Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[shocktarts17]

Again, I don't think not selling as much in the west as it did in Japan means that DQ can't be in Smash.

If it did, however, it wouldn't matter for a character like Geno because of his fan demand. Sometimes, the fan demand is enough to get a character into Smash, no matter how well known they are, as we have seen with Lucas, Roy, and Bayonetta. They are characters who aren't super well known, but the amount of fan demand was enough to get them into Smash. So even if Super Mario RPG didn't sell as much in the west as it did in Japan, it wouldn't matter due to how many people want Geno in Smash. DQ doesn't have this fan demand. I don't think it would stop it from getting into Smash, though

And again, that't not what I'm talking about.

I'm not saying anything about Geno's chances vs Erdrick's chances OVERALL, what I am saying is that if you want to give reasons why Geno should be in Smash over Erdrick don't say it's because Erdrick didn't sell well in the west because he sold better in the west than Geno did.

 

[Deleted member]

And again, that't not what I'm talking about.

I'm not saying anything about Geno's chances vs Erdrick's chances OVERALL, what I am saying is that if you want to give reasons why Geno should be in Smash over Erdrick don't say it's because Erdrick didn't sell well in the west because he sold better in the west than Geno did.

I see what you are saying.

The reason people use that point is because it ties into how much people want something as well, where in this case, it wouldn't matter for Geno. Again, I know what you are mean, just saying that this is part of the point people make when talking about sales of the games

 

[Latyon]

And again, that't not what I'm talking about.

I'm not saying anything about Geno's chances vs Erdrick's chances OVERALL, what I am saying is that if you want to give reasons why Geno should be in Smash over Erdrick don't say it's because Erdrick didn't sell well in the west because he sold better in the west than Geno did.

IMO the reason Geno deserves it more than Erdrick is because DQ is a boring, lowest-common-denominator amalgam of JRPG cliches...

 

[Tree Gelbman]

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/4439/super-mario-rpg-legend-of-the-seven-stars/

I mean by any definition that Dragon Quest is niche due to sales Super Mario RPG fits into that same boat with most of its sales being in Japan, and it didn't even sell a million in the west. I don't say this to dump on Geno just to say that any argument that Dragon Quest shouldn't get into Smash because of sales in the west would also disqualify Geno.

This doesn't include the many many times Super Mario RPG has been re-released onto mega-watt sellers like the SNES Classic, or it's sales on the Virtual Consoles however. A kind of exposure that Dragon Quest doesn't have in the West.

 

[ForsakenM]

And again, that't not what I'm talking about.

I'm not saying anything about Geno's chances vs Erdrick's chances OVERALL, what I am saying is that if you want to give reasons why Geno should be in Smash over Erdrick don't say it's because Erdrick didn't sell well in the west because he sold better in the west than Geno did.

Hmm...

>Says DQ outsold SMRPG, so that's not a valid reason
>DQ has 11 games now, SMRPG has only the single game re-released 3 times.
>Square has actively tried to push DQ, doesn't seem to give two s***s about SMRPG

Huh, and yet DQ is STILL a niche in the West yet upon it's original release, SMRPG was the most rented game for 16 weeks in a row and sold more than most (if not all) other Square RPGs and maybe even just flat out RPGs in the West at the time. It's almost as if, had Square and Nintendo not been so hard-headed and worked together for another SMRPG on the 64, it would be a successful series possibility even until this day...barring Miyamoto opening his mouth of course.

Of course this is pure speculation and conjecture, but when you compare how well SMRPG was received considering the times and how soon the N64 came out after to sweep the SNES away versus how DQ just does not seem to click with the West despite how hard it gets pushed, you can see where that speculation comes from. Hell, in a Japanese magazine poll around between E3 and August fans were asked who they wanted in Smash. Geno made #11 while the first DQ rep to place was Slime at #15. Japan's own Smash fanbase doesn't really want DQ in Smash, they tend to share requested with the West with minor exceptions like Captain Rainbow.

When I say DQ is niche, I'm not wrong: being the biggest thing in one country in the world and being relatively ignored by the rest of the world makes DQ niche in the US, Europe and the rest. I'm not saying SMRPG is more or less niche, this isn't a comparison: it's a statement that is based on factual evidence. I COULD say that the US wants Geno more than Eddy or another DQ rep and that would probably be true as well, but I personally won't step out that far.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Again, I don't think not selling as much in the west as it did in Japan means that DQ can't be in Smash.

If it did, however, it wouldn't matter for a character like Geno because of his fan demand. Sometimes, the fan demand is enough to get a character into Smash, no matter how well known they are, as we have seen with Lucas, Roy, and Bayonetta. They are characters who aren't super well known, but the amount of fan demand was enough to get them into Smash. So even if Super Mario RPG didn't sell as much in the west as it did in Japan, it wouldn't matter due to how many people want Geno in Smash. DQ doesn't have this fan demand. I don't think it would stop it from getting into Smash, though

It doesn’t have any polling demand long term. Though Japan is one of the hardest regions to nail down from a perspective of what is wanted and what is not, and Dragon Quest stuff has appeared in different places with some votes.

I don’t think something being super popular in one region and not in others means much of anything to niche or not. Niche to the western market is a true statement, but inaccurate when you include Japan. A series like Metroid largely has such a large place thanks to Western fans. Yet the series has four playable characters. Would we point fingers at Metroid if our perspective was flipped? Possibly. And that’s my point. You can’t just use the not popular in certain regions or not popular in my region and write things off if they’re insanely popular or notable elsewhere. Especially when Japan is the exact market in which Smash and literally every third party in the game originated from. They’ve always played favoritism with Japanese third party IPs anyway.

Plus, not every character will be a fan requested one or decided on fan demand. Characters can get in for other reasons, and that’s one of the things I’m looking to sort of push with these comments.

It sucks we didn’t get Geno along with how other fan service that Sakurai paid in the production of Ultimate, but not every character is or even should be of the fan request spectrum and I’ve found that narrative to be pushed a little too much in the post-Ultimate release cycle when so many other dreams came true.

Ideally we’d see a balance between new characters, interesting choices from the developer, fan requests, and expanding the roster with new franchises and choices.

 

[Deleted member]

It doesn’t have any polling demand long term. Though Japan is one of the hardest regions to nail down from a perspective of what is wanted and what is not, and Dragon Quest stuff has appeared in different places with some votes.

I don’t think something being super popular in one region and not in others means much of anything to niche or not. Niche to the western market is a true statement, but inaccurate when you include Japan. A series like Metroid largely has such a large place thanks to Western fans. Yet the series has four playable characters. Would we point fingers at Metroid if our perspective was flipped? Possibly. And that’s my point. You can’t just use the not popular in certain regions or not popular in my region and write things off if they’re insanely popular or notable elsewhere. Especially when Japan is the exact market in which Smash and literally every third party in the game originated from. They’ve always played favoritism with Japanese third party IPs anyway.

Plus, not every character will be a fan requested one or decided on fan demand. Characters can get in for other reasons, and that’s one of the things I’m looking to sort of push with these comments.

It sucks we didn’t get Geno along with how other fan service that Sakurai paid in the production of Ultimate, but not every character is or even should be of the fan request spectrum and I’ve found that narrative to be pushed a little too much in the post-Ultimate release cycle when so many other dreams came true.

Ideally we’d see a balance between new characters, interesting choices from the developer, fan requests, and expanding the roster with new franchises and choices.

I wasn't saying DQ shouldn't be in Smash, even if it is more popular in one region than the other, I was saying Geno's fan demand is something that massively helps him, no matter the sales of his game.

And hey we still have 4 more DLC characters. Geno could very well be one of them. Don't lost hope :D I won't

 

[GoodGrief741]

IMO the reason Geno deserves it more than Erdrick is because DQ is a boring, lowest-common-denominator amalgam of JRPG cliches...

