Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[Randizzle]

i suck more =p
(insert warming up johns in early pools matches here...)

for the fox ditto, thunders combo (if you've got the tech), lots of grabs, and good edgeguarding. i actually find myself usmashing a little less in fox dittos and using a lot of nairs and bairs, but the only notable fox i usually get to ditto is scotu (and i haven't played a ditto with him for quite a while) so i should probably just stop talking.

 

[SCOTU]

lol. I'm not worth noting.

 

[Zankoku]

I suck a lot.

FC's rankings are inaccurate for determining skill when it comes to the pools. It implies that I suck equally as much as you, which we know is completely false. scotu >>> Ankoku.

 

[brawlpro]

scotu sayin u suck implies most of us suck like ****, don't say that!

 

[Oskurito]

At recovering: From a ledgewavedash (done with full invincibility) can lead into all of the following options while still being invincible when the hitbox comes out:
Jab
Shield
Ftilt
Utilt
Dsmash
Usmash
Shine

@ Oskurito:


I suck a lot.

nope imo 129 of 250 is ok (I wonder how I'll place if I go there...)

 

[Shai Hulud]

At recovering: From a ledgewavedash (done with full invincibility) can lead into all of the following options while still being invincible when the hitbox comes out:
Jab
Shield
Ftilt
Utilt
Dsmash
Usmash
Shine

@ Oskurito:


I suck a lot.

This is what I expected...unfortunately I still SD a high enough percentage of the time on ledge dashes to make this a very risky tactic. Guess I'll just practice more. Any tips on method?

 

[Silent Wolf]

What some Fox players do is drop quite low then do the ledgedash, so not to miss-time it. you could do this after dropping and re-grabbing the ledge a few times. it would make them think you're just going to re-grab again because you're still going low.

 

[brawlpro]

phfft, listen to da man above me!

 

[SCOTU]

Unfortunately, with that method, you don't get your invincibility. But for the other type, simple. Hit down, then wavedash like normal. The normal wavedash timing works. Same if you shine, your waveshine timing works too.

edit: @ oskurito: you've got to keep in mind that i tied with like 50 ppl for 129th, and there are only like 4 or 5 places below that.

 

[Falco&Victory]

scotu, did you just question Silent Wolf?

I find it simplest just to use Falco.
Jk, his WD is hard to learn

Try varying heights, mindgames

 

[Shai Hulud]

What some Fox players do is drop quite low then do the ledgedash, so not to miss-time it. you could do this after dropping and re-grabbing the ledge a few times. it would make them think you're just going to re-grab again because you're still going low.

This sounds like a good idea. I can waveland pretty consistently if I drop a bit first. I've been trying to do frame perfect ledgedashes, but if I mess up even slightly I usually SD so I don't know if it's worth it, even for the invincibility frames.

 

[4 Aces]

Is there any use for jab canceling? Like, does it allow you to grab/*insert move here* quicker?

Does SHL-->shine/SHDL-->shine have any use like reflecting projectiles while lasering?
If you use the shine and reflect something with it, is there a way to get out/cancel the lag?

Would it be adviseable to do a dashed shine to grab? Is it even effective? I tested it yesterday, and it does work, but I'm not sure how effective this technique really is (or the upsmash version for that matter).

 

[SCOTU]

no, i in no way questioned SW. I just gave the other common method (the one i use more commonly).

Jab cancelling only allows you to perform your jab after a jab instead of the 2nd punch.

shl>shine can work. Sometimes. Don't be predictable with it. And don't reflect things that shouldn't be reflected. No, there's no way to avoid reflection lag.

Those work on every character. If you JC the shine, you can turn a jc grab/ usmash from 8 frame startup into an equivalent 4 frame startup. Dash cancelled, there's no benefit.

 

[brawlpro]

how do you jab-cancle...yup, i'm a n00b...

 

[SCOTU]

how do you jab-cancle...yup, i'm a n00b...

You IASA your jab with a crouch, and then cancel the duck animation with a jab. basically, it cancels the window to press A to continue the rapid a with a crouch (which gets canceled into a jab)

I've got frame data (in my frame thread). It's listed as falco's, but they're exactly the same.

 

[Silent Wolf]

If you hold a certain direction (Downward and at an angle) you can just be set in the position to automatically jab cancel. Falcomist told me this after Zhu apparently found it out. it's way fast.

 

[Shök]

im sorry, how does the jab cancel work?

