Psycho_Bayleef
Smash Apprentice
Point 3 in my post
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Social General Ice Climber Chat
- Thread starter dj asakura
- Start date
Vanitas
Smash Ace
Take notes on whatever Chu does right in this match https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wHXoDoYaSU
I believe the Ice Climbers' Bair is one of few moves that can break through Yoshi's armoured double jump but don't quote me on that.
Unrelated but what do people think of this:
I was thinking that in the situation where it's Sopo vs a space animal and you are edgeguarding and the space animal is trying to recover from below, there might be only one optimal way of ensuring its death. And I believe that it is by ledgehopping Dair indefinitely until you have racked enough damage for a single smash to kill them. As we all know, our Dair outprioritizes Up-B's of spacies from above. I've seen many videos where professional Ice Climber players do the ledgehop Dair once and then proceed to a smash but sometimes it did not guarantee the kill. This is under the assumption that Dair is not strong enough for them to ledgetech (correct me if I am wrong) and for them to DI outwards to get a different position. In addition, there is the slow start up of their Up-Bs and their falling speed will make them fall far enough to give you enough time to reclaim the edge and repeat. Sure you might be verbally assaulted for being lame, but with the metagame heavily favouring punishment, this might be the best way for making the spacies suffer. What do people think?
Chuckles
Smash Apprentice
It's situational IMO because Fox especially can mixup the up-b angle which might be why ICs don't do it often. It might work once or twice in a match or until your opponent adapts. Ledgehop dair is good, but I think a well spaced double bair with nana off ledge is much safer plus, if you're synced with nana, mashing the side-b you can recover from very low.
Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
It can be tricky to cover everything when Fox SDIs the dair away and mixes up going towards the stage and going straight up.
Regarding Yoshi's double jump, it has subtractive knockback armor*, so anything with non-set knockback should break it eventually.
*There is some value of knockback c such that, if Yoshi gets hit during his double jump by a move that deals knockback k, the knockback he receives is max{0,k-c}. I don't remember what c is, so I'm not sure when you can start expecting certain moves to break his double jump. It does make sense that bair would break it reasonably early since it's a strong move, though.
Regarding Yoshi's double jump, it has subtractive knockback armor*, so anything with non-set knockback should break it eventually.
*There is some value of knockback c such that, if Yoshi gets hit during his double jump by a move that deals knockback k, the knockback he receives is max{0,k-c}. I don't remember what c is, so I'm not sure when you can start expecting certain moves to break his double jump. It does make sense that bair would break it reasonably early since it's a strong move, though.
I think the optimal punish should be a move that trades with th up-b, so you get the jump back and can take the ledge, and also pushes fox away from the stage even more, i have a hard time learning which move that is though.
Yoshi is fun to play against, he has a good fair(one of like 2 approaching moves) that definitly should be respected (but can be intercepted with uptilt, which is also great against yoshis doublejump), and a really good dsmash, something that has IASA frames (or similar) out of rolls.
If hes lost his doublejump he is kinda out of options, attacking him from below in that situation works like attacking marth in the same situation, pressures the character heavily.
Yoshi is fun to play against, he has a good fair(one of like 2 approaching moves) that definitly should be respected (but can be intercepted with uptilt, which is also great against yoshis doublejump), and a really good dsmash, something that has IASA frames (or similar) out of rolls.
If hes lost his doublejump he is kinda out of options, attacking him from below in that situation works like attacking marth in the same situation, pressures the character heavily.
KingDozie
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2014
- Messages
- 456
Just watch your Ic's video. Its pretty good.
Hands
Smash Cadet
I hope I don't s
Hands
Smash Cadet
sound silly when I say this, but can someone explain how to do the belay desynch please?
Hands
Smash Cadet
Thank you sir
#FreeICs
#FreeICs
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
sopo isn't really on the tier list, honestly, I still think he's better than the mario bros (exception of luigi's jank ass self)
Sopo is pretty good. You just have to really get your movement and combo game down.
Tech chasing is super important too.
But he's fast, he hits hard, and he combos forever.
He just has a crappy super predictable recovery and pretty jank approaches that can usually be countered.
Sopo is pretty good. You just have to really get your movement and combo game down.
Tech chasing is super important too.
But he's fast, he hits hard, and he combos forever.
He just has a crappy super predictable recovery and pretty jank approaches that can usually be countered.
Renth
Smash Hero
The adventures of Renth and Uber Ice 4 new friendlies (Ganondorf vs. Ice Climbers)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVUJvvfI4ek&list=PLRZgx2SiH09u3BRgroYwFJnv12ILGlMKN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVUJvvfI4ek&list=PLRZgx2SiH09u3BRgroYwFJnv12ILGlMKN
Kingdozie,: thanks, didnt realize i still had the link there.
Noticed somthing in nintendude vs sava http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqRzGbi1V00#t=2m58s
Apparenthly fox can upsmash luigis nair oos to get the cielingglitch on him, so if wddsmash is a reliable oos punish on luigi i guess with good timing its extreemly good.
Noticed somthing in nintendude vs sava http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqRzGbi1V00#t=2m58s
Apparenthly fox can upsmash luigis nair oos to get the cielingglitch on him, so if wddsmash is a reliable oos punish on luigi i guess with good timing its extreemly good.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
the way the ceiling glitch works is if luigi uses his full speed wavedash->move or full tilt downB into a shield and fox (or other characters) usmash OoS, he'll hit a ceiling and then get a chance to tech.
Iceman
Smash Apprentice
So is there anything the Ice Climbers can do out of a shield drop? If so what is the best thing to do?
grab them and wobble
dont ever leave the stage ever
Bones0
Smash Legend
Is it true that when you smash attack an opponent out of a grab instead of the air/ground, they don't have as much KB/stun?
Utilt is really good if Falco keeps trying to come down on top of you. Chu/Nintendude hit me with it a lot when I get impatient. Uair works as well.
cemo
white walker
i believe in the grab it does less damage or something, so KB would be reduced.
if you grab someone without a doublejump you should do that, since they won't get their jump back.
if you grab someone without a doublejump you should do that, since they won't get their jump back.
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DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
Yes, that allows up to do jank things like dthrow->dsmash CG
but most of the time we can time the smash to connect at the release point from a throw so they still take the maximum kb
Nintendude
Smash Hero
D-throw d-smash isn't related to reduced knockback when the opponent is held. It just works when Nana's d-smash is staled. I'd advise against ever using it though. Just do d-throw d-tilt instead.
Vanitas
Smash Ace
Hey Ice Climbers; not sure if this is the right thread to post this in, but I'm looking to get some critiquing and feedback. I do get to play Japan's renowned Ganondorf player Loki, but only very briefly. I know I edgeguarded him poorly at the end, but I'm looking for tips against Ganondorfs in the neutral game.
I play against a Fox, Falcon, and then Ganondorf
I come on at 22:00 of this crew battle and my ICs have an in-game tag OTTA (short for Ottawa lol):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3hPf3g6ob8&feature=youtu.be
Thanks in advance!
I play against a Fox, Falcon, and then Ganondorf
I come on at 22:00 of this crew battle and my ICs have an in-game tag OTTA (short for Ottawa lol):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3hPf3g6ob8&feature=youtu.be
Thanks in advance!
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DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
Oh yeah I hate using dthrow dsmash cgs.I thought it had to do with the lowered kb as well as the staled move, but I guess I'm wrong.
cemo
white walker
vs Ganon, try baiting out the f-tilt and d-tilt, they will try to place these to stuff approaches. it is really easy to run into an aerial or a jab or a tilt if you aren't careful. get in with a wavedash grab or dash attack or something after baiting out a tilt. if you scare them off trying to stuff approaches it lets you play more offensively.
blizzards and ice blocks are good to force ganon to jump/shield or just to control space. try to use them to get a position where you can poke with an upair or something, and maybe he'll get hit by the blizzard and you can follow up with something stronger like fair/grab. if you can bait a jump and you're close enough usually punish as well. just wavedashing straight at ganon with something is usually a good way to get hit with a fair/jab/f-tilt/d-tilt/wizard's foot though.
blizzards and ice blocks are good to force ganon to jump/shield or just to control space. try to use them to get a position where you can poke with an upair or something, and maybe he'll get hit by the blizzard and you can follow up with something stronger like fair/grab. if you can bait a jump and you're close enough usually punish as well. just wavedashing straight at ganon with something is usually a good way to get hit with a fair/jab/f-tilt/d-tilt/wizard's foot though.
Psycho_Bayleef
Smash Apprentice
Celing glitch is weird af. I'll go find the cause and paste it
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
blizzard walls and utilts. Get under that ho, she's super slow in the air.
