Fthrow/Dthrow Chaingrab Thread

[Jmex]

Do you guys think switching one of the directions of the dpad to grab will help out? I was thinking of doing this.

The sliding off the Z sounds good too though.

 

[KayLo!]

Do you guys think switching one of the directions of the dpad to grab will help out? I was thinking of doing this.

The sliding off the Z sounds good too though.

Uhh that's basically the same as having Z set to grab, only I feel like it'd be awkward to CG with your left thumb on the d-pad.

Whatever works best for you, though. There's no right or wrong way to do it as long as it gets done.

 

[bigman40]

Oh yeah I forgot to elaborate. I dont know why, but I get the feeling that if you hold the z button longer then 3 frames even in the buffer zone youll buffer shield instead of grab, which is the problem most people have. Dont know if thats true or not but it could be.

So yeah, some people may already do this, but Im starting to do the chaingrab the way I short hopped in melee. Before Id just press the button and try to lift it up really fast, but because of the awkward button its a little hard to get it right all the time.

However, I found that if you slide your finger across instead of press the button it makes it much much easier. Basically just move your finger to the tip of the Z button and slide it down along the curve of the controller so it makes a loud clicky noise once your finger slides off the button. I've found that this has caused me to mess up way less. Like, it makes it ridiculously easy.

If you're shielding during the CG, then why don't you just hold down L/R and grab with A? I've been doing it this way since I tend to screw up with Z, and I barely have any problems with the CG that way.

 

[Piman34]

usually thats either not fast enough or if you use z, you aren't limited to shielding
thats just me

 

[bigman40]

usually thats either not fast enough or if you use z, you aren't limited to shielding
thats just me

I've only been too slow when doing it against a Snake (only done it about 3 times against them and they footstool out of it). The timing isn't that hard compared to Yoshi's CGs, so I don't see the problem to screwing them up XD

 

[Jmex]

So wait, holding L/R while while performing the throws and then pressing a will work just as good?

 

[bigman40]

So wait, holding L/R while while performing the throws and then pressing a will work just as good?

It's what I do, and I don't mess up the CG too many times. I guess it just depends on your style.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Are you sure you are doing the buffered one? You use L/R + A against MK and it still works?

 

[Yumewomiteru]

If everyone's having problems with z-grabbing, why not set X or Y to grab? then its basically shorthopping with the grab button.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

X and Y do the same thing as Z. If you hold it too long, you will still shield. The only thing that will NEVER shield is using the C-stick to grab...but most people depend on that.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

True, I use the C-stick for smashes and aerials, so I can never change that. But if people can shorthop with X or Y, but are holding Z for too long, then changing X or Y to grab will def help alot

 

[bigman40]

Are you sure you are doing the buffered one? You use L/R + A against MK and it still works?

I'm positive. You don't need to time L/R cause you just need to hold it down the whole time you're CGing. You only time A (which is kinda like timing Z but you don't really have the "**** I shielded" mistake as often). I've played a few MKs with Pika and I've done it to about 50% (only because I haven't memorized the numbers).

 

[Jmex]

^ Hmmm, i guess ill try this out this friday.

Does anyone know if this chaingrab can be tried out in training mode when the computer is set to jump or soemthing like that. I dont really have people to test it out with.

 

[KayLo!]

^ Hmmm, i guess ill try this out this friday.

Does anyone know if this chaingrab can be tried out in training mode when the computer is set to jump or soemthing like that. I dont really have people to test it out with.

You can practice buffering in Training, but your throws won't stale. It's better to practice in regular Brawl mode, imo, but some people beg to differ.....

*Looks at Stealth*

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

You can't test it in training mode. SInce the throws don't diminish the knockback is more so you won't be able to CG. Just have your wiimote as a person and then you, and make it a standstill computer. Get the timing with it. Most characters you won't be able to CG after the % it says anyway so you should be good.

 

[Jmex]

^ So this will work Esam?

Also @ Kaylo, will practicing on a level 9 comp work as well?

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Yeah. You may go higher than the %s on some characters, but the important thing is the timing, you can memorize % later.

 

[Stealth Raptor]

as i have said a billion times before, practicing the cg does not require the regrab, only the fact that you grabbed again. it doesnt matter if he was grabbed again or not, you can still visually see whether or not you grabbed correctly. i practiced in training mode and i dont mess up. you can train however you want, im just saying you can use practice mode

 

[Jmex]

^ Ok Stealth, thanks everyone.

I have one last question. Say for example Metaknight. Since he starts at 10% correct? The chaingrab lasts until about 60%? During these percentages, can he be grabbed and chaingrabed until the 60%, or does the chaingrab have to start from less than 10% with a grab leading to the following grabs?

Sorry if this is confusion.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

For MK specifically i basically know the %s. If you start at 10, you can get to 52. If you start at 11-20, you can get him to about 40. If you start at 30, i think you can get one grab.

 

[Jmex]

^ Ohhhhhh, so the grabs are dependent on when the first grab was initiated? Innnnnteresting!

 

[KayLo!]

as i have said a billion times before, practicing the cg does not require the regrab, only the fact that you grabbed again. it doesnt matter if he was grabbed again or not, you can still visually see whether or not you grabbed correctly. i practiced in training mode and i dont mess up. you can train however you want, im just saying you can use practice mode

It's still better to practice in Brawl mode, imo. You can get the fluid timing down better that way and not have to do it one grab at a time, which eventually happens in Training Mode because of the throw always being fresh. That, or you have to keep pressing Start to reset the percentage to 0, which just sounds annoying and not worth it.

But, whatever works for you. *shrug*

 

[Pikabunz]

Tag needs to update this thread!!!! I wish I could do it myself.

