Got a question! Sheik Q&A & FAQ

[DarkThundah]

Alright I have a quick question. I've searched the fourms for about 15min now (n' also smashwiki).

Ok: Is is better to use shield grab or normal grab, or does it depend on the situation? Ex: better to dash>shield>neutral A or dash>Z; maybe less frames or something...

Thanks

 

[Voyeur]

Alright I have a quick question. I've searched the fourms for about 15min now (n' also smashwiki).

Ok: Is is better to use shield grab or normal grab, or does it depend on the situation? Ex: better to dash>shield>neutral A or dash>Z; maybe less frames or something...

Thanks

well, yeah I think it is pretty situational. Dashing into an attack and then power shielding it and immediately grabbing afterwards is efficient. But if you know your opponent is predicting with a Sheild to counter your Usmash or Dash attack but you end up not doing neither of those, you could instead do the normal dash-grab.

You can also boost grab; it's the same idea as DACUS except you do a grab instead of Usmash to cancel the dash attack.

 

[Flamingo]

What??? Seriously??? Boost grabbling? Please tell me you are joking man... I've never heard of this.

Dude, I just do dash-cancelled grabs. It has nothing to do with the dash Attack, but you cancel the running animation with the shield so you slide, and then you can grab, dsmash, ftilt, etc depeiding on the situation... heck even nair out of the sheild.

 

[Voyeur]

What??? Seriously??? Boost grabbling? Please tell me you are joking man... I've never heard of this.

Dude, I just do dash-cancelled grabs. It has nothing to do with the dash Attack, but you cancel the running animation with the shield so you slide, and then you can grab, dsmash, ftilt, etc depeiding on the situation... heck even nair out of the sheild.

yeah, seriously :]

http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Boost_Grab

 

[Tristan_win]

1+1= meta knight chain grab.

Sheik has a guaranteed grab release into dacus and dash attack.

Shouldn't a boost grab mean she would also have a chain grab on meta knight?

 

[Flamingo]

Ummm Tristan...? anyone else...? This is new, right? Or was I in the dark?

Few questions:
1. Will the enemy get hit by the dash attack and be damaged and still get grabbed?? or is the dash attack cancelled to a grab?

2. Have you done this? Is the timing ridiculous?

3. Did you mistake this to be a Brawl tech that is actually a melee tech?

 

[Zankoku]

1+1= meta knight chain grab.

Sheik has a guaranteed grab release into dacus and dash attack.

Shouldn't a boost grab mean she would also have a chain grab on meta knight?

No, because the escapability of the second grab is due to the height of Sheik's grab, not the distance she has to cover.

 

[SinkingHigher]

Sheik has little trouble dealing with projectiles.....especially Pits. I have no clue what your talking about when you say that Pit has better projectiles than: Wolf, Falco, Fox, Tink, Link, Samus, Snake, etc.....all of those charcters are great at camping and some of them can even trap you and use projectiles as a semi-wall( Link, Tink, Samus).

If your having trouble dealing with Pit, you don't dash into a shield enough. His arrows are very easy to powershield. In fact, the only time I ever have trouble with them is when i'm offstage.

Ha!

I totally forgot about that.

I was playing WiFi so it makes it hard to sheild properly. They still eat away at the sheil pretty fast.

I know what you mean about the others being good at camping but I guess I've just never had the good fortune of meeting a decent camper. :/

 

[DarkThundah]

You can also boost grab; it's the same idea as DACUS except you do a grab instead of Usmash to cancel the dash attack.

boost grab? wtf? Oh wow it actually exists:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=168815
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MVBSCs3mvM

 

[Blue Yoshi]

Just wondering, what gives Sheik a huge advantage over Ganondorf? Both boards say it's a 95-5 matchup, meaning Ganon is lucky to even take a stock. I played against a CPU ganon, tried basically everything, and haven't found anything that breaks this matchup. Ganon is easy to combo... is there a 0-death, 0-100+, or something similar?

I'm planning on learning every character's worst matchup (Sheik for Ganon, Pika for Fox, GaW for Lucas / Yoshi, Marth for Ness, DDD for infinitables, etc.), and Sheik is Ganon's by far according to the Ganon boards. At the moment, I don't play Sheik, but I plan to for this specific matchup (and other extreme Sheik advantaged matchups).

 

[SinkingHigher]

Ganondorf is SO easily gimped using tether, and he's practically dead after needles from the right place.

f-tilt lock and chain lock work beautifully on him.
f-air streaming.
chainguarding DESTROYS him.
She's pretty much too fast for him to hit.

Basically, once ganon is off the stage he's screwed.

It's kinda shocking that it's 95-5. Never heard of that before.

 

[Blistering Speed]

Ice Climbers vs Ganon is essentially 100:0.

Throw one needle, pull out chain. You win.

 

[Ich Bin Awesome]

I noticed you guys have a xat chat (http://xat.com/SSBBsheikgroup). I'm trying to make a universal xat room that is tabbed to all individual character xats with each main owner becoming an owner in this room as well.

To do it the main owner has to tab xat.com/Wifi_Room
(Go to "Edit your Chat", type in Wifi_Room, click get, select it, OK)

So far the Link, Mario, Pit, and Pikachu xats are connected.

Who is the main owner by the way?

 

[Flamingo]

What is xat chat?

 

[Voyeur]

it's like Xfire; it's just a chat system used for most games to involve a quicker form of talking to other people; i.e. like clan chats for GunZ or something.
I guess this one can work over a vast network of LANs?...not sure but I have no idea who even runs our xat since it's the first time I've heard or knew we had one.

It would save thread creation of "We're discussing so and so" they could just hit up our chat room and tell us which is handy I suppose.

 

[Flamingo]

that's pretty interesting.

 

[Ich Bin Awesome]

Yeah, it's pretty fun and easy to make. Just get someone on the boards to go to xat.com and make one. See my sig for an example.

 

[Ich Bin Awesome]

Hey everyone-

I'm trying to get a "brawl lobby" set up that connects all the xat chats so people can chat or find matches or w/e (or you can go to it directly at www.xat.com/Wifi_Room No signup or registration is needed). So far 16 xats have the room tabbed in their chats. See this thread for the details:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=218563

Check it out, I hope you guys don't mind that I listed the Shiek xat chat. If your boards have an "important links" thread, it would be appreciated if the above thread and site were added. It's might be at least useful for those that want to locate the individual character xats.

Thanks.

 

[Voyeur]

You should of just added that as an edit to your above post instead of a double one. But as soon as I'm finished with the new index & reference guide thread I'll add that into the multimedia section. I can see the convenience of something like that though, thanks

 

[Flamingo]

I got's a question for anyone who has experience againse a good Sonic. Coz i gots a money match comin up against one!

What is Sheik's approach?
What does Sheik do against a character who is actually faster than her?
Is needle camping effective?
Does the chain work well? Is it really ownage off the edge vs his vertical recovery?
Ftilt good?

Sorry, literally no experience against a decent Sonic. All help appreciated!!!

 

[SinkingHigher]

**** wrong topic nevermind.

 

[Blistering Speed]

Double post, ignore.

 

[Blistering Speed]

I got's a question for anyone who has experience againse a good Sonic. Coz i gots a money match comin up against one!

What is Sheik's approach?
What does Sheik do against a character who is actually faster than her?
Is needle camping effective?
Does the chain work well? Is it really ownage off the edge vs his vertical recovery?
Ftilt good?

Sorry, literally no experience against a decent Sonic. All help appreciated!!!

