Ganon's Beard - General. Social. Rankings.

[Sgt. Baker]

That was better than The Great Gatsby

 

[Sovereign]

So, everybody. Today I engaged in rare act of philanthropy whilst purchasing sustenance from a purveyor of sub sandwiches. I was prompted to relinquish one of my dollars unto a Children's Special Olympics fund upon my purchase, and I did so. Rather, it was more an act of spiteful jealousy than philanthropy. Since it was not I who afflicted those shattered souls with my own hand, I sought to prolong their insignificant lives in the event I would see to their demise personally.

I was given a volleyball-sized ticket which I was asked to inscribe my name upon. In bold, mighty script, condemning enough as if to bellow aloud my name: Ganondorf.

Verm is prime evil at its best. Everyone should quote this, or at least post this on the first page of the General Discussion, so mofos know what boards they just walked into.

777EDIT: I will scream roar if somethin' lucky happens to me. I got 777 posts, yay MWAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[Dajayman]

Why is DDD a fat Piplup?

 

[Clai]

I'm learning how to use Brawlbox to hack the game, specifically I've been hacking Ganondorf's AI. Using a hex editor, I came across the data for Ganon's AI, so I replaced what was there to a story of Ganondorf's epicness and how he has unsustainable power and will undoubtedly rule the world.

Unsurprisingly, the Wii couldn't handle it.

 

[Vermanubis]

The tournament today went pretty well, I must say. It was Mass Madness 19. I placed somewhat lower than I'dve liked (9/17), but in my defense, I got gayed HAAARD. First set was against Pelca (who took 3rd, I think). I won against his Snake, but he CPed Falco and I got my *** CG spiked twice. <_>

Beat two guys in Losers, then faced C. Awesome. I beat his Snake first round, but he CPed MK and RC. He stayed MK and got the win, unfortunately. I got gimped so hard. ;-; But I'm content with the fact that I beat his main (Snake) and made him CP me like that. xP He's notorious in NE for being very campy and patient, so I'm very pleased I was able to nab that one.

After the tournament, I played a 1$ MM, best 3/5 with Duke, formerly ranked 7th in New England, and won. He beat me with MK first match. I beat his DK round 2. Beat his Snake round 3. His MK got me round 4 and I got his MK round 5. Wish Id've gotten some replays though. I really regret not having gotten them. I pulled out some amazing FoGs in my sets with Duke and C. Awesome. Everyone went nuts when I did. XD

Aside from that, I played a bunch of friendlies and won them all, save for a few stray matches I lost. I played Pelca, Hotdogturtle, MajorGamer14 and NEAce in friendlies and won all but a few matches. Aside from the meh placing, I feel like I did overall well today. I feel silly placing 9th, then beating someone who placed 5th in a MM. >_>; It's an awful habit of mine to not ban RC when someone doesn't use MK first round, so I assume they'll stick with Snake or something.

NE definitely is one of the toughest regions to be a Ganon in, that's all I can say. Nothing but MKs, Snakes and Falcos. >_<

 

[Dajayman]

Did Ganon do any work at MLG?

 

[adumbrodeus]

Nice job verm, protip: everybody has a pocket MK. Yes, that includes your grandma.

I'm learning how to use Brawlbox to hack the game, specifically I've been hacking Ganondorf's AI. Using a hex editor, I came across the data for Ganon's AI, so I replaced what was there to a story of Ganondorf's epicness and how he has unsustainable power and will undoubtedly rule the world.

Unsurprisingly, the Wii couldn't handle it.

Lol, I'm surprised the world was able to handle it.

 

[Dajayman]

FoG?

 

[Vermanubis]

Nice job verm, protip: everybody has a pocket MK. Yes, that includes your grandma.

A hard-won lesson this time around lol. I just feel like crap for not banning RC, because if I had, I'm 95% confident I could've won the set and gotten 7th or above. Considering I beat the guy who placed 5th, I could've even gotten 5th. >_<

Definitely gotta admit, it's pretty frustrating to place so meh when you won against most of the people who placed above you. D:

 

[Dark 3nergy]

Why is DDD a fat Piplup?

i still havent figured that out either and i sleep with him everynight

 

[Divilenta]

Verm, I nearly died of laughter when I read your paragraph about philanthropy. Oh the ideas, how they flow.

 

[Thinkaman]

Attention K-mart shoppers,

Twilight Prince took on Fonz and his MK teammate 1v2 at a 50% disadvantage @ MLG 2v2 bracket.

That is all.

 

[Dark 3nergy]

your jiggs is hella manly

those TP / DLA ganon dittos where complete sex

 

[PK-ow!]

Well, it was a good run, but I decided I want to win games, and be rewarded for how much effort I put in.
I am no longer okay with impossible matchups. This character is unviable. I don't want to have to be so psychically attuned to my opponent that I'm not wrong once, to escape the easily-prolonged juggle to edgeguard and then death combo, which ends stocks for ONLY this character. It's not like just any noob can do it, but an MK or a Marth who knows what to do, at what percents, has unsolvable aggression at any point of the game.
I want credit for noticing what my opponent doesn't know and I want credit for being able to create unsolvable situations, frame traps, and hard mixups.

