General Final Fantasy Discussion - Final Fantasy XII remake incoming!

[Ryu Shimazu]

Final Fantasy games typically have a lot of customization for a jrpg. I'm pretty sure V did, I know VII had a decent amount, IX was lacking, but X you could re innovate your whole sphere grid. XII was very open worldish/do what you want too. X

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Final Fantasy games have the appearance of customization, but most of it is pretty linear upgrades with fancy, overcomplicated interfaces.

 

[finalark]

Final Fantasy games have the appearance of customization, but most of it is pretty linear upgrades with fancy, overcomplicated interfaces.

I don't entirely agree with this statement, I think it varies from game to game.

But XIII is the most guilty of that.

 

[LivewiresXe]

Final Fantasy games have the appearance of customization, but most of it is pretty linear upgrades with fancy, overcomplicated interfaces.

I have to disagree in the case of FFVI, FFVIII, and FFTactics, if nothing else.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Final Fantasy games have the appearance of customization, but most of it is pretty linear upgrades with fancy, overcomplicated interfaces.

Ever played FF1, FF5, FF6, FF8, or FF9?

In the case of VIII, it can suffer from "everyone being the same over powered character with Limit Breaks separating them" syndrome, getting all characters to that point takes WAY too long to accomplish.

 

[finalark]

Anyone who says that Final Fantasy has limited customization options hasn't played very many other JRPGs.

Just like how people who say that Final Fantasy is a generic JRPG hasn't played very many other JRPGs.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

There are more RPG's than JRPG's

 

[LivewiresXe]

There are more RPG's than JRPG's

True, but in that same vein, a lot of things that are considered RPGs aren't even actually RPGs.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Just like how people who say that Final Fantasy is a generic JRPG hasn't played very many other JRPGs.

These don't count as Final Fantasy games, right?

Super Mario Legend of the Seven Stars
Wild Arms
Breath of Fire
Saga Frontier
Romancing Saga
Earthbound
Shining Force
Skies of Arcadia
Dragon Quest
Xenosaga

These are generic jRPG games. The Final Fantasy series is generic.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Finlark was comparing them to non Final Fantasy games

I don't see why I can't broaden that as well

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Using finalark's distinction, RPGs in general don't have great customization to say an RTS like FF Tactics which would have more of a "customized" feel since you are using more units to fight a larger group of enemies. RTSs also fail in ways to MMOs in terms of individual character creation. However, with internet connectivity it is possible to have a very large possibility for RTS games like Disgaea to create custom maps and user related content. Especially if there is great cross-compatibility between the game and computer, it is possible to extensively hack the game and allow possibly more content than originally intended. But RPGs aren't very customizable at all in the sense that we would like it to potentially have in an overall sense.

 

[LivewiresXe]

These don't count as Final Fantasy games, right?

Super Mario Legend of the Seven Stars
Wild Arms
Breath of Fire
Saga Frontier
Romancing Saga
Earthbound
Shining Force
Skies of Arcadia
Dragon Quest
Xenosaga

These are generic jRPG games. The Final Fantasy series is generic.

Whoa whoa whoa whoa. Breath of Fire I'll give you, and I MIGHT at times give you Saga Frontier, but Wild ARMs and Earthbound are FAR from generic jRPGs.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Whoa whoa whoa whoa. Breath of Fire I'll give you, and I MIGHT at times give you Saga Frontier, but Wild ARMs and Earthbound are FAR from generic jRPGs.

I agree, especially in the case of Earthbound, but only in concept and design. As far as level up and customization goes, they're very straightforward and quite linear.

 

[Rutger]

Using finalark's distinction, RPGs in general don't have great customization to say an RTS like FF Tactics which would have more of a "customized" feel since you are using more units to fight a larger group of enemies. RTSs also fail in ways to MMOs in terms of individual character creation. However, with internet connectivity it is possible to have a very large possibility for RTS games like Disgaea to create custom maps and user related content. Especially if there is great cross-compatibility between the game and computer, it is possible to extensively hack the game and allow possibly more content than originally intended. But RPGs aren't very customizable at all in the sense that we would like it to potentially have in an overall sense.

Um, I think you are mixing up your terms, RTS is Real Time Strategy, games like Starcraft.

FFT and Disgaea are Turn Based Strategy/Tactical RPGs, like Fire Emblem.


And calling Dragon Quest generic, when it's the game that built the genre? I don't know, I think it has earned the right to stay old school.


As for the subject of customization, FF varies greatly between games. I would say that Atlus games can be really damn good about it, at least from a skillset point of view, and also with the various Shin Megami Tensei games where you recruit and/or fuse demons to be your party members.

 

[Minato]

I'm actually confused on what we're calling generic now. The customizing abilities/moveset for characters?
If so, what jRPGs are good enough to not be generic to people who are saying they are (unless you're saying the entire genre is generic).

 

[finalark]

I'm not even sure what the hell we're arguing about. I just made an observation that a number of people I have met write off Final Fantasy as a "generic" JRPG, which is something I disagree with.

Also, a few things I feel compelled to argue with to kill time before my next class.

These don't count as Final Fantasy games, right?

