Eaode
Smash Champion
Cool, so one post you say you saw claiming that it won't happen makes this whole thread pointless right?
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Heavy Brawl as the competitive standard? EDIT: Could a pro post his/her opinion?
- Thread starter DRaGZ
- Start date
JusticeWillPrevail
Smash Cadet
I tried it and I really didn't like it. What are you trying to do to the game? This doesn't make the game more technical in anyways. All I see is it screws character's recovery and some times even their attacks and approaches up. The only plus that I guess is ok is you kill faster.
LouisLeGros
Smash Journeyman
$2 says JusticeWillPrevail didn't read the entire thread
Endless Nightmares
Smash Master
No offense but is that even possible anymore? I mean give me like an hour and maybe I could read 683 posts...lol but I know what you mean
I usually read the most recent pages at least >_>
I'll take those $2
I usually read the most recent pages at least >_>
I'll take those $2
JusticeWillPrevail
Smash Cadet
OK listen. I'm sorry I only read the first few and first last pages. I'm not gonna waste my time reading 46 pages on this topic. I simply stated my opinion, I never said I was right. I just stated what I saw from the time I played.
Heavy Brawl breaks the game for some characters but melee guys love overpowered **** anyways.
Just don't use certain characters in heavy brawl (Ike, Sonic, D3, PT, etc.). Use guys like Fox, Rob, kirby and you'll beat 90% of the guys in heavy.
Just don't use certain characters in heavy brawl (Ike, Sonic, D3, PT, etc.). Use guys like Fox, Rob, kirby and you'll beat 90% of the guys in heavy.
hippochinfat!!
Smash Lord
I'm uber pro and I say no.
SilverBlaze
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2007
- Messages
- 86
I was initially 100% against heavy mode, but I decided to do some experimenting. I played Melee as my old main, Marth, for a little bit. I then switched to Heavy Brawl, and aside from the animation/range changes to Marth, it had the same general feel. Switching to regular Brawl completely threw me off the game though.
I also tried heavy brawl a few times with my current main, Meta Knight, and, surprisingly, I enjoyed it. People should definitely give it a chance.
Balance is always a nice thing in a fighting game, but it's frustrating when my inexperienced friends get lucky with Ike and end up giving me a run for my money, especially in FFAs. I think Heavy Brawl should be considered at least for some tournaments. As for the back room, I remember a post(from I think Gimpy), saying that the reason Heavy brawl is not likely to be considered is because of the drastic change it makes on gameplay. In melee, if someone wanted to become competitive, they just needed to learn the advanced techs and when to use them. If we switch to heavy brawl, noobs wanting to get competitive not only need to learn the new techs, but also get accustomed to a different setting of play.
I also tried heavy brawl a few times with my current main, Meta Knight, and, surprisingly, I enjoyed it. People should definitely give it a chance.
Balance is always a nice thing in a fighting game, but it's frustrating when my inexperienced friends get lucky with Ike and end up giving me a run for my money, especially in FFAs. I think Heavy Brawl should be considered at least for some tournaments. As for the back room, I remember a post(from I think Gimpy), saying that the reason Heavy brawl is not likely to be considered is because of the drastic change it makes on gameplay. In melee, if someone wanted to become competitive, they just needed to learn the advanced techs and when to use them. If we switch to heavy brawl, noobs wanting to get competitive not only need to learn the new techs, but also get accustomed to a different setting of play.
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
Honestly, the best thing that can come out of this is that Heavy Brawl becomes a common side tournament thing. And that's fine.
Solid Moose
Smash Cadet
im still confused why i continue to look at posts and threads saying "brawl will never be competitive" followed by "dont change brawl, play how it is"
seriously, you either like it or you dont. if you dont like it, why would you be against making it better? im willing to bet a ton of people havent even played a single game against a person in heavy brawl. stop judging what you dont know. camping is such a prevalent strategy its sad, and its ruining this game so much. i dont need a new melee, but i played that for 3 years and never got sick of it
seriously, you either like it or you dont. if you dont like it, why would you be against making it better? im willing to bet a ton of people havent even played a single game against a person in heavy brawl. stop judging what you dont know. camping is such a prevalent strategy its sad, and its ruining this game so much. i dont need a new melee, but i played that for 3 years and never got sick of it
Oh man do we ever. We love that overpowered not-tripping BS. Or, if you can, remember when Fox won every single tournament ever. Man was he broken. How about those chain grabs from zero to death on almost every character? ****, wasn't that awesome?
