Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Teeb147]

Sorry I don’t have a lot of time to respond to this but I think it’s pretty clear that I do understand exactly what you are saying and just do not agree with your points and/or think your points are pretty thin on actual logic. And you’re just kind of repeating yourself at this point.

And regarding yuusha to Brave: It feels like you want to have your cake and eat it too. You’re now saying it’s not clear cut that it’s a reference to Erdrick but then also stated it along with his name being leaked are the biggest points for his being a legit newcomer. So which is it? Either it’s a clear piece of evidence for Erdrick or it’s not. Because if it’s not then there’s no reason he has a stronger case for him right now than any other SE rep.

See you later

You replied quick. I have a few minutes.
I said you dont understand my points because you're not trying to know what i mean by them. And since you jsut said again that you disagree with them even though i said that, which i dont appreciate because im being honest about there being more to them then you've handled.

We already talked about this exact brave point. And like I said, it's valuable along with the leaks, corroborating that erdrick could be the next character. By itself Brave doesn't necessarily point to erdrick, and that's exactly what i mean by you putting words in my mouth, because i never said brave is a clear piece of evidence in that way.
So chill and if you want to have a talk at some point later on that's fine we can do that, but please hold back from making too many assumptions about what im saying.

 

[Firox]

Holy Moley, this got a lot of responses since I died around 1AM and resurrected. I'm hitting up some of the smaller ones real quick.



Eh, I'll be honest: gender doesn't mean that much to me. If it does to someone else that's fine, but to me personally it's not that important, thus if I misgender someone in a situation where it's not immediately obvious what their gender is I don't get into a tizzy about it. It's for the same reason when I did call center work and I got called 'Ma'am' a lot even though I'm a dude. I never corrected them because it was never a big deal.

If it bothers you Verde Coeden Scalesworth then know I didn't mean anything by it.



There were a lot of interesting theories out there that are suddenly taking shape, like how the codenames is a word-game on top of being hints at the character and that each codename starts with the same letter as the actual name of the character (Packu starts with 'P' and so does Piranha Plat, Jack starts with 'J' and so does Joker. Arsene isn't a character and is an asset of a character so being Doyle doesn't break the theory). I left all those out of my post because they have no true weight to them. However, we DO have a case of "three is a pattern": Jack, Doyle and Brave are all signs of masking character names with cutesy codenames that somehow link to the character choice. Packu is not an outlier because Piranha Plant was never meant to be DLC until there was no more time for base roster and the character was revealed before copies of the game were available to be datamined, meaning there would be no reason to go to such lengths to hide the character's identity.

Like I said, there are a lot of interesting pattern theories or codename theories out there, with this new one for Banjo tying in folklore, literature, and cultural references into the Brave codename. It's a fun read that doesn't seem too crazy.



So you are actually correct, Dragon Quest is the second-best-selling franchise due to the pure number of titles: Dragon Quest had four games come out while Zelda only had two. I did the math, and Dragon Quest just barely snubs Zelda by 85,000 units. I find it hilarious that it's the sales of Dragon Quest I that REALLY didn't do nearly as well in comparison that brings the franchise into that 2nd place spot just barely.


For future reference:

• Super Mario Bros. - 40,240,000
• Super Mario Bros. 3 - 18,000,000
• Super Mario Bros . 2 - 7,460,000
• The Legend of Zelda - 6,510,000
• Zelda II: Link's Adventure - 4,380,000
• Dragon Quest III - 3,895,000
• Dragon Quest IV - 3,180,000
• Dragon Quest II - 2,400,000
• Dragon Quest - 1,500,000

Remember folks, quantity over quality! However, do keep in mind that individually, each Dragon Quest title on NES was outsold by Tetris, Dr. Mario, Excitebike, Golf (a sign of the times to be sure) and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.



I also have been a part of Smash speculation for over a decade, and while I've never been super active on forums, I have been super active in other media like YouTube, and I can tell you right now that there is more to a character's speculation than just a forum or two. All over YouTube people had been wishing for her but convinced she was 'too sexy for Smash' or 'she uses guns so she can't get in' and she was very much in Joker's place of 'I want her but I'm not gonna talk about it all too much because it's not possible at all' sort of scenario where there WERE people wishing for the character but they had little faith.

Calling her the 'Ridley before Ridley' fits her perfectly because her reasons for not getting in were thought to be just as much as a roadblock as Ridley's size was to him. Hell, her inclusion gave more faith to Ridley because it was clear roadblocks can be avoided or dealt with: if Cloud brought the idea that Sakurai can get any character, then Bayonetta cemented it. Thus when she was revealed people had another wave of "anything is possible with Sakurai at the wheel!" right after Cloud. She's part of the reason why more confidence in far-out character picks came into play and why so many people turned their opinion from 'this can't happen' to 'anything can happen, I have no idea!'