 

[Fatmanonice]

>humoring the fake leak
>again
This is like the Grinch leak again, isn't it. Hope this won't result in a Team Real/Fake/Hmm/whatever divide again...

Anyway it doesn't matter how niche an IP is before it gets into Smash, Smash is big enough in terms of publicity that it'll more or less make them non-niche (except for retro NES games, those are special cases).

I mean, just look at Fire Emblem, you'd have a hard time finding Western fans of the series before Melee happened. Even with Persona, it's getting more attention now, with its most popular entry's hero having made it in.

Also, body reactions? Did I accidentally go into the general?

It's more like Gematsu because now that even major gaming news outlets are covering it, nobody wants to bring up anything else until literally any detail is proven wrong.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I wasn't saying DQ shouldn't be in Smash, even if it is more popular in one region than the other, I was saying Geno's fan demand is something that massively helps him, no matter the sales of his game.

And hey we still have 4 more DLC characters. Geno could very well be one of them. Don't lost hope :D I won't

Sorry that wasn't all pointed at you, just more in general since your post seemed like a good jumping off point.

I can't necessarily agree with you on Geno being one of the four, but I do think his best chances lie with another round of DLC if we can get it (Or maybe just straight up a success of Operation Starfall pushing him to be a character chosen outside of the initial Fighter's Pass selection).

 

[Deleted member]

That reminds me.

I should watch The Big Lebowski one time

EricTheGamerman Well, I still have hope he will make it into wave 1. With Operation Starfall, I am also confident that he will make it into a potential wave 2, if not wave 1. I wasn't feeling that before, but I am with OS

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

It's more like Gematsu because now that even major gaming news outlets are covering it, nobody wants to bring up anything else until literally any detail is proven wrong.

Ahh, so a "Emperor's New Clothes" kind of case then.

That reminds me.

I should watch The Big Lebowski one time

EricTheGamerman Well, I still have hope he will make it into wave 1. With Operation Starfall, I am also confident that he will make it into a potential wave 2, if not wave 1. I wasn't feeling that before, but I am with OS

If neither, maybe miscellaneous DLC that wouldn't need to bring in a new stage in accompaniment.

 

[Deleted member]

Ahh, so a "Emperor's New Clothes" kind of case then.



If neither, maybe miscellaneous DLC that wouldn't need to bring in a new stage in accompaniment.

Nah, he should come with a stage

If he can't, I will be more than happy to accept him alone

But he needs a stage

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Nah, he should come with a stage

If he can't, I will be more than happy to accept him alone

But he needs a stage

Okay, but the only problem is Mario has an ungodly amount of stages, so they wouldn't necessarily feel the need to toss in another one (especially since New Donk City just debuted here). We'll see what happens though.

 

[Ovaltine]

Geno would honestly... not need a stage. It's why I think he's a better fit outside of Fighter's Pass rather than within it. We already have a lot of Mario stages and representation, so really, just adding Geno with some music is all I could ever ask for.

 

[Deleted member]

Okay, but the only problem is Mario has an ungodly amount of stages, so they wouldn't necessarily feel the need to toss in another one (especially since New Donk City just debuted here). We'll see what happens though.

Geno has so much potential for a SMRPG stage though - Forest Maze, Star Hill, Bowser's Keep, etc.

I think he should come with a stage. Again, if he can't, I will still be soooo happy that he is playable. I think he still needs a stage though

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Were Ice Climbers and Mr. Game & Watch gaming icons that brought them into Melee? Pit in Brawl? Duck Hunt in Smash 4? Yet, they are in Smash. (specifically the base game).

To be fair. They're all base roster characters. They came packaged in with already keen rosters as part of the initial cast.

DLC characters are a different story as they need to be well picked choices that will entice people to pay more than they already have for the initial game.

 

[Datboigeno]

Geno would honestly... not need a stage. It's why I think he's a better fit outside of Fighter's Pass rather than within it. We already have a lot of Mario stages and representation, so really, just adding Geno with some music is all I could ever ask for.