How about auto-canceling, because only newbs too the time to practice L-canceling. Edgecanceling is out, wayyyy too overpowered. I mean, stopping people from coming back? You have no honor!
Yeah, melee was way to broken, so let's play Brawl. I got an idea! Let's make the standard metal, bunny ears, flower, slow, giga brawls! Yeah, it totally makes everyone even. Trust me.
No, just trust me. I know you won't take the time to figure it out on your own.
nviv
Smash Cadet
I understand that agrument and see how it is valid but there are a couple things to consider with it, first off switching from normal to heavy does not take an overwhelming amount of time, it is possible as depth increases that the time to switch will increase with it. However, I feel adjusting from normal to heavy is a one time thing and after that you can go between the two within a game or two, that is no different than learning a new A.T. and shouldn't be a reason to prevent heavy from being played at tournaments.
Second I understand that being able to bring new people into the competitive community is important but isn't the goal of the competitive community to have a fair balanced platform to compete on, not see how many people we can get to join the community. It doesn't make it impossible for new people to join or compete, it just offers them more of a challenge. When I first started learning about the competitive community for melee I had to spend many many hours learning to SHFFL, wavedash and many other A.T's by myself because I knew no one who could show me or help me. It was a big challange but I feel it made it even more rewarding and allowed me to see the depth Melee had. I never thought about giving up on competitive Melee just because learning the things the veterans already knew was difficult, it simply made me respect the community even more and increased my desire to learn and challange myself. If someone gives up just because they can't transition from regular to heavy brawl, chances are they wouldn't be very successful within the competitive community anyway.
Finally I would like to point out how there are quite a few gaming communities who don't use default rules and still thrive and grow without problem. For example, Halo 2 and Halo 3, if you look at casual gamers you usually see games with the AR/SMG default start or snipers only or rockets only. The competitive community uses none of these and uses a BR start. In Halo 3 they even changed speed and bullet damage also to balance it out, even with all the changes the Halo community still grows and evolves, I think MLG's success speaks for itself on that matter. If people are provided a fair even and balanced platform to compete on they will adapt to it no matter how much time it needed to adjust to it, and that should be the goal of the competitive community to provide that to people.
Ampleforth
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2005
- Messages
- 43
I don't understand why people say Heavy Brawl "breaks the game" for certain characters
It's not like standard Brawl is 100% balanced
It's not like standard Brawl is 100% balanced
Because Heavy isn't 100% either there chum.
And, after palying at a tournament today, I think Brawl will be just fine (as far as Brawl can be) with normal mode. Out of 30+ people, the top three were: 3) Falco 2) Marth 1) Wario
I mean, gosh, Wario? I didn't get to play him myself, but they were saying that he was playing like puff from melee. He ended up taking home over 100 some dollars (to show it was very serious). If Wario can win a tournament where there was a Marth, Pit, Ike, R.O.B., Dedede, and many other "better" characters, then normal Brawl will be just fine. All you have to do is just have fair stages, good counter picks, a nice format to play in (i.e. strike a level from random, loser choses stage, winner choses char, loser choses char), and other basic things it will be fine.
That said, normal Brawl isn't all cake and ice-cream. I didn't see certain characters make it very far. I say several Zero-to-Death combos from characters, and tripping... lots and lots of tripping. Why? Why Sakura? Why do you hate us soooo much?
eMORAY21
Smash Journeyman
... I've no read all the posts here and I've no intention too. But I thought I'd just make a quick point that has probably been made already.
The chars have all been balanced for normal grav by the developers, changing something as big as this just screws up any balance there once was. People like this because it then intoduces tier lists into the game. WHO CARES? I play as TL who is obviously pretty good, but I prefare the game being more balanced, rather than fox/falco/marth owning everyone.
The amount of time everyone is spending looking for breaks and even possibly some techs that have been put into the game, we'll end up finding something that will either quicken the game or make it harder to separate the noobs and the 'pros' eventually. I'm sure most people sore the link of the first Melee tourny of link vs jiggly, (LOL) and the obvious progression from that. So just give it time!