This is your opinion of Bayonetta, a very subjective and very aggressive opinion against her. I have never had attachment to the character at all and am coming from a completely neutral stance, and I can tell you her announcement sent major waves and had many people getting hype.



So the stance that I take about leakers is that they never offer anything for proof. It's always just 'take my word for it' which you cannot use 'Hey, this leaker said X about this character, so they are/aren't in' when leakers rarely ever have visual or audio evidence. Even if a leaker gets something right or even gets multiple things right, you still have to take their next statement with a grain of salt unless proof is provided because for all we know the previous statements were just lucky guesses. This is coming from someone who thinks Verge did have real information on the base game, but it's been made clear that he burned his bridges and resources at this point. He rarely pipes up about Nintendo stuff, the last time he did he was wrong, he backpedals and alters his claims to make him look better, and he hasn't been right about a damn thing related to Smash since Incineroar. This isn't to mention how it's clear he is gullible and that his sources have given him false information on TOP of multiple persons in the leaker community stating that he piggybacked and lost his sources in one way or another. THIS was the most trustworthy leaker for Smash Ultimate, and now look at him! He's nothing.

If there is solid proof, then sure. If it's just 'believe me on this' then quit using that as an argument. That would be like me arguing that Tupac is still alive because someone told me they saw him a week ago but they didn't have any evidence and I had to take their word for it. It doesn't make any sense.



Fun fact, in Soul Calibur IV we got Darth Vader, Yoda and Starkiller. No Luke to be found.

To be fair, Cloud is not a silent protagonist and has character unlike many other protagonists in games that are meant to be self-insert. However, this is no longer really a point against Erdrick as Legend of Zelda games often let you change Link's name and he is a silent protagonist. So I admit that this particular point doesn't hold weight nearly as much as I originally thought. However, whether or not Erdrick from DQ3 is the best choice to represent Dragon Quest in Smash Ultimate as a single character like Cloud is still heavily up for debate.

I may respond to more of your replies later, but if I don't it's because I did my best to represent both sides and some of your replies echo that. Also yes, this post very much targets a certain crowd in terms of the really obnoxious and kind of fake bandwagon-ing fans who are more aggressive, but the points made that do still stand apply in general and not just to that crowd.

Also the main point was that cultural impact and fan demand are the two most important factors shown thus far for character inclusion. Having high sales or a remembered history are usually a result of said cultural impact.
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I think I may start work on the Geno Doc now, considering all the hubbub this got.

Honestly, I don't really care that much about gender either. Just figured I'd point it out. As for my consensus on your big post, you had some good points about Erdrick. The entire expectation of another SE rep is totally dependent on the opinion of a questionably accurate leaker. That said, I trust you understand the titanically colossal amount of crow you'll have to swallow should Erdrick somehow end up getting in. It will obliterate your credibility and vindicate Vergeben to a level of authority I really hope he never gets. Again, that's a big IF, but I just wanted to point that out as well.

 

[Ovaltine]

Honestly, I don't see why people even bring up Verge as the holy grail when it comes to the Erdrick leaks anyway. I only really saw people dumping their chips in when Tansut claimed Erdrick was coming. I think that's the one people ought to focus on, not on-again off-again Verge.

 

[Deleted member]

Vergeben is an unreliable, autism-insulting ****hole.

 

[Firox]

Honestly, I don't see why people even bring up Verge as the holy grail when it comes to the Erdrick leaks anyway. I only really saw people dumping their chips in when Tansut claimed Erdrick was coming. I think that's the one people ought to focus on, not on-again off-again Verge.

Regardless of the leaker(s) responsible, I'm just saying that if Erdrick gets in, it's going to turn the speculation world upside down. At that point, Tansut or Verge could claim any random thing is getting in and the vast majority of sheep out there would buy it hook, line and sinker.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Erdrick is perhaps the likeliest character to be "brave" at this point if we just listen to leaks and the translations.

People would like to consider other options, though, as the leakers' sources could be wrong.

For example, Brave may be a reference to the Disney movie or what Native American cultures use the bear to symbolize at least from what someone in the Banjo thread found.

Perhaps Brave could also be any brave boi, like Geno, Ninten, Sora, Agumon, [insert more characters here].

 

[The Anigriffin]

Regardless of the leaker(s) responsible, I'm just saying that if Erdrick gets in, it's going to turn the speculation world upside down. At that point, Tansut or Verge could claim any random thing is getting in and the vast majority of sheep out there would buy it hook, line and sinker.

