Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Dukefire]

The only mistake with Ultimate's DLC records was for Terry's arrival as Challenger 4

 

[Terry Badguy]

The only mistake with Ultimate's DLC records was for Terry's arrival as Challenger 4

How so?

 

[JarBear]

The only mistake with Ultimate's DLC records was for Terry's arrival as Challenger 4

That’s a funny way of spelling Byleth and 5.

 

[Vector Victor]

The REAL mistake for the DLC is Banjo-Kazooie as the 3rd pass character.





As they should have been in Smash YEARS ago.





Same mistake that Geno will have as the 2nd character of pass 2.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Frankly, I'm not seeing any DLC mistakes here. They got more than one fan favorite, a unique pass opener, a very unique mook character, a unique Fire Emblem character showing off ala the weapons.

None I would call a "mistake".

 

[Megadoomer]

The only mistake with Ultimate's DLC records was for Terry's arrival as Challenger 4

If you're referring to how Nintendo of Europe accidentally leaked the copyright information (possibly - it's odd that it only listed SNK, as opposed to having every company involved in Smash plus SNK), Hero and Banjo were also leaked before launch (Hero's codename being found through datamining and quickly figured out; shinobi from ResetEra leaking Banjo in Smash).

Still, about half of the DLC came out of nowhere (Joker, Byleth, Piranha Plant), so it's got a better track record than the base game. (where 4 or 5 of the 6 unique newcomers and some clones were leaked in advance)

Or did you mean something else? (if you mean that Terry's inclusion was a mistake, I'm going to have to disagree with you there, and suggest that you look into some of the King of Fighters or Fatal Fury games that were mentioned in Sakurai's presentation on Terry)

 

[Polarthief]

Frankly, I'm not seeing any DLC mistakes here. They got more than one fan favorite, a unique pass opener, a very unique mook character, a unique Fire Emblem character showing off ala the weapons.

None I would call a "mistake".

Byleth as a paid part of FP1 was a mistake. Being a separate DLC character (or even a bonus) would have been received better IMO. You see the first 3 as very strong so you buy FP1, and then you get handed another FE in part of the pass. It feels like a very bitter end to FP1.

Corrin was bad, but you didn't "pre-purchase" Corrin as part of a pass.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Byleth as a paid part of FP1 was a mistake. Being a separate DLC character (or even a bonus) would have been received better IMO. You see the first 3 as very strong so you buy FP1, and then you get handed another FE in part of the pass. It feels like a very bitter end to FP1.

Corrin was bad, but you didn't "pre-purchase" Corrin as part of a pass.

It was then or nothing anyway. Reality is the character came out just in time for Challenger Pack 5. They didn't exactly have a lot of time to magically make a 7th DLC character at that point. Take a look at how long ARMS is taking to come out. A massively long time. And there's not really an indication that it's COVID related, which has shown at best to slightly slow down development, but not heavily affect it.

It's a pretty normal finishing character as is. Every game has generally finished promoting with an "eh" character as is. Incineroar, Olimar, Duck Hunt, Mr. Game & Watch, Ness, etc. These weren't attention grabbers and the fire cat is the only one that was slightly popular alone, but still got a lot of crap for not being Decidueye. You pre-purchased the pass despite not knowing the full contents. Anybody disappointed in it while refusing to wait for all of them is definitely on them. Nintendo not announcing them all can happen for many reasons. That can actually be part of an NDA they signed. Since a lot of characters are specifically announced around when a game releases, announcing them too early completely dismantles the necessary advertising effect to help other companies. It's unfortunate that the model is this way, but that's because DLC in Ultimate has a promotional effect that 4's didn't overall(4 had pretty much Corrin, and the timing of Cloud and Ryu were around when there latest games were announced as well, though Cloud was somewhat later, but not much).

Byleth wasn't a mistake. If anything, it came out possibly too late to properly advertise the base game. Corrin was done way worse at that point. They were only known to about 1/3 or so of the world, being the Japanese regions. Byleth was known worldwide and far easier to sell. Three Houses did amazingly well(way better than Fates too) and wasn't nearly as controversial. If it was a bonus character, it'd be way too late to actually even sell the DLC.

The timing was as best as it could be. It had to be part of Fighter's Pass 1 to begin with to work out.

 

[Qeomash]

Hackers don't count for an NDA factor. They didn't sign anything.

...

There's no content for an NDA issue when the company itself is not at fault. If it was an employee, you'd be right. But since it was an unrelated hacker, they aren't breaking an NDA. They're stealing Nintendo's property.

Right, probably not specifically an NDA, but same sort of thing. I was meaning more in general legal culpability. If the vendor was hired to protect the information, and they signed a contract stating that sort of thing (which they would have when Nintendo signed up for their service), Nintendo could now sue for breach of contract and damages because it was the host's fault they didn't secure it properly and allowed the hackers to get in.

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

I agree that Byleth makes more sense as a bonus character since he could not make base game. I guess Moptimus probably has a good point about them not really being able to adjust the order to accommodate for a bonus character though especially considering how long the development for the ARMS character has dragged on. As much as I rag on Byleth and think they could have a much more imaginative gimmick and generally FP5 could have been a much better character choice, I do have to admit that I find them really really fun and different to play now that I've played them more and honestly that's one of the most important things at the end of the day. Now if only they could take the fun to play aspect, combine it with a moveset that pays homage to it's character and characters home series, and then do that for characters I actually care about like Geno, Rayman, Crash, etc then I'd love the fighters pass. I will admit that I enjoyed the fighters pass and playing as the characters even though I don't personally really care for the characters in it. Terry is the only character I just cannot play for the life of me, but I absolutely respect his inclusion and honestly he deserves the slot a lot more than many other characters. I hope FP2 isn't an exact repeat in the sense that I don't care for the characters but I'm sure all the characters will still be loads of fun regardless.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Correct, not specifically NDA, I was meaning more in general legal culpability. If the vendor was hired to protect the information, and they signed a contract stating that sort of thing (which they would have when Nintendo signed up for their service), Nintendo could now sue for breach of contract and damages because it was the host's fault they didn't secure it properly and allowed the hackers to get in.

Which sounds to me taking an unnecessary stance on the issue. There's no reason to remotely sue the company besides making extra cash. Unless it's literally in the NDA that if they're hacked, they're in massive legal trouble. There's also nothing indicating Nintendo took legal action against them either. Which makes sense. It serves zero purpose and they can accomplish more by talking to them about strengthening their security. As well as a new NDA or removing the content if they don't believe the company can keep it secure. Of course, if they have to sue due to copyright issues, that's a different story and Nintendo is basically unable to do much else. My guess is that it's not an issue either and suing is an option instead of a requirement.

They already took down the hacker, who was given a warning the first time around(how lucky they weren't actually arrested the first time) but still went and did it again. It feels to me that they already made a very strong message. So legal action wouldn't do anything anymore. I get what you mean by legally culpable too, of course. That's true. I more meant that their actions in this situation, which is to target solely the hacker, doesn't really have an NDA factor. Of course, they absolutely could sue the company for their bad security and it'd be fine. I don't know if they have to even sue them either.

They were hacked. Now if it was an employee, that's a different issue. That's a breach of their contract.

 

[maf91186]

Byleth as a paid part of FP1 was a mistake. Being a separate DLC character (or even a bonus) would have been received better IMO. You see the first 3 as very strong so you buy FP1, and then you get handed another FE in part of the pass. It feels like a very bitter end to FP1.

Corrin was bad, but you didn't "pre-purchase" Corrin as part of a pass.

If anyone really wants to avoid any and all possible disappointment, all they have to do is buy each fighter individually. What's a couple of "extra" dollars to ensure satisfaction?