And I want a f*cking approach.

This character is unviable. That to me was the line. I now understand this is true, and I can't keep using Ganon and say I actually want to win. To prove something, I have to learn more than this guy. And I have to never use him in competition again. I stuck with him 'cause I wanted to unlock something. But I don't think it's coming any more. And that to me is the line.


I will no longer hold the mantle of Ganon mainship, if you don't think I deserve it. I may withdraw the Ganon head next to my name, for you guys. To me, being one of Ganon's kind means giving people an entertaining time in friendlies and pulling a crowd. And... I think I'll agree to murder Trolls in pools with Ganon, if they're disrespectful.

I'll still help out here, 'cause I've given my soul to Ganondorf. He's still going to be, for a while yet, the char I know the most about.

But I have a purpose now.
I wish I could say Ganon made me a good player, but actually, I know next to nothing about this game. I've only been to six tourneys, and they are the all of my offline play, plus a couple of hours with some guy who left for Melee. I'm still learning what it takes to beat CPUs (even when they don't perfect shield).
Had the game for a year, and literally do nothing but think about Fighters and RTSs and competition and strategy ALL DAY (I'm not in school), and this is how good I still am.

At the very least, I promise not to ever let a single one of you guys rise past me in brackets so long as you go Ganon. Then my switching won't be in vain. And all we established here - what we, the Ganon students, *know* about this guy - won't be in vain. I'll use it to destroy all of you completely. That will be my respect.

I hope you ask yourselves each the right question. Keep advancing Ganon's game, or switch out and try to do better. You do deserve to learn a higher tier. For you it may be right or may be wrong to use Ganon, for what you want to do. But if you want to win money? And you believe Ganon is this bad? Then you're deceiving yourself.

 

[Vermanubis]

Well, it was a good run, but I decided I want to win games, and be rewarded for how much effort I put in.
I am no longer okay with impossible matchups. This character is unviable. I don't want to have to be so psychically attuned to my opponent that I'm not wrong once, to escape the easily-prolonged juggle to edgeguard and then death combo, which ends stocks for ONLY this character. It's not like just any noob can do it, but an MK or a Marth who knows what to do, at what percents, has unsolvable aggression at any point of the game.
I want credit for noticing what my opponent doesn't know and I want credit for being able to create unsolvable situations, frame traps, and hard mixups.

And I want a f*cking approach.

This character is unviable. That to me was the line. I now understand this is true, and I can't keep using Ganon and say I actually want to win. To prove something, I have to learn more than this guy. And I have to never use him in competition again. I stuck with him 'cause I wanted to unlock something. But I don't think it's coming any more. And that to me is the line.


I will no longer hold the mantle of Ganon mainship, if you don't think I deserve it. I may withdraw the Ganon head next to my name, for you guys. To me, being one of Ganon's kind means giving people an entertaining time in friendlies and pulling a crowd. And... I think I'll agree to murder Trolls in pools with Ganon, if they're disrespectful.

I'll still help out here, 'cause I've given my soul to Ganondorf. He's still going to be, for a while yet, the char I know the most about.

But I have a purpose now.
I wish I could say Ganon made me a good player, but actually, I know next to nothing about this game. I've only been to six tourneys, and they are the all of my offline play, plus a couple of hours with some guy who left for Melee. I'm still learning what it takes to beat CPUs (even when they don't perfect shield).
Had the game for a year, and literally do nothing but think about Fighters and RTSs and competition and strategy ALL DAY (I'm not in school), and this is how good I still am.

At the very least, I promise not to ever let a single one of you guys rise past me in brackets so long as you go Ganon. Then my switching won't be in vain. And all we established here - what we, the Ganon students, *know* about this guy - won't be in vain. I'll use it to destroy all of you completely. That will be my respect.

I hope you ask yourselves each the right question. Keep advancing Ganon's game, or switch out and try to do better. You do deserve to learn a higher tier. For you it may be right or may be wrong to use Ganon, for what you want to do. But if you want to win money? And you believe Ganon is this bad? Then you're deceiving yourself.

You'll be missed, PK. But your decision is understandable. But I think most Ganon mains know that they'd probably win money if they went to a higher tier. Most of them don't just because they don't have that kind of interest in going that far.

I personally stick to Ganon just because he's the only character I find to be fun. I have tried every character in the past, but only Ganondorf really cauight my attention. Brawl is just a silly, broken game, so I guess the Ganon population's main motivation is just to have fun. But, that may differ from Ganon to Ganon, depending on their success rate. I personally just started going to offline tournaments, and I've won more than I've lost, so maybe the fun factor all depends on how well you do.

To be perfectly honest, I plan on quitting Brawl once my goals are achieved. I want to make playoffs, make New England PR and seize the top Ganon spot (THAT'S RIGHT KALM, I'M COMING FOR YA! >:U). I suppose that's why I'm so dedicated to the 'Dorf. This game interests me so little outside of Ganondorf. I just want to take him as far as he can go.

 

[Divilenta]

I can definitely understand where you're coming from PK. Just sorry that you're gonna quit.

 

[Bahamut777]

And there goes another one...
I'm sad maining Peach. I wan my Cute Nigg Gerudo Warlock back. :'(

 

[Divilenta]

Lol, nice avatar there Bahamut. Konata?

 

[Bahamut777]

Yes. Watched Lucky Star over again last month. Too good.

 

[Divilenta]

Yes. Watched Lucky Star over again last month. Too good.

Lucky Star is legit. AND VERY MANLY TO THE REST OF YOU >:O

 

[Ganonsburg]

Another One Bites the Dust. See ya, PK-ow!.

 

[TP]

To be perfectly honest, I plan on quitting Brawl once my goals are achieved. I want to make playoffs, make New England PR and seize the top Ganon spot (THAT'S RIGHT KALM, I'M COMING FOR YA! >:U).

I'll race you there. I'm officially dropping MK (except for certain matchups), since winning with him is no longer able to give me any enjoyment. I'm not sure if I'm going back to Ganon or some other character (considering ROB or Luigi), but beating Fonz and his MK partner in a 2v1 has sorta inspired me to see how far I can go with Ganon. I'm going for the top.

 

[Vex Kasrani]

I'll race you there. I'm officially dropping MK (except for certain matchups), since winning with him is no longer able to give me any enjoyment. I'm not sure if I'm going back to Ganon or some other character (considering ROB or Luigi), but beating Fonz and his MK partner in a 2v1 has sorta inspired me to see how far I can go with Ganon. I'm going for the top.

Ya son, who told you to go Ganon at MLG? ;]

 

[Clai]

You'll be missed, PK. But your decision is understandable. But I think most Ganon mains know that they'd probably win money if they went to a higher tier. Most of them don't just because they don't have that kind of interest in going that far.

****, son, every time I try using a higher-tier character for the 'play-to-win' mantra, I do worse than when I'm Ganon. Yeah, you can say that I just need to practice other characters more, but I say to them, but that'd be time I should be using practicing Ganon.

I want to make playoffs, make New England PR and seize the top Ganon spot (THAT'S RIGHT KALM, I'M COMING FOR YA! >:U).

Yeah, but you have no chance at being the manliest Ganon, which, imo, is much more rewarding. Being the best will get you respected, for sure, but being the manliest will get you feared.

 

[Divilenta]

Honestly I have no desire to play anything hither tier. It's not because they're so high up there, it's because it just seems...how do I put it. Too easy. Not my style. I like a good fight, not just LOL METAKNIGHT and I win. Maybe I don't like easy fights so much because I really don't have anybody good to play against offline...it really gets boring after awhile. The main reason I've been so active in Brawl lately is building all kinds of custom stages for awesome minigames like Capture the Flag. Get some.

 

[Vermanubis]

****, son, every time I try using a higher-tier character for the 'play-to-win' mantra, I do worse than when I'm Ganon. Yeah, you can say that I just need to practice other characters more, but I say to them, but that'd be time I should be using practicing Ganon.





Yeah, but you have no chance at being the manliest Ganon, which, imo, is much more rewarding. Being the best will get you respected, for sure, but being the manliest will get you feared.

FOOL. I AM Ganondorf!

Edit: GANON ALSO FORGETS TO THROW OUT HIS USED TP ROLLS AND DECORATES HIS BATHROOM WITH CUTE LITTLE SEAHORSES.

 

[Divilenta]

^Epic Win.

10 s

 

[Sgt. Baker]

I was about to comment on the Ganon Rolls in the background.

EPIC

 

[TP]

Everyone knows that seahorses are basically small, aquatic Ganons.

 

[Bahamut777]

man...
every ganon mainer should have a photo of himself with some MANLY pose...

I was seized by Vermanubis' manlyness!

 

[Terodactyl Yelnats]

Nothing beats those seahorses though -_-

 

[Bahamut777]

Vermanubis 4 da most ganny ganon!

 

[Dajayman]

I want your babies Verm.

 

[SLASHinator]

man...
every ganon mainer should have a photo of himself with some MANLY pose...

OHMY new thread idea?




Hi guise, I'm 'new' here (been lurking a time), old Ganondorf main. I already know Verm and the Flying Dutchman (I'm more of a grounded Dutchman imo), also I revere the Dorf. Though I have been using Kirby for more serious matches (regrettably with greater effect), I'll always main the Dorf.

 

[Clai]

Epic picture with seahorses

Fool, it's not the pose that makes you manly, it's the way you play Ganon that determines your manliness. Ganondorf has no time to play silly bait games, Ganon swats all of his opponents' desperate attempts to strike him and DESTROYS THEIR ****!

Ganon smites offstage opponents with his iron-clad moots of darkness; he grabs them by the throat and sends them downward, where they can only hope that there's ground below them to make their deaths a quick and painless one. Ganon punches his opponents so hard that he punches their souls out and then eats the hostless bodies like they were prime ribs. Ganon wears the blood of his opponents so that he can literally drip with manliness.