The chars have all been balanced for normal grav by the developers, changing something as big as this just screws up any balance there once was. People like this because it then intoduces tier lists into the game. WHO CARES? I play as TL who is obviously pretty good, but I prefare the game being more balanced, rather than fox/falco/marth owning everyone.
The amount of time everyone is spending looking for breaks and even possibly some techs that have been put into the game, we'll end up finding something that will either quicken the game or make it harder to separate the noobs and the 'pros' eventually. I'm sure most people sore the link of the first Melee tourny of link vs jiggly, (LOL) and the obvious progression from that. So just give it time!
you know... the whole reason this thread exists is because the author strongly believes that Heavy Brawl is a way to balance Brawl out more, not break it. Maybe you had no intention to read every post in the thread, but you could have at least taken the time to read the OP, you know, the important one.
Wrath`
Smash Master
you think heavy brawl balances the game? wow thats a good one, i thought the whole reason people wanted heavy brawl was to create less balence so that tiers might exist and a compition would be formed and bad characters would exist and characters that ***** existed so power hungry
play it normal gezee
Mario & Sonic Guy
Old rivalries live on!
From what I've discovered, you're only in danger of tripping while dashing. If you don't dash too much, then odds are you won't trip throughout the whole match.
(CAPS) READ OTHER PEOPLE'S POSTS BEFORE YOU MAKE ASSUMPTIONS!
I have strongly disagreed with Heavy Brawl from the conception of this thread. You should stfu instead of putting words in other people's mouth. Or, rather, just don't talk on the internet, Do us all a favor.
Plus, if you are going to disagree with the OP, at least come up with a sound reason. Pros wanting to be cheap to stay pros doesn't sound like a good reason to me. Try, I don't know, logic? Like, recovery problems with certain characters, combos with certain characters, chain grabs, stalls, etc. The list goes on, but you are to busy coming up with conspiracy theories to make a sound notion.
Game Over. No High-Score. Try again.
Edit:
Also-
Not true. It's possible to trip during anything that requires movement. While it most certainly happens during dashes, it also happens during Forward B attacks, smashes, grabs, and other things. The only way you are absolutely assured not to trip is if you do not move on the ground the entire game. That's just the facts.
Wrath`
Smash Master
If I obviously agree with the author, then I am also the President of Nintendo. I would request that you ask anyone in this thread if I agree with what the original poster said is true and everyone who posted would tell you know (unless they are trolling like I do), but I bet you wouldn't take the time. So, it really doesn't matter does it?
Heavy Brawl is broken to certain characters. IT doesn't fix the camp/spam problem. It gimps recoveries for certain characters. It is all around NOT an improvement. I take regular brawl over this. Heavy is bad.
Now go change your tampon, figure out the quote button, learn some grammar (So I can understand ha;f of your argument), and read the rest of the thread before you make false accusations. Just think, if this were clue, you would have lossed! Not to say that you didn't fail though :D
Heavy Brawl is broken to certain characters. IT doesn't fix the camp/spam problem. It gimps recoveries for certain characters. It is all around NOT an improvement. I take regular brawl over this. Heavy is bad.
Now go change your tampon, figure out the quote button, learn some grammar (So I can understand ha;f of your argument), and read the rest of the thread before you make false accusations. Just think, if this were clue, you would have lossed! Not to say that you didn't fail though :D
Mario & Sonic Guy
Old rivalries live on!
Interesting, because I never saw any tripping except for when I tried to dash.
Well, now I don't know what to think. I don't think I have the time to read through everything... *sigh*
So, does Heavy Brawl IMPROVE or WORSEN balance?
When I first heard of this, I started thinking that maybe Brawl was in fact balanced with Heavy Brawl in mind. I mean... it does nerf Marth, Pit, Toon Link, Olimar, Ike, Metaknight and Diddy and maybe the Space Animals in terms of recovery, right? And those are probably the ones in need of some nerfing... though I guess it might also make them even easier to combo with... but it would also enable other characters to combo them, at least... that would be quite good.
Sakurai did hint that there might be something for the competitive players to discover, right? Probably just a hint at possible glitches that they didn't know of, but maybe he did actually mean Heavy Brawl? Kind of like "let the casuals play casual Brawl and give Heavy to the heavy players".