 

[Foxmeister]

jab canceling is just tapping down and crouching after the jab and keep on doing that it's fast but i dont really recommend it unless your trying to break down the shield and even then shffled nair shines work better.

 

[Silent Wolf]

You can't jump cancel a jab.

 

[Mcscruff]

What is the easiest way to do the Shine->JC usmash? do you reccomend Y and A, or up on control and c stick?

 

[Silent Wolf]

I don't recommend it at all. if you mean Usmash out of shine.
I just use up on the control stick and A.

 

[Oskurito]

Yup the easiest and safest way is just shine and do the upsmash with the control stick and A so you do the attack and JC the shine at the same time, you can use the c-stick also but you've got to flick the control stick up for the jump cancel (jc).

 

[SCOTU]

It's only good in a few places. Ending wallshine infinites (use A for charge, making it better than the waveshine version), and for shining a shinefaller against a wall (use c-stick for speed, unless you feel manly enough to use a and not charge it - only hold A for one-two frames).

EDIT: is SW no longer in the Smash Back room?

 

[Silent Wolf]

of course I am, I'm a mod.

 

[Zankoku]

Check his profile, scotu. He's a Moderator, a BRoomer, a Smash BRoomer, and a Tournament Director. Moderator red just happens to have more priority than the rest of the colors.

Random question: How situational is a SHFFL'd uair?

 

[Shök]

hey guys, i have updated my thread with new videos, so any help will be appreciated!

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=112763&highlight=shok192

 

[SCOTU]

Check his profile, scotu. He's a Moderator, a BRoomer, a Smash BRoomer, and a Tournament Director. Moderator red just happens to have more priority than the rest of the colors.

Random question: How situational is a SHFFL'd uair?

Well, he's been a mod for some time now, but it was the smash back room purple for a while. So i wasn't sure. Forgot you could check profiles for that stuff. Good **** SW. I wish I were as good as S Wolf.

 

[brawlpro]

I wish I were as good as S Wolf.

other than pros...who doesn't...

 

[SCOTU]

well, some people look up to other pro foxen. There are a few foxen that i look up to, but they're all extremely technical.

BTW, SW is a pro.

 

[brawlpro]

dude, i knew he was a pro for a while, the other than pros part implied:if u were a pro, then why would u wanna be like SW, and i said who wouldn't want to be as good as SW sayin who wouldn't want to be as good as him, not if anyone didn't look up to him or somethin scotu =P

this didn't make sensce

VVV

 

[Miharu]

dude, i knew he was a pro for a while, the other than pros part implied:if u were a pro, then why would u wanna be like SW, and i said who wouldn't want to be as good as SW sayin who wouldn't want to be as good as him, not if anyone didn't look up to him or somethin scotu =P

That sort of didn't make any sense AT ALL.

Is Jungle Japes a good stage for Fox against non-spacies? Or which one of the counterpick stages would be good for Fox against something like Sheik/Marth, etc, since people tend to ban the stages that I'm more comfortable on.

 

[Silent Wolf]

I personally hate Japes more than any other stage by far.
if you're comfortable on Green Greens and can use it well, that would be a good CP.
I like Stadium more than anything though. FD against Sheik. Maybe DreamLand against Marth.

 

[Shai Hulud]

What about Poke Floats vs. Marth?

 

[brawlpro]

it can be evened out, marth can have a tuff time chaingrabing there tho.

that earlier post, yea, didn't word it rite...

 

[4 Aces]

It's only good in a few places. Ending wallshine infinites (use A for charge, making it better than the waveshine version), and for shining a shinefaller against a wall (use c-stick for speed, unless you feel manly enough to use a and not charge it - only hold A for one-two frames).

EDIT: is SW no longer in the Smash Back room?

Wouldn't the enemy escape if you tried to charge?

no, i in no way questioned SW. I just gave the other common method (the one i use more commonly).

Jab cancelling only allows you to perform your jab after a jab instead of the 2nd punch.

shl>shine can work. Sometimes. Don't be predictable with it. And don't reflect things that shouldn't be reflected. No, there's no way to avoid reflection lag.

Those work on every character. If you JC the shine, you can turn a jc grab/ usmash from 8 frame startup into an equivalent 4 frame startup. Dash cancelled, there's no benefit.

Does SHDL have equal benefits as the SHL version?
Wait, I don't get what you're saying about the dashed shine to grab/upsmash.

 

[SCOTU]

Wouldn't the enemy escape if you tried to charge?

If they don't fall to the shine, and you charge a jc usmash out of shine, you have ample time to charge it a bit (no need for the waