Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

ForsakenM

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 14, 2018
Messages
1,393
So it's late and I'm tired, but I promised you guys a list of reasons as to why Geno is actually a good choice for Square to get down on and agree to put into Smash.

So, here we go...
  1. Probably the most obvious one being the fandom behind him. I mean, I dunno if you've been under a rock or in denial so hard that you must visit GameFAQs regularly, but Geno is KINDA a big deal in the Smash community. Love or hate him, you've heard about him. Everyone in every community that talks about what characters could be coming to Ultimate has brought him up and by the day he has more people supporting his entry whether it's because they think he's cool, want us to be vindicated after two decades of requests, or are just sick of hearing about him. Geno is now the front-runner for a Smash fandom pick and is the most-discussed Smash fandom pick of current times.

    Sakurai has known about our demand for years and what little noise we've heard form Nintendo about SMRPG seems to show that they have also heard us, so there is no way Square doesn't also know about our demand for them now that they are becoming good partners with Nintendo again. This means that outside of Sora, Geno would be the best choice for a character from Square to be well-received by the audience and we play a bigger part in getting the content we want from companies than we think. Just remember that every other fighting game out there makes the most demanded characters happened eventually, and the only reason we have any fear or dread is because Smash can pull from all of video games instead of just a single franchise a couple guest characters that will never return.

  2. We've been up and down on this, but the fact remains that Square's biggest hits tend to hit a lot of snares when it comes to approving content for third party purposes. Now we already know that Square seems to be really iffy on their biggest hits and they like to make good money and perfect representation when they are involved, but another thing we PRESUMABLY know (I don't believe anyone has 100% confirmed this) is that both Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest have a lot of moving parts and separate entities who all need to be communicated with and to get their approval and their cut of the profits.

    If I remember what someone said here, and if this is true, there were issues with the FFVII artist in some way and it's why we only have Cloud's Ultimate renders as his Spirits. Similar things have been said about the composer, which ends us up with only two music tracks. This makes it appear that it's not all Square's fault that we haven't gotten more content, though with how they are about getting their money's worth, I'm sure they also play a part. For these reasons and the fact that Cloud is all you REALLY need for Final Fantasy content, it significantly hurts the chances of more Final Fantasy content down the road, forget more playable characters.

    Dragon Quest had similar issues, what with a composer that refuses to give his best to the overseas market and leaving us with MIDIs, and having both Armor Project and Akira Toriyama's Bird Studios to work with. Now it seems Square played ball a bit better this time but there were still many limitations on content (though not as bad as Final Fantasy) and it seems very unlikely there will be more Dragon Quest content as Sakurai really covered all his bases with this one.

    Geno is in an amazing place in this regard: his content isn't really broken up between many different companies and persons, and what could be broken up isn't an issue. For music, Yoko Shimomura was working for Square at the time so they technically don't need her permission since she wasn't freelance until years later, but even so she's already working on Ultimate so it doesn't matter. As far as I'm aware, the artists for SMRPG work for Nintendo on different projects, so that's a non-issue. In fact, everything Square needs they wholly own with no ties to companies like Bird Studios or Disney, are assets that are already working on Ultimate, or are a part of Nintendo who is the other half to SMRPG as it is. The fact Sakurai would be coming to negotiate for Geno would mean Nintendo approved it already and thus the only other company involved in the matter is already onboard. Add in that Square wouldn't have to potentially divvy up profits with anyone else but Nintendo on this one and it turns out that Geno is essentially easy money for them.

    In fact, Geno's lack of use actually benefits him here oddly enough. Sure, you can point out that Sakurai and Nintendo have had Ultimate really going down the path of picking up characters who long lost their relevance, which it true of course, but more importantly Geno being hidden away for so long has what fans of Maximillian_Dood will understand as the Rival Schools/Power Stone effect, in which the lack of new titles and appearances has actually created an incredibly craving while leaving all the red tape applied to others series. Geno doesn't have to worry about any contracts or agreements or special restrictions they do/COULD apply to characters like FF general content, DQ characters, 2B, Kingdom Hearts general content and so on.

  3. For some reason people don't mention this more often, but the amount of good PR Geno's inclusion would do for Square is kinda nuts. This thread on and off talks about how greedy or stingy or generally terrible Square is, and as with being a company that sells a product, you naturally have those who criticize you. Now, imagine Geno gets revealed as the next fighter, as Challenger Pack 8: how much would your opinion change on that, being a Nintendo fan? See, where Sora getting in would mean at lot to a larger casual audience, Geno getting in means more to Nintendo's hardcore consumer base. Remember when Square came out and announced new and returning IPs for Switch? Remember how their decisions have suggested that we are back to the old glory days of working together with Nintendo? Well putting Geno into Smash is actually putting your money where your mouth is for such a statement.

    It's a sign to Nintendo's audience who has been around since the 90s that Square remembers and answered the call with a yes, a living testament to the revival of a legendary partnership. Suddenly, Nintendo fans start talking better of Square. Now Nintendo fans are wondering if a remake/sequel to SMRPG could really happen. What could this mean for the Chrono Series? For Breath of Fire? Since the Mana series, SaGa series and recently TWEWY have been getting a lot of love, who knows what could be next! Now fans are excited for what else Square has in store for the Switch. Now every time we have a Nintendo announcement and Square's logo shows up, people are on the edge of their seat. Now I won't act as if this does more for a wider audience as I know better than that, but it would be a big deal for Nintendo's older fanbase which is honestly a huge demographic.

  4. Speaking of remakes and sequels for SMRPG, Geno in Smash could very easily lead to such happenings, something which we are already speculating about right now. Square getting good PR and getting a taste of the love us older fans have would open the door to more opportunity than I think they had in mind with their original 'new and returning IPs' statement. This would means more potential money and work with Nintendo in the future, opening doors that may have been closer previously, which of course is good for them considering Nintendo is now the richest Japanese company.

    We talk about it, but imagine Geno in more Mario titles, like Mario Party or Mario Kart. Maybe the next Mario sports game or M&S Olympics? Hell, maybe a cameo or bigger role in the next Mario game that isn't an RPG? This is a bigger deal than people like to let on.

  5. Geno is actually possibly the best character choice for Square in terms of what he can offer from representation. Geno is essentially a Square-crafted Mario character, and is the most popular character from a franchise hasn't done well recently despite all the love it has from fans. Geno not only represents Square and Nintendo originally coming together to make something great, not just the final glory days of the SNES, nor the glory years of the late 90s: he represents the beginning of Mario RPGs. The love we have for him and his game is the reason Paper Mario and M&L ever got to exist in the first place. SMRPG showed a clear desire for Mario to have more lore and deeper world building and unique characters to interact with. Geno, despite being dead for essentially a quarter of a century, bring with him the legacy of an amazing partnership that crafted the great granddaddy in a long line of Mario titles that we love to this day, and he also represents going back to the roots of what made those titles great.

    I'm checking my own bias at the door when I say that only Sora gives him a run for his money in terms of a legacy, as the big two are already in and anything else Square has fails to compete with the bombshell that Geno brings alongside him. Lara Croft doesn't hold as much weight as these two, 2B's series was dead up until she came around, Crono's IS dead, and Neku is starting to have his own revival by TWEWY's own terms and merits.

There are probably things I missed, but it's time I head to bed. Just wanted to get this to you guys since I promised it a couple days ago.
 
Last edited:

QQS

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
969
So it's late and I'm tired, but I promised you guys a list of reasons as to why Geno is actually a good choice for Square to get down on and agree to put into Smash.

So, here we go...
  1. Probably the most obvious one being the fandom behind him. I mean, I dunno if you've been under a rock or in denial so hard that you must visit GameFAQs regularly, but Geno is KINDA a big deal in the Smash community. Love or hate him, you've heard about him. Everyone in every community that talks about what characters could be coming to Ultimate has brought him up and by the day he has more people supporting his entry whether it's because they think he's cool, want us to be vindicated after two decades of requests, or are just sick of hearing about him. Geno is now the front-runner for a Smash fandom pick and is the most-discussed Smash fandom pick of current times.

    Sakurai has known about our demand for years and what little noise we've heard form Nintendo about SMRPG seems to show that they have also heard us, so there is no way Square doesn't also know about our demand for them now that they are becoming good partners with Nintendo again. This means that outside of Sora, Geno would be the best choice for a character from Square to be well-received by the audience and we play a bigger part in getting the content we want from companies than we think. Just remember that every other fighting game out there makes the most demanded characters happened eventually, and the only reason we have any fear or dread is because Smash can pull from all of video games instead of just a single franchise a couple guest characters that will never return.

  2. We've been up and down on this, but the fact remains that Square's biggest hits tend to hit a lot of snares when it comes to approving content for third party purposes. Now we already know that Square seems to be really iffy on their biggest hits and they like to make good money and perfect representation when they are involved, but another thing we PRESUMABLY know (I don't believe anyone has 100% confirmed this) is that both Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest have a lot of moving parts and separate entities who all need to be communicated with and to get their approval and their cut of the profits.

    If I remember what someone said here, and if this is true, there were issues with the FFVII artist in some way and it's why we only have Cloud's Ultimate renders as his Spirits. Similar things have been said about the composer, which ends us up with only two music tracks. This makes it appear that it's not all Square's fault that we haven't gotten more content, though with how they are about getting their money's worth, I'm sure they also play a part. For these reasons and the fact that Cloud is all you REALLY need for Final Fantasy content, it significantly hurts the chances of more Final Fantasy content down the road, forget more playable characters.

    Dragon Quest had similar issues, what with a composer that refuses to give his best to the overseas market and leaving us with MIDIs, and having both Armor Project and Akira Toriyama's Bird Studios to work with. Now it seems Square played ball a bit better this time but there were still many limitations on content (though not as bad as Final Fantasy) and it seems very unlikely there will be more Dragon Quest content as Sakurai really covered all his bases with this one.

    Geno is in an amazing place in this regard: his content isn't really broken up between many different companies and persons, and what could be broken up isn't an issue. For music, Yoko Shimomura was working for Square at the time so they technically don't need her permission since she wasn't freelance until years later, but even so she's already working on Ultimate so it doesn't matter. As far as I'm aware, the artists for SMRPG work for Nintendo on different projects, so that's a non-issue. In fact, everything Square needs they wholly own with no ties to companies like Bird Studios or Disney, are assets that are already working on Ultimate, or are a part of Nintendo who is the other half to SMRPG as it is. The fact Sakurai would be coming to negotiate for Geno would mean Nintendo approved it already and thus the only other company involved in the matter is already onboard. Add in that Square wouldn't have to potentially divvy up profits with anyone else but Nintendo on this one and it turns out that Geno is essentially easy money for them.

    In fact, Geno's lack of use actually benefits him here oddly enough. Sure, you can point out that Sakurai and Nintendo have had Ultimate really going down the path of picking up characters who long lost their relevance, which it true of course, but more importantly Geno being hidden away for so long has what fans of Maximillian_Dood will understand as the Rival Schools/Power Stone effect, in which the lack of new titles and appearances has actually created an incredibly craving while leaving all the red tape applied to others series. Geno doesn't have to worry about any contracts or agreements or special restrictions they do/COULD apply to characters like FF general content, DQ characters, 2B, Kingdom Hearts general content and so on.

  3. For some reason people don't mention this more often, but the amount of good PR Geno's inclusion would do for Square is kinda nuts. This thread on and off talks about how greedy or stingy or generally terrible Square is, and as with being a company that sells a product, you naturally have those who criticize you. Now, imagine Geno gets revealed as the next fighter, as Challenger Pack 8: how much would your opinion change on that, being a Nintendo fan? See, where Sora getting in would mean at lot to a larger casual audience, Geno getting in means more to Nintendo's hardcore consumer base. Remember when Square came out and announced new and returning IPs for Switch? Remember how their decisions have suggested that we are back to the old glory days of working together with Nintendo? Well putting Geno into Smash is actually putting your money where your mouth is for such a statement.

    It's a sign to Nintendo's audience who has been around since the 90s that Square remembers and answered the call with a yes, a living testament to the revival of a legendary partnership. Suddenly, Nintendo fans start talking better of Square. Now Nintendo fans are wondering if a remake/sequel to SMRPG could really happen. What could this mean for the Chrono Series? For Breath of Fire? Since the Mana series, SaGa series and recently TWEWY have been getting a lot of love, who knows what could be next! Now fans are excited for what else Square has in store for the Switch. Now every time we have a Nintendo announcement and Square's logo shows up, people are on the edge of their seat. Now I won't act as if this does more for a wider audience as I know better than that, but it would be a big deal for Nintendo's older fanbase which is honestly a huge demographic.

  4. Speaking of remakes and sequels for SMRPG, Geno in Smash could very easily lead to such happenings, something which we are already speculating about right now. Square getting good PR and getting a taste of the love us older fans have would open the door to more opportunity than I think they had in mind with their original 'new and returning IPs' statement. This would means more potential money and work with Nintendo in the future, opening doors that may have been closer previously, which of course is good for them considering Nintendo is now the richest Japanese company.

    We talk about it, but imagine Geno in more Mario titles, like Mario Party or Mario Kart. Maybe the next Mario sports game or M&S Olympics? Hell, maybe a cameo or bigger role in the next Mario game that isn't an RPG? This is a bigger deal than people like to let on.

  5. Geno is actually possibly the best character choice for Square in terms of what he can offer from representation. Geno is essentially a Square-crafted Mario character, and is the most popular character from a franchise hasn't done well recently despite all the love it has from fans. Geno not only represents Square and Nintendo originally coming together to make something great, not just the final glory days of the SNES, nor the glory years of the late 90s: he represents the beginning of Mario RPGs. The love we have for him and his game is the reason Paper Mario and M&L ever got to exist in the first place. SMRPG showed a clear desire for Mario to have more lore and deeper world building and unique characters to interact with. Geno, despite being dead for essentially a quarter of a century, bring with him the legacy of an amazing partnership that crafted the great granddaddy in a long line of Mario titles that we love to this day, and he also represents going back to the roots of what made those titles great.

    I'm checking my own bias at the door when I say that only Sora gives him a run for his money in terms of a legacy, as the big two are already in and anything else Square has fails to compete with the bombshell that Geno brings alongside him. Lara Croft doesn't hold as much weight as these two, 2B's series was dead up until she came around, Crono's IS dead, and Neku is starting to have his own revival by TWEWY's own terms and merits.

There are probably things I missed, but it's time I head to bed. Just wanted to get this to you guys since I promised it a couple days ago.
Amazing, thanks for sharing! Geno is a perfect fit in many many many ways. I swear Geno is a Full Challenger Pack!
 

PsychoIncarnate

The Eternal Will of the Swarm
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Messages
50,262
Location
Char
NNID
PsychoIncarnate
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Any Geno news?


ALSO Quick Update on my RPG
View attachment 290411

I decided to make my RPG finally functional for testing. It's mostly just enemy pictures at this point. I've got like 100 different enemies I've made, though it's more like 30 something since they all have alternate colors.

I've decided to go with larger Walkabout sprites. The "normal" size is about the size of FF1 sprites, which I am not a fan of that size. These sprites are about 40x40 but most of that is empty space. It's more like 20x20
View attachment 290412

These 3 characters are ones I made up when I was in kindergarten. lol. They are the 3 first characters in the game.
OMG I am spending way too much time on the tiles. I only made them as placeholders

Test2.png
 
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GenoDoge

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 13, 2020
Messages
462
Location
Here! I think...
So it's late and I'm tired, but I promised you guys a list of reasons as to why Geno is actually a good choice for Square to get down on and agree to put into Smash.

So, here we go...
  1. Probably the most obvious one being the fandom behind him. I mean, I dunno if you've been under a rock or in denial so hard that you must visit GameFAQs regularly, but Geno is KINDA a big deal in the Smash community. Love or hate him, you've heard about him. Everyone in every community that talks about what characters could be coming to Ultimate has brought him up and by the day he has more people supporting his entry whether it's because they think he's cool, want us to be vindicated after two decades of requests, or are just sick of hearing about him. Geno is now the front-runner for a Smash fandom pick and is the most-discussed Smash fandom pick of current times.

    Sakurai has known about our demand for years and what little noise we've heard form Nintendo about SMRPG seems to show that they have also heard us, so there is no way Square doesn't also know about our demand for them now that they are becoming good partners with Nintendo again. This means that outside of Sora, Geno would be the best choice for a character from Square to be well-received by the audience and we play a bigger part in getting the content we want from companies than we think. Just remember that every other fighting game out there makes the most demanded characters happened eventually, and the only reason we have any fear or dread is because Smash can pull from all of video games instead of just a single franchise a couple guest characters that will never return.

  2. We've been up and down on this, but the fact remains that Square's biggest hits tend to hit a lot of snares when it comes to approving content for third party purposes. Now we already know that Square seems to be really iffy on their biggest hits and they like to make good money and perfect representation when they are involved, but another thing we PRESUMABLY know (I don't believe anyone has 100% confirmed this) is that both Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest have a lot of moving parts and separate entities who all need to be communicated with and to get their approval and their cut of the profits.

    If I remember what someone said here, and if this is true, there were issues with the FFVII artist in some way and it's why we only have Cloud's Ultimate renders as his Spirits. Similar things have been said about the composer, which ends us up with only two music tracks. This makes it appear that it's not all Square's fault that we haven't gotten more content, though with how they are about getting their money's worth, I'm sure they also play a part. For these reasons and the fact that Cloud is all you REALLY need for Final Fantasy content, it significantly hurts the chances of more Final Fantasy content down the road, forget more playable characters.

    Dragon Quest had similar issues, what with a composer that refuses to give his best to the overseas market and leaving us with MIDIs, and having both Armor Project and Akira Toriyama's Bird Studios to work with. Now it seems Square played ball a bit better this time but there were still many limitations on content (though not as bad as Final Fantasy) and it seems very unlikely there will be more Dragon Quest content as Sakurai really covered all his bases with this one.

    Geno is in an amazing place in this regard: his content isn't really broken up between many different companies and persons, and what could be broken up isn't an issue. For music, Yoko Shimomura was working for Square at the time so they technically don't need her permission since she wasn't freelance until years later, but even so she's already working on Ultimate so it doesn't matter. As far as I'm aware, the artists for SMRPG work for Nintendo on different projects, so that's a non-issue. In fact, everything Square needs they wholly own with no ties to companies like Bird Studios or Disney, are assets that are already working on Ultimate, or are a part of Nintendo who is the other half to SMRPG as it is. The fact Sakurai would be coming to negotiate for Geno would mean Nintendo approved it already and thus the only other company involved in the matter is already onboard. Add in that Square wouldn't have to potentially divvy up profits with anyone else but Nintendo on this one and it turns out that Geno is essentially easy money for them.

    In fact, Geno's lack of use actually benefits him here oddly enough. Sure, you can point out that Sakurai and Nintendo have had Ultimate really going down the path of picking up characters who long lost their relevance, which it true of course, but more importantly Geno being hidden away for so long has what fans of Maximillian_Dood will understand as the Rival Schools/Power Stone effect, in which the lack of new titles and appearances has actually created an incredibly craving while leaving all the red tape applied to others series. Geno doesn't have to worry about any contracts or agreements or special restrictions they do/COULD apply to characters like FF general content, DQ characters, 2B, Kingdom Hearts general content and so on.

  3. For some reason people don't mention this more often, but the amount of good PR Geno's inclusion would do for Square is kinda nuts. This thread on and off talks about how greedy or stingy or generally terrible Square is, and as with being a company that sells a product, you naturally have those who criticize you. Now, imagine Geno gets revealed as the next fighter, as Challenger Pack 8: how much would your opinion change on that, being a Nintendo fan? See, where Sora getting in would mean at lot to a larger casual audience, Geno getting in means more to Nintendo's hardcore consumer base. Remember when Square came out and announced new and returning IPs for Switch? Remember how their decisions have suggested that we are back to the old glory days of working together with Nintendo? Well putting Geno into Smash is actually putting your money where your mouth is for such a statement.

    It's a sign to Nintendo's audience who has been around since the 90s that Square remembers and answered the call with a yes, a living testament to the revival of a legendary partnership. Suddenly, Nintendo fans start talking better of Square. Now Nintendo fans are wondering if a remake/sequel to SMRPG could really happen. What could this mean for the Chrono Series? For Breath of Fire? Since the Mana series, SaGa series and recently TWEWY have been getting a lot of love, who knows what could be next! Now fans are excited for what else Square has in store for the Switch. Now every time we have a Nintendo announcement and Square's logo shows up, people are on the edge of their seat. Now I won't act as if this does more for a wider audience as I know better than that, but it would be a big deal for Nintendo's older fanbase which is honestly a huge demographic.

  4. Speaking of remakes and sequels for SMRPG, Geno in Smash could very easily lead to such happenings, something which we are already speculating about right now. Square getting good PR and getting a taste of the love us older fans have would open the door to more opportunity than I think they had in mind with their original 'new and returning IPs' statement. This would means more potential money and work with Nintendo in the future, opening doors that may have been closer previously, which of course is good for them considering Nintendo is now the richest Japanese company.

    We talk about it, but imagine Geno in more Mario titles, like Mario Party or Mario Kart. Maybe the next Mario sports game or M&S Olympics? Hell, maybe a cameo or bigger role in the next Mario game that isn't an RPG? This is a bigger deal than people like to let on.

  5. Geno is actually possibly the best character choice for Square in terms of what he can offer from representation. Geno is essentially a Square-crafted Mario character, and is the most popular character from a franchise hasn't done well recently despite all the love it has from fans. Geno not only represents Square and Nintendo originally coming together to make something great, not just the final glory days of the SNES, nor the glory years of the late 90s: he represents the beginning of Mario RPGs. The love we have for him and his game is the reason Paper Mario and M&L ever got to exist in the first place. SMRPG showed a clear desire for Mario to have more lore and deeper world building and unique characters to interact with. Geno, despite being dead for essentially a quarter of a century, bring with him the legacy of an amazing partnership that crafted the great granddaddy in a long line of Mario titles that we love to this day, and he also represents going back to the roots of what made those titles great.

    I'm checking my own bias at the door when I say that only Sora gives him a run for his money in terms of a legacy, as the big two are already in and anything else Square has fails to compete with the bombshell that Geno brings alongside him. Lara Croft doesn't hold as much weight as these two, 2B's series was dead up until she came around, Crono's IS dead, and Neku is starting to have his own revival by TWEWY's own terms and merits.

There are probably things I missed, but it's time I head to bed. Just wanted to get this to you guys since I promised it a couple days ago.
Nice list! It really shows just how much Square Enix and Nintendo would benefit from his inclusion. I'm nearly 100% sure he's in, and posts like these jst convince me even more.
 

Armadillo5_42

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 28, 2020
Messages
401
Nice list! It really shows just how much Square Enix and Nintendo would benefit from his inclusion. I'm nearly 100% sure he's in, and posts like these jst convince me even more.
With Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest out of the way, they could finally attempt to add Geno. It was simply all priority that Sakurai probably think it would make sense to add FF first and he must of wanted to add DQ for a long time since both are highly influential and Sakurai a huge fan as well. Unless we get screwed by another character that he has more bias, we could finally get our chance.
 
Last edited:

Loliko YnT

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
757
Location
PNF-404, I guess?
NNID
karilthewizard
3DS FC
0447-8484-5229
This is my likeness top10 to be Fighters right now: the ones with the more chances I mean

Geno
Crash
Lloyd
Hayabusa
Rayman
A Pokemon (Urshifu, Rillaboom or new Trainer)
Waluigi
Porky
Isaac
Shovel Knight (as the Indie king rep)
Ah , I'm happy to see some love for my man Shovel Knight here ! I feel like people are underestimating his importance sometimes ; his impact on the indie world was massive , and SK Treasure Trove is a fantastic game that I would recommend to any platformer fan.

I know that he's not talked about a lot due to his AT status , but I wish he got a bit more love.

Also , found some Geno art :
 

ctt4lfecw

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 31, 2007
Messages
653
You know I think the thing that doesn’t get talked about enough is, Geno looks so different compared to all the other DLC we have got. Geno’s unique design really makes him a standout not just for the DLC cast so far, but also compare him to Cloud and Hero from Square.
 

YsDisciple

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 14, 2019
Messages
1,173
So it's late and I'm tired, but I promised you guys a list of reasons as to why Geno is actually a good choice for Square to get down on and agree to put into Smash.

So, here we go...
  1. Probably the most obvious one being the fandom behind him. I mean, I dunno if you've been under a rock or in denial so hard that you must visit GameFAQs regularly, but Geno is KINDA a big deal in the Smash community. Love or hate him, you've heard about him. Everyone in every community that talks about what characters could be coming to Ultimate has brought him up and by the day he has more people supporting his entry whether it's because they think he's cool, want us to be vindicated after two decades of requests, or are just sick of hearing about him. Geno is now the front-runner for a Smash fandom pick and is the most-discussed Smash fandom pick of current times.

    Sakurai has known about our demand for years and what little noise we've heard form Nintendo about SMRPG seems to show that they have also heard us, so there is no way Square doesn't also know about our demand for them now that they are becoming good partners with Nintendo again. This means that outside of Sora, Geno would be the best choice for a character from Square to be well-received by the audience and we play a bigger part in getting the content we want from companies than we think. Just remember that every other fighting game out there makes the most demanded characters happened eventually, and the only reason we have any fear or dread is because Smash can pull from all of video games instead of just a single franchise a couple guest characters that will never return.