We need the speculation world turned upside down for sure... But not like that.

Perhaps Brave could also be any brave boi, like Geno, Ninten, Sora, Agumon, [insert more characters here].

Let's heckin go.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

ForsakenM I get mistaken for a male a lot. No worries. Not offended at all. My avatar and name changes enough for that to be a normal thing.

That said, I get your points, I just don't care as much as I used to about "perfect representation". I honestly am not bothered by the idea of Dixie grabbing characters with her hands instead of her hair. Now her not having her helicopter hair is bothersome, which is why she could at least have that as an Up B with some animation changes, but still use Donkey Kong's Up B. Something pointed out by vaanrose a long time back is that Dixie and DK share the same bodyshape. That was enough for me to believe a unique Up B is possible. That said, just having her there is enough for me. I'm not that picky at this point. Of course, some want her a lot more unique and that's perfectly fine. It just doesn't matter to me anymore whether she's an echo or semi-clone at this point. I've such stopped caring about high accuracy when I realized that's not that important when making a character actually work and flow right has more priority overall. Basically, balance first. Ganondorf in Ultimate pretty much felt like he no longer flowed very well, as the swords just don't feel right(not that they're a bad idea, it's just their implimentation was... eh. The range feels off for his Down Smash, though his Forward Smash is pretty good, and the Up Smash is okay. He's far harder to play since they changed him up. I had similar issues with Bowser come Smash 4, with the Wrestler style). I'm okay with imperfect representation, cause basically the characters often feel more fun to play when there's less worry about gameplay mechanics or accuracy. Or as many have said, taking liberties with the moveset.

 

[Datboigeno]

You replied quick. I have a few minutes.
I said you dont understand my points because you're not trying to know what i mean by them. And since you jsut said again that you disagree with them even though i said that, which i dont appreciate because im being honest about there being more to them then you've handled.

We already talked about this exact brave point. And like I said, it's valuable along with the leaks, corroborating that erdrick could be the next character. By itself Brave doesn't necessarily point to erdrick, and that's exactly what i mean by you putting words in my mouth, because i never said brave is a clear piece of evidence in that way.
So chill and if you want to have a talk at some point later on that's fine we can do that, but please hold back from making too many assumptions about what im saying.

I mean, unless you have more to say on your specific points I don't think there's that much more to get. I'm just responding to what you have previously said. You said previously that leakers presenting him as the SE rep and Brave being the codename that was datamined where the strongest evidence for Erdrick did you not? Like, I'm pretty sure that's in your initial post on the Erdrick thread which you've directed me to before. My point is that it's not a huge piece of evidence for him any more than it is a piece of evidence against him at this point. I'm pretty chill lol I'm just responding to what you are saying and have said in the past. I don't really see what assumptions I'm making really.

ForsakenM I get mistaken for a male a lot. No worries. Not offended at all. My avatar and name changes enough for that to be a normal thing.

That said, I get your points, I just don't care as much as I used to about "perfect representation". I honestly am not bothered by the idea of Dixie grabbing characters with her hands instead of her hair. Now her not having her helicopter hair is bothersome, which is why she could at least have that as an Up B with some animation changes, but still use Donkey Kong's Up B. Something pointed out by vaanrose a long time back is that Dixie and DK share the same bodyshape. That was enough for me to believe a unique Up B is possible. That said, just having her there is enough for me. I'm not that picky at this point. Of course, some want her a lot more unique and that's perfectly fine. It just doesn't matter to me anymore whether she's an echo or semi-clone at this point. I've such stopped caring about high accuracy when I realized that's not that important when making a character actually work and flow right has more priority overall. Basically, balance first. Ganondorf in Ultimate pretty much felt like he no longer flowed very well, as the swords just don't feel right(not that they're a bad idea, it's just their implimentation was... eh. The range feels off for his Down Smash, though his Forward Smash is pretty good, and the Up Smash is okay. He's far harder to play since they changed him up. I had similar issues with Bowser come Smash 4, with the Wrestler style). I'm okay with imperfect representation, cause basically the characters often feel more fun to play when there's less worry about gameplay mechanics or accuracy. Or as many have said, taking liberties with the moveset.

Really? I feel like the implementation of his sword is the closest Smash has come to making Gannondorf feel like a formidable and unique character in his own right instead of just being slow Captain Falcon.

Honestly, I don't see why people even bring up Verge as the holy grail when it comes to the Erdrick leaks anyway. I only really saw people dumping their chips in when Tansut claimed Erdrick was coming. I think that's the one people ought to focus on, not on-again off-again Verge.

