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General Ness discussion
- Thread starter thesage
- Start date
Sinji
Smash Master
how do u counter falco's ledgehop?
thesage
Smash Hero
I mean I can do it when I practice, I just forget i have that option... I suck, you all know that.
I do like dem djc bairs oos though.
I do like dem djc bairs oos though.
otg
Smash Master
As in, he's on the ledge and then comes up with an aerial or double lasers or something?
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
I shield and WD out of shield using the same trigger.These.
and WOWWWWW Sage you gotta be ****ing KIDDING me...you can't WD oos? The way I learned it before I knew much about the game was by holding one of the shield buttons down while wavedashing using the other shield button. That should get you started
toasty
Smash Hero
Good for you, Ruse.
I's just easier to learn using both triggers then when you're more comfortable with the timing, you can move onto using one trigger
Sage, how do you manage to suck at being self-deprecating?
See you in a couple weeks homie =D
I's just easier to learn using both triggers then when you're more comfortable with the timing, you can move onto using one trigger
Sage, how do you manage to suck at being self-deprecating?
See you in a couple weeks homie =D
thesage
Smash Hero
I am horrible at everything. That's how.
My most memorable achievement in smash is 3 stocking doll's peach twice in a row. He now ***** my Ness everytime. =(
My most memorable achievement in smash is 3 stocking doll's peach twice in a row. He now ***** my Ness everytime. =(
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Remember when you killed my Popo with PK Flash, Sage?
Actually, I'm not sure if you did. But I remember you tried.
Actually, I'm not sure if you did. But I remember you tried.
thesage
Smash Hero
I don't really remember much from that day. I was starving.
I kill ic's all the time with pk flash... it sopo recovery.
It also ***** dk and bowser
I kill ic's all the time with pk flash... it sopo recovery.
It also ***** dk and bowser
Sinji
Smash Master
otg
Smash Master
What's the problem exactly?
Sinji
Smash Master
otg
Smash Master
I would try Nair OOS in between the lasers, or fair.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
I think Ness's dash attack goes under high lasers.
Aerial out of shield sucks for getting around laser pressure, since Ness lacks range (although fair is good at certain distances). Wavedash out of shield is pretty reliable though.
Aerial out of shield sucks for getting around laser pressure, since Ness lacks range (although fair is good at certain distances). Wavedash out of shield is pretty reliable though.
otg
Smash Master
If you are below falco and in your shield as Falco comes down with the second laser you can beat it with Nair oos, move has insane priority.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Well, it's faster than fair, but less disjointed. So they each have their benefits.
Sinji
Smash Master
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Actually whenever Falco is forced to up-b from below the stage, it's pretty safe to just go out there and bair/nair him.
otg givin that ness advice
otg
Smash Master
Son PC/otg Double ness in teams? *****s dont know.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
That sounds powerful.
thesage
Smash Hero
Double Ness is so fun lol. I love that team. Anybody want to try it at Pound 5 lol.
Yea nair is ****. It trades with everything that's not disjointed like Falco's dair and Dk's bair. It comes out in 5 frames and is Ness' fastest aerial.
Yea nair is ****. It trades with everything that's not disjointed like Falco's dair and Dk's bair. It comes out in 5 frames and is Ness' fastest aerial.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Remember when we did double Ness teams, Sage? That was fun. Lol.
thesage
Smash Hero
I've done double Ness with Chu, toasty, Jmoan, KirbyKaze, and maybe Mow....
I still suck though.
I still suck though.
toasty
Smash Hero
I love double Ness teams...XIF and I did that for a tourney and actually did better than when we switched to Marth/Peach
Yedi will you be at Pound? I'd love to do some double Ness stuff =D
Yedi will you be at Pound? I'd love to do some double Ness stuff =D
Sinji
Smash Master
Whats a good follow up after uair?
ViceGrip
Smash Journeyman
Hey guys, i've dropped brawl ness for melee ness. Having a lot of fun re-learning melee with Ness and brawl has lost its competitive charm for me. How active are melee ness mains? Hoping to improve a lot in a short while.
thesage
Smash Hero
er well... I don't think there's anybody who mains Ness outside of mofo...
I main Peach lol. Ness is my secondary, though I don't think I'd ever go Ness in tournament...
I main Peach lol. Ness is my secondary, though I don't think I'd ever go Ness in tournament...