  2. We've been up and down on this, but the fact remains that Square's biggest hits tend to hit a lot of snares when it comes to approving content for third party purposes. Now we already know that Square seems to be really iffy on their biggest hits and they like to make good money and perfect representation when they are involved, but another thing we PRESUMABLY know (I don't believe anyone has 100% confirmed this) is that both Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest have a lot of moving parts and separate entities who all need to be communicated with and to get their approval and their cut of the profits.

    If I remember what someone said here, and if this is true, there were issues with the FFVII artist in some way and it's why we only have Cloud's Ultimate renders as his Spirits. Similar things have been said about the composer, which ends us up with only two music tracks. This makes it appear that it's not all Square's fault that we haven't gotten more content, though with how they are about getting their money's worth, I'm sure they also play a part. For these reasons and the fact that Cloud is all you REALLY need for Final Fantasy content, it significantly hurts the chances of more Final Fantasy content down the road, forget more playable characters.

    Dragon Quest had similar issues, what with a composer that refuses to give his best to the overseas market and leaving us with MIDIs, and having both Armor Project and Akira Toriyama's Bird Studios to work with. Now it seems Square played ball a bit better this time but there were still many limitations on content (though not as bad as Final Fantasy) and it seems very unlikely there will be more Dragon Quest content as Sakurai really covered all his bases with this one.

    Geno is in an amazing place in this regard: his content isn't really broken up between many different companies and persons, and what could be broken up isn't an issue. For music, Yoko Shimomura was working for Square at the time so they technically don't need her permission since she wasn't freelance until years later, but even so she's already working on Ultimate so it doesn't matter. As far as I'm aware, the artists for SMRPG work for Nintendo on different projects, so that's a non-issue. In fact, everything Square needs they wholly own with no ties to companies like Bird Studios or Disney, are assets that are already working on Ultimate, or are a part of Nintendo who is the other half to SMRPG as it is. The fact Sakurai would be coming to negotiate for Geno would mean Nintendo approved it already and thus the only other company involved in the matter is already onboard. Add in that Square wouldn't have to potentially divvy up profits with anyone else but Nintendo on this one and it turns out that Geno is essentially easy money for them.

    In fact, Geno's lack of use actually benefits him here oddly enough. Sure, you can point out that Sakurai and Nintendo have had Ultimate really going down the path of picking up characters who long lost their relevance, which it true of course, but more importantly Geno being hidden away for so long has what fans of Maximillian_Dood will understand as the Rival Schools/Power Stone effect, in which the lack of new titles and appearances has actually created an incredibly craving while leaving all the red tape applied to others series. Geno doesn't have to worry about any contracts or agreements or special restrictions they do/COULD apply to characters like FF general content, DQ characters, 2B, Kingdom Hearts general content and so on.

  3. For some reason people don't mention this more often, but the amount of good PR Geno's inclusion would do for Square is kinda nuts. This thread on and off talks about how greedy or stingy or generally terrible Square is, and as with being a company that sells a product, you naturally have those who criticize you. Now, imagine Geno gets revealed as the next fighter, as Challenger Pack 8: how much would your opinion change on that, being a Nintendo fan? See, where Sora getting in would mean at lot to a larger casual audience, Geno getting in means more to Nintendo's hardcore consumer base. Remember when Square came out and announced new and returning IPs for Switch? Remember how their decisions have suggested that we are back to the old glory days of working together with Nintendo? Well putting Geno into Smash is actually putting your money where your mouth is for such a statement.

    It's a sign to Nintendo's audience who has been around since the 90s that Square remembers and answered the call with a yes, a living testament to the revival of a legendary partnership. Suddenly, Nintendo fans start talking better of Square. Now Nintendo fans are wondering if a remake/sequel to SMRPG could really happen. What could this mean for the Chrono Series? For Breath of Fire? Since the Mana series, SaGa series and recently TWEWY have been getting a lot of love, who knows what could be next! Now fans are excited for what else Square has in store for the Switch. Now every time we have a Nintendo announcement and Square's logo shows up, people are on the edge of their seat. Now I won't act as if this does more for a wider audience as I know better than that, but it would be a big deal for Nintendo's older fanbase which is honestly a huge demographic.

  4. Speaking of remakes and sequels for SMRPG, Geno in Smash could very easily lead to such happenings, something which we are already speculating about right now. Square getting good PR and getting a taste of the love us older fans have would open the door to more opportunity than I think they had in mind with their original 'new and returning IPs' statement. This would means more potential money and work with Nintendo in the future, opening doors that may have been closer previously, which of course is good for them considering Nintendo is now the richest Japanese company.

    We talk about it, but imagine Geno in more Mario titles, like Mario Party or Mario Kart. Maybe the next Mario sports game or M&S Olympics? Hell, maybe a cameo or bigger role in the next Mario game that isn't an RPG? This is a bigger deal than people like to let on.