My Ganon is a bulwark of manliness, and nothing can topple it. Fear all that is man!

[I hold a motion that Vermanubis gets a "Most Epic Ganon" award. He more than deserves it]

 

[Vermanubis]

Fool, it's not the pose that makes you manly, it's the way you play Ganon that determines your manliness. Ganondorf has no time to play silly bait games, Ganon swats all of his opponents' desperate attempts to strike him and DESTROYS THEIR ****!

Ganon smites offstage opponents with his iron-clad moots of darkness; he grabs them by the throat and sends them downward, where they can only hope that there's ground below them to make their deaths a quick and painless one. Ganon punches his opponents so hard that he punches their souls out and then eats the hostless bodies like they were prime ribs. Ganon wears the blood of his opponents so that he can literally drip with manliness.

My Ganon is a bulwark of manliness, and nothing can topple it. Fear all that is man!

[I hold a motion that Vermanubis gets a "Most Epic Ganon" award. He more than deserves it]

Clai... ! *grasps fast and presses manly chests together*... Brother! T'was not the pose through which I sought to measure the masculine worth of the great, pernicious King! It was merely a symbol of channeling; a movement through which I sought to imbue horror to the very core of all those ****ed enough to bear witness. To flaunt the burning, infernal confidence of malice that flows in Ganon's veins!

To, in a single motion, impart the very essence of horror and death unto the unworthy, so that in the meandering hell of the dark abyss, they may eternally wander, lost and reverent of the One True King! To agonize forever with the sole image left in their minds; the supreme terror of my ruthless bloodlust.

 

[PK-ow!]

Fool, it's not the pose that makes you manly, it's the way you play Ganon that determines your manliness. Ganondorf has no time to play silly bait games, Ganon swats all of his opponents' desperate attempts to strike him and DESTROYS THEIR ****!

Ganon smites offstage opponents with his iron-clad moots of darkness; he grabs them by the throat and sends them downward, where they can only hope that there's ground below them to make their deaths a quick and painless one. Ganon punches his opponents so hard that he punches their souls out and then eats the hostless bodies like they were prime ribs. Ganon wears the blood of his opponents so that he can literally drip with manliness.

My Ganon is a bulwark of manliness, and nothing can topple it. Fear all that is man!

[I hold a motion that Vermanubis gets a "Most Epic Ganon" award. He more than deserves it]

How to play vs. Meta Knight:

1 . First you want to get into
1. Unplug their controller
2. If 1 doesn't work or there are too many unskewered eyes in the venue.... ****, you'll actually have to play the game.

Okay.

3. Don't jump.

If you jump, you get juggled. If you get put offstage, you take 80%, and then juggled or gimped. If MK juggles you or gimps, you die. (Dying means you lose)

This rule contradicts a later point where I'm going to say to Thunderstorm. Well too bad. Don't ****ing jump. This means don't reflex DAir when he gets "in your space" like a ****ing '08 Ganon. March '08 Ganon. It doesn't accomplish anything anyway, even if you cross MK up.

We learned Ganon has risk reward. In this matchup, you don't take risks. You play perfectly.

4.
Ganon has one option to stop a basic walk-up, and that's ftilt. This ftilt is safe on block, but only if you get him with the sole of the boot, not any closer. Else he shieldgrabs.
However, it's safe in the sense you can do something before MK can hit you... but you'll be forced to shield + something if he runs up right after blocking. Remember though that he has to *run*, and at that distance it means DA, Dash grab (which has a goofy box from MK), or jump aerial, no normals. JC Usmash is punishable f10 at least after shield drop and is completely abuseable if spot dodged, so it's just inferior to DA; don't worry about it. He can't dash up shield unless he stops right in front of you, and Ganon's grab (lag) is faster than his insemination (when he gets serious). In short: Don't answer options he doesn't even have.

Thankfully, ftilt also has a range that compares to Ganon and MK's roll such that the threat of walk-up ftilt from you is real pressure. MK has to do something before you get to that range, unless he's planning to dodge. This opens you into Fsmash game, Ganon's general slow brutal murdering techniques, and what I'm getting to called "Ganon's mixup."
Oh, and perfect shield dtilt. On reaction. I'm not even joking.


For other kinds of approaches, you've got pivot grab - sliding pivot or not. (To slide, enter the grab at about the point the sound finishes, or when you could have foxtrotted. It's a friction effect for Ganon, so it has to do with where his foot is.) Ganon's grab, surprisingly, will get MK out of the air, but you had to already have cleared a certain distance. The slide is, if applied in the situation I want to communicate, safe on whiff, if you use only when MK is in the air, and he doesn't Dimensional Cape, because he can't cover the horizontal distance.
To shore up pivot grab's goofiness, if terrain is flat, or you're retreating into lower ground, there's thunder storming. TS makes it hard for MK to roll around underneath you, but it will lose to "wait". (The pivot grab is helped by uneven terrain.)
I need to stress TS in this MU is about taking initiative. TS before he gets under you; see how fast his reaction is, and what he likes to do with split seconds. You're showing ownership of your space, you're flinging your strongest box around, the one that kills MK in five. You hope to hit but you don't expect to. But if you could possibly be read into doing it and whiff punished? It's a bad reflex, stifle it. Mix in more grab / footsie.
You only do it because of him rolling around. And he will start rolling around, because if he doesn't he can't really move. His super F/DAir makes it look like he's mobile, but he's barely more mobile than you. He sucks out of dash. Without Roll you can corner him in so many ways, plus Fsmash is basically only answerable with roll, even if on reaction.
(btw, don't Dsmash. NAir is better.)


5.
If MK becomes very aerial, or jumps from far away and comes in from the vertical, you've got Usmash if you can actually nail the moment of his descent (MK's aerials can't clash with attacks; Tornado doesn't work 'down'). I stress "vertical", I mean 90 degrees. Abuse that IASA and act between MK's jumps so you either hit, or can shield and get away if he jumped again.

If he's not vertical, but is 'aerial' in the sense I mean here, he's hanging around your head. For that, he's obviously going to play around your A, but what you've got is a pivot grab as said, a slide effect out of your dodge if you want it, a nice roll, and BAir. There's an art to using BAir in a way that won't be caught by the sword, that will hit MK sooner than he thinks, and gives you a kind of initiative if it actually deters as an air anti-air. (Ganon should land before MK). Remember BAir only works for an MK "up"; one or two air jumps above the ground, for him. BAir sucks a-t-g.
BAir ends up being the move you use the least, because it's really bad if baited, but you hope to make it the one that sticks out in your opponent's mind the most, so he underestimates your movement tools.


6.
So understand his (MK's) dilemma here. He can't go through jab (although he'd love to cut your hand with his FAir; don't be tricked). So either he gets into the air and comes from mostly above that line, or he gets within your bubble first and comes up from below it. You have less ways to hit him if he comes from above, but keep cool and he actually has little ways to hit you. Refer to step 3. Roll, stay center stage, dash around (for pivot grab). Think ahead to when he runs out of jumps, save shield because you can't let Nado stab it. Just don't ****ing jump. Not even if your Uair would hit, don't ****ing do it.

A few small words: If you have tons of shield, sure, its not in your favour, but you can let MK come down through it. When he's low on jumps, he can't repeat rising DAir too many times; what he'll do is aerial, then something else to keep you blocking, then something on block or a get-away/grab. Answer these, of course, by waiting for the moment he's the one who can choose wrong, and either block something unsafe, or calmly drop shield (/ roll a grab) and chase his get away. You have to do this sometimes or MK can always land when he wants, by telegraphing this very attempt.​

When he comes in from low, he's got one set of tools which have basic answers from you, and the other set of tools which are the "strong" ones you'll actually see. Study his grab box; it's actually crap, and I paid for it SO LONG not knowing when it wouldn't even connect. Answer this 'low' approach with pivot grabs, TS, ftilt when he ****s up or hesitates.


His 'high' approach is better for you IMO, with payoff, but it requires a higher energy level. A lot of interactions go on in a second in this situation. The low approach is simplistic and at a low energy level, which MK styles may disfavour, but it lets him work on you psychologically more. You have to blank your mind and be inherently random while still paying attention, when playing the low game. Might be good to forget about predicting, and make him the one who has to predict. If you predict all the time, you just betray what your fears and expectations are. The high approach isn't mindgames, but technical interaction. You need air control, focus, foxtrotting / pivot grabbing (which I don't have consistently...), and not just any pivot grabbing but control over the two kinds relevant here; you need to move on the ground without taking eyes off of him in the air; if the stage isn't FD, you need awareness of the terrain and the consequences of the irregularities. Oh, and I understate this all the time, but you need to know how fast you walk, how fast MK jumps, falls, and drifts. You have to piece the (implied) numbers together to see the spatial relationships as they could work out a couple dozen frames from now, unconsciously (as unconsciously as you link Choke -> dtilt on peeps by now).


7.
Apply all of the above, and if the opponent isn't perfect (<==> the opponent makes a mistake (<==> if you've got a bloody chance in Hell) ), the opponent is going to lose his positioning. He's now close but not too close, has no momentum, has no frame advantage, and is probably "landing" (past the point of jumping).
You now apply "Ganon's mixup".
Ganon's mixup is the following garbage:
Dash up, Choke.
Dash up, Dash Attack
Dash up, stop (true pivot cancel, ideally), chase response.

Ganon's DA beats any attack, jump, and is situationally good on rolling. Choke beats shield, nothing, and late attacks.
The 'dash up' is because you've got to make most of 'em look like Dash Attack even though shield ***** it. There's a certain distance you use the Choke or DA from where you'll stop more than a leap from MK if you go through invincibility. You're trying to do this though where he'll feel too at risk to roll; you want to gel him; mostly, don't take the 'mixup' but rather look for an Fsmash, getting him to block at tip... or that ftilt.
If he indeed dodges you're kind of boned, but that's connected to the third item there, and this eighth point:


8.
If Meta Knight rolls, sidesteps, or air dodges, murder him.
I said don't jump up there. Okay, really, don't jump. But now you've got Air choke, Smashes, Nair, and BAir. Air Choke combines seamlessly with kara BAir. NAir is for MKs who haven't technically mastered the stringest requirements of his pressure. But make sure MK is 50%+ or he'll attack you after hit. BAir still sucks air to ground.