I was focusing on him specifically because so many people still take his word as gospel and from what I remember Verg bringing up the 7 SE characters and then Erdrick/DQ specifically is when people started assuming that he was in. I feel like the Tansut claim was made much more recently and after people had already begun assuming it was Erdrick.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Regardless of the leaker(s) responsible, I'm just saying that if Erdrick gets in, it's going to turn the speculation world upside down. At that point, Tansut or Verge could claim any random thing is getting in and the vast majority of sheep out there would buy it hook, line and sinker.

We need the speculation world turned upside down for sure... But not like that.

These days, I find myself wishing they would just end this already and reveal Brave. Not just because Smash news make me happy, but just so the speculation can move on, regardless of who was correct. Having people get sassy (and sometimes, downright toxic) over who is right over video game speculation really takes the fun out of it for me.

 

[Firox]

These days, I find myself wishing they would just end this already and reveal Brave. Not just because Smash news make me happy, but just so the speculation can move on, regardless of who was correct. Having people get sassy (and sometimes, downright toxic) over who is right over video game speculation really takes the fun out of it for me.

Right there with you. I'd prefer they give us everything or nothing. Not a bunch of ambiguous bread crumbs to squabble about.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Imagine where we would be if Brave was never left in the game files at all.

 

[Firox]

Imagine where we would be if Brave was never left in the game files at all.

That's what I'm saying. Give us a character reveal or nothing at all. At least that way we could speculate the good ol fashion way with nothing but our imaginations.

 

[The Anigriffin]

Imagine where we would be if Brave was never left in the game files at all.

I’m starting to think it was on purpose at this point.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Right there with you. I'd prefer they give us everything or nothing. Not a bunch of ambiguous bread crumbs to squabble about.

I mean.. following the bread crumb trail is usually part of the fun behind speculating. The problem is, sometimes the trail just ends at a junction. To me, the fun isn't to find which way is "right", but rather to see exactly what is on each trail and how interesting each could be.

Regarding Erdrick, I have warmed up to the idea quite a bit. Of course Geno and Sora would appeal to me more, but these discussions are more interesting to me on a hypothetical level than they are about confirming something.

ForsakenM made some very good points (particularly the one about sales figures, which I later went to check myself). But to me the thing that stood out the most was about how people treat character X (in this case Erdrick, but could apply to a number of others) as a lock because of these breadcrumbs. That... seems unproductive to me. Yes, there is a lot going for certain characters, but that is very different from them being shoe-ins.

Well, uh... sorry if this post seems scattered all over the place. Still processing, in a way.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Imagine where we would be if Brave was never left in the game files at all.

Bored as ****.

 

[Ovaltine]

ForsakenM ForsakenM made some very good points (particularly the one about sales figures, which I later went to check myself). But to me the thing that stood out the most was about how people treat character X (in this case Erdrick, but could apply to a number of others) as a lock because of these breadcrumbs. That... seems unproductive to me. Yes, there is a lot going for certain characters, but that is very different from them being shoe-ins.

Even as someone who's prepared in case of Erdrick instead of Geno, this is true. Shadow looked like he had everything ever going for him, and he ended up as a mere assist trophy. Even if things look great, it might not mean anything. Alas, that also applies to all the SMRPG nods we've been getting in Ultimate, so it's a two-way street. Erdrick and Geno have things for and against them, but neither of them are locks or definitely not happening. Likelihood, yeah, Erdrick's got it plenty more than Geno does in my eyes, but it could all be a farce somehow. I doubt it, but there's always that off-chance...

 

[ForsakenM]

Regardless of the leaker(s) responsible, I'm just saying that if Erdrick gets in, it's going to turn the speculation world upside down. At that point, Tansut or Verge could claim any random thing is getting in and the vast majority of sheep out there would buy it hook, line and sinker.

So much this, regardless if Erdrick gets in or not. If Erdrick doesn't get in but we still get a DQ rep, there will be feuds on whether Verge and Tansut are still credible. If we get someone who isn't DQ at all then it truly is the Wild West that we have been slowly trotting towards all these months past and just like many have said with Joker...pretty much anything will be on the table.

If Erdrick gets in it will be chaos incarnate on the forums and the internet in general: gloating individuals and YouTubers rubbing it in and mocking people for thinking otherwise, fans upset and confused that they waited so long for a reveal that the West has little investment in, people angry that this was saved for E3 (if it's revealed then, which is basically the only option at this point) and for picking a character that wasn't as highly requested...I may have to step away for a while if that does come to pass just because not only will I be swallowed with disbelief that Nintendo mishandled their second Fighter Pass reveal so poorly (note I'm not referring to choosing Erdrick but referring to waiting for so long to reveal him) but also trying to avoid the inevitable toxicity that will come our way for even remotely doubting the chance that Lord Erdrick would arrive to Smash.