1. Sheik doesn't have to deviate from standard approach, walking F Tilt, RAR'd B Air etc. are all still applicable, just change your spacing to suit Sonic's abilitys.
2. Sonic is only faster then you in running speed. This gives him great tech chase, followup and punishing capabilities, however your attack speed is still way ahead of his. Sheik has the unique ability to play as a character who's main strategy is 'hit them before they hit you' and you shouldn't be blinded by running speed to think this still doesn't apply here.
3. This is Brawl. Needle camping is always effective.
4. If you're under a platform, Sonic can't get through the chain in anyway (as he usually can jump above you and spring), so if you have good chain control then it becomes VERY useful. From the leaving of the spring to the apex of his jump, Sonic has invincibility frames so no, the chain isn't so great against his vertical recovery. Sonic also has great recovery options anyway so he can avoid the chain easily.
6. F Tilt is your best move, it's always good.

 

[FrozenFire13]

Ok, how bout this question? Would breaking out the chain against MK be a good idea? Since he has no projectiles and must come to you? The chain hits him out of the tornado, and (as far as I can tell) the shuttle loop can't reach as long as you have good chain control. So, is the chain a good idea? Besides needle camping of course

 

[Voyeur]

Ok, how bout this question? Would breaking out the chain against MK be a good idea? Since he has no projectiles and must come to you? The chain hits him out of the tornado, and (as far as I can tell) the shuttle loop can't reach as long as you have good chain control. So, is the chain a good idea? Besides needle camping of course

It is applicable but don't go overboard with it and become really predictable. Because sooner or later the MK player is just going to get wise to that game and wait for his moments when you're retracting the chain.

If you camp off with needles and during his approach you use the chain, that's more savy but don't just all together throw off your normal Bair spacing or in this case I think it might be an advantage to try for some Dtilt locking with Zelda, so Down-B once your moves start to decay

 

[Blistering Speed]

It is applicable but don't go overboard with it and become really predictable. Because sooner or later the MK player is just going to get wise to that game and wait for his moments when you're retracting the chain.

Why do you have to retract?

 

[Voyeur]

Why do you have to retract?

Because Project Mayhem demanded it so.

EDIT: seriously though, times when you would loose chain control perhaps and get punished for it once MK gets inside. Or during his respawn and frames of invincibility where you'd obviously need to retract to reposition yourself :]

 

[Blistering Speed]

Because Project Mayhem demanded it so.

EDIT: seriously though, times when you would loose chain control perhaps and get punished for it once MK gets inside. Or during his respawn and frames of invincibility where you'd obviously need to retract to reposition yourself :]

You're forgetting the first rule.

OBVIOUSLY in respawn you'd retract, you know that's not what I meant, and if you lose chain control that's a mistake on your part. Don't make a mistake and you don't have to retract.

I know it seems like I'm just repeating myself over and over with this chain stuff, but I honest to God feel people just aren't realising the implications of it.

 

[Flamingo]

Thank you BlisteringSpeed for the Sonic advice! It will sure come in handy. I tested the chain thing vs vertical recovery and it got me 25 damage before he could get up far enough with his invincibility, and since he was so high, I could safely retract. I think I will use that as my edgeguarding game since gimping is basically out of the question.

Also, pertaining to recent chain topic, I totally agree with what BlisteringSpeed says, and I don't know what you guys are talking about retracting in respawn lol... the chain won't kill, unless you are off the edge-ing it vs Jigglypuff, even that is lucky... Or if you got a jacketed kill, which is really lucky also.

I say if the chain is working, KEEP IT GOING. If they hit you out of it, chances are that you are going to do more damage than them in the long run and even if you are near killing percentage, the lag from retract will probably get you killed anyways without the possibility of giving them a little more damage, unless you sweetspot them (electric hit) before the retract, even still, it is dangerous... IMO.. Keep the chain out.

 

[Slasherx]

Is it possible to use Bair backward to score a KO?
The knockback won't be high but it might trick them into falling off the stage or chain with another Bair.

 

[Voyeur]

Is it possible to use Bair backward to score a KO?
The knockback won't be high but it might trick them into falling off the stage or chain with another Bair.