Gauge whether dtilt or ftilt is going to kill this stock. Depends how much ftilt staled. (I've forgotten, does ftilt stale on shield?) In actual practice, I've found ftilt still kills when it should off Choke.


9.
You now hit the opponent. Congrats. Don't chase him, because you've got nothing. Start over. Either MK lands far away or does an air approach. Watch out for Nado, but get reasonably close to his landing point. Don't get too close to edge, don't get overeager. Unlike the Snake matchup, MK can get that landing, and you don't need to keep it from him to win.


X.
Remember that some things MK does aren't safe on hit at low percents, or situationally. ftilt from him at tip give you time to make him uncomfortable, if you don't screw up and turn around or shield, but consciously roll or shield pressure him back. NAir, likewise, actually terrible if it doesn't induce tumble.
Don't play afraid of these attacks; you literally want to get hit by them, as they're the best opening you'll see.



tl; dr

BAIT.

Or, you know, lose. Three straight stocks. While he toys with you seeing how many unpunished Tornadoes he can get off. Or gives you one stock, to see how long it actually takes you when he DIs, and how many trades he can get because of his parallel-rules-moveset bs + your reckless spacing. I know people really do this.


So there's my analysis.

Opinion on the matchup: 0:100. Ganon can't win you scrub. You actually thought this would help you win? Dair dair dair Nado Meta Knight da bess, scrub.


This is all just how to look manly as you fight, rather than pathetic, frail, and compensatory using a VG villain. To actually make your opponent think the whole time, even if he doesn't have to think hard, try hard, guess right, or fear your damage to win more often than air planes safely reach their destination without emergency.

Because that's what it is. I said a lot to points otherwise in the early days I know, but Ganon is the same as any character: To put the fear of God in a player, is by playing right, 100%, the whole time, no matter the risk, the hype, the backlash, the money, your damage, their clutch, or the calamity of the finishing blow. End with Jab, end with BAir, however you do it, it's because the opponent walked into it one too many times. That's what makes that moment your triumph. You did this because you actually made the opponent walk into them a bunch of other times... or even better, avoid it so utterly that the moment it comes completely blows their mind. That is, you create the chance for mistakes. You create mistakes by doing what's correct, 100%, all the time. And then, you are ****** because you won.
Not because you command grabbed.
Not because you sprayed purple everywhere.
Not because you broke his shield.

But because you did what the opponent could not keep up with, for three whole stocks, through all of his attempts to discourage you, from the moment the game said "Choose your character." And then, in just another moment of crucial decision, you made the chance for a mistake. And a mistake happened.
gg.



Hint: The increase in profane content from my baseline is not a result of rage or bitterness vis a vis Ganon. I just thought it gave the right voice to the breakdown.
Plus it's profane content. I was out of place not having too much of that around here before.



Murder

Spoiler

Actually I'd love to upload pictures in a thread. Other boards had it.
I know what shot to take to leave you all in awe...

 

[Bahamut777]

I love PK-ow!
I would love being ***** by him.

 

[Z1GMA]

FOOL. I AM Ganondorf!

Edit: GANON ALSO FORGETS TO THROW OUT HIS USED TP ROLLS AND DECORATES HIS BATHROOM WITH CUTE LITTLE SEAHORSES.

^****

man...
every ganon mainer should have a photo of himself with some MANLY pose...

Srsly... I'm in for it.

How to play vs. Meta Knight:

1 . First you want to get into
1. Unplug their controller
2. If 1 doesn't work or there are too many unskewered eyes in the venue.... ****, you'll actually have to play the game.

Okay.

3. Don't jump.

If you jump, you get juggled. If you get put offstage, you take 80%, and then juggled or gimped. If MK juggles you or gimps, you die. (Dying means you lose)

This rule contradicts a later point where I'm going to say to Thunderstorm. Well too bad. Don't ****ing jump. This means don't reflex DAir when he gets "in your space" like a ****ing '08 Ganon. March '08 Ganon. It doesn't accomplish anything anyway, even if you cross MK up.

We learned Ganon has risk reward. In this matchup, you don't take risks. You play perfectly.

4.
Ganon has one option to stop a basic walk-up, and that's ftilt. This ftilt is safe on block, but only if you get him with the sole of the boot, not any closer. Else he shieldgrabs.
However, it's safe in the sense you can do something before MK can hit you... but you'll be forced to shield + something if he runs up right after blocking. Remember though that he has to *run*, and at that distance it means DA, Dash grab (which has a goofy box from MK), or jump aerial, no normals. JC Usmash is punishable f10 at least after shield drop and is completely abuseable if spot dodged, so it's just inferior to DA; don't worry about it. He can't dash up shield unless he stops right in front of you, and Ganon's grab (lag) is faster than his insemination (when he gets serious). In short: Don't answer options he doesn't even have.

Thankfully, ftilt also has a range that compares to Ganon and MK's roll such that the threat of walk-up ftilt from you is real pressure. MK has to do something before you get to that range, unless he's planning to dodge. This opens you into Fsmash game, Ganon's general slow brutal murdering techniques, and what I'm getting to called "Ganon's mixup."
Oh, and perfect shield dtilt. On reaction. I'm not even joking.


For other kinds of approaches, you've got pivot grab - sliding pivot or not. (To slide, enter the grab at about the point the sound finishes, or when you could have foxtrotted. It's a friction effect for Ganon, so it has to do with where his foot is.) Ganon's grab, surprisingly, will get MK out of the air, but you had to already have cleared a certain distance. The slide is, if applied in the situation I want to communicate, safe on whiff, if you use only when MK is in the air, and he doesn't Dimensional Cape, because he can't cover the horizontal distance.
To shore up pivot grab's goofiness, if terrain is flat, or you're retreating into lower ground, there's thunder storming. TS makes it hard for MK to roll around underneath you, but it will lose to "wait". (The pivot grab is helped by uneven terrain.)
I need to stress TS in this MU is about taking initiative. TS before he gets under you; see how fast his reaction is, and what he likes to do with split seconds. You're showing ownership of your space, you're flinging your strongest box around, the one that kills MK in five. You hope to hit but you don't expect to. But if you could possibly be read into doing it and whiff punished? It's a bad reflex, stifle it. Mix in more grab / footsie.
You only do it because of him rolling around. And he will start rolling around, because if he doesn't he can't really move. His super F/DAir makes it look like he's mobile, but he's barely more mobile than you. He sucks out of dash. Without Roll you can corner him in so many ways, plus Fsmash is basically only answerable with roll, even if on reaction.
(btw, don't Dsmash. NAir is better.)


5.
If MK becomes very aerial, or jumps from far away and comes in from the vertical, you've got Usmash if you can actually nail the moment of his descent (MK's aerials can't clash with attacks; Tornado doesn't work 'down'). I stress "vertical", I mean 90 degrees. Abuse that IASA and act between MK's jumps so you either hit, or can shield and get away if he jumped again.

If he's not vertical, but is 'aerial' in the sense I mean here, he's hanging around your head. For that, he's obviously going to play around your A, but what you've got is a pivot grab as said, a slide effect out of your dodge if you want it, a nice roll, and BAir. There's an art to using BAir in a way that won't be caught by the sword, that will hit MK sooner than he thinks, and gives you a kind of initiative if it actually deters as an air anti-air. (Ganon should land before MK). Remember BAir only works for an MK "up"; one or two air jumps above the ground, for him. BAir sucks a-t-g.
BAir ends up being the move you use the least, because it's really bad if baited, but you hope to make it the one that sticks out in your opponent's mind the most, so he underestimates your movement tools.


6.
So understand his (MK's) dilemma here. He can't go through jab (although he'd love to cut your hand with his FAir; don't be tricked). So either he gets into the air and comes from mostly above that line, or he gets within your bubble first and comes up from below it. You have less ways to hit him if he comes from above, but keep cool and he actually has little ways to hit you. Refer to step 3. Roll, stay center stage, dash around (for pivot grab). Think ahead to when he runs out of jumps, save shield because you can't let Nado stab it. Just don't ****ing jump. Not even if your Uair would hit, don't ****ing do it.

A few small words: If you have tons of shield, sure, its not in your favour, but you can let MK come down through it. When he's low on jumps, he can't repeat rising DAir too many times; what he'll do is aerial, then something else to keep you blocking, then something on block or a get-away/grab. Answer these, of course, by waiting for the moment he's the one who can choose wrong, and either block something unsafe, or calmly drop shield (/ roll a grab) and chase his get away. You have to do this sometimes or MK can always land when he wants, by telegraphing this very attempt.​

When he comes in from low, he's got one set of tools which have basic answers from you, and the other set of tools which are the "strong" ones you'll actually see. Study his grab box; it's actually crap, and I paid for it SO LONG not knowing when it wouldn't even connect. Answer this 'low' approach with pivot grabs, TS, ftilt when he ****s up or hesitates.


His 'high' approach is better for you IMO, with payoff, but it requires a higher energy level. A lot of interactions go on in a second in this situation. The low approach is simplistic and at a low energy level, which MK styles may disfavour, but it lets him work on you psychologically more. You have to blank your mind and be inherently random while still paying attention, when playing the low game. Might be good to forget about predicting, and make him the one who has to predict. If you predict all the time, you just betray what your fears and expectations are. The high approach isn't mindgames, but technical interaction. You need air control, focus, foxtrotting / pivot grabbing (which I don't have consistently...), and not just any pivot grabbing but control over the two kinds relevant here; you need to move on the ground without taking eyes off of him in the air; if the stage isn't FD, you need awareness of the terrain and the consequences of the irregularities. Oh, and I understate this all the time, but you need to know how fast you walk, how fast MK jumps, falls, and drifts. You have to piece the (implied) numbers together to see the spatial relationships as they could work out a couple dozen frames from now, unconsciously (as unconsciously as you link Choke -> dtilt on peeps by now).


7.
Apply all of the above, and if the opponent isn't perfect (<==> the opponent makes a mistake (<==> if you've got a bloody chance in Hell) ), the opponent is going to lose his positioning. He's now close but not too close, has no momentum, has no frame advantage, and is probably "landing" (past the point of jumping).
You now apply "Ganon's mixup".
Ganon's mixup is the following garbage:
Dash up, Choke.
Dash up, Dash Attack
Dash up, stop (true pivot cancel, ideally), chase response.

Ganon's DA beats any attack, jump, and is situationally good on rolling. Choke beats shield, nothing, and late attacks.
The 'dash up' is because you've got to make most of 'em look like Dash Attack even though shield ***** it. There's a certain distance you use the Choke or DA from where you'll stop more than a leap from MK if you go through invincibility. You're trying to do this though where he'll feel too at risk to roll; you want to gel him; mostly, don't take the 'mixup' but rather look for an Fsmash, getting him to block at tip... or that ftilt.
If he indeed dodges you're kind of boned, but that's connected to the third item there, and this eighth point:


8.
If Meta Knight rolls, sidesteps, or air dodges, murder him.
I said don't jump up there. Okay, really, don't jump. But now you've got Air choke, Smashes, Nair, and BAir. Air Choke combines seamlessly with kara BAir. NAir is for MKs who haven't technically mastered the stringest requirements of his pressure. But make sure MK is 50%+ or he'll attack you after hit. BAir still sucks air to ground.

Gauge whether dtilt or ftilt is going to kill this stock. Depends how much ftilt staled. (I've forgotten, does ftilt stale on shield?) In actual practice, I've found ftilt still kills when it should off Choke.


9.
You now hit the opponent. Congrats. Don't chase him, because you've got nothing. Start over. Either MK lands far away or does an air approach. Watch out for Nado, but get reasonably close to his landing point. Don't get too close to edge, don't get overeager. Unlike the Snake matchup, MK can get that landing, and you don't need to keep it from him to win.


X.
Remember that some things MK does aren't safe on hit at low percents, or situationally. ftilt from him at tip give you time to make him uncomfortable, if you don't screw up and turn around or shield, but consciously roll or shield pressure him back. NAir, likewise, actually terrible if it doesn't induce tumble.
Don't play afraid of these attacks; you literally want to get hit by them, as they're the best opening you'll see.



tl; dr

BAIT.

Or, you know, lose. Three straight stocks. While he toys with you seeing how many unpunished Tornadoes he can get off. Or gives you one stock, to see how long it actually takes you when he DIs, and how many trades he can get because of his parallel-rules-moveset bs + your reckless spacing. I know people really do this.


So there's my analysis.

Opinion on the matchup: 0:100. Ganon can't win you scrub. You actually thought this would help you win? Dair dair dair Nado Meta Knight da bess, scrub.


This is all just how to look manly as you fight, rather than pathetic, frail, and compensatory using a VG villain. To actually make your opponent think the whole time, even if he doesn't have to think hard, try hard, guess right, or fear your damage to win more often than air planes safely reach their destination without emergency.

Because that's what it is. I said a lot to points otherwise in the early days I know, but Ganon is the same as any character: To put the fear of God in a player, is by playing right, 100%, the whole time, no matter the risk, the hype, the backlash, the money, your damage, their clutch, or the calamity of the finishing blow. End with Jab, end with BAir, however you do it, it's because the opponent walked into it one too many times. That's what makes that moment your triumph. You did this because you actually made the opponent walk into them a bunch of other times... or even better, avoid it so utterly that the moment it comes completely blows their mind. That is, you create the chance for mistakes. You create mistakes by doing what's correct, 100%, all the time. And then, you are ****** because you won.
Not because you command grabbed.
Not because you sprayed purple everywhere.
Not because you broke his shield.

But because you did what the opponent could not keep up with, for three whole stocks, through all of his attempts to discourage you, from the moment the game said "Choose your character." And then, in just another moment of crucial decision, you made the chance for a mistake. And a mistake happened.
gg.



Hint: The increase in profane content from my baseline is not a result of rage or bitterness vis a vis Ganon. I just thought it gave the right voice to the breakdown.
Plus it's profane content. I was out of place not having too much of that around here before.



Murder

Spoiler

Actually I'd love to upload pictures in a thread. Other boards had it.
I know what shot to take to leave you all in awe...

PK, I wish I was a girl, so that I would be able to wish that you would **** me. (no homo)

 

[Vermanubis]

KYEHKYEHKYEHKYEHKYEHEHEHEHEHEH!!!! GANON FEEDS ON THEIR FEAR! Revel in their complete submission to the one true King!

BWWWWAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! Look at them revere Ganon's strength!