 

[Enigma735]

Man I just heard about this source code leak and this sounds pretty crazy. Usually I am the type of person that doesn't like leaks or want leaks to pop up since they can ruin surprises, and even though it is probably unlikely, I REALLY want to see leaks of unreleased games and never before seen prototypes. I would love to see the beta versions of Mario 64 in HD and maybe even EarthBound 64 if people can find it.

On the topic of Smash however, I personally don't think this leak will effect anything with Smash, thankfully, although at the bare minimum, I could see another datamine leak similarly to the Hero datamine in February last year where we get codenames for at least the next two characters and this ARMS rep, but probably nothing more then that.

 

[axel_]

The only mistake with Ultimate's DLC records was for Terry's arrival as Challenger 4

Nice try, Billy. I know this is your alt account.

 

[Dukefire]

Really though, nintendo's accident on the SNK info was the bomb that ruined the surprise for Challenger 4.

Hopefully that is the only accident that will happen when preparing for the next challenger's arrival.

 

[axel_]

Really though, nintendo's accident on the SNK info was the bomb that ruined the surprise for Challenger 4.
View attachment 270990

Hopefully that is the only accident that will happen when preparing for the next challenger's arrival.

I do think my personal reaction to Terry would've been even more of an explosion if it didn't get spoiled by the leak.
Part of me is almost willing to believe it was a conspiracy. A move intentionally done by Nintendo so that the little babby Smash fans can take a few days for Terry, KOF, and the history of SNK to grow on them.

 

[HudU]

Yeah I don't either. Even if there's not a trailer, there's no way we're gonna go half a year with one reveal.



Of SwSh? Who would have guessed it would be a 3DS game originally? *totally and most definitely shocked face (/s)*

Unless you meant Gen 6/7, but I'm still convinced of the above, haha.

I wish, it was Gen 7/6 sorry to be a bit off topic. Though someone did get a partially complete SDK from the switch that leaked. And a bunch of other stuff.

That is an interesting thought though. SwSh or other Gen 8 games being originally made for the 3ds.

 

[Enigma735]

Really though, nintendo's accident on the SNK info was the bomb that ruined the surprise for Challenger 4.
View attachment 270990

Hopefully that is the only accident that will happen when preparing for the next challenger's arrival.

It sucks because Terry was so close to getting included without getting leaked. Also, Imagine if that SNK leak didn't exist. I honestly wonder what people's reactions would have been like. So much people didn't even know who Terry was, let alone SNK as a whole.

 

[Phoenix Douchebag]

Really though, nintendo's accident on the SNK info was the bomb that ruined the surprise for Challenger 4.
View attachment 270990

Hopefully that is the only accident that will happen when preparing for the next challenger's arrival.

I was low-key upset that Kyo Kusanagi got Chrom'd during Terry's reveal.

On the other hand, now Kyo knows how it feels to be the US Sports Team all the time.

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

Man I just heard about this source code leak and this sounds pretty crazy. Usually I am the type of person that doesn't like leaks or want leaks to pop up since they can ruin surprises, and even though it is probably unlikely, I REALLY want to see leaks of unreleased games and never before seen prototypes. I would love to see the beta versions of Mario 64 in HD and maybe even EarthBound 64 if people can find it.

On the topic of Smash however, I personally don't think this leak will effect anything with Smash, thankfully, although at the bare minimum, I could see another datamine leak similarly to the Hero datamine in February last year where we get codenames for at least the next two characters and this ARMS rep, but probably nothing more then that.

I totally mirror the sentiment that I don't normally like hacks, but this has been really enjoyable for me to see more beta stuff. I really love looking at stuff like Pokemon that never made the cut or got reworked and similarly the evolution of games and what content gets cut. Honestly, Nintendo kind of did this to themselves since most of the stuff that's gotten out could have just been released by Nintendo since it wouldn't really hurt them other than big stuff that will really aid ROMs/emulators which that aspect still bothers me because my opinion is that if you enjoy something that someone makes then you either need to be willing to pay what that person is asking for it or you need to decide that it's not worth your money and not buy it (I make exceptions for things like Retron gaming systems since those older systems are not actually sold by the people who make them any more).

