RetrogamerMax
Smash Legend
I think if Erdrick is out, than it would be down between Sora and Geno to who the SE rep could be.
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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior
- Thread starter PsychoIncarnate
- Start date
- Status
Fatmanonice
Banned via Warnings
Try GameFAQs. Vergeben has stated Erdrick multiple times while Xenother went further by saying there would be a female ALT. Aside from that, Tansut of Resetera has repeated what Xenother said.
D
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I am about done with my Speculation Piece so I'm just sprucing it up a bit, Yes I stayed up until five in the morning writing and reviewing all of my info but no I do not regret it.
I'll likely post it by the end of the day.
I'll likely post it by the end of the day.
TheCJBrine
Smash Legend
Last edited:
D
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Erdrick, Geno & Leakbait: Phew, I'm finally done. Good day everyone I am here to finally post my Speculation Piece I was mentioning yesterday I worked hard on it and stayed up all night last night working on it so I'll probably take a nap after I finish posting it but I'm here to Speculate on the whole SE rep situation, notably Erdrick, Geno & Leakbait so without further ado let's begin. Also side note it's a very long read so I suggest you read at your own pace.
Before we Begin let's define what Leakbait is and what it's used for, Leakbait is the process of a few Employees spreading false information to root out Leakers and catch them redhanded.
Now Let's examine the "Incineroar is Leakbait" theory the community had going while the Grinch Hoax was still alive, it didn't make sense for Incineroar to
be leakbait for one simple reason, when companies do leakbait they usually send out multiple names which wasn't the case for Incineroar but is indeed what happened with the Seven Square names. You would've thought if Incineroar was leakbait some people would've heard "Mimikyu, Decidueye, Lycanroc, Alolan Raichu, Alolan Pokemon Trainer" and so on but no, we had a consistant answer of it being Incineroar.
The Opposite is what's happening with the Square rep we saw Spawn Wave make hints towards Sora being revealed at the TGA's, We saw a few leaks say Chrono namely This one and The JSon Leak. And of course Verge, Polar/Xenother and Tansut claiming Erdrick. That's the difference between "Incineroar is Leakbait!" and "Erdirck Might be Leakbait" it fits the Criteria of Leakbait, which the Incineroar situation did not.
"Okay But Nintendo and Namco Never Use Leakbait!"
Well actually that wouldn't be true cause of SF:Grand Prix being an Industry Hoax which tricked everyone and Namco putting out Leakbait for Tekken 7 Why does Namco Matter? It proves both companies can use Leakbait and will if the Circumstances call for it and with Leakers leaking what was basically the entire Base Roster for Smash Ultimate I can see a timeline where they say "You know what? they leaked the entire roster let's start using leakbait".
Also interesting note before we move on, and this may just be my bias but the Namco tweet says something like "Which is Why Akuma, Neese, Noctis nor Negan ever got leaked" Who's one character off of the Square list that hasn't gotten even a Single leak besides an insider within NoA itself? Geno. I mean after the Square Seven came out btw not before cause of course there were "Leaks" for Geno. It likely doesn't mean anything but it's funny non-the-less.
So they Can and Will Leakbait if under the right Circumstances and the Square Seven could be called into questioning as what if it is indeed Leakbait? it
fits under the criteria for it.
Now Let's examine the "Incineroar is Leakbait" theory the community had going while the Grinch Hoax was still alive, it didn't make sense for Incineroar to
be leakbait for one simple reason, when companies do leakbait they usually send out multiple names which wasn't the case for Incineroar but is indeed what happened with the Seven Square names. You would've thought if Incineroar was leakbait some people would've heard "Mimikyu, Decidueye, Lycanroc, Alolan Raichu, Alolan Pokemon Trainer" and so on but no, we had a consistant answer of it being Incineroar.
The Opposite is what's happening with the Square rep we saw Spawn Wave make hints towards Sora being revealed at the TGA's, We saw a few leaks say Chrono namely This one and The JSon Leak. And of course Verge, Polar/Xenother and Tansut claiming Erdrick. That's the difference between "Incineroar is Leakbait!" and "Erdirck Might be Leakbait" it fits the Criteria of Leakbait, which the Incineroar situation did not.
"Okay But Nintendo and Namco Never Use Leakbait!"
Well actually that wouldn't be true cause of SF:Grand Prix being an Industry Hoax which tricked everyone and Namco putting out Leakbait for Tekken 7 Why does Namco Matter? It proves both companies can use Leakbait and will if the Circumstances call for it and with Leakers leaking what was basically the entire Base Roster for Smash Ultimate I can see a timeline where they say "You know what? they leaked the entire roster let's start using leakbait".
Also interesting note before we move on, and this may just be my bias but the Namco tweet says something like "Which is Why Akuma, Neese, Noctis nor Negan ever got leaked" Who's one character off of the Square list that hasn't gotten even a Single leak besides an insider within NoA itself? Geno. I mean after the Square Seven came out btw not before cause of course there were "Leaks" for Geno. It likely doesn't mean anything but it's funny non-the-less.
So they Can and Will Leakbait if under the right Circumstances and the Square Seven could be called into questioning as what if it is indeed Leakbait? it
fits under the criteria for it.
I can't really go against much of what Verge has said about the Square rep except for obviously it not being the first one revealed, we all saw what happened and that maybe it isn't Erdrick but instead Geno. Verge seems to be very Careful about what he puts out there on much of his Smash News but I can still argue for why somethings seem fishy around here.
First off there is so much conflicting information between Leakers and people in general, People first thought that Erdrick must have been his Taller Design
and to be revealed first, that didn't happen so people were thinking he'd obviously be the second character.