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Oh, and the Geno Document has begun development.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Even as someone who's prepared in case of Erdrick instead of Geno, this is true. Shadow looked like he had everything ever going for him, and he ended up as a mere assist trophy. Even if things look great, it might not mean anything. Alas, that also applies to all the SMRPG nods we've been getting in Ultimate, so it's a two-way street. Erdrick and Geno have things for and against them, but neither of them are locks or definitely not happening. Likelihood, yeah, Erdrick's got it plenty more than Geno does in my eyes, but it could all be a farce somehow. I doubt it, but there's always that off-chance...

Don't forget Isaac, either. Until the last second, he had a lot going for him, or so people thought.

Also, something I thought about after seeing the last few posts:

In regards to character-choosing criteria, people often point to characters that were base roster in Smash 4 or Ultimate for confirmation. But I think the best way to see if sales, popularity and whatever else fits is by looking at Smash 4's three third party DLCs: , and .

The arguments people often refer to are: sales figures, series popularity, character popularity (both in and out of the core Smash fanbase), current relevancy and finally historical gaming relevancy.

: Fourth best selling fighting game franchise overall, with two games (II and IV) in the top 10; one of the largest fighting game fanbases to this day; the protagonist of said series, also considered iconic in his own right; was relevant at the time (IV) and still is right now (V); his series is considered one of the staples of its genre.

: One of the highest grossing games (not only RPGs) of all time; very popular series in his genre, if not one of the most popular; is arguably the most popular protagonist in the series overall; no longer the protagonist, appearing mostly in spinoffs, though a remake of his game is scheduled for ... *ahem*, "sometime"; literally considered one of the best JRPGs of all time.

: Sells well, the point of being nominated for TGA in 2014. Nowhere near the other two, though; popular, but not to the point of obfuscating other icons in her genre; popular, but not to the extent of other characters, even others from her developer/publisher; very much relevant, particularly because her third game has been announced and, since 2, is Nintendo exclusive; relatively relevant, but not to the extent of others in her genre.

What I mean by all this is not that these aspects do not matter, but rather, that not all of these boxes need to be ticked. In fact, these characters either don't fulfill all of these conditions or they do so in different ways.

So while sales, Nintendo history and whatever else certainly helps... it may not be everything. I don't think any of these characters would have been treated as locks, except Ryu, because his name was literally in the files. So I don't think any character should right now, either.

...Yikes, did not expect this much rambling when I began typing. Might edit it later to make this post easier on the eyes.

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

Don't forget Isaac, either. Until the last second, he had a lot going for him, or so people thought.

Also, something I thought about after seeing the last few posts:

In regards to character-choosing criteria, people often point to characters that were base roster in Smash 4 or Ultimate for confirmation. But I think the best way to see if sales, popularity and whatever else fits is by looking at Smash 4's three third party DLCs: , and .

The arguments people often refer to are: sales figures, series popularity, character popularity (both in and out of the core Smash fanbase), current relevancy and finally historical gaming relevancy.

: Fourth best selling fighting game franchise overall, with two games (II and IV) in the top 10; one of the largest fighting game fanbases to this day; the protagonist of said series, also considered iconic in his own right; was relevant at the time (IV) and still is right now (V); his series is considered one of the staples of its genre.

: One of the highest grossing games (not only RPGs) of all time; very popular series in his genre, if not one of the most popular; is arguably the most popular protagonist in the series overall; no longer the protagonist, appearing mostly in spinoffs, though a remake of his game is scheduled for ... *ahem*, "sometime"; literally considered one of the best JRPGs of all time.

: Sells well, the point of being nominated for TGA in 2014. Nowhere near the other two, though; popular, but not to the point of obfuscating other icons in her genre; popular, but not to the extent of other characters, even others from her developer/publisher; very much relevant, particularly because her third game has been announced and, since 2, is Nintendo exclusive; relatively relevant, but not to the extent of others in her genre.

What I mean by all this is not that these aspects do not matter, but rather, that not all of these boxes need to be ticked. In fact, these characters either don't fulfill all of these conditions or they do so in different ways.

So while sales, Nintendo history and whatever else certainly helps... it may not be everything. I don't think any of these characters would have been treated as locks, except Ryu, because his name was literally in the files. So I don't think any character should right now, either.

...Yikes, did not expect this much rambling when I began typing. Might edit it later to make this post easier on the eyes.