Let's face it, Brawl is unbalanced and slow the way it is. And I'm saying that as a casual noob.
So, does Heavy Brawl IMPROVE or WORSEN balance?
When I first heard of this, I started thinking that maybe Brawl was in fact balanced with Heavy Brawl in mind. I mean... it does nerf Marth, Pit, Toon Link, Olimar, Ike, Metaknight and Diddy and maybe the Space Animals in terms of recovery, right? And those are probably the ones in need of some nerfing... though I guess it might also make them even easier to combo with... but it would also enable other characters to combo them, at least... that would be quite good.
Sakurai did hint that there might be something for the competitive players to discover, right? Probably just a hint at possible glitches that they didn't know of, but maybe he did actually mean Heavy Brawl? Kind of like "let the casuals play casual Brawl and give Heavy to the heavy players".
Let's face it, Brawl is unbalanced and slow the way it is. And I'm saying that as a casual noob.
nviv
Smash Cadet
That depends on what balance you are referring to, as far as character balance goes it does put some characters at a natural disadvantage but that is true in regular brawl as well. I feel character balance overall for heavy is a little worse than in regular but character balance isn't the reason for using heavy brawl.
The balance that it helps is offensive vs defensive balance. Right now camping and playing defensively is more rewarding the majority of the time but by using heavy brawl it rewards playing more aggressive because you can combo your opponent better. So instead of doing 5-10% of damage every time you beat their defense you do like 20% and every time their defense works they still only do 5-10% and because defense works more often than offense it balances it out better and allows people to play either style and potentially be successful.
Eternal Neo
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2007
- Messages
- 91
I would love to see this because I think most people would move over to heavy brawl after awhile because of the little depth and room for improvement in standard brawl. I believe standard brawl will probably reach its competitive peak within the year. After mastering the timing and spacing of defensive maneuvers there really isn't much room for improvement in standard brawl. Therefore I think it's just the nature of the game that after awhile either people will get bored and stop playing brawl or move on to other modes in the game. I could see the majority of the dedicated competitive smashers ending up playing heavy brawl as the casual players quit brawl.
Also there will be tiers in standard brawl and in heavy brawl. Tiers are just a natural part of fighting games. The reason people like heavy brawl is because we think it's more fun to play; not because it helps our mains and hurts yours, or because it makes a bigger tier list, or any other dumb conspiracy theory. Why do some posters here think it's wrong to play any mode but standard brawl. If Sakurai only wanted people to play standard mode he wouldn't have put heavy brawl in the game.
RazeveX
Smash Ace
it might help if you think about the characters in the game as people.
Every character deserves equality, right?
Then you cant use heavy brawl. Thats like shooting jiggs and metaknight right in the face to give fox and wolf new TVs. Sure some may have started off better or worse than others, but its not the characters faults. Why hurt all of the sad metaknight, jiggs, marth, rob, etc. mains out there just so you can make brawl slightly more fun for you?
Whats that you say? That all the characters getting nerfed by heavy brawl are high tier anyway? And that this fixes the game?
Not even close. And even if you were right, this is a brawlocracy. I am the brawltator, and I made the brawlcisions around here.
Seriously though, this isn't brawlunism (its hard to fit brawl and communism together).
Every character deserves equality, right?
Then you cant use heavy brawl. Thats like shooting jiggs and metaknight right in the face to give fox and wolf new TVs. Sure some may have started off better or worse than others, but its not the characters faults. Why hurt all of the sad metaknight, jiggs, marth, rob, etc. mains out there just so you can make brawl slightly more fun for you?
Whats that you say? That all the characters getting nerfed by heavy brawl are high tier anyway? And that this fixes the game?
Not even close. And even if you were right, this is a brawlocracy. I am the brawltator, and I made the brawlcisions around here.
Seriously though, this isn't brawlunism (its hard to fit brawl and communism together).
Papapaint
Just your average kind of Luigi.
All characters are not created equal. Not by a long shot.
Eternal Neo
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2007
- Messages
- 91
Actually we shouldn't be doing this and I have no idea why you think standard brawl is any more balanced than heavy brawl.
Edit: Jigglypuff is actually much better is heavy brawl since she can acually do aerial combos and wall of pain. In standard brawl she's nearly unplayable. Have you even played the mode or are you just rambling about communism?