Even when the Brave leak came out and it was suggested to be a Short Zoner character people changed their views and thought that Erdrick must be his Chibi Design and use a lot of Magic and such, but Tansut said that Erdrick would come with his Fem Alt yet She doesn't have a Chibi Design so they'd just make a brand-new design for her right on the spot? Not a Single Character in the entire roster to date has had that privilege and with Square being super
stingy I don't think they'd have THAT much cooperation.
Every character that has had an Alt their Alt already previously existed Wire-Frame Mac existed and didn't need a brand new design,Over-alls Wario already Existed, Fem Robin already Existed, Fem Corrin Already Existed and all of them could fit with the Characters without needing to go out of the way to fit
the model by making a new design.
Just remembered the two 5Chan leaks claimed that Alucia and Fem Erdrick will be Alts for Erdrick which again doesn't make sense cause If Namco who is making the game only allows Pac-Man to have colors change on his gloves & Shoes only what makes you think the company who only gave Sakurai One Character, One Stage, Two Songs and Four Spirits (Including the two Fighter Spirits) would make a brand new design for Sakurai to use? that just seems like nonsense.
"Okay but that's the only thing that doesn't add up!"
Nope there's even more, Most Insiders are saying that Erdrick will be the Second or at most Third DLC Character meanwhile a few weeks ago or so Tansut said that Erdrick just started Development so he wouldn't be revealed for awhile which seems to suggest that he'd be the 4th/5th character so people are even conflicted about the release schedule.
Let's even examine the list itself, Having three DQ reps is a very weird thing. You don't see KH getting three characters nor even two, You don't even see
Lara Croft on the list, nor 2B, Edea, Etc. Yet there's three whole DQ Reps it's very weird sure you can make an argument for it being cause there's a
different Protag every game but Slime isn't really needed to be in the List cause it's in DQ3 and DQ11 yet it's still there, I can't really put my finger
on it but it's Strange and maybe they're putting multiple DQ reps out there cause it's not DQ or maybe it's actually Slime.
Meanwhile remember when I said that the Square list might be Leakbait? well Verge also said Geno is Leakbait if the list was sent out by Square and they
said Geno is Leakbait wouldn't it make sense if it's the reverse and the List is Leakbait but Geno is not? I think that would make more sense than them being completely honest especially with all these inconsistencies. We even have an actual NoA insider who has not been wrong a single time in the past say that there's been talk about Geno, I can't Imagine there would be talk of Geno outside of Smash be it a Mii Costume or an actual Playable Character.
Geno wouldn't even make sense to be Leakbait as Companies use Leakbait in order to lower people's expectations only to reveal something people have been wanting, that would be the reverse for this situation. They use Geno, somebody people have been wanting for a Decade+ as Leakbait only to reveal Erdrick who is very Niche outside of Japan and to be added in Smash partly to advertise DQ to the West it wouldn't make sense for this to be the case in fact it would make sense for it to be the Reverse.
Yes while Both are Very Niche Geno still has worldwide appeal and a fanbase everywhere while Erdrick's fanbase mainly comes from one part of the world, Japan. Erdrick does have fans in America/Europe/UK but the majority of his and DQ's fanbase comes from Japan while it's pretty evenly spread across the world with Geno.
I think in the end the reverse of this situation would make more sense and they're just lying about Geno being Leakbait as it doesn't fit how Leakbait is usually done with the more popular and rewarding outcome usually being the one they hide under the veil of Leakbait.
First off there is so much conflicting information between Leakers and people in general, People first thought that Erdrick must have been his Taller Design
and to be revealed first, that didn't happen so people were thinking he'd obviously be the second character.
Even when the Brave leak came out and it was suggested to be a Short Zoner character people changed their views and thought that Erdrick must be his Chibi Design and use a lot of Magic and such, but Tansut said that Erdrick would come with his Fem Alt yet She doesn't have a Chibi Design so they'd just make a brand-new design for her right on the spot? Not a Single Character in the entire roster to date has had that privilege and with Square being super
stingy I don't think they'd have THAT much cooperation.
Every character that has had an Alt their Alt already previously existed Wire-Frame Mac existed and didn't need a brand new design,Over-alls Wario already Existed, Fem Robin already Existed, Fem Corrin Already Existed and all of them could fit with the Characters without needing to go out of the way to fit
the model by making a new design.
Just remembered the two 5Chan leaks claimed that Alucia and Fem Erdrick will be Alts for Erdrick which again doesn't make sense cause If Namco who is making the game only allows Pac-Man to have colors change on his gloves & Shoes only what makes you think the company who only gave Sakurai One Character, One Stage, Two Songs and Four Spirits (Including the two Fighter Spirits) would make a brand new design for Sakurai to use? that just seems like nonsense.
"Okay but that's the only thing that doesn't add up!"
Nope there's even more, Most Insiders are saying that Erdrick will be the Second or at most Third DLC Character meanwhile a few weeks ago or so Tansut said that Erdrick just started Development so he wouldn't be revealed for awhile which seems to suggest that he'd be the 4th/5th character so people are even conflicted about the release schedule.
Let's even examine the list itself, Having three DQ reps is a very weird thing. You don't see KH getting three characters nor even two, You don't even see
Lara Croft on the list, nor 2B, Edea, Etc. Yet there's three whole DQ Reps it's very weird sure you can make an argument for it being cause there's a
different Protag every game but Slime isn't really needed to be in the List cause it's in DQ3 and DQ11 yet it's still there, I can't really put my finger
on it but it's Strange and maybe they're putting multiple DQ reps out there cause it's not DQ or maybe it's actually Slime.
Meanwhile remember when I said that the Square list might be Leakbait? well Verge also said Geno is Leakbait if the list was sent out by Square and they
said Geno is Leakbait wouldn't it make sense if it's the reverse and the List is Leakbait but Geno is not? I think that would make more sense than them being completely honest especially with all these inconsistencies. We even have an actual NoA insider who has not been wrong a single time in the past say that there's been talk about Geno, I can't Imagine there would be talk of Geno outside of Smash be it a Mii Costume or an actual Playable Character.
Geno wouldn't even make sense to be Leakbait as Companies use Leakbait in order to lower people's expectations only to reveal something people have been wanting, that would be the reverse for this situation. They use Geno, somebody people have been wanting for a Decade+ as Leakbait only to reveal Erdrick who is very Niche outside of Japan and to be added in Smash partly to advertise DQ to the West it wouldn't make sense for this to be the case in fact it would make sense for it to be the Reverse.
Yes while Both are Very Niche Geno still has worldwide appeal and a fanbase everywhere while Erdrick's fanbase mainly comes from one part of the world, Japan. Erdrick does have fans in America/Europe/UK but the majority of his and DQ's fanbase comes from Japan while it's pretty evenly spread across the world with Geno.
I think in the end the reverse of this situation would make more sense and they're just lying about Geno being Leakbait as it doesn't fit how Leakbait is usually done with the more popular and rewarding outcome usually being the one they hide under the veil of Leakbait.
"Okay fine but What does Geno have that Erdrick doesn't?"
Three Words: In-Game Evidence. With Piranha Plant joining so too did a ton of SMRPG references being Smilax in the Palutena guidence, Piranha Plant's Classic Mode being a SMRPG reference, even earlier with Geno & Mallow being Spirits, one of the new Bowser themes having a bit from SMRPG, Etc.
Even outside of Ultimate there's also a SMRPG Reference in Yoshi's Crafted World and also The Tweet by Nintendo, The Trivia Question with Smash being referenced in the beginning of the game, the Smash 4 Mii Costume, the Super Mario Kun Story, Etc. which is a very big contrast to a Decade ago when Nintendo refused to even mention SMRPG.
I'm not claiming to say that this means Geno will be in Smash but it at least shows that Nintendo realizes SMRPG has a very big and Strong cult following
inside and outside of Smash.
So Nintendo Knows but does Sakurai? he without a shadow of a doubt knows of Geno's Popularity as he stated he added the Geno Mii Costume cause of his Popularity Also cause he wanted Geno in Brawl and likely wanted him in Sm4sh but it didn't pan out within Smash 4. He Saw the move-set potential within Geno and wanted him so he is likely a fan of his. this isn't speculation you can specifically see him State he wanted Geno here.
Even Square-Enix knows Geno is Popular cause they put Geno on the list instead of some huge and Iconic Character like Lara Croft/They "leaked" Geno over Lara that proves that at the very least they know Geno is popular and heavily requested for Smash.
So All Parties know Geno is Popular and Polar's NoA contact has heard Geno mumblings around NoA. With Every Party Knowing of his Popularity. Sakurai wanting him for a Decade at this point plus Sakurai adding Fan Favorites I think Nintendo can do Sakurai a Solid and add Geno unless something happens and Square begins to throw a tantrum I see why not. Every Party involved know Geno is Popular, Geno fits within Sakurai's choice of adding fan favorites this time around and Sakurai even wanted Geno and he doesn't seem to be the kind of person who would give up easily. Those things are massive points towards Geno.
"Okay but Geno doesn't fit as DLC"
I disagree with that, From what I've gathered most people seem to think that Nintendo will add Characters that appeal to people who might not have bought Smash yet but here's the thing in my opinion it makes more sense for Nintendo to focus on adding Fan Favorites or Characters that will appeal to both audiences/a Mix of both.
As if you focus on people who haven't bought Smash yet there's no guarantee that those people will buy Smash + the Fighter's Pass as that would be
75 Dollars right there. Some might not even HAVE a Switch so they would have to buy a 300$ Console + a 60$ game + a 25$ DLC Season that rounds up to 375$ just for one game and DLC I heavily doubt People would do that Meanwhile if you do a blend of both or focus on your core audience you'd have GUARANTEED Sales instead of "Let's hope they buy our stuff and hope our core audience like the DLC" I for one will likely skip the DLC if Geno/Banjo aren't in so I'm sure some are like that for their characters.
Your entire Core Audience being guaranteed to buy the DLC or Appealing to people who might not have bought Smash Ultimate or even a Switch, I think it would make more sense for them to do the first and mix in a few DLC characters that also appeal to other fanbases, Geno would appeal to your core audience.
Even then let's say Sakurai did in fact push for Geno in Base Game they could be withholding Geno for DLC cause of Square prioritizing Money more than
playing Nice.
Even Brave's Stats fit Geno with the apparent Short Zoner playstyle, The Sliding, The Wide Shield Size, Etc. Brave just feels like Geno to me, it feels like
what Geno would feel like and play like. Short Zoner fits Geno's Description perfectly with him being slightly shorter than Mario being accurate to Geno's
size and Geno obviously being a Zoner. The sliding cause Geno is Wooden and Wood has a lot of traction. The Wide Shield Size being cause maybe Geno's Cape is flowing outwards making the shield size bigger.
While DQ isn't as complicated as we initially thought Nintendo and Sakurai already have the rights to Geno and supposedly SMRPG so why go out and go through Square-enix and Toriyama when you have a Fan Favorite Character right there one that people have been requesting since Brawl at the latest! People have been wanting Geno for a Decade and they have the right to Geno and Super Mario RPG so why not use them? Not even Nintendo is that dumb. They HAVE to know what they have right in front of them and how important Geno is to a decent size of the Smash fanbase. It is a fact at this point that they have the rights to SMRPG for Smash Use.