  5. Geno is actually possibly the best character choice for Square in terms of what he can offer from representation. Geno is essentially a Square-crafted Mario character, and is the most popular character from a franchise hasn't done well recently despite all the love it has from fans. Geno not only represents Square and Nintendo originally coming together to make something great, not just the final glory days of the SNES, nor the glory years of the late 90s: he represents the beginning of Mario RPGs. The love we have for him and his game is the reason Paper Mario and M&L ever got to exist in the first place. SMRPG showed a clear desire for Mario to have more lore and deeper world building and unique characters to interact with. Geno, despite being dead for essentially a quarter of a century, bring with him the legacy of an amazing partnership that crafted the great granddaddy in a long line of Mario titles that we love to this day, and he also represents going back to the roots of what made those titles great.

    I'm checking my own bias at the door when I say that only Sora gives him a run for his money in terms of a legacy, as the big two are already in and anything else Square has fails to compete with the bombshell that Geno brings alongside him. Lara Croft doesn't hold as much weight as these two, 2B's series was dead up until she came around, Crono's IS dead, and Neku is starting to have his own revival by TWEWY's own terms and merits.

There are probably things I missed, but it's time I head to bed. Just wanted to get this to you guys since I promised it a couple days ago.
Excellent points Genobro. In addition to this, let us not forget that,
  • Cloud's inclusion back in Super Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS blew people away by shunning the mentality that "characters that haven't appeared on Nintendo systems can not join the roster". This was a BIG deal considering the game Cloud originated from; Final Fantasy VII which around the end of the SNES's cycle and the beginning of the next generation of consoles, was the period of Nintendo and SquareSoft's fallout. With Cloud being included in Smash, albeit Square Enix had already worked with Nintendo in previous years, THIS moment signaled the beginning to a true return to "form" (or more precisely, partnership like the one they had back in the day).
  • According to statements by Sakurai, Super Smash Bros. Ultimate was the final mission the late CEO of Nintendo, Mr. Satoru Iwata gave to Sakurai. Mr. Iwata had been like a mentor to Sakurai for years, and both got along extremely well. Like Sakurai, Mr. Iwata was also a man knowledgeable of video games and their historic value (contribution wise). Being this the "final" mission before his passing, Sakurai went all in into making it so.
  • Besides Super Smash Bros. Ultimate being Mr. Iwata's final mission entrusted to Sakurai, another task that had been requested was getting representation from the Dragon Quest series. Many fans from the west may not have perceived Hero's inclusion to Ultimate as that much of a big deal, passing him off as "just another swordfighter", or Robin, but in Japan... ohhh baby was it a BIG deal. Won't go into giving a sermon about it but the Dragon Quest franchise was one of the earliest (if not THE grand daddy) of JRPGs ever around the NES era, and after it many more JRPGs came along. Imo, Dragon Quest got a much better representation in Ultimate than even Cloud, but like ForsakenM ForsakenM mentioned earlier, it was most likely due to the negotiation with various parties aside from Square Enix.
  • Last but certainly not the least, around the NES and SNES era, it is true that RPG games existed, but they had been having a hard time popularizing themselves over in the west. Games from the genre either seemed to complex, or non-appealing to the audience at the time. On the other hand the Super Mario Bros. franchise was booming; kids loved it! Thus SquareSoft came to a realization and pitched Nintendo the idea for an RPG game based around the Super Mario Bros. franchise. It was then that Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars was created, and with its released it drew the attention of many western Nintendo, Super Mario fans to a genre many had dismissed up until that moment; RPGs. This game has been contributed as well to having helped popularize the RPG genre in the west. This fact alone is a HUGE deal as today, the US market is the biggest one in terms of video game unit sales for any video game Company (be it first party or third). Had it not been for this collaboration, it may have been possible that RPG games may have taken a bit longer to settle into the western market, thus potentially changing the entire RPG genre spectrum we have today.
 

*Verrix*

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Clamping down on all the mini leaks has really hurt speculation. Now it just feels like there is not a whole lot to talk about in between character releases that hasn't already been brought up in the past 2 years.
 

Vector Victor

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They said at the beginning it is the last Partner Showcase of the year!
Why do I fear that Nintendo will spend the next two months in complete silence, leaving people with zero confidence in their 2021 plans?


Oh right, because that's what they did this year.

Expect people to spend each week in November and December going 'Surely THIS is the week where Nintendo tells us news!'
 

Peepo T. Skeleton

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If this is the very last Partners Showcase, then that either means we're getting random Twitter drops for the rest of the year, or this is it and nothing is getting announced until 2021. I guess there's the possibility of a full Direct but Nintendo seems happy with the Twitter approach.
 

skydogc

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Why do I fear that Nintendo will spend the next two months in complete silence, leaving people with zero confidence in their 2021 plans?


Oh right, because that's what they did this year.

Expect people to spend each week in November and December going 'Surely THIS is the week where Nintendo tells us news!'
I mean, optimistically, that could mean they have a true full Direct for later on.
But honestly, who knows? 2020 gonna 2020.
I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get some more kind of news, but honestly I'm not thrown off if there's nothing till January (which isn't fun).
 