It would be really cool to see some unused stuff for SMRPG or stuff about Melee we never knew about. It is a shame we have to find this stuff out through unsavory means. At any rate, I don't think we will see much that will impact anything recent except for an uptick in emulation.

 

[Loliko YnT]

I don't know if SMRPG stuff could leak , considering SE made the game and probably still own the code to it.

But hey , maybe it could happen. And we could get a super cool looking early design for Geno

 

[Firox]

I hope the ARMs rep's codename is "legs".

Hackers: "Ok, let's see here.....the next DLC character codename is......'NotRibbonGirl'. Gosh dang it, Sakurai! Why must you taunt us with such cryptic names!?"

 

[Loliko YnT]

Inb4 the codename for Geno is just "Mallow".

 

[Nicnac]

If you told me that Fighter 4's codename was "Dolly", had a level of importance to Sakurai that he'd mentioned them before, and was associated with a big star, there's no way I wouldn't have thought Geno. Good thing Terry's codename didn't leak like Hero's did.

 

[cmbsfm]

If you told me that Fighter 4's codename was "Dolly", had a level of importance to Sakurai that he'd mentioned them before, and was associated with a big star, there's no way I wouldn't have thought Geno. Good thing Terry's codename didn't leak like Hero's did.

Yeah that would’ve been a huge ****show if it happened. Especially the aftermath of the reveal. Gonna be honest, some of the fanbase would’ve gotten cocky and adamant that Dolly was Geno, and as a result the whole fanbase would be ridiculed after the reveal. Glad the code name didn’t leak.

 

[Let Geno Smash]

If you told me that Fighter 4's codename was "Dolly", had a level of importance to Sakurai that he'd mentioned them before, and was associated with a big star, there's no way I wouldn't have thought Geno. Good thing Terry's codename didn't leak like Hero's did.

I'm glad Byleth's was not leaked, since the codename is Master, can you imagine? People would have believed it would be master chief

 

[Vector Victor]

I'm glad Byleth's was not leaked, since the codename is Master, can you imagine? People would have believed it would be master chief

Two commonly requested characters with Geno and Master Chief and Nintendo gives codenames Dolly and Master to two characters whose connection to the names makes little sense.

You think Nintendo did that intentionally after the whole Brave debacle?

What's ARMS codename, 'leaf?'

Nintendo: 'Because trees have branches which are like the arms on people, and at the end of the branch is a leaf and ARMs have fists at the end of their arms so its a perfectly logical naming connection shut up.'

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Two commonly requested characters with Geno and Master Chief and Nintendo gives codenames Dolly and Master to two characters whose connection to the names makes little sense.

You think Nintendo did that intentionally after the whole Brave debacle?

What's ARMS codename, 'leaf?'

Nintendo: 'Because trees have branches which are like the arms on people, and at the end of the branch is a leaf and ARMs have fists at the end of their arms so its a perfectly logical naming connection shut up.'

Master and Dolly made sense to me knowing the context of the two characters lol

 

[Lyncario]

Two commonly requested characters with Geno and Master Chief and Nintendo gives codenames Dolly and Master to two characters whose connection to the names makes little sense.

You think Nintendo did that intentionally after the whole Brave debacle?

What's ARMS codename, 'leaf?'

Nintendo: 'Because trees have branches which are like the arms on people, and at the end of the branch is a leaf and ARMs have fists at the end of their arms so its a perfectly logical naming connection shut up.'

In Japanese, the last name is before the first name, so Terry Bogard is Bogard Terry, and it's pronounced Borgado Telly, take the 2 last syllables of each, Dolly.

Master in Japanese is Sensei, which also mean proffesor. And yeah, Byleth is exactly that. It's the exact same thing as Brave being Yushaa in Japanese, which also means Hero.