In-Game evidence, Reputable NoA contacts saying Geno, All Parties knowing Geno is Popular, References inside and outside of Smash Ultimate, Geno fitting in as DLC, Brave's Stats, They already have the Rights, Etc. There ARE things going for Geno.
Three Words: In-Game Evidence. With Piranha Plant joining so too did a ton of SMRPG references being Smilax in the Palutena guidence, Piranha Plant's Classic Mode being a SMRPG reference, even earlier with Geno & Mallow being Spirits, one of the new Bowser themes having a bit from SMRPG, Etc.
Even outside of Ultimate there's also a SMRPG Reference in Yoshi's Crafted World and also The Tweet by Nintendo, The Trivia Question with Smash being referenced in the beginning of the game, the Smash 4 Mii Costume, the Super Mario Kun Story, Etc. which is a very big contrast to a Decade ago when Nintendo refused to even mention SMRPG.
I'm not claiming to say that this means Geno will be in Smash but it at least shows that Nintendo realizes SMRPG has a very big and Strong cult following
inside and outside of Smash.
So Nintendo Knows but does Sakurai? he without a shadow of a doubt knows of Geno's Popularity as he stated he added the Geno Mii Costume cause of his Popularity Also cause he wanted Geno in Brawl and likely wanted him in Sm4sh but it didn't pan out within Smash 4. He Saw the move-set potential within Geno and wanted him so he is likely a fan of his. this isn't speculation you can specifically see him State he wanted Geno here.
Even Square-Enix knows Geno is Popular cause they put Geno on the list instead of some huge and Iconic Character like Lara Croft/They "leaked" Geno over Lara that proves that at the very least they know Geno is popular and heavily requested for Smash.
So All Parties know Geno is Popular and Polar's NoA contact has heard Geno mumblings around NoA. With Every Party Knowing of his Popularity. Sakurai wanting him for a Decade at this point plus Sakurai adding Fan Favorites I think Nintendo can do Sakurai a Solid and add Geno unless something happens and Square begins to throw a tantrum I see why not. Every Party involved know Geno is Popular, Geno fits within Sakurai's choice of adding fan favorites this time around and Sakurai even wanted Geno and he doesn't seem to be the kind of person who would give up easily. Those things are massive points towards Geno.
"Okay but Geno doesn't fit as DLC"
I disagree with that, From what I've gathered most people seem to think that Nintendo will add Characters that appeal to people who might not have bought Smash yet but here's the thing in my opinion it makes more sense for Nintendo to focus on adding Fan Favorites or Characters that will appeal to both audiences/a Mix of both.
As if you focus on people who haven't bought Smash yet there's no guarantee that those people will buy Smash + the Fighter's Pass as that would be
75 Dollars right there. Some might not even HAVE a Switch so they would have to buy a 300$ Console + a 60$ game + a 25$ DLC Season that rounds up to 375$ just for one game and DLC I heavily doubt People would do that Meanwhile if you do a blend of both or focus on your core audience you'd have GUARANTEED Sales instead of "Let's hope they buy our stuff and hope our core audience like the DLC" I for one will likely skip the DLC if Geno/Banjo aren't in so I'm sure some are like that for their characters.
Your entire Core Audience being guaranteed to buy the DLC or Appealing to people who might not have bought Smash Ultimate or even a Switch, I think it would make more sense for them to do the first and mix in a few DLC characters that also appeal to other fanbases, Geno would appeal to your core audience.
Even then let's say Sakurai did in fact push for Geno in Base Game they could be withholding Geno for DLC cause of Square prioritizing Money more than
playing Nice.
Even Brave's Stats fit Geno with the apparent Short Zoner playstyle, The Sliding, The Wide Shield Size, Etc. Brave just feels like Geno to me, it feels like
what Geno would feel like and play like. Short Zoner fits Geno's Description perfectly with him being slightly shorter than Mario being accurate to Geno's
size and Geno obviously being a Zoner. The sliding cause Geno is Wooden and Wood has a lot of traction. The Wide Shield Size being cause maybe Geno's Cape is flowing outwards making the shield size bigger.
While DQ isn't as complicated as we initially thought Nintendo and Sakurai already have the rights to Geno and supposedly SMRPG so why go out and go through Square-enix and Toriyama when you have a Fan Favorite Character right there one that people have been requesting since Brawl at the latest! People have been wanting Geno for a Decade and they have the right to Geno and Super Mario RPG so why not use them? Not even Nintendo is that dumb. They HAVE to know what they have right in front of them and how important Geno is to a decent size of the Smash fanbase. It is a fact at this point that they have the rights to SMRPG for Smash Use.
In-Game evidence, Reputable NoA contacts saying Geno, All Parties knowing Geno is Popular, References inside and outside of Smash Ultimate, Geno fitting in as DLC, Brave's Stats, They already have the Rights, Etc. There ARE things going for Geno.
"Okay but the Brave Codename doesn't fit Geno" That's the thing! Codenames shouldn't be obvious, they're supposed to loosely tie into the character
and to not be super obvious at first glace but with hindsight or the more you think about other options it starts to make sense, Brave's relation to Erdrick
is too obvious and it doesn't really hide the character's identity well which a good codename should. I really do think it's too obvious, Maybe it is
Erdrick but something seems weird about it.
I think both Geno and Erdrick could make sense for being Brave and I'm not even Saying Erdrick isn't Brave but it's kind of weird, I think we need to look
outside of the box as the saying goes for this one. Maybe we're putting too much emphasis on the Codename and not enough emphasis on the Data sure things could always change but it's more solid than trying to make sense of the Codename when it's there to throw you off of who it's going to be in the first place.
The Data can change but it's entire playstyle cannot change for either it's super early into development or something went terribly wrong, The Apparent
Playstyle suggests it to be a Zoner which fits with Geno or other characters, not so much Erdrick. the entire playstyle did not change for Piranha Plant
nor did it likely change for Joker so unless we can prove otherwise I think it's safe to guess maybe it will change but nothing drastic enough for it to
change the Character's entire archetype.
I simply think we're looking at it from the wrong angle, Maybe Brave really is Geno.
and to not be super obvious at first glace but with hindsight or the more you think about other options it starts to make sense, Brave's relation to Erdrick
is too obvious and it doesn't really hide the character's identity well which a good codename should. I really do think it's too obvious, Maybe it is
Erdrick but something seems weird about it.
I think both Geno and Erdrick could make sense for being Brave and I'm not even Saying Erdrick isn't Brave but it's kind of weird, I think we need to look
outside of the box as the saying goes for this one. Maybe we're putting too much emphasis on the Codename and not enough emphasis on the Data sure things could always change but it's more solid than trying to make sense of the Codename when it's there to throw you off of who it's going to be in the first place.
The Data can change but it's entire playstyle cannot change for either it's super early into development or something went terribly wrong, The Apparent
Playstyle suggests it to be a Zoner which fits with Geno or other characters, not so much Erdrick. the entire playstyle did not change for Piranha Plant
nor did it likely change for Joker so unless we can prove otherwise I think it's safe to guess maybe it will change but nothing drastic enough for it to
change the Character's entire archetype.
I simply think we're looking at it from the wrong angle, Maybe Brave really is Geno.
People heavily underestimate Geno and basically act like he's deconfirmed when that's simply not the case in fact I would go so far as to say he's
the second most likely Square rep right behind Erdrick himself. Geno simply has stuff going for him that other characters do not and the information coming out for Erdrick contradicts itself by some saying he'll be revealed next or soon, some saying he'll be revealed as one of the last DLC characters. Some saying he'll have only his fem alt and some saying his fem alt + Alucia when neither characters have Chibi Designs which Erdrick must be if the Square rep is indeed next, I don't think Square would make brand new designs for Smash as they've been very stingy in regards to the game so far. It's rather unlikely. I think Something is definitely up and if you add in all of the Contradictions Erdrick seems suspicious at the very least.
Nintendo already has the rights to the character and the rights to use SMRPG stuff within Smash not even Nintendo is stupid enough to not do anything with them, they already Know Geno is popular and highly requested they wouldn't just let him go unused they'd at least give us the Mii costume if not make him playable not to mention the composer from SMRPG is on board for Smash. Simply put Geno is without a doubt the easiest Square rep to get as everything is laid out right in-front of them they just have to get the go ahead by Square. Every party involved know that Geno is popular so they wouldn't just leave him as a Spirit and do nothing at least they'd give us the Mii Costume if not a Character so I do not think this is all that's left for Geno, I think something is coming I just don't know what.
Geno may not have anything to advertise but he and Super Mario RPG is important to Nintendo and Square's history together as that was Nintendo and Square's first huge collaboration and their last big game for Nintendo before they went non-exclusive so by adding him it would be a nice way to tie up loose ends and would be a symbol of their relationship prospering.
Even everything going on with Brave seems to fit with how Geno would play, a Short Zoner is exactly how this guy would play. Geno is short like slightly
smaller than Mario which fits the height and Geno's main attacking method is using beams and bullets which would be how a Zoner plays. The Sliding even makes sense with Geno as wood has a lot of traction. The Shield Size also makes sense as it would have to be very wide yet we don't know what position the Character is in so who's to say it isn't Geno and his cape is simply flowing back making the shield size bigger, there really isn't anything debunking it nor is there anything to support that claim. If the Square rep is brave I think it might be Geno.
Geno is a unique case as he's a huge outlier for the List so we don't exactly know how likely or unlikely he really is we could be down and be depressed
thinking Geno will never get in but behind the scenes he's the frontrunner, we'd never know that cause he's in such a strange position with Smash and within
Square reps itself. He's kind of irrelevant but there's also so many symbolic reasons to add him and with such a huge fanbase Geno lives on within the
fandom's hearts so he's never really dead. at the very least we can all see that Geno will get in eventually be it the fighters pass, Misc DLC or even Smash
6. Geno is in a very weird position and we can never truly understand how likely or unlikely he really is.
Geno is a strange character as he has many things going for him and somethings not even Erdrick or Sora have yet we can't really predict how likely or
unlikely he is as he's a massive outlier for the list of Square reps, maybe he really is the frontrunner or maybe he's never been discussed we truly cannot
tell for sure all we can do is hope for the best, but with everything going on it seems mighty suspicious.
Something is definitely going on I'm telling Y'all, Geno might actually be more likely than we give him credit for yet we'll never know for sure until the
Square rep is revealed. Maybe Erdrick is indeed leakbait with all the inconsistencies surrounding him so unless Leakers get their story straight and exactly what's going on with Erdrick I'm gonna have to start assuming most of the reason they thought Erdrick was likely is cause of the Brave Datamine, There's simply too much inconsistencies to ignore. Also I have nothing against Insiders and Leakers I'm just saying people should stop taking their words as gospel, they're just as in the dark as we are only that they get information sooner and maybe we're wrong and the Square rep is actually Geno, finally.
the second most likely Square rep right behind Erdrick himself. Geno simply has stuff going for him that other characters do not and the information coming out for Erdrick contradicts itself by some saying he'll be revealed next or soon, some saying he'll be revealed as one of the last DLC characters. Some saying he'll have only his fem alt and some saying his fem alt + Alucia when neither characters have Chibi Designs which Erdrick must be if the Square rep is indeed next, I don't think Square would make brand new designs for Smash as they've been very stingy in regards to the game so far. It's rather unlikely. I think Something is definitely up and if you add in all of the Contradictions Erdrick seems suspicious at the very least.
Nintendo already has the rights to the character and the rights to use SMRPG stuff within Smash not even Nintendo is stupid enough to not do anything with them, they already Know Geno is popular and highly requested they wouldn't just let him go unused they'd at least give us the Mii costume if not make him playable not to mention the composer from SMRPG is on board for Smash. Simply put Geno is without a doubt the easiest Square rep to get as everything is laid out right in-front of them they just have to get the go ahead by Square. Every party involved know that Geno is popular so they wouldn't just leave him as a Spirit and do nothing at least they'd give us the Mii Costume if not a Character so I do not think this is all that's left for Geno, I think something is coming I just don't know what.
Geno may not have anything to advertise but he and Super Mario RPG is important to Nintendo and Square's history together as that was Nintendo and Square's first huge collaboration and their last big game for Nintendo before they went non-exclusive so by adding him it would be a nice way to tie up loose ends and would be a symbol of their relationship prospering.
Even everything going on with Brave seems to fit with how Geno would play, a Short Zoner is exactly how this guy would play. Geno is short like slightly
smaller than Mario which fits the height and Geno's main attacking method is using beams and bullets which would be how a Zoner plays. The Sliding even makes sense with Geno as wood has a lot of traction. The Shield Size also makes sense as it would have to be very wide yet we don't know what position the Character is in so who's to say it isn't Geno and his cape is simply flowing back making the shield size bigger, there really isn't anything debunking it nor is there anything to support that claim. If the Square rep is brave I think it might be Geno.
Geno is a unique case as he's a huge outlier for the List so we don't exactly know how likely or unlikely he really is we could be down and be depressed
thinking Geno will never get in but behind the scenes he's the frontrunner, we'd never know that cause he's in such a strange position with Smash and within
Square reps itself. He's kind of irrelevant but there's also so many symbolic reasons to add him and with such a huge fanbase Geno lives on within the
fandom's hearts so he's never really dead. at the very least we can all see that Geno will get in eventually be it the fighters pass, Misc DLC or even Smash
6. Geno is in a very weird position and we can never truly understand how likely or unlikely he really is.
Geno is a strange character as he has many things going for him and somethings not even Erdrick or Sora have yet we can't really predict how likely or
unlikely he is as he's a massive outlier for the list of Square reps, maybe he really is the frontrunner or maybe he's never been discussed we truly cannot
tell for sure all we can do is hope for the best, but with everything going on it seems mighty suspicious.
Something is definitely going on I'm telling Y'all, Geno might actually be more likely than we give him credit for yet we'll never know for sure until the
Square rep is revealed. Maybe Erdrick is indeed leakbait with all the inconsistencies surrounding him so unless Leakers get their story straight and exactly what's going on with Erdrick I'm gonna have to start assuming most of the reason they thought Erdrick was likely is cause of the Brave Datamine, There's simply too much inconsistencies to ignore. Also I have nothing against Insiders and Leakers I'm just saying people should stop taking their words as gospel, they're just as in the dark as we are only that they get information sooner and maybe we're wrong and the Square rep is actually Geno, finally.
"Why would they even Choose Geno? He's not relevant nor would he advertise anything"
Simple, Geno is a symbol of a time where Square and Nintendo were best buddies and when Square was developing games exclusively for Nintendo so Geno would be a character that would symbolize a reuniting of Square and Nintendo in a sense. Fun Fact: SMRPG was Square's last big game before leaving to develop for Playstation so it would make sense for him to bring it back around. Not to mention the fact that he's a fan favorite and they might just MIGHT want to do something nice for the fans this one time, that or Sakurai made a really good deal towards Square.
"Didn't SMRPG Flop?"
No Actually it was the 19th best selling Super Nintendo game of all time and sold 2.1M copies which outdid Kirby Super Star, Chrono Trigger, Super Street
Fighter 2, Super Metroid, Final Fantasy IV, Dragon Quest III, Super Ghouls and Goblins and even Megaman X. So no by no means did it flop. Not to mention people would've played it on the Wii and Wii U virtual Console + The SNES Classic and Emulation so by all means we know more than 2M people played SMRPG.
"Square doesn't care about the fans they'd rather put in someone who they could advertise."
Sure that is indeed the case but just cause they don't care doesn't mean Nintendo and Sakurai don't care In-Fact I would say they do care about what the fans want this time around so there's nothing saying Sakurai and Nintendo didn't strike a mutually beneficial deal with Square for Geno and that they took it. We simply don't know all of the details so there's nothing going either way, Maybe they struck a deal maybe they didn't.
With all this said and done I want to clarify something, I do not dislike DQ fans nor do I dislike DQ in general I simply want to defend my boy Geno with all my might cause he's a good character and I think he should get in, If both got in I would be more than Satisfied with that I would celebrate with DQ fans and Square fans in general as we both got what we wanted and I would be happy for you guys. So yeah if you have the misconception that I dislike DQ fans, I don't so just letting y'all know that. Cya.
Simple, Geno is a symbol of a time where Square and Nintendo were best buddies and when Square was developing games exclusively for Nintendo so Geno would be a character that would symbolize a reuniting of Square and Nintendo in a sense. Fun Fact: SMRPG was Square's last big game before leaving to develop for Playstation so it would make sense for him to bring it back around. Not to mention the fact that he's a fan favorite and they might just MIGHT want to do something nice for the fans this one time, that or Sakurai made a really good deal towards Square.
"Didn't SMRPG Flop?"
