Fox is bad now?

[Duo55]

wolf is a good amount better then fox, and wolf is definitely faster than fox. Fox only runs fast, when it comes to moving about the stage and using platforms. Wolf is definitely faster.

I agree with lucient, Wolf is pretty much better than Fox in just about every aspect, or rather, wolf is far better suited for brawls engine. And for the record, wolfs D-smash is far better than fox's.

 

[soul ark]

i believe that fighting wolf involves using a slightly different play style and that would generally be the case is you are fighting a character that has something over you.

for instance when you fight diddy you might want to use your reflector more often than normal or when you fight falco you might fight at the corner and trying stall and run away tactics to keep the opponent at bay every fight warrants a particular way of playing.

and thats why i think we have this discussion right now because not to many people know how to not combo and run into traps while fighting a meta knight and snake (awesome example)

snake boards believe fox is at a disadvantage when they fight. but why is this it's not fox him self it's the play style most are playing (combo combo combo) not with snake you'll run right into a bomb.

give people the chance to play the game what it came out 6 months ago give fox a chance to grow.

 

[A6M Zero]

i believe that fighting wolf involves using a slightly different play style and that would generally be the case is you are fighting a character that has something over you.

for instance when you fight diddy you might want to use your reflector more often than normal or when you fight falco you might fight at the corner and trying stall and run away tactics to keep the opponent at bay every fight warrants a particular way of playing.

and thats why i think we have this discussion right now because not to many people know how to not combo and run into traps while fighting a meta knight and snake (awesome example)

snake boards believe fox is at a disadvantage when they fight. but why is this it's not fox him self it's the play style most are playing (combo combo combo) not with snake you'll run right into a bomb.

give people the chance to play the game what it came out 6 months ago give fox a chance to grow.

The last thing you want to do is try to stall a Falco, he's a perfect character to combo.

I love it when snake drops grenades, I'm doing more damage faster than he is, and he'll get to the kill zone I need quicker.

 

[soul ark]

The last thing you want to do is try to stall a Falco, he's a perfect character to combo.

I love it when snake drops grenades, I'm doing more damage faster than he is, and he'll get to the kill zone I need quicker.

what i meant was that to damage falco. the chain grab is really inevitable so it would be best to use non lagy moves and the blaster so you can rack up the damage before it happens

then by all means go ahead and combo falco to oblivion

 

[M@v]

For goodness sakes, here is the space animals in a nutshell.

Fox: aerial and combo master, and the best recovery by far. Worst blaster, Ground game needs work(besides upsmash). Fox is also the lightest.

Wolf: Spamming and ground game master. Aerials are so-so, but bair is very nice. Recovery sucks.

Falco: Not quite as good as fox in the air, and can't combo as well as fox(excluding CG). He is not quite as good as wolf on the ground, but his blaster is about equal to wolf's, but is used differently. However, Falco has a really well balanced game. Good horizontal recovery, very bad vertical recovery. Throw in the chain grab, the boost smash, and gattling combo and you got a top tier character.

 

[Heroes_Never_Die]

That blue font pisses me off.

On topic, I think Fox is decent. He suffers from terrible match-ups, which will be very difficult to change. Aside from the terrible match-ups though, I think he has a lot of potential.

 

[FreakingMethodiC]

Eh, whatever, I'm not talking about minor differences. You look at the whole picture of Fox/Falco/Wolf (or Faxolf as I so ingeniously dubbed the trio) and one word comes to mind : Clone. I get your point on "This isn't SSBM", they aren't as much of clones as they were, but it seems as though the decloning process is only half completed. (And then Wolf was added at the same state as Falco, half clone, half not. For reasons unknown to all.) They play differently yes, but it is merely minor changes in their respective move sets that set them apart. It's not like comparing Pikachu and Bowser. I am comparing 3 VERY similar characters.

.CMW.

I understand to an extent comparing Fox and Falco who aren't close at all in move set... but wolf is like a whole nother animal buddy.

And about wolf's Bair haven more priority then fox's airs is pretty silly thing to say, when fox's FAir goes through most attacks in the game so far.

 

[M@v]

Also adding to my post above.

In my honest opinion,

Falco>Fox>Wolf

 

[thumbswayup]

Don't mess with Smooth, he'll **** your **** up.

Btw Brawl ruined Fox, just like it ruined smash.

 

[Foxy Alopex]

To me Fox is still good and I like his new model hehe. *grins*

 

[chaos_Leader]

I feel like I've walked onto a murder scene with blood and innards splattered over the wall.

anyways,

On the 'clone' issue:
Since fox Falco and Wolf are based out of the same basic framework, its easier for my muscle memory to transition between them, that's why I can main all three spacies at once. What really sets them apart is the application purposes of their moves; the muscles can make the change easy, its the mind that has to work at it. Each character requires a different mindset, most of which have been discussed.

.CMW.
You can't just come in out of nowhere and expect your opinion to be automatically respected, you have to earn it. You use the justification "In my personal experience" a lot. Here's what you do: you go out and expand your experiences, fast. I drove 300 miles to go to my first tournament and I don't regret it one bit. Even though I was performing reasonably well in the friendlies, I bombed in the competition (turns out I crack under pressure, hard). I Learned a lot, most of my local tournament-goers are far more defensive players than the players I'm used to playing against. (who aren't bad, just ridiculously aggressive) I had to completely form new strategies on the fly. The best way to learn is to be beaten, learn from it and win the next round. You'd be surprised how creative you can get when you're against slip odds.

 

[MaNg0]

i agree

i ****


=D

 

[JigglyZelda003]

To me Fox is still good and I like his new model hehe. *grins*

O.O
me too!!! i love Foxs new model. lol

 

[HeroMystic]

Wow, the space animal debates is about as bad as the Mario vs Luigi debates.

But how come people hate Fox's new model? I think it's badass, plus he has a scouter. :D

 

[Zhamy]

But how come people hate Fox's new model? I think it's badass, plus he has a scouter. :D

Fox looks like he's wearing 500 pound boots.

 

[KheldarVII]

I understand to an extent comparing Fox and Falco who aren't close at all in move set... but wolf is like a whole nother animal buddy.

And about wolf's Bair haven more priority then fox's airs is pretty silly thing to say, when fox's FAir goes through most attacks in the game so far.

That F-air can eat MK's glide attack, and then serve up the rest of the 5 course meal.

 

[RNDM!]

no...just no

 

[Smash_Man001]

If your even gonna use Fox, use him in Melee. Shining is good, pistol lasers go far, etc. I still like playing melee. Nothing can compare to it. Not even Brawl.

 

[chaindude]

. I still like playing melee. Nothing can compare to it. Not even Brawl.

thats flamebait for a debate....

 

[Storm_Fox]

You just need a strategy for each character now instead of realing on just one for all

 

[JigglyZelda003]

i don't think G@W Bair wall needs a ton of strategy other than knowing how to not force your body on them while doing it.

 

[NinjaFoxX]

thats flamebait for a debate....

you dont understand the truthiness of the above quote

melee>brawl but you're obviously too inexperienced to know why

 

[~ Gheb ~]

^ Sarcasm doesn't work thru the internez...

 

[kriatevPit]

wow guys... fox is good...ok...AMAZING. if you use him right. or are just incredibly intuitive with fast reaction speed.

on the clone debate is stupid noone is really a clone anymore link and toon link maybe but thats pushing it.

needless to say redundancing is in order and fox is a BAMF-A$S-MOFO

 

[JigglyZelda003]

if link and Tlink are still clone like then Mario and luigi are still clone like. theres quite enough differences between link and Tlink to make them their own separate characters, especially since one works like a heavy wieght and the other a lightwieght. they both have the same assortment of weapons too so how big on differnt looking moves can you get?

/clone rants

 

[§witch]

Well, TL and link are the closest things to clones in brawl.

 

[GrayPlague]

The only time I've heard complaints about how crappy Fox is is in matches against Pikachu. So, no, I don't think he's THAT bad.

 

[punked_25]

How many more of these kind of threads are we going to see?

 

[JigglyZelda003]

a whole bunch on any character thats not amazing. JP's was a hot topic 4 months ago lol

 

[punked_25]

Oh no .......

 

[Smash_Man001]

thats flamebait for a debate....

Why say that I posted that for a flamebait? Are you a psycho who can read my mind? That was a declarative sentence saying I like Melee a little more than brawl. I hate the competitiveness on this board.

 

[KheldarVII]

This thread is getting a little too many replies.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

^the way it was posted it could be interpereted by some as a flamebait for debate.

Edit: @Kheldar7
don't worry lol. after a while like the jp one months ago it will die out. even the one on the C.Falcon boards is slowly dying off

 

[JhMS]

i agree

i ****


=D

Mango posting in the Brawl Fox boards FTW!.
Anyway:
I also believe Fox has potential.Not top tier and that but maybe High Tier.
Still,I see that some people think Fox has an advantage versus Metaknight and Falco.
I know its their opinion but I disagree heavily.
Maybe we should make a thread about Foxs weaknesses(sp?English is not my first language).
The biggest thing we need is some tourney representation...

 

[JigglyZelda003]

@JhMS
have you looked at the new Fox matchup chart recently? when it went over MK gimping is really the biggest thing he's got on Fox. theres more, but it was unanimously agreed that that matchup is pretty even. on Falco its still kinda good on his end, but not by alot, especially when it comes to KOing Fox.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I don't know about the match-up thread but Fox is certainly not "pretty even" with MK.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

when i fight mk w/ Fox the only thing i feel seriosly threatened about is gimping, but thats just me. go look @ it yourself and see what other better Fox mains thought about the matchup against MK. its not an easy 5:5 match but its not just outright Fox disadvantage.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

That match-up thread is so wrong, I don't have time to read through all of that crap. Fox a Snake hard counter??? Lmao

 

[JigglyZelda003]

who says hard counter? it doesn't say that.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

They have a 70:30 advatage. That's a hard counter