Eh, if you're going to represent SMRPG with Geno and music from the game you may as well add Bowser's Keep w/ Exor for the sake of it being the most iconic image in SMRPG and to double as a Bowser home stage.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Eh, if you're going to represent SMRPG with Geno and music from the game you may as well add Bowser's Keep w/ Exor for the sake of it being the most iconic image in SMRPG and to double as a Bowser home stage.

Hmm, two long requested birds with one stone in that case.

 

[Deleted member]

Hmm, two long requested birds with one stone in that case.

It is so weird that there is no Bowser's castle stage yet. It's one of the most iconic settings in Mario games

 

[Tetrin]

I wish it was possible for a series to get music in Smash without having a rep. Shadow Fight 2 has a killer soundtrack (listen to Forest of Death and Lessons in the Dark Room, highly recommend).

Speaking of which, SMRPG music isn't owned by Square, right?

 

[Deleted member]

I wish it was possible for a series to get music in Smash without having a rep. Shadow Fight 2 has a killer soundtrack (listen to Forest of Death and Lessons in the Dark Room, highly recommend).

Speaking of which, SMRPG music isn't owned by Square, right?

I think SMRPG music is owned by Yoko Shimmomura

 

[Tetrin]

Kinda sucks that the music from the game was cut, then.

Unless the music comes with Geno if he were to be revealed as an extra character.

Tinfoil hat mini theory.

Also I think it's just incredibly obvious that we're getting at least one other character outside of Piranha Plant and the Fighter's Pass. There's six slots open for the stages and I know damn well Piranha Plant isn't getting one of his own. If they do just so happen to leave the space blank, then my OCD has officially been triggered. At least center the stages at the bottom.

 

[Deleted member]

Kinda sucks that the music from the game was cut, then.

Unless the music comes with Geno if he were to be revealed as an extra character.

Tinfoil hat mini theory.

Also I think it's just incredibly obvious that we're getting at least one other character outside of Piranha Plant and the Fighter's Pass. There's six slots open for the stages and I know damn well Piranha Plant isn't getting one of his own. If they do just so happen to leave the space blank, then my OCD has officially been triggered. At least center the stages at the bottom.

The sixth slot is for the training stage...
But, I still wouldn't rule out the possibility of another character outside of the fighter pass. I don't think it's likely but certainly not impossible.
And yeah I don't see why SMRPG isn't already in the game already lol

 

[Ovaltine]

The sixth slot is for the training stage...
But, I still wouldn't rule out the possibility of another character outside of the fighter pass. I don't think it's likely but certainly not impossible.
And yeah I don't see why SMRPG isn't already in the game already lol

False. The 'random' selector is replaced by the training stage when going into training. The sixth slot is not in fact for the training stage.

 

[domriver]

Hello my Geno brothers! Just a thought occurred to me. When i reading the smashboards regarding these leaks. I was thinking maybe this is all part of the plan. Misleading. Lets face it Sakurai has done pretty well to keep a nice lid on smash. Come this direct maybe Nintendo will throw a curve ball and surprise us all. I do like it when they do that and show something people are not expecting. (Wishful thinking maybe on my end) Just a thought that occurred. When is the supposed January Direct?
Itching for some information on
Smash DLC
Bayonetta 3
Metroid Prime 4
( all i can think of now)

 

[Ovaltine]

Hello my Geno brothers! Just a thought occurred to me. When i reading the smashboards regarding these leaks. I was thinking maybe this is all part of the plan. Misleading. Lets face it Sakurai has done pretty well to keep a nice lid on smash. Come this direct maybe Nintendo will throw a curve ball and surprise us all. I do like it when they do that and show something people are not expecting. (Wishful thinking maybe on my end) Just a thought that occurred. When is the supposed January Direct?
Itching for some information on
Smash DLC
Bayonetta 3
Metroid Prime 4
( all i can think of now)

Man I just want Metroid Prime. C'mon Nintendo, just give me the Metroids.