Wait Ryu is from the fourth best selling fighting game franchise of all time? I thought Street Fighter was just below Tekken and Smash Bros and that was it.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Just assume if Nintendo thinks they can make decent money off a character they will add them regardless of reasons.

Like with Erdrick for example: Japanese sales alone would justify Erdrick being added. With the added benefit of being an advertisement for Dragon Quest in the western world.

 

[Ovaltine]

Just assume if Nintendo thinks they can make decent money off a character they will add them regardless of reasons.

Like with Erdrick for example: Japanese sales alone would justify Erdrick being added. With the added benefit of advertising Dragon Quest to the western world.

Honestly, in terms of Smash DLC, almost any character will sell. Even Corrin, who seems to be poorly-received in many corners of the world (not all, of course, because there is someone for everyone), sold. Every character will sell. While that does good for lesser known characters like Geno, it also means Nintendo can take risks that may disappoint a lot of people a la the aforementioned Corrin.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Don't forget Isaac, either. Until the last second, he had a lot going for him, or so people thought.

Also, something I thought about after seeing the last few posts:

In regards to character-choosing criteria, people often point to characters that were base roster in Smash 4 or Ultimate for confirmation. But I think the best way to see if sales, popularity and whatever else fits is by looking at Smash 4's three third party DLCs: , and .

The arguments people often refer to are: sales figures, series popularity, character popularity (both in and out of the core Smash fanbase), current relevancy and finally historical gaming relevancy.

: Fourth best selling fighting game franchise overall, with two games (II and IV) in the top 10; one of the largest fighting game fanbases to this day; the protagonist of said series, also considered iconic in his own right; was relevant at the time (IV) and still is right now (V); his series is considered one of the staples of its genre.

: One of the highest grossing games (not only RPGs) of all time; very popular series in his genre, if not one of the most popular; is arguably the most popular protagonist in the series overall; no longer the protagonist, appearing mostly in spinoffs, though a remake of his game is scheduled for ... *ahem*, "sometime"; literally considered one of the best JRPGs of all time.

: Sells well, the point of being nominated for TGA in 2014. Nowhere near the other two, though; popular, but not to the point of obfuscating other icons in her genre; popular, but not to the extent of other characters, even others from her developer/publisher; very much relevant, particularly because her third game has been announced and, since 2, is Nintendo exclusive; relatively relevant, but not to the extent of others in her genre.

What I mean by all this is not that these aspects do not matter, but rather, that not all of these boxes need to be ticked. In fact, these characters either don't fulfill all of these conditions or they do so in different ways.

So while sales, Nintendo history and whatever else certainly helps... it may not be everything. I don't think any of these characters would have been treated as locks, except Ryu, because his name was literally in the files. So I don't think any character should right now, either.

...Yikes, did not expect this much rambling when I began typing. Might edit it later to make this post easier on the eyes.

Though, if you take Bayonetta as an outlier (and there is certainly a basis to taking her as such), then you could argue that those factors are very important.

Then again, Joker is not a Ryu or a Cloud, so maybe Bayonetta shouldn't be taken as an outlier either.

 

[The Anigriffin]

Or if they have an upcoming first party that they think needs a bit more of a push, they could always add someone from that Corrin style. Though I'd say the chance of an FE rep is pretty slim right now, but completely counting out first parties isn't a wise move.

 

[Deleted member]

So much this, regardless if Erdrick gets in or not. If Erdrick doesn't get in but we still get a DQ rep, there will be feuds on whether Verge and Tansut are still credible. If we get someone who isn't DQ at all then it truly is the Wild West that we have been slowly trotting towards all these months past and just like many have said with Joker...pretty much anything will be on the table.

If Erdrick gets in it will be chaos incarnate on the forums and the internet in general: gloating individuals and YouTubers rubbing it in and mocking people for thinking otherwise, fans upset and confused that they waited so long for a reveal that the West has little investment in, people angry that this was saved for E3 (if it's revealed then, which is basically the only option at this point) and for picking a character that wasn't as highly requested...I may have to step away for a while if that does come to pass just because not only will I be swallowed with disbelief that Nintendo mishandled their second Fighter Pass reveal so poorly (note I'm not referring to choosing Erdrick but referring to waiting for so long to reveal him) but also trying to avoid the inevitable toxicity that will come our way for even remotely doubting the chance that Lord Erdrick would arrive to Smash.

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...

Oh, and the Geno Document has begun development.

Yeah, I'm in the same place. I'm very doubtful of him, but if he gets in, it's gonna be hell for anyone who thought otherwise lol, even more than right now when we don't have a set answer (and people even think we do). Either way, I'm confident of Geno being in this pass.