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
LOL.
coreygames has been one of the people here who consistently has been against Heavy Brawl, and he's done it with sound arguments that I wholeheartedly respect. He's a good guy.
At the same time, I don't think people are understanding what I mean by balance:
What most people think when I say balance is "character balance". This could not be further from the truth. Characters are already very unbalanced in Brawl, or for that matter any fighting game that didn't have ditto characters across the board.
What I am talking about is "gameplay balance", which in this case specifically refers to the defensive and offensive options available to a player. I am making the argument that regular Brawl is much more oriented towards a defensive style while Heavy Brawl facilitates both.
Also, coreygames, I am seeing your point. At Bossy's Biweeklies yesterday, two of the coolest and most effective characters I saw were Boss's very tightly-played Ness, Nicktendo's tightly-played DeDeDe, Ken's very aggressive Wolf, and Death's crazy-*** Metaknight. Still saw some campy action though.
M.K
Level 55
Ok, prove it. Which character is so overly powerful that no other character can overcome it? Dare you to name one, because there is ALWAYS a counter.
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
There is no character that cannot defeat another character. I don't think anyone was saying that, and if that's what you thought, then you're...very narrow-minded at the very least. However, if two players of equal skill level choose different characters and the character balance is offset enough, the player with the worse character will lose consistently.
Cases in point, Marth vs. Yoshi, Metaknight vs. Donkey Kong, Mario vs. R.O.B., Fox vs. Ganondorf, etc.
M.K
Level 55
Well, in your last sentence, you state that those character match-ups are beneficial to one and distatrous to another. However, you said that there is no character that can't defeat another character. So, of course Marth vs. Yoshi would be a tough match for Yoshi, but the character balance is not offset enough to where it is impossible to win as Yoshi.
However, in Heavy Brawl, let's just take Marth vs. Sonic. It is almost impossible for Sonic to win. His recovery is an abortion waiting to happen, and his attacks can't do ****. Don't give me the "Oohh, Sonic sucks anyways so it doesn't matter" argument. If that's true, why don't we just play Marth, Fox, Wolf, and Meta-Knight for the rest of Brawl's career. Let's not let ANYONE new play Brawl and get good at it. I'm sure this would be awesome. It seems that Heavy Brawl IS the excuse to tell people "We don't want Melee 2.0, we want Brawl, but Heavy Brawl is most like Melee 2.0, but it's not Melee 2.0, so it's ok to promote it"
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
The crux of your argument, however flawed it may be for several different reasons posted across several different posts by several different people across this thread that I am sure you have taken the time to willfully ignore, is that you think I care about character balance.
To tell you the truth, it's the last thing on my mind when I am thinking about Heavy Brawl (or regular Brawl for that matter).
Move on to some other point of discussion, because you're not getting anywhere with this one.
M.K
Level 55
If you toss aside the factor of Character Balance, I can't imagine how you can promote Heavy Brawl with any intention of furthering the Smash competitive community! However positive Heavy Brawl could be is crippled by the fact that character balance becomes even more skew and exponentially greater (in the wrong way).
However, arguing is a moot point. Back Room announced that they wouldn't condone Heavy Brawl as the competitive standard.
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
I've heard about the announcement (I can't really find it anywhere, but I was expecting this nonetheless, so it's not very surprising to me). This is why I am talking about side tournies.
Also, you don't seem to understand that character balance =/= community robustness (I'm not even sure how you've made that correlation). MvC2 has one of the most robust communities, but competitive play centers around about 6 characters.
Also, stop talking out of your ***. "exponentially greater"? Psssssh. You clearly haven't read the things we have said earlier.
M.K
Level 55
Oh well, whatever. Have fun at your side tournies.
Eternal Neo
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2007
- Messages
- 91
Where are you getting this idea that standard brawl is somehow balanced at all for tournament play? Sakurai did not balance the characters for 1 v 1 tournament play because he clearly did not design the game mechanics with tournament play in mind. The campy defensive style of play that pervades high level brawl is proof of this, and as players improve and master the timing and spacing better, the differences between the characters who can camp well and those who can't will only be accentuated. And those are the only characters that will win touraments.