Okay, I lied, give me a SMRPG-related thing and F-Zero, too.

 

[Eric2625]

https://twitter.com/_Mizumi/status/1082674700810182657
Someone putted braves stats over ike,it seems he slides a lot.

 

[Datboigeno]

Man I just want Metroid Prime. C'mon Nintendo, just give me the Metroids.

Okay, I lied, give me a SMRPG-related thing and F-Zero, too.

12 year old me in 2002: “I hope we get an F-Zero GX sequel ”

29 year old me 17 years later: “Same.”

 

[Deleted member]

12 year old me in 2002: “I hope we get an F-Zero GX sequel ”

29 year old me 17 years later: “Same.”

For Switch I need either Mother 3 translated or a remake of the 3 Mother games, and a remake of Super Mario RPG

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

I wish it was possible for a series to get music in Smash without having a rep.

Style Savvy called.

 

[Deleted member]

https://twitter.com/_Mizumi/status/1082674700810182657
Someone putted braves stats over ike,it seems he slides a lot.

It seems like a lot of people think it could be Sora.

Sora being in doesn't mean that Geno can't be, though, especially since Sora is Disney

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

It is so weird that there is no Bowser's castle stage yet. It's one of the most iconic settings in Mario games

Probably because heroes are generally preferred over villains in Japan. Hell, somehow managed to get TWO stages over and .

Hello my Geno brothers! Just a thought occurred to me. When i reading the smashboards regarding these leaks. I was thinking maybe this is all part of the plan. Misleading. Lets face it Sakurai has done pretty well to keep a nice lid on smash. Come this direct maybe Nintendo will throw a curve ball and surprise us all. I do like it when they do that and show something people are not expecting. (Wishful thinking maybe on my end) Just a thought that occurred. When is the supposed January Direct?
Itching for some information on
Smash DLC
Bayonetta 3
Metroid Prime 4
( all i can think of now)

Still waiting for that Super Mario 3D World port.

Oh, and currently it may broadcast this Thursday.

 

[Tetrin]

Spoiler: Dream Nintendo Direct

Golden Sun, Wario Land, F-Zero, and Advance Wars reboots
Odyssey DLC with Sunshine, Beanbean, and Futuristic kingdoms. Also remastering some old SM64 painting levels, in particular, Bomb-omb Battlefield, Whomp's Fortress, Jolly Roger Bay, Cool Cool Mountain, and Wet-Dry World. Last, and last but definitely not least, an expanded Ruined Kingdom.
BotW sequel announced with a new villain to the series. Hyrule is starting to be rebuilt and certain places that felt bland were vastly improved. Introduction of way more common enemies instead of the same 4 all the time. More dungeons with more unique feels and looks to them, and shrines, while having their numbers cut, are still relevant and require much more out of the box thinking.
Mario Kart 9 with inventive ideas for stages and characters.
New Kid Icarus, marking even more inconsistent dates for games.
Daemon X Machina information
Metroid Prime 4
Luigi's Mansion 3
Animal Crossing information
A BOXBOY game that actually gets a lot of fans attracted to the series.
Splatoon 3 that allows for a much more traversable town and is more story-driven than its predecessors but still loads of fun online. Octolings still have a story mode of their own, but the levels feel fun all the way through instead of chore like (the matching boxes has gotta go). The subway is given different stops and I'd like to see the introduction of a new evildoer that's entirely separate from DJ Octavio but is still very much a prominent villain.
Popular games coming to the switch:

Spoiler

Cuphead
What Remains of Edith Finch
Detroit: Become Human
Portal series
New God of War games
NieR: Automata (I could've sworn it was already on the Switch but okay)

