 or 3. Consider the amount of people there is on the list and the amount of more people showing up. I'm thinking Melee Top 3 and Brawl Top 2. My reasons should be obvious.
Geeez, how many pools are you gonna have??? And how many in a pool for that matter?
TO4 had top 4 advancing in 7 person pools, and that worked out fine, but I dunno how many we'll actually have here.
Something else isn't right with this arithmetic, but I can't figure out what it is...
TO4 had top 4 advancing in 7 person pools, and that worked out fine, but I dunno how many we'll actually have here.
Something else isn't right with this arithmetic, but I can't figure out what it is...
Vilt
Smash Lord
i dunno man, that is why i want some suggestions. someone do the math xD
Stop using so many big words my wetback so dont understand. ;-;
Alright, there were 56 people at TO4. There were 8 pools with 7 people each. 4 out of those 7 in each pool (which is the majority) advanced to the 32-man bracket because 4 X 8 = 32. You probably wanna shoot for 32 in the brackets btw.
Oh, and you wanna even the skill levels out for every pool too, so that all of the good players can make it to brackets, and that not all of the really good ones are in one pool, etc.
Oh, and you wanna even the skill levels out for every pool too, so that all of the good players can make it to brackets, and that not all of the really good ones are in one pool, etc.
This is why I love White People. <333
Bout time we start getting some approval again. =p
I see whut you did thur.
<3 NC smash.
I say we just let PP be in charge of the math behind the pools.
duh hes like the only one in NC who does not Drink or get High.<3 NC smash.
I say we just let PP be in charge of the math behind the pools.
Lulz I've been to one huge tournament.
I think Darksyde knows about this stuff. Give me the figures and I'll talk to him on AIM about it.
Dorsey probably knows about it, too.
NC is too cool. =p
I think Darksyde knows about this stuff. Give me the figures and I'll talk to him on AIM about it.
Dorsey probably knows about it, too.
NC is too cool. =p