There's no basis to say that heavy brawl is more or less balanced than standard brawl right now because it hasn't been tested enough. Will heavy brawl have a tierlist? Yes, but standard will too so that's not a good argument. What we do know is that heavy brawl improves some of the flaws that are inherent in standard brawl, which certainly wasn't designed or balanced to be a competitive tournament game.
popsofctown
Smash Champion
Most of my ideas are bad, but the really big balloons pop the prettiest.
What if instead of playing one tourney, the same mode throughout, we blended the tourney so we could blend the tiers together?
This could be done by giving characters gravity counterpicks. Based on a set of rules, lower tier characters can get to pick which gravity is played for the match, to their advantage. So since the lower tier characters are given the ability to counterpick gravity, they become more powerful. And if the bottom tier becomes more powerful we come closer to having no tiers at all.
Let me give an example of a little of how this idea would work. As far as i know, Kirby's outlook is mid tier in normal grav. He is severely gimped by Heavy Gravity.
Kirby has a number associated with him. Let's say 7. Any game is going to be played heavy grav unless some characters number is much higher than another.
Kirby plays a really low tier character that is not gimped by gravity, Ganondorf, who has a 6. Ganondorf (just go with this) is so bad that Kirby's gravity number isn't high enough to change the gravity to whatever kirby wants.
So we can see here the kirby's grav number doesn't let him obliterate anyone.
Now Kirby goes up to play Falco. Uh oh. Falco isn't very weakened by heavy gravity. He also is pretty high tier to start with. His gravity number is 2. Kirby has an over-4 difference in gravity. Kirby gets to decide whether high gravity will be on. He turns it off.
Now that example shows how grav numbers could protect the tiers as they are. In other examples, it can make them even better than they already are.
Bowser is a very slow character. Let's say he comes out really ugly on the tier list, and gets a grav number of 15, even though high grav doesn't hurt him. ( i think it helps him, dont really know).
Bowser and the Kirby fight. Normally Kirby would smoke Bowser ten games out of ten. But Bowser has a very high grav number, he chooses to maintain gravity at high (actually, even if his number was seven it would stay high). Now kirby is gimped, bowser gains an advantage, the tier list is even flatter than before.
I think it's a good idea at least. You could give really low grav precedence to the characters who camp well, so the grav is heavy and Capt. Falcons and what not can charge them.
Oh this probably wouldn't take off at all, you would have to recognize character inequalities. Why do i bother?
What if instead of playing one tourney, the same mode throughout, we blended the tourney so we could blend the tiers together?
This could be done by giving characters gravity counterpicks. Based on a set of rules, lower tier characters can get to pick which gravity is played for the match, to their advantage. So since the lower tier characters are given the ability to counterpick gravity, they become more powerful. And if the bottom tier becomes more powerful we come closer to having no tiers at all.
Let me give an example of a little of how this idea would work. As far as i know, Kirby's outlook is mid tier in normal grav. He is severely gimped by Heavy Gravity.
Kirby has a number associated with him. Let's say 7. Any game is going to be played heavy grav unless some characters number is much higher than another.
Kirby plays a really low tier character that is not gimped by gravity, Ganondorf, who has a 6. Ganondorf (just go with this) is so bad that Kirby's gravity number isn't high enough to change the gravity to whatever kirby wants.
So we can see here the kirby's grav number doesn't let him obliterate anyone.
Now Kirby goes up to play Falco. Uh oh. Falco isn't very weakened by heavy gravity. He also is pretty high tier to start with. His gravity number is 2. Kirby has an over-4 difference in gravity. Kirby gets to decide whether high gravity will be on. He turns it off.
Now that example shows how grav numbers could protect the tiers as they are. In other examples, it can make them even better than they already are.
Bowser is a very slow character. Let's say he comes out really ugly on the tier list, and gets a grav number of 15, even though high grav doesn't hurt him. ( i think it helps him, dont really know).
Bowser and the Kirby fight. Normally Kirby would smoke Bowser ten games out of ten. But Bowser has a very high grav number, he chooses to maintain gravity at high (actually, even if his number was seven it would stay high). Now kirby is gimped, bowser gains an advantage, the tier list is even flatter than before.
I think it's a good idea at least. You could give really low grav precedence to the characters who camp well, so the grav is heavy and Capt. Falcons and what not can charge them.
Oh this probably wouldn't take off at all, you would have to recognize character inequalities. Why do i bother?