Oh and I'm excited for the Geno Document. Don't rush yourself though

 

[3BitSaurus]

Wait Ryu is from the fourth best selling fighting game franchise of all time? I thought Street Fighter was just below Tekken and Smash Bros and that was it.

Weeell... I used "fourth" in a bit of a loose way, since the statistics I dug up considered the Dragon Ball fighting games as the third. Apparently the series as a whole sold about a million and a bit more copies than SF.

So really, if we're talking about game-only franchises, then it's Smash, Tekken and Street Fighter, as you said.

Just assume if Nintendo thinks they can make decent money off a character they will add them regardless of reasons.

Like with Erdrick for example: Japanese sales alone would justify Erdrick being added. With the added benefit of being an advertisement for Dragon Quest in the western world.

Honestly, in terms of Smash DLC, almost any character will sell. Even Corrin, who seems to be poorly-received in many corners of the world (not all, of course, because there is someone for everyone), sold. Every character will sell. While that does good for lesser known characters like Geno, it also means Nintendo can take risks that may disappoint a lot of people a la the aforementioned Corrin.

My point exactly. Like some people were talking yesterday, this makes it more likely that the DLC will be a mix of fighters that may or may not cater to different audiences altogether and would bring revenue... which means pretty much anyone, except really obscure or hated characters (looking at you, Bubsy).

 

[Ovaltine]

My point exactly. Like some people were talking yesterday, this makes it more likely that the DLC will be a mix of fighters that may or may not cater to different audiences altogether and would bring revenue... which means pretty much anyone, except really obscure or hated characters (looking at you, Bubsy).

I will eat a raw onion like an apple if Bubsy gets into Smash. You heard it here first, folks. Ready your onions.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I will eat a raw onion like an apple if Bubsy gets into Smash. You heard it here first, folks. Ready your onions.

Save it for the day Shrek gets in, just so you can tie it in with the onion layer memes.

I'm sorry, as soon as I saw your post I knew I had to say this.

 

[The Anigriffin]

My point exactly. Like some people were talking yesterday, this makes it more likely that the DLC will be a mix of fighters that may or may not cater to different audiences altogether and would bring revenue... which means pretty much anyone, except really obscure or hated characters (looking at you, Bubsy).

Bubsy's not the only one.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Ya'll stop talking **** about Bubsy. You're just jealous of his purfect success.

 

[Ze Diglett]

I will eat a raw onion like an apple if Bubsy gets into Smash. You heard it here first, folks. Ready your onions.

You just reminded me of this clip. Kudos for that.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I will eat a raw onion like an apple if Bubsy gets into Smash. You heard it here first, folks. Ready your onions.

I would just laugh. But hey, at least he's talked about. Better to have some bad publicity than none at all.

 

[Marvel-Otaku-Man]

If Erdrick really is coming to Smash, I really hope Nintendo has enough sense not to reveal him at E3. As big as a cultural phenomenon Dragon Quest is in Japan, it just isn't that well known in the West. And if I'm not mistaken, E3 is a pretty Western experience. If the were smart they'd try to sneak him in a Fall direct or in a Japanese event like jump festa or something. Showing off Erdrick at E3 would just feel tone deaf, and Nintendo has been kinda good at not being that lately.

 

[Teeb147]

There could be a reveal this month as well, including with the private video on the smash channel we dont know about.
And it happens that Dragon Quest day is this month, I'm really curious if there'll be anything interesting for that. I think revealing anything DQ related would be smart to do before, and then having something more worldwide at E3.

Only a little over a month before e3, so we wont have too long to see what comes of it
For now I'm more focused on persona since there's supposed to be more p5r news soon.

 

[MissingGlitch]

There could be a reveal this month as well, including with the private video on the smash channel we dont know about.
And it happens that Dragon Quest day is this month, I'm really curious if there'll be anything interesting for that. I think revealing anything DQ related would be smart to do before, and then having something more worldwide at E3.

Only a little over a month before e3, so we wont have too long to see what comes of it
For now I'm more focused on persona since there's supposed to be more p5r news soon.

I can see that going down. They might know Erdrick won't go down that well in the west. Announce him before E3. Let him have the spotlight for a few weeks. And then E3 comes along with a reveal that will make people forget about Erdrick.

 

[ForsakenM]

There could be a reveal this month as well, including with the private video on the smash channel we dont know about.
And it happens that Dragon Quest day is this month, I'm really curious if there'll be anything interesting for that. I think revealing anything DQ related would be smart to do before, and then having something more worldwide at E3.

Only a little over a month before e3, so we wont have too long to see what comes of it
For now I'm more focused on persona since there's supposed to be more p5r news soon.