ViceGrip
Smash Journeyman
aw : (. He seems somewhat viable when I see mofo play. Peach used to be my main as well. Getting used to melee physics now/ learning L cancel and wavedash. My question is how important is it for Ness to L cancel and which ariels are the most important to cancel. Like, if i don't L cancel a fair will I be unable to follow it up with a grab (assuming it connects). In that situation I am also unsure if Ness's dash speed is quick enough to follow up with a grab...he may need to wave dash. I can't tell, but I see mofo do it but i'm not sure exactly how he gets his combos off.
thesage
Smash Hero
You need to l-cancel to combo with any of Ness' aerial except dair which you can auto cancel.
Djc fair -> grab works by djcffling a fair and then dash grabbing. I don't think you have enough time to wd -> grab. It doesn't always work though.
Djc bair -> grab works in a similar way.
You have to l-cancel all aerials with Ness, there's no reason not to.
Djc fair -> grab works by djcffling a fair and then dash grabbing. I don't think you have enough time to wd -> grab. It doesn't always work though.
Djc bair -> grab works in a similar way.
You have to l-cancel all aerials with Ness, there's no reason not to.
otg
Smash Master
Mofo really mains the spacies tho, and I think he isn't really active at all now since that No Johns where he put up a good showing vs. Hax. Ness is Ness, aka he sucks (unless its otg)
ViceGrip
Smash Journeyman
haha thanks guys. Thanks for the info sage, really appreciate it. It's hard for me to tell what's going on in melee sometimes. Like sometimes I can't tell a difference between dash dancing and wavedashing when studying how people move.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Ness has a lot of glaring weaknesses. But he has a huge head, so that makes up for it.
thesage
Smash Hero
That's what she said.
Ness' glaring weaknesses are:
-very bad cc game
-bad recovery
-can be chaingrabbed/combo'd easily
-very situational and specific combo game
-above average shieldstun
-****ty range
Pros:
-Small
-aerial game
-djc
-f-smash in tiny melee
-combos
-***** bowser
All the areas he's "good" in, he's just average to other characters. I.e. movement and range and speed. It really frustrates me that Ness' f-smash has not vertical hitbox.
Ness' glaring weaknesses are:
-very bad cc game
-bad recovery
-can be chaingrabbed/combo'd easily
-very situational and specific combo game
-above average shieldstun
-****ty range
Pros:
-Small
-aerial game
-djc
-f-smash in tiny melee
-combos
-***** bowser
All the areas he's "good" in, he's just average to other characters. I.e. movement and range and speed. It really frustrates me that Ness' f-smash has not vertical hitbox.
ViceGrip
Smash Journeyman
fsmash in tiny melee is pretty cool. yay for destructive huge head!
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Don't forget how easy it is to platform camp him :D
Above average shield stun? Don't be silly, that's the same for everyone.
Above average shield stun? Don't be silly, that's the same for everyone.
thesage
Smash Hero
Doll told me otherwise. **** if I know.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Peach Fair has the same amount of shield stun on Ness's shield as it does on Peach's shield.
You could note that Ness's oos game is crippled by his inherent range / speed issues, which would be true, and therefore his shield game is naturally worse than a lot of characters, but he doesn't take extra shield stun or anything like that.
I think Ness's good traits are basically that he has some potential for ground speed, speed on low platforms, some good combo / tech chase potential, a bit of range on some of his decent moves, and decent KB on a few others.
But his lack of approach, lack of range on the vast majority of his moves, awful recovery, and the somewhat situational nature of his combo game makes him so easily shut down by characters with decent punishment on him and some reasonably good camping tools.
You could note that Ness's oos game is crippled by his inherent range / speed issues, which would be true, and therefore his shield game is naturally worse than a lot of characters, but he doesn't take extra shield stun or anything like that.
I think Ness's good traits are basically that he has some potential for ground speed, speed on low platforms, some good combo / tech chase potential, a bit of range on some of his decent moves, and decent KB on a few others.
But his lack of approach, lack of range on the vast majority of his moves, awful recovery, and the somewhat situational nature of his combo game makes him so easily shut down by characters with decent punishment on him and some reasonably good camping tools.
lol nah toasty, not goin to pound V unfortunately
moves have different shield stun, not characters lol
moves have different shield stun, not characters lol
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Yoshi's shield blows.