 

[TLMSheikant]

I guess im buffering correctly since I havent had the whole "oops i shielded situation" except against fox >.>. Against fox I find it better to hold shield while doing the down throws. But against snake, DDD, falco and metaknight I find it easier to just tap z at the correct time.

 

[Jmex]

Against Fox, its pretty much like, how do you not chain grab him, its so easy.

I got the timing down yesterday thanks guys. I did that whole slide the finger off the button thing, works pretty well.

 

[Dynamism?]

so um...
dedede, falco and snake...
i like it

edit
regarding that 'change controls for grab' thing...
If you use Lucas or some other character (yoshi, peach) that can actually benefit from having Z as jump and x or y as grab, then doing this for Pika is not bad. I eventually grew a second nature for having controls changed every match cause I used 'groups' of characters at tourneys and some were different control settings then others. SHing can be tough at first with Z but if you can get used to it, it actually opens a few options in terms of aerials... you can FH and instant aerial the frame you leave the ground in one direction while moving the other... something you can't do with normal controls... could be handy with QAC too ionno... and I guess makes it easier to grab? I donno why that would but is that what's being discussed over the last page? lol

 

[KayLo!]

Just curious: how often do you guys pull off the MK CG in an actual match?

I've seen Anther do it, and I can get the grab if the MK's not expecting it, but if they know about the CG...... it's almost impossible to actually get the grab on him with his range (unless he majorly f's up his spacing). Usually I just give up and switch back to playing normally, because trying too hard for the grab is suicide vs. MK.

I'm just wondering if there are easy grab setups I'm missing. Tjolt lead-ins, punishing landings, shieldgrabbing, etc..... gimme more ideas if you got 'em.

 

[Zee725]

it is rather difficult to get a hold of an MK and get the CG off, usually i just take their first stock off without CGing, and then their next stock go for it. They usually don't expect it on the second stock if you dont do it the first time. Usually they'll be using Dair and Fair to space the whole time, in which case I just camp with Tjolts until they realize that i'm not going for the grab, it really throws off an MKs game.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I get it quite a lot actually. MKs can either UP-B OOS, fair space, or dair space. If they try to space with fair or dair, just T-jolt camp them...and if they get hit, you are getting free % much like if you actually got the CG. If they UP-b OOS, punish their landing, since it will have A LITTLE time to retaliate.

 

[gallax]

i actually think its fairly easy to get a grab off on MK. i usually get at least one a match. and this is against good MK's who dair camp too. i just wait till they land and try to get it somehow. remember that a tornado usually leads to a free grab if shielded properly.

when i say grab i mean the beginning cg grab. grabbing MK is probably the difference maker in the MU imo. the more grabs the better chance you have at winning.

 

[Dynamism?]

3 grabs at 0% is the goal ;D

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

The F-throw->regrab is the hardest part if you get it at 0%

 

[Ussi]

Tag needs to update this thread!!!! I wish I could do it myself.

I believe a month and a half of not bothering to care for this means you should go make a new thread with your info. Besides didn't you do the best/most testing for this?

 

[KayLo!]

I believe a month and a half of not bothering to care for this means you should go make a new thread with your info. Besides didn't you do the best/most testing for this?

Or he could ask Xiivi to make him the OP if Tag doesn't mind. Much easier that way.

 

[Ussi]

Or he could ask Xiivi to make him the OP if Tag doesn't mind. Much easier that way.

if mods can do that, then go with that. Tag lost his rights in his say in this. He stopped caring about this thread.

 

[KayLo!]

it is rather difficult to get a hold of an MK and get the CG off, usually i just take their first stock off without CGing, and then their next stock go for it. They usually don't expect it on the second stock if you dont do it the first time. Usually they'll be using Dair and Fair to space the whole time, in which case I just camp with Tjolts until they realize that i'm not going for the grab, it really throws off an MKs game.

I get it quite a lot actually. MKs can either UP-B OOS, fair space, or dair space. If they try to space with fair or dair, just T-jolt camp them...and if they get hit, you are getting free % much like if you actually got the CG. If they UP-b OOS, punish their landing, since it will have A LITTLE time to retaliate.

i actually think its fairly easy to get a grab off on MK. i usually get at least one a match. and this is against good MK's who dair camp too. i just wait till they land and try to get it somehow. remember that a tornado usually leads to a free grab if shielded properly.

when i say grab i mean the beginning cg grab. grabbing MK is probably the difference maker in the MU imo. the more grabs the better chance you have at winning.

I almost forgot: thanks, guys. A lot of this is what I was already trying to do..... I guess I just need to work on it more.

if mods can do that, then go with that. Tag lost his rights in his say in this. He stopped caring about this thread.

Heh, harsh but true. We'll figure it out.

 

[The Truth!]

Ussi for the millionth and hopefully final time stfu about the things you know nothing about. You never had any rights regarding this thread in the first place. I have absolutely zero incentive to listen to you about anything especially regarding these chaingrabs after all the effort you put into destroying one of the advantages pikachu users should have had for the sake of making some backward attempt at advertising a game no serious smasher gives two ****s about. I already talked to Prime about the post he made and he gave me nothing to update. So rather then cluelessly make idiotic claims and stabs at me just sit down and shut up rather then continuously yourself look stupid. Im tired of having to deal with you regarding this subject.

 

[Meccs]

wow, this is great.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Does the CG have to be started at 0%? If I do it against Wolf and he has 20%, does it still work the same?

 

[KayLo!]

Does the CG have to be started at 0%? If I do it against Wolf and he has 20%, does it still work the same?

No, your dthrow will be too fresh. You missed the boat by that point, and he'll probably be able to reflector or jump out of it.