I can see that going down. They might know Erdrick won't go down that well in the west. Announce him before E3. Let him have the spotlight for a few weeks. And then E3 comes along with a reveal that will make people forget about Erdrick.

Remember when everyone swore we were getting a Direct in October because they updated the playlist in October? You all remember when we got that Direct? That's right, not October, but November. This is very likely the same thing: prepping in advance for either E3 or for an announcement that isn't as important.

You also remember the February Direct where we got "You'll just have to wait to find out!"? Could easily be a video that says "Keep your eyes pealed for some Smashing summer fun early this Summer!" and be done with it until E3.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Remember when everyone swore we were getting a Direct in October because they updated the playlist in October? You all remember when we got that Direct? That's right, not October, but November. This is very likely the same thing: prepping in advance for either E3 or for an announcement that isn't as important.

You also remember the February Direct where we got "You'll just have to wait to find out!"? Could easily be a video that says "Keep your eyes pealed for some Smashing summer fun early this Summer!" and be done with it until E3.

All I really said was I can see it happening. :v

 

[Teeb147]

Remember when everyone swore we were getting a Direct in October because they updated the playlist in October? You all remember when we got that Direct? That's right, not October, but November. This is very likely the same thing: prepping in advance for either E3 or for an announcement that isn't as important.

You also remember the February Direct where we got "You'll just have to wait to find out!"? Could easily be a video that says "Keep your eyes pealed for some Smashing summer fun early this Summer!" and be done with it until E3.

Definitely possible, but not gonna count out a direct this month either. Last time they did reveals elsewhere than e3, so we'll just have to see.

It's not that big of a deal if they revealed someone like erdrick at e3 either, there's still a big bunch of people who like dragon quest. But it would still make a bigger splash if it were someone else at a western conference. It'd depend how they frame it.

 

[link2702]

Well everyone the time is finally here. I’d been putting this off for awhile but with mouser sending my 30 (correct) cr2032 holders, it’s time to dismantle all my snes games with batteries and change every one. This includes smrpg. I’ll likely go and play my files on it just a bit one more time before i swap the batteries and lose the data for good.

It will be a bit refreshing though to start again new, but this time with fresh batteries that i know I won’t need to worry about for another 10+ years, and I won’t have to do any more soldering (unless the resistor or capacitors go out. If that happens though I’ve got something really big to worry about, as chances are those games are probably gonna have the actual chips go next and there’s no point in trying to repair the game anymore after that point.)

Oot and my n64 memory card are also gonna be opened up. I may try to finish up quest 64 one more time before I wipe that card though, i feel the n64 stuff isn’t anywhere close to dying just yet. And thankfully most n64 games didn’t use batteries anyway, only really large ones like oot.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Well everyone the time is finally here. I’d been putting this off for awhile but with mouser sending my 30 (correct) cr2032 holders, it’s time to dismantle all my snes games with batteries and change every one. This includes smrpg. I’ll likely go and play my files on it just a bit one more time before i swap the batteries and lose the data for good.

It will be a bit refreshing though to start again new, but this time with fresh batteries that i know I won’t need to worry about for another 10+ years, and I won’t have to do any more soldering (unless the resistor or capacitors go out. If that happens though I’ve got something really big to worry about, as chances are those games are probably gonna have the actual chips go next and there’s no point in trying to repair the game anymore after that point.)

Oot and my n64 memory card are also gonna be opened up. I may try to finish up quest 64 one more time before I wipe that card though, i feel the n64 stuff isn’t anywhere close to dying just yet. And thankfully most n64 games didn’t use batteries anyway, only really large ones like oot.

If you have a Gameshark Pro, you can save some N64 files over. I'd do that with Quest 64 at least. OOT is debatable if you need to. I found it a fairly easy game to get everything for. At least compared to Quest 64, which is a huge grind. I'd never remove a file of that if I can help it. Same with Super Mario 64, as I copied over my save file after some issues happened. I was able to restore the entire set of data. I don't know if you can literally copy memory card data over, but it's still worth it. That's a lot of hard work, after all~

(BTW, I did make a Quest 64 thread, but there's also a Brian support topic if it's of interest to you. They're both among my sig. Also, OOT is a great game. I'd suggest trying out a randomizer. I've been working on ideas for a Quest 64 randomizer, but it's pretty difficult with how the game is designed... due to really bad programming ideas).

Speaking of lost data, some of my old Gameboy games lost their data. My poor Pokemon Crystal... though I kind of go through Red a different way now, with the Monster Brain. I'm kind of thankful for emulation cause you can copy saves a bit easier.