Nintendo Land 2 with Splatoon, Advance Wars, Golden Sun, and Mother games.
Super Mario Maker 2
Pikmin 4
Yoshi's Island 3 (yeah, I said it) (don't shoehorn baby daisy and baby rosalina in here, please)
Bayonetta 3
The World Ends With You 2
Tomodachi Life 2.
Mario Sluggers 2 with a better roster (Geno) and more stages.
Information on Persona 5 on the Switch
Partners in Time remake with non-obnoxious graphics like the new Inside Story. I'd actually be fine with the Shroobs are Fawful returning in any capacity.
A new IP that doesn't suck
A new Paper Mario that doesn't suck.
An open-world Pokemon game that isn't so linear and has more unique type combinations and more Pokemon in general (the dwindling number of Pokemon per gen is a little upsetting). I didn't like Sun and Moon tbh, and I honestly think that gens 4-6 were the best ones. The Pokemon felt generally lackluster save the Ultra Beasts and a few others. Also, keep Pokemon following you around like in other games, but I'd understand if it can't be implemented since there's so many Pokemon.
Mother 3 localization and trilogy release. I'm not sure how I'd feel about a Mother 4.
Nintendo Switch Online cancelled forever.

And most importantly

Geno announced for Smash along with an extra fighter pass that can be bundled with the first one for 2/3 the price of their sum and a Mario RPG sequel. We find out Geno and Mallow are now officially owned by Nintendo as a result of fan efforts in Operation: Starfall and we can expect them in future mainline titles. At long last getting the recognition they've waited so long for. And to be honest, I wouldn't mind seeing Culex back as a secret boss again. A fated rematch against rivals.

It'd be like a day long direct lol but it is a dream after all.

Style Savvy called.

I completely forgot lol. Of all the games, Style Savvy, though.

 

[Looma]

Style Savvy called.

tfw Style Savvy has a wider music selection than Final Fantasy

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Style Savvy called.

It's amazing how Pilotwings still gets remixes with no characters around.

 

[Deleted member]

It's amazing how Pilotwings still gets remixes with no characters around.

Even Dragon Spirit, an arcade game that hardly anyone remembers (as awesome as it is) got a remix lol

 

[Looma]

Even Dragon Spirit, an arcade game that hardly anyone remembers (as awesome as it is) got a remix lol

Mappy got one too, to my eternal joy

Spoiler

kinda want Mappy in this game...

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

K. Rool was also "niche" and people were "entitled" for wanting the character to return.

This was honestly me when I was supporting King K. Rool for Smash Brothers. Some of the fan base is funny when they hate on characters. I've seen some hate comments on K. Rool and there was one that had me in tears. I saw an article and some K. Rool hater told a K. Rool supporter something like "Nobody wants your googly-eyed Bowser in Smash!", and it made me laugh so hard.

But that's the thing. What they do is they **** on characters that have a lot of fan support, and when they make it in Smash, they don't pick on them anymore because once a character gets in, they basically have support that outnumbers the haters. Because Geno didn't make it and has a lot of flaws for making it in Smash, many decided to **** on him because he's one of the last few characters with a lot of support. It's like a hating bandwagon, and most of the time nobody has a real reason for hating him, it's just mainstream.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

This was honestly me when I was supporting King K. Rool for Smash Brothers. Some of the fan base is funny when they hate on characters. I've seen some hate comments on K. Rool and there was one that had me in tears. I saw an article and some K. Rool hater told a K. Rool supporter something like "Nobody wants your googly-eyed Bowser in Smash!", and it made me laugh so hard.

But that's the thing. What they do is they **** on characters that have a lot of fan support, and when they make it in Smash, they don't pick on them anymore because once a character gets in, they basically have support that outnumbers the haters. Because Geno didn't make it and has a lot of flaws for making it in Smash, many decided to **** on him because he's one of the last few characters with a lot of support. It's like a hating bandwagon, and most of the time nobody has a real reason for hating him, it's just mainstream.

That's how it is, the moment anyone's popular enough to be noticed, a bunch of naysayers decide to snipe them. Most character suggestions can only dream to even get that far.

Indie character supporters in particular haven't been treated very well by that kind of people.