Don't approach Zelda from the side too much. You don't want/need to challenge her strongest moves (fair/bair). Camp platforms, shoot ice at her, make blizzard walls, and abuse the fact the she doesn't really have any good hit boxes above and below her. She's really slow and you don't really have to approach her at any time, so you can get away with playing really defensive/campy. Make her approach you and punish hard when she whiffs any move. Use ICs' great ground speed, projectiles, and fast/high jumps (combined with platforms) to regain stage control.
Zelda can't really do anything if you avoid running/WDing into her moves.
Zelda can't really do anything if you avoid running/WDing into her moves.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
I've been using a lot of fthrow-fair lately. I like forcing floaties onto the ground with it.
I've also been playing around with mixing up nanapults and just throwing nana at people and making her fair. it's fun.
I've also been playing around with mixing up nanapults and just throwing nana at people and making her fair. it's fun.
I like to use d-throw -> fair at low % against floaties as a wobbling set-up. Fair will send them down without knocking them into the ground so that you can grab them right away. It's usually your best option against characters where you can't get a regrab off d-throw -> dair, like the Marios/Luigi/Samus/Puff.
Also, thanks for turning in the other day, Fly. Anything you think I should work on? You mentioned something about buffering d-throws I think?
I use Shield drop -> uair quite a lot. I think it's one of ICs' best ways to get down from platforms. Shield drop -> bair/dair can be used to catch people under you off guard.
Also, thanks for turning in the other day, Fly. Anything you think I should work on? You mentioned something about buffering d-throws I think?
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DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
just saw this now. disregard that you can leave the stage whenever you want.I catch falco's out of their sideB with nair all the time. then you can do rising fair out of that and it looks sexy and if you have nana you can make it back to the stage after the fair ends. if falco tried to come down on you with dair, you can just uair him
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Chuckles
Smash Apprentice
If full hop fast fall Nair on spacies and CF any good? How good is Nair in general? I notice I almost never use it because it feels like such a weak move. What matchup suffers most from nair? Also, is nair OOS any good? I know bair OOS is good.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
nair is amazing. it doesn't have a ton of range, but it's low kb is great for combos and clean grab setups.
It's one of my favorite moves.
the only problem is it's lack of range.
the only two ways to really use it effectively are rising with it or by using it as late as possible (or offstage, it's your best offstage move)the reverse hit of nair is also very good for comboing into rising bairs.
I don't really like to use it out of a fullhop though, I usually find that it's better closer to the ground.I use nair OoS on occasion, but generally I stick to uair or bair. nair has very little range and doesn't cover above you. But if your opponent misspaces you can use nair to combo into like dsmash or grab if you do it late enough.
it does have low knockback though, so it's not a great "get off me" move most of the time, but you can interrupt combos with it.
it's also a very interesting move to intercept people with because of the position of the hitbox. Like I said before, I use to it catch spacies out of their sideB all the time. you can also sneak under people with a rising nair very effectively, I tend to use it a lot against peach and sheik.nair is also particularly fun to use against ganon. you can just kind of nair him all the way across the stage.you can also dthrow->nair->regrab on most characters within a certain percent range, wobbles used to use it pretty effectively with sopo.
It's one of my favorite moves.
the only problem is it's lack of range.
the only two ways to really use it effectively are rising with it or by using it as late as possible (or offstage, it's your best offstage move)the reverse hit of nair is also very good for comboing into rising bairs.
I don't really like to use it out of a fullhop though, I usually find that it's better closer to the ground.I use nair OoS on occasion, but generally I stick to uair or bair. nair has very little range and doesn't cover above you. But if your opponent misspaces you can use nair to combo into like dsmash or grab if you do it late enough.
it does have low knockback though, so it's not a great "get off me" move most of the time, but you can interrupt combos with it.
it's also a very interesting move to intercept people with because of the position of the hitbox. Like I said before, I use to it catch spacies out of their sideB all the time. you can also sneak under people with a rising nair very effectively, I tend to use it a lot against peach and sheik.nair is also particularly fun to use against ganon. you can just kind of nair him all the way across the stage.you can also dthrow->nair->regrab on most characters within a certain percent range, wobbles used to use it pretty effectively with sopo.
Psycho_Bayleef
Smash Apprentice
Isn't it great to put someone on a platform and keep them there for at least a little bit with desynched uair? I don't mean is it a good option. It just feels good to control both icies to go bop a person.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
i just read and watched the video for the nana forward-facing blizzard
amazing
amazing
Encephalon Decay
Smash Cadet
What kind of situations would really call for utilt? I feel like it's probably a lot more useful than I give it credit for, as I almost never use it. Same with bthrow (If I want to send them backwards, I'll typically just uthrow-fsmash).