Super Mario Legend of the Seven Stars
Wild Arms
Breath of Fire
Saga Frontier
Romancing Saga
Earthbound
Shining Force
Skies of Arcadia
Dragon Quest
Xenosaga

These are generic jRPG games. The Final Fantasy series is generic.

I can't really speak for Wild Arms, or any of the Saga games, since I haven't played Wild Arms and I have limited experience with the Saga series, but most of those you listed are far from generic. Earthbound and Mario RPG are about as unique as JRPGs get. Shining Force is a TBS game. The only ones I'll give you as being generic in there is maybe Xenosaga, Skies of Arcadia and Breathe of Fire.

Since Dragon Quest practically invented the genre I think it pretty much has to right to do whatever the hell it wants, and I'm not even a fan of the series.

Using finalark's distinction, RPGs in general don't have great customization to say an RTS like FF Tactics which would have more of a "customized" feel since you are using more units to fight a larger group of enemies. RTSs also fail in ways to MMOs in terms of individual character creation. However, with internet connectivity it is possible to have a very large possibility for RTS games like Disgaea to create custom maps and user related content. Especially if there is great cross-compatibility between the game and computer, it is possible to extensively hack the game and allow possibly more content than originally intended. But RPGs aren't very customizable at all in the sense that we would like it to potentially have in an overall sense.

I think you mean TBS, or turn based strategy. These are games like Fire Emblem or Shining Force. And RTS means real time strategy, like Warcraft or Age of Empires.

By the way, your whole argument about strategy games having not as much customization as MMOs (I'm not even sure how that's relevant to the current discussion) is pretty much shot down by the entire X-Com series.

I'm just going to throw this out there, but I know RPGs exist outside of JRPGs. I'm an avid fan of table top RPGs and western RPGs. But let's be honest, JRPGs are rather different from their western counterparts. This is why we separate them into different genres.

Seriously, man, clean up your paragraphs. I have no idea what you're trying to say half the time.

 

[♖♘♗♔♕♗♘♖]

Chapter 2 of WotL:

Spoiler

I don't think I could have passed the entire story arc from Gogg, if I hadn't power leveled preceding the Mustadio/wall scaling stage to get the Chemists's safeguard skill which led me to jacking up the range of Jump/Dragoon, surplus gil for rifles/Chemist, and Shockwave/Monk by the time I got to Gaffgarion at Episode 2. Then the Lucavi thing that came from nowhere wiped out my entire party with doom/sleep partly because I was trying to attack the candles or the ornaments to make it reveal his health points. I mean his stats are question marks and you had that wall trigger in the Gaff stage. After I died, I could have gotten that equipment in Gogg to prevent status ailments, but I wanted to try to beat it one more time with the party I had without doing stupid ****. Charged the ****** and he ended up doom/sleeping/stoning my entire party on the stair case. Only thing is, he stoned them while they had him surrounded, basically trapping him and preventing him from moving. Even though his bio skill has extensive range, my chemist with 2 hp was just chilling in the far left corner of the map just outside of his attack range. I basically ended up shooting him to death while he did nothing the entire round because he didn't attack my units while they were stoned. RIP Ludovich, you never stood a chance against that cardinal.

 

[LivewiresXe]

Oh right, FFTactics PSP. Ah...how I miss the PS1 version where things were spelled differently and the random bits of Engrish were amusingly present.

 

[♖♘♗♔♕♗♘♖]

Oh right, FFTactics PSP. Ah...how I miss the PS1 version where things were spelled differently and the random bits of Engrish were amusingly present.

I heard the PS1 version has speed-up which would be fantastic, given the slower battles in Tactics make me impatient and to focus more on melee classes than on magic. I don't have a single unit that's been a black or white mage... which I need to work on. Also there's an iOS version for Tactics, I wonder how that version plays out given the lack of input versatility aside from relying on the touch screen.

 

[LivewiresXe]

Also on the PS1, there's a lot of cool things you can do with the Gameshark, though you don't get the Dark Knight and Onion Knight classes playable.

 

[♖♘♗♔♕♗♘♖]

Also on the PS1, there's a lot of cool things you can do with the Gameshark, though you don't get the Dark Knight and Onion Knight classes playable.

Yeah, I'm trying to blind run the job system as much as possible. When I get back home I'm probably going to grind JP on present classes to at least level 3-5 to see what new classes unlock. Right now I've been very physical attack class oriented. I'm close to maxing out dragoon and monk, however I still haven't unlocked ninja/samurai. I haven't touched geomancer/arithmetic due to monk being an overall solid class to max out skills wise and arithmetic is because I've been avoiding using mages. But yeah, I'm not even thinking about the secret classes atm.

 

[LivewiresXe]

Samurai you won't really need, but I WILL say this. Go to Ninja if for nothing else than the Two Swords ability. That thing makes Ramza beastly, and having it (plus one of my favourites in Move-HP-Up from the Monk class) as support for Squire Ramza can go make you go "holy crap". Though I can't stress how key it is to get them ASAP and will only say "when the time comes to need them...you'll know and be glad you have them".

