General ICs Q&A Thread

[rchau]

quoted because you obviously didn't read it the first time he answered you

i did read it, so stfu.


just skeptical. I've never seen it used in a match before. Even Chibi says not to use it but in friendlies cuz its so hard to do.

 

[J4pu]

alright then, have fun asking questions then being "skeptical" of the answers experienced people give you. No, really, it's a great way to learn and an even greater attitude to have when you're the one asking for help.

 

[Anonymous Brawler]

What chaingrab do you guys recommend me to learn?
And is there any setup for the ice block lock, other than the nana fair spike?
Cause falco can use his ftilt to do the laserlalock in certain percents

 

[EverAlert]

Learn FThrow-FThrow first, it is absolutely essential. If you can master it then you can CG any character, unlike other throws.

You can hobble (throw -> footstool) to setup a lock. Anyway I recommend learning something else, Ice Locking isn't really that useful. Unless you're bored, lol.

just skeptical. I've never seen it used in a match before. Even Chibi says not to use it but in friendlies cuz its so hard to do.

Ugh. It's one of the oldest tricks in the Brawl ICs book, get over it. You probably see it all the time and assume that they're just chaingrabbing fast, it's not like the game flashes with huge red letters "BUFFERED CHAINGRAB" whenever someone does it. And any ICs player who is reluctant to learn something because it's "too hard" should just choose another character. >.>

hitting them during grab doesn't take away the "amount of frames" they need to deduct in order to break out so much as it gives them more time to accumulate said amount of frames. The "amount of frames" somebody needs to accumulate to break out depends on your percent, so nobody is going to be able to answer your question as it currently is.

I'm not quoting this to argue, you are completely correct. Actually, this actually makes me curious about something. As we know, the amount of frames one needs to deduct to break out of a grab is: 90+(1.7*dmg). Let's say I grab someone at 50%. They have to pay a toll of 175 frames in order to escape. But let's say I FSmash during the grab, adding 14.7% (FSmash+Pummel, both unstaled). For the purposes of the example, we'll round this up to 15%, potentially an additional 25.5-frame toll. What I'm curious about is this: does that extra 25.5 frames get added to the toll, or is it discarded for this hold?

Obviously it's inconsequential in terms of breaking out, there would still be no point adding damage during a hold. Even so, I'm kinda curious, if only for the sake of having a better understanding of Brawl's mechanics.

 

[rchau]

I'm not quoting this to argue, you are completely correct. Actually, this actually makes me curious about something. As we know, the amount of frames one needs to deduct to break out of a grab is: 90+(1.7*dmg). Let's say I grab someone at 50%. They have to pay a toll of 175 frames in order to escape. But let's say I FSmash during the grab, adding 14.7% (FSmash+Pummel, both unstaled). For the purposes of the example, we'll round this up to 15%, potentially an additional 25.5-frame toll. What I'm curious about is this: does that extra 25.5 frames get added to the toll, or is it discarded for this hold?

This was more or less what I was trying to ask =\

 

[Hylian]

i did read it, so stfu.


just skeptical. I've never seen it used in a match before. Even Chibi says not to use it but in friendlies cuz its so hard to do.

I use buffered throws in all my matches, every IC should. It doesn't let them mash out at low %'s. You can buffer downthrow to backthrow fairly easy, just practice on a platform. If you're not buffering the dthrow then nana will fall through the platform. At low %'s you should do buffered downthrows to fthrow or more dthrows on characters so they can't escape until you have time to bthrow them.

 

[J4pu]

Learn FThrow-FThrow first, it is absolutely essential. If you can master it then you can CG any character, unlike other throws.

But Fthrow>fthrow is so hard and takes forever due to move decay
I can't do it :/

And any ICs player who is reluctant to learn something because it's "too hard" should just choose another character. >.>

*slaps self

Bthrow (popo throw)>fthrow would theoretically be the best CG method since fthrow, the highest damage dealing throw wouldn't get stale and you would be able to do it in place

 

[FrozenHobo]

squall hammer
pivot grounded blizzard
???
profit

try it out.

 

[swordgard]

But Fthrow>fthrow is so hard and takes forever due to move decay
I can't do it :/



*slaps self

Bthrow (popo throw)>fthrow would theoretically be the best CG method since fthrow, the highest damage dealing throw wouldn't get stale and you would be able to do it in place

Depends on which char.

 

[toobusytocare]

i naturally buffer almost everything so buffering the IC CG was no sweat for me to learn.


/flex

 

[Smoom77]

EA, Chibi is talking specifically about buffered f-throws. Not bthrow>buffered f-throw, but ONLY buffered f-throws. You should use buffer the throw after bthrow all the time...

 

[Rubberbandman]

I use buffered throws in all my matches, every IC should. It doesn't let them mash out at low %'s. You can buffer downthrow to backthrow fairly easy, just practice on a platform. If you're not buffering the dthrow then nana will fall through the platform. At low %'s you should do buffered downthrows to fthrow or more dthrows on characters so they can't escape until you have time to bthrow them.

Oh, thats buffered throws? I've been doing those the whole time for the most part, my friend can escape pretty easily, so I had to learn to chain grab faster.

You probably see it all the time and assume that they're just chaingrabbing fast, it's not like the game flashes with huge red letters "BUFFERED CHAINGRAB" whenever someone does it.

Thats sounds hilarious enough to make a sig out of it.

 

[EverAlert]

EA, Chibi is talking specifically about buffered f-throws. Not bthrow>buffered f-throw, but ONLY buffered f-throws. You should use buffer the throw after bthrow all the time...

Ah, fair enough, the fthrow/fthrow one specifically is kinda hard. Well, it doesn't really change what I was saying, but I do feel a bit silly now.

 

[DK SPEED DK]

whats the best way to chain grab heavy characters i know light characters are back and down but what do you do for heavys?

 

[00-Zero]

whats the best way to chain grab heavy characters i know light characters are back and down but what do you do for heavys?

Forward throw>forward throw. It's the easiest and it's the same with each character. Then just hobble them backwards if you can't back throw them to get them headed back towards the middle of the stage with more forward throws.

 

[r3d d09]

sorry about not posting <3 um. for me, on some light weights. to where you have to short step after down throw to grab them. i dash. *just out of practice* but back to forward throw works as well. and please read threads before asking, i have a chaingrab preference for each character in a thread somewhere. just search for it

 

[rchau]

im not sure if there's a formal guide or link to a thread about buffered throws.

Can anyone please explain when exactly I do the inputs for a buffered throw?

 

[J4pu]

(<)10 frames (1/6 of a second) before the previous move ends. I'm pretty sure the first answer you got stated this very clearly.

 

[rchau]

(<)10 frames (1/6 of a second) before the previous move ends. I'm pretty sure the first answer you got stated this very clearly.

Sorry.... what's up your butt?

I was just asking a question, you don't have to be mean.

 

[J4pu]

The first or 2nd post of yours I read here was you being a **** to somebody who was trying to answer your question and give you constructive advice on how to improve, basically I'm just returning the favor.
not to mention you are repeatedly asking questions that had already been answered FOR YOU the first time you asked them. I can understand not wanting to search through the whole thread trying to see if it's already been answered but when you ignore answers that were given to you, it just makes you annoying.

EDIT- I went back to confirm that you were actually being a ****, you didn't quite start things off, but what you did do was disregard information that you were given because "you like doing it your way" or something along those lines which is what got under my skin I guess. Need to be open to change, if you aren't trying to improve, why are you here?

 

[r3d d09]

You need to learn that IC mains are hard balled people. our way or the highway

 

[FrozenHobo]

*sniff*

i'm so proud of all of you...

 

[Anonymous Brawler]

I FINALLY MASTERED MY FIRST CHAINGRAB!!!!
It's a d-throw wobble. Could I always use it or do you recommend me to learn others?

 

[FrozenHobo]

thats not really a chain grab... try bthrow -> fthrow.

 

[r3d d09]

dthrow hobble? wtf? uthrow or bthrow to hobble please.

stand on a platform and do Bthrow to d throw. buffer the d throw so you don't fall through the plat. thanx

 

[00-Zero]

*sniff*

i'm so proud of all of you...

I blame you

 

[Smoom77]

Why would you hobble at all with any throw other than bthrow? I heard uthrow hobble is di able?

 

[r3d d09]

i know but D throw hobble? wtf?

 

[00-Zero]

I throw in a down throw hobble on bowser every now and then for the lulz.

 

[Anonymous Brawler]

I've saw in youtube that it works. It's the only one I can do. (Except for back-forward on bowser only, I miss on other characters)

 

[00-Zero]

The back fobble bobble doesn't work on bowser if I remember correctly. Only down throw hobbling works on him.

 

[Anonymous Brawler]

With back-forward I meant the chaingrab that you use back throw -> regrab -> forward throw -> repeat

 

[theunabletable]

But Fthrow>fthrow is so hard and takes forever due to move decay

I practically only Fthrow CG. Maybe Fthrow>Bthrow if it's a lightweight, but otherwise I just Fthrow across the stage, then pivot Fthrow CG to turn around, then Fthrow back across the stage.

 

[J4pu]

I only know the CG timing of dthrow/bthrow for MK, because well, that's what I picked up IC's for, I've tried fthrow CG'ing MK and I remember failing to regrab more than 90% of the time, so I just stopped and went back to my normal CG.

A repeating CG using the same throw for both Popo and Nana will take a long time regardless of which throw it is.

 

[Smoom77]

There's no point to learn bthrow-fthrow on meta if you already have bthrow>dthrow down.

 

[J4pu]

I'm not trying to, I just mentioned earlier that theoretically the best grab only CG would be alternating Bthrow Fthrow with nana doing the fthrows.
as long as it's inescapable and you can do it consistently though any one works.

 

[theunabletable]

I only know the CG timing of dthrow/bthrow for MK, because well, that's what I picked up IC's for, I've tried fthrow CG'ing MK and I remember failing to regrab more than 90% of the time, so I just stopped and went back to my normal CG.

Actually MK and Lucas seem to have wierd Fthrow timing, for some reason. I can 0-death Kirby consistently with Fthrows, but I fail at it against MK and Lucas. Idk why. I don't play the ICs vs MK matchup, anyway. I just go MK and ditto them. Less chance of getting gay'd to hell.

Although I can Bthrow>Dthrow most of the cast consistently anyways

 

[00-Zero]

Against an MK, my Ice Climbers aren't the ones getting gay'd. Thy're doing more of a face ****** type of action

 

[theunabletable]

Meh I'm scared of running into a scrooging MK.

Hell I scrooge ICs as MK if ever I run across some.

 

[00-Zero]

Scrooge? Like selfish? I don't get it lol