No Actually it was the 19th best selling Super Nintendo game of all time and sold 2.1M copies which outdid Kirby Super Star, Chrono Trigger, Super Street
Fighter 2, Super Metroid, Final Fantasy IV, Dragon Quest III, Super Ghouls and Goblins and even Megaman X. So no by no means did it flop. Not to mention people would've played it on the Wii and Wii U virtual Console + The SNES Classic and Emulation so by all means we know more than 2M people played SMRPG.
"Square doesn't care about the fans they'd rather put in someone who they could advertise."
Sure that is indeed the case but just cause they don't care doesn't mean Nintendo and Sakurai don't care In-Fact I would say they do care about what the fans want this time around so there's nothing saying Sakurai and Nintendo didn't strike a mutually beneficial deal with Square for Geno and that they took it. We simply don't know all of the details so there's nothing going either way, Maybe they struck a deal maybe they didn't.
With all this said and done I want to clarify something, I do not dislike DQ fans nor do I dislike DQ in general I simply want to defend my boy Geno with all my might cause he's a good character and I think he should get in, If both got in I would be more than Satisfied with that I would celebrate with DQ fans and Square fans in general as we both got what we wanted and I would be happy for you guys. So yeah if you have the misconception that I dislike DQ fans, I don't so just letting y'all know that. Cya.
KirbyWorshipper2465
Smash Legend
Something that occurred to me earlier today, I think at least some of the pass characters may be of the "characters you never knew you wanted" type, much like Joker. An initial DLC wave made mostly of oddball picks would be interesting, I'll say this much.
Meanwhile, that one 5Chan post claimed Luminary and Anlucia alts.
Funktastic
Smash Apprentice
Hope you're right buddy!
TheCJBrine
Smash Legend
If I remember correctly, Verge didn't say that Geno was leakbait, just that he was told to not take him seriously...which sounds like a biased source (or he's biased himself, which he seems he might be based on some comments he's made on GameFaqs).
The only one that Verge or his source said was not in is Sora; I don't know how they would know that, though, unless they saw some proof (dunno what that'd be) or a higher-up said so for some reason.
The only one that Verge or his source said was not in is Sora; I don't know how they would know that, though, unless they saw some proof (dunno what that'd be) or a higher-up said so for some reason.
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coolcat12347
Smash Journeyman
It's been a while! What'd I miss?
KirbyWorshipper2465
Smash Legend
Verge tries to act neutral like Fatman does. Unfortunately, the problem is that between Gamefaqs and here, the game of telephone very quickly turns his words into him being biased about something.
The only way to win is to not play the game.
The only way to win is to not play the game.
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The Anigriffin
Smash Lord
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Bless you.
ForsakenM
Smash Lord
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Couple of points I would like to add.
1. According to that one guy who came in and pointed how how many things changed with PP's stats, even if slightly, lots of changes were made. We never got him to answer if the height was changed. If the heights were changed for PP before release, then the argument against Erdrick has no weight, but if PP's height didn't change then the weight lessens but it still there: leakers could be wrong about the alts but right about Erdrick and the stats besides the height could change to better fit his playstyle.
2. Vergeben's claim to Geno being leakbait (as well as Sora not being possible) have no evidence or credibility behind them: both these statements are his own speculation, and seeing as he has been saying it's Erdrick for a while not and that he has shown to have a bias against Geno and his fans (I believe he made a post calling people ********/something about marrying or having sex with dolls since we love them so much or whatever) we can't take anything he says against Geno seriously due to his own bias. That and his reputation has been falling lower and lower recently.
3. Just a thought for Brave: people keep thinking that the codenames should be obvious since we connect PP and Joker to Pakku and Jack Frost so quickly, but all these people need to keep in mind that we also had both of these characters revealed before we saw there codenames, so if we are right about these codenames and who they are attached to...of COURSE it would be obvious since we already KNEW the characters. However, what about characters we don't know, like Brave? Perhaps the whole reason the codename is 'Brave' is to make us think it's Erdrick when in actuality it's another character entirely. Just because it was easy the first two times doesn't mean it will continue to be so.
Well done overall on getting all this info and critical thinking down so fast.
alemerltoucanet
Smash Lord
Exactly. Imagine if we saw the codename "Jack" in isolation before Joker was revealed. How many people do you think would've connected it to any Persona character, let alone Joker specifically? Plant probably got away with having just his name as the filename because A.) he was already planned to be revealed before people even got a chance to datamine the game (and was most likely planned for base roster anyway), and B.) even if they did, the concept of a Piranha Plant in Smash would've been so unbelievable to people, they probably would've just connected it to Petey Piranha or Ms. Pac-Man or something.
The Anigriffin
Smash Lord
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I’m telling ya. Brave isn’t gonna be our Square rep. This whole scenario is sketchy.
6eyondthegrave
Smash Apprentice
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You have made my day, thank you! I still hope Geno is in
Ovaltine
Smash Master
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Yeah, either Brave is Erdrick or they aren't even a Square rep at all. At least, that's my vision.
ShotoStar, that post was a nice little analysis. I personally don't think Erdrick is leak bait, but I'm steeling myself for the least favorable outcome (given I'm very ambivalent on Erdrick).
ETA: Also! I've gotten onto playing Mario Odyssey, at long last. This game is amazing. I can only imagine Geno's life is insanely monotonous up in Star Road, so I can only imagine him being starstruck (heh) with the locations and kingdoms he never got to see. Super Geno Odyssey when?
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TheBeastHimself
No time for tea, uncle, gotta capture the Avatar!
If Square and Nintendo continue playing nice, I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility for Geno to appear in Mario's next installment or sometime down the (star) road.