Bair backward, you mean just B-air? and yes at the right %s it's easy to get a KO.
it's a good edgeguarding/spacing tool when you're hanging on the edge lets say and drop and keep the Bair from the opponent to recover can get some gimps.


so it's better as a spacing tool, it can get some gimps and at high percentages like 160+ I know it can get the KO but Nair is better for that, or ftilt lock to tipper at earlier %s

 

[Slasherx]

Bair backward, you mean just B-air? and yes at the right %s it's easy to get a KO.
it's a good edgeguarding/spacing tool when you're hanging on the edge lets say and drop and keep the Bair from the opponent to recover can get some gimps.


so it's better as a spacing tool, it can get some gimps and at high percentages like 160+ I know it can get the KO but Nair is better for that, or ftilt lock to tipper at earlier %s

No I mean, if you're facing right with Sheik, then do a shorthop N-air. Then your oponent is on the left.
My bad I didn't mean B-air.

 

[Voyeur]

No I mean, if you're facing right with Sheik, then do a shorthop N-air. Then your oponent is on the left.
My bad I didn't mean B-air.

so the back hit box of the N-air

___O_S_____
\----------------/

O is your opponent, and S is Sheik, you do a short hop Nair to connect with that back hitbox ....I'm not sure but I know it can toss some one far enough....I don't think it can KO though but in all cases in that situation Bair is just better. And Nair of course being more dominant as a front approach of Ftilt-lock follow up.

Even if it could KO from that angle or set up for a gimp, it isn't as reliable or practical as other moves.

 

[Flamingo]

No I mean, if you're facing right with Sheik, then do a shorthop N-air. Then your oponent is on the left.
My bad I didn't mean B-air.

Yes, as long as they are touching you. They have to be preeetty high damage though. If you miss, the weak hitbox will hit, and it won't kill. You basically have to be inside them while using it if you know what I mean.

 

[Voyeur]

I was wondering if ANY of Sheik's moves have a spike property. I've been searching around and saw that Fair apparently has a semi-spike, but do any of her moves allow a gimp for some one to just get the knock back straight down?

even if it's a light one, like her chain perhaps?

 

[Flamingo]

I was wondering if ANY of Sheik's moves have a spike property. I've been searching around and saw that Fair apparently has a semi-spike, but do any of her moves allow a gimp for some one to just get the knock back straight down?

even if it's a light one, like her chain perhaps?

I spiked someone with Utilt (it looked like it anyway). Idk how. But I did. It was on-stage, and I have the video... trying to get it up so that I can both show you the spike, and get critiqued.

PS: The chain owns Kirby's vertical recovery.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Why does the Dair suck again? I never really got that.

 

[Blistering Speed]

Telegraphed, bad ending lag, relatively noticeable start up.

A thread I made back in September, a few people post uses for it there, but it's all situational.
http://www.smashboards.com/archive/index.php/t-196570.html

 

[Flamingo]

Telegraphed, bad ending lag, relatively noticeable start up.

A thread I made back in September, a few people post uses for it there, but it's all situational.
http://www.smashboards.com/archive/index.php/t-196570.html

Yeah, it is bad. And the only nice and unexpected application I saw in those posts (And it is very situational) is using it while both you and your enemy are up in the air. Yep. KO off the top. I believe the only situation where I see this working is where a multiple jump character hits us up in the air and then chases with uair, ie. MK, Kirby, Jiggs, Pit. This may work, but I am not all that confident in Dair's priority because it does not have a disjointed hitbox like MK's uair (or Pit's) would have, and they would win. And if the other multi-jumpers characters timed their uairs somewhat intelligently, both would hit, and we would most likely die first. (or both of us die). So... DAIR BLOWS. >.<

 

[LordoftheMorning]

Today's news:

LordoftheMorning's Shiek was allegedly bombarded with Mach Tornados and he had NO IDEA how to stop them whatsoever. He emerged victorious, seeing as how said MetaKnight was a noob, but wishes to know what moves can clank or punish the Whorenado. Many thanks. I should spend more time on these boards.