 

[♖♘♗♔♕♗♘♖]

This probably has been mentioned before, but Final Fantasy V is still glitched even with Square promoting it in their anniversary sale give-away. When I got control of the ship and tried to navigate it through the straight, my screen ended up turning bright green with brown roadblocks before I received an in-game message stating, "This machine cannot handle..." and then forcibly shutting down my PSP. Also when you try to save, the menu screen glitches out and when you try to exit, it makes it impossible to leave the menu. When I was able to exit the menu, the maps were glitched such as the Wind Dragon temple in the beginning of the game resulting in me getting kicked out if I tried to press any buttons after entering the glitched area.

 

[finalark]

This probably has been mentioned before, but Final Fantasy V is still glitched even with Square promoting it in their anniversary sale give-away. When I got control of the ship and tried to navigate it through the straight, my screen ended up turning bright green with brown roadblocks before I received an in-game message stating, "This machine cannot handle..." and then forcibly shutting down my PSP. Also when you try to save, the menu screen glitches out and when you try to exit, it makes it impossible to leave the menu. When I was able to exit the menu, the maps were glitched such as the Wind Dragon temple in the beginning of the game resulting in me getting kicked out if I tried to press any buttons after entering the glitched area.

This must be an issue with your download. I've played through the game twice, once on PS1 and once on GBA and not only have I never encountered these glitches but I've never heard of them being encountered.

Might I suggest redownloading the game?

 

[Minato]

This probably has been mentioned before, but Final Fantasy V is still glitched even with Square promoting it in their anniversary sale give-away. When I got control of the ship and tried to navigate it through the straight, my screen ended up turning bright green with brown roadblocks before I received an in-game message stating, "This machine cannot handle..." and then forcibly shutting down my PSP. Also when you try to save, the menu screen glitches out and when you try to exit, it makes it impossible to leave the menu. When I was able to exit the menu, the maps were glitched such as the Wind Dragon temple in the beginning of the game resulting in me getting kicked out if I tried to press any buttons after entering the glitched area.

The PS1 version is known to be very glitchy. And since the PSOne Classic has nothing changed, all the glitches are intact. I've maybe hit 1 glitch or so iirc. You can probably look up the list of glitches if you want to see what to avoid.

 

[finalark]

Apparently FFX HD is still a thing, here's ten seconds of Tidus and Yuna's idle animations. IN GLORIOUS HD!

http://www.gamesradar.com/final-fantasy-x-hd-first-footage-revealed/

 

[Jon Farron]

It doesn't really look that different...


or maybe it only appears that way cuz I haven't played it in forever.

 

[finalark]

Tomorrow the PS4 is speculated to be revealed. It makes me wonder if Versus XIII will still come out on PS3 or if Square will decide to make it a PS4 title.

Or, you know, if it comes out at all.

 

[Jon Farron]

I'm hoping to buy a PS3 for my B-Day (Feb 24th) but depending on the release of PS4, and if it's backwards compatibility, I might wait...

 

[LivewiresXe]

Tomorrow the PS4 is speculated to be revealed. It makes me wonder if Versus XIII will still come out on PS3 or if Square will decide to make it a PS4 title.

Or, you know, if it comes out at all.

They MIGHT reveal it, but I still maintain they'll wait until the 720's been out for a year to release it, since they're now outselling 360 in games and consoles.

 

[Minato]

I have a feeling that it's moved to PS4, and that we'll get news of it sometime this year.
And White Mage, judging by leaks and rumors, PS4 won't have traditional backwards compatibility. Things are iffy on it, but I wouldn't hold out for it.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

PS4? but I just got a PS3.

 

[LivewiresXe]

PS4? but I just got a PS3.

Don't worry too much. I wouldn't expect anything concrete about it for a couple of years now. PS3 was made to be the primary system for 10 years so...I'll worry in like 2015, lol.

 

[Claire Diviner]

On top of that, I doubt we'll see another main series Final Fantasy for a while, given how they're still busy with Versus XIII, XIV, and XIII-3. I'll only start getting pissed if they ninja the mentioned games as exclusives for the PS4. Other than that, I'm not too worried myself.

 

[Jon Farron]

I'm pretty sure Versus will stay on the PS3, because XIII is the PS3's Final Fantasy series... for the entire generation. It only had one "number" compared to the PS1 & 2. PS1 had 7-9, and PS2 had 10-12.

Well there's also 14... but who knows where that's going to go after beta starts with the PC.

 

[Minato]

I still think it was planned to be moved to PS4 which was why they couldn't show anything for awhile. Gonna predict it's going to be shown soon and that it'll just be called Final Fantasy Versus or something. I can see "XIII" being dropped like it did for Type-0 when it was Agito XIII.

 

[Jon Farron]

Hmm, XIII could very well be dropped. Seeing as it has basically nothing to do with XIII. .-.

 

[Claire Diviner]

I still think it was planned to be moved to PS4 which was why they couldn't show anything for awhile.

If this turns out to be the case, I wonder if they'll use that Agni's Philosophy engine for it.

 

[Jon Farron]

Is this the engine?

If so, that would look completely amazing.

 

[Claire Diviner]

That's the engine, yes.