Ovaltine
Smash Master
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ya need to be freakin stopped m8
But yeah, it looks like Furukawa is keen on giving Square the red carpet, so I think Nintendo and Square are gonna be good for the foreseeable future. That's extremely good news for Geno making a reappearance one day.
ForsakenM
Smash Lord
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Holy crap, I forgot that it was literally just Jack for the codename. Imagine that with no Joker reveal!
"I think it's Jak and Daxter!"
"No way, PASBR was a flop, they won't pick him. It's totally Handsome Jack!"
"Nah, that game is too extreme!"
"We got Snake and Bayo, whaddayamean?"
"Speaking of Snake, maybe it's Big Boss as an echo or maybe even Raiden, as he is called 'Jack The Ripper'."
Just based off some of my own knowledge and a quick google search. Hell, you could have argued for Jazz Jackrabbit for crimey sake!
People are so basic: a couple of people who said something that came true a couple times and now got nothing HAVE to be right.
6eyondthegrave
Smash Apprentice
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The Opus Magnum!
NintendoKnight
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Holy crap, guys, just realized something.
If Brave is Geno, why does he have a wider shield? Well, when most characters block, they usually contract their shape and pull their limbs inward to assume guarding position. Why would this be different with Geno?
![]()
Because whenever Geno guards in SMRPG, he extends his arm OUTWARDS; he doesn't pull himself closer like most other characters! This would explain why his shield is wider: to compensate for his arm sticking out forward! It make sense!
If Brave is Geno, why does he have a wider shield? Well, when most characters block, they usually contract their shape and pull their limbs inward to assume guarding position. Why would this be different with Geno?
Because whenever Geno guards in SMRPG, he extends his arm OUTWARDS; he doesn't pull himself closer like most other characters! This would explain why his shield is wider: to compensate for his arm sticking out forward! It make sense!
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Datboigeno
Smash Lord
Something to note about the Brave codename that I feel a lot of people overlook: People are saying Nintendo was being super obvious with The codenames but were they really?Jack being a codename for Joker is obvious in retrospect. However if Jack was uncovered before Joker was revealed do you really think it would’ve been that obvious? I mean going from people’s reasoning about why Brave is Erdrick wouldn’t people have also assumed with that same logic that Jack was Jack Frost from SMT rather than Joker?
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EarlTamm
Smash Hero
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If I recall correct, the Jack name was known before the reveal in the datamining community because the game got out early, but they had no clue who it was. I am pretty sure
Fatmanonice
mentioned this before after everything was exposed.RetrogamerMax
Smash Legend
That was beautiful. I hope you're right.
KirbyWorshipper2465
Smash Legend
Really valid point. Even the DA user ProfessorFandango noted how the Joker reveal nearly ruined his current last surprise drawing for his Smash 150 DLC drawings project, that being the Jack Bros: https://www.deviantart.com/professorfandango/art/SMASH-150-190-JACK-BROS-775834547
Hyperkin, not even once.
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GenoFlash
Smash Journeyman
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Are they known for that? My SNES is busted and I figured an HD SNES would be a good buy.
I was doing Booster Hill and didn't get as many Flower Points as I wanted so if it's just an issue with the reset button I'll avoid that.
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KirbyWorshipper2465
Smash Legend
Generally, most of their consoles/products are flawed in some way.
Pokemaster73
Smash Cadet
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What a great post. It's been such a roller coaster rooting for my puppet boy's inclusion. From thinking he was "guarenteed" in the base roster, being crushed by him being just a spirit, giving up hope, and now I think it might just be possible again. I hope something happens soon.
Firox
Smash Master
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Holy ****! You're right! (crosses fingers)Holy crap, guys, just realized something.
If Brave is Geno, why does he have a wider shield? Well, when most characters block, they usually contract their shape and pull their limbs inward to assume guarding position. Why would this be different with Geno?
![]()
Because whenever Geno guards in SMRPG, he extends his arm OUTWARDS; he doesn't pull himself closer like most other characters! This would explain why his shield is wider: to compensate for his arm sticking out forward! It make sense!
Sovereign Trinity
Smash Ace
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Thank you so much for taking the time to type all of this. I can't wait to read this, and may you have a deep and dreamy rest, good sir.
Ovaltine
Smash Master
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Honestly, even if we get Erdrick, I'd recommend not giving up hope. All of the prior problems when including Geno (time and licensing) seems as though they shouldn't be a problem for this game. Nintendo and Square are working together again, and Sakurai has stated that they have a surplus of time and money for the DLC. Even with another SE rep, I believe hope exists for Geno yet.
Send all your wishes to Star Road!
The Anigriffin
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Damn, that sucks to hear. I know that feeling, losing all that hard work.
D
Deleted member
Guest
*Wishes for Geno as DLC*
I Swear if Geno gets in as DLC I will at the very least Secondary him if not main him.
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D
Deleted member
Guest
And Seagull Joe wants Lanky Kong
KirbyWorshipper2465
Smash Legend
I think it can be fair to say that ATLUS is mostly to blame for why the next character reveal is taking forever in this case, seeing as they have the bad habit of teasing Persona-related anything for a long time. Especially if they want Nintendo to tie in Persona 5 R's full unveiling to Joker's release...
If the rest of the pass characters come out much faster afterwards, there'll be no doubt. There's no way Nintendo would allow Joker getting hidden any further than April when they got a deadline to reach.
If the rest of the pass characters come out much faster afterwards, there'll be no doubt. There's no way Nintendo would allow Joker getting hidden any further than April when they got a deadline to reach.
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BoringName
Smash Rookie
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This was just amazing. I don’t think I’ve ever read a speculation piece this good before, and I’m really starting to believe that geno has a very good chance and that Erdrick might be leakbait. Go get a good rest, you deserve it
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