Kremling Kommander

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So...a Partner Showcase happened. It wasn’t exceptionally good, but still far better than the first two we had imo.
My thoughts:
-Not into BD2 and it’s unfortunate it got delayed, but at least the devs can polish it up and take their time
-Didn’t care for the other games after this
-No More Heroes 1 & 2 coming to Switch is really nice, because I wanted to get into the series for a while now
-Age of Calamity looks as exciting as ever, especially with the fact that DIVINE BEASTS are playable?! Also demo!

With that said...am I hearing this right? This is the last Partner Showcase of the year? Are we actually getting at least one more first party showcase before the year ends?!
 

SonicSmasher1

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So...a Partner Showcase happened. It wasn’t exceptionally good, but still far better than the first two we had imo.
My thoughts:
-Not into BD2 and it’s unfortunate it got delayed, but at least the devs can polish it up and take their time
-Didn’t care for the other games after this
-No More Heroes 1 & 2 coming to Switch is really nice, because I wanted to get into the series for a while now
-Age of Calamity looks as exciting as ever, especially with the fact that DIVINE BEASTS are playable?! Also demo!

With that said...am I hearing this right? This is the last Partner Showcase of the year? Are we actually getting at least one more first party showcase before the year ends?!
I do hope so, we could useone.
 

GenoDoge

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Here! I think...
Here's my thoughts on the Partner Showcase:

-Not really into Bravely Default. Kinda suspected that it would be delayed though.
-The new Story of Season game looks decent, gives me Starder Valley vibes.
-That Surviving the Aftermath isn't too exciting. Not enough footage for a solid opinion.
-Immortals Fenyx Rising looks awesome, gives me BoTW vibes. We already knew about it though.
-Nothing too exciting in the little showreel.
-Was that Hitman III? Not really my type of game.
-Control looks like it could be decent. Pretty nice graphically.
-Not really into No More Heroes. The NMH1 and NMH2 ports had been rumored.
-Part Time UFO is back! I've heard of it before, looks neat and cute. Might pick it up if the price is right. This also means HAL Laboratory is considered a partner, which means a new Kirby COULD be revealed in one of these...if it wasn't the last one of the year.
-Hyrule Warriors: Age of Calamity! Can't wait for this! Definitely going to play the demo to help the wait. Will be neat to actually control the Divine Beasts!

So, overall nothing too exciting for me, but happy for the fans of these games!
 

GenoDoge

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Here! I think...
This being the last Partner Showcase of the year does seem to be lining up with what Fatmanonice Fatmanonice had mentioned previously of November potentially being an eventful month (leaving the possibility open for a General Direct like the ones from past Novembers).
I hope we get a General Direct. I hope Nintendo doesn't leave us in the dark until January or even all the way to March.
 

MattX20

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This being the last Partner Showcase of the year does seem to be lining up with what Fatmanonice Fatmanonice had mentioned previously of November potentially being an eventful month (leaving the possibility open for a General Direct like the ones from past Novembers).
That, and the current Smash Bros Challenge Cup ends on the 1st day of November, so if the pattern of reveals for Smash characters occurring after a tournament like this concludes, we could see a reveal for FP8 within 2 weeks
 

GenoDoge

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Here! I think...
That, and the current Smash Bros Challenge Cup ends on the 1st day of November, so if the pattern of reveals for Smash characters occurring after a tournament like this concludes, we could see a reveal for FP8 within 2 weeks
If we get Geno and a General Direct in the next two weeks I'll probably overload from hype. Anyway, Nintendo is getting a pretty strong line-up of games for 2021.
 

Enigma735

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So, I just skimmed through this Partner's Showcase and honestly it seemed like it was pretty decent. We got Bravely Default II and No More Heroes III information as well as the announcement for the Demo for Age Of Calamity so that's pretty cool. I'm glad they ended this Partner's Showcase on a high note.
 
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YsDisciple

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Past November Directs.
  • 2018 = Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Direct 11.1.18
  • 2015 = Nintendo Direct 11.12.15 (Cloud was revealed for Smash 4)
  • 2014 = Nintendo Direct 11.5.14 (Majora's Mask for the 3DS opens up the Direct; F-Zero inspired track added to Mario Kart 8 as well as Link as a playable racer and personal bike + wheels and glider; Duck Hunt revealed as a fighter for Smash 4)
So, curious little detail; this year would make five years since Cloud got into Smash. :denzel: the gears begin to turn
 

RetrogamerMax

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I feel like Nintendo is going to leave us in the dark until January or February. I'm pretty sure we won't see FP8 or hear of any major Nintendo news until close to Spring time. Life sucks half of the time.
 

MattX20

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I feel like Nintendo is going to leave us in the dark until January or February. I'm pretty sure we won't see FP8 or hear of any major Nintendo news until close to Spring time. Life sucks half of the time.
I wouldn't say that until both November and December have come and gone as far as DLC is concerned. Remember, DLC doesn't take nearly as much work to do as a full blown game so announcing FP8 and potentially a release isn't out of the cards just yet
 

RetrogamerMax

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I wouldn't say that until both November and December have come and gone as far as DLC is concerned. Remember, DLC doesn't take nearly as much work to do as a full blown game so announcing FP8 and potentially a release isn't out of the cards just yet
Well, Nintendo likes to keep Smash reveals at a 3 to 6 month gap from each other so I wouldn't bet on seeing FP8 until 2021.
 
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