 

[StarLight42]

Some potential codenames I could see for Geno:

Puppet (too obvious)
Star (too obvious)
Warrior
Blue
Starstruck
Outlander
Possessed
Caped
Beamer
Flasher
Whirler
Spirit
Saviour
Mystic
Mage
Magician
Protector
Authority
Superstar
Symbols

 

[Firox]

Some potential codenames I could see for Geno:

Puppet (too obvious)
Star (too obvious)
Warrior
Blue
Starstruck
Outlander
Possessed
Caped
Beamer
Flasher
Whirler
Spirit
Saviour
Mystic
Mage
Magician
Protector
Authority
Superstar
Symbols

LOL "Flasher". He'd end up showing us a little more wood than we bargained for.

 

[Kremling Kommander]

So we’re likely due for another spirit event announcement tonight. I’m placing my bets on either Luigi’s Mansion 3 since the latest DLC update came out, or Undertale since Cuphead had a spirit event but Undertale hasn’t yet. But it could also be from an unrepresented franchise, so who knows.

 

[MisterMike]

So we’re likely due for another spirit event announcement tonight. I’m placing my bets on either Luigi’s Mansion 3 since the latest DLC update came out, or Undertale since Cuphead had a spirit event but Undertale hasn’t yet. But it could also be from an unrepresented franchise, so who knows.

Speaking of Undertale Spirits, I think it'd be really funny if Sans' Spirit was just be a piece of paper with the word "sans" on it in Comic Sans. Like, he's too lazy to appear as a Spirit so he just sent 'em that.

 

[SSGuy]

Some potential codenames I could see for Geno:

Puppet (too obvious)
Star (too obvious)
Warrior
Blue
Starstruck
Outlander
Possessed
Caped
Beamer
Flasher
Whirler
Spirit
Saviour
Mystic
Mage
Magician
Protector
Authority
Superstar
Symbols

Wood

 

[GodzillaGuy64]

So we’re likely due for another spirit event announcement tonight. I’m placing my bets on either Luigi’s Mansion 3 since the latest DLC update came out, or Undertale since Cuphead had a spirit event but Undertale hasn’t yet. But it could also be from an unrepresented franchise, so who knows.

Yeah, I'm placing my bets on LM3 or some unrelated spirit event with no new spirits.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

In Japanese, the last name is before the first name, so Terry Bogard is Bogard Terry, and it's pronounced Borgado Telly, take the 2 last syllables of each, Dolly.

Master in Japanese is Sensei, which also mean proffesor. And yeah, Byleth is exactly that. It's the exact same thing as Brave being Yushaa in Japanese, which also means Hero.

The word Dolly can also refer to the dolly car of a train. Terry’s home stage in Fatal Fury games is such a dolly car, it’s even the background for his Spirit Board

cause remember also, Banjo’s codename was Buddy, a whole ass English word with no Japanese equivalent that has the same informality

 

[Powerman293]

Yeah, I'm placing my bets on LM3 or some unrelated spirit event with no new spirits.

What time are they usually announced at?

 

[Garteam]

I have a bad feeling about tonight's spirit event. Not sure why, but I'm expecting a Resident Evil/Astral Chain style deconfirmation. Not sure who, just kinda anticipating it.

"Here's spirits of Lloyd Irving, Heihachi, Crash Bandicoot, Sora, 2B, and Master Chief. Also, another spirit for Geno."

 

[Powerman293]

I have a bad feeling about tonight's spirit event. Not sure why, but I'm expecting a Resident Evil/Astral Chain style deconfirmation. Not sure who, just kinda anticipating it.

"Here's spirits of Lloyd Irving, Heihachi, Crash Bandicoot, Sora, 2B, and Master Chief. Also, another spirit for Geno."

God, I can't imagine the possibility of a SMRPG spirit event.

 

[Garteam]

God, I can't imagine the possibility of a SMRPG spirit event.

No matter what happens with Geno, there's going to be a ton of people ecstatically happy and just as many who are furious.

I'm kinda hoping that'll be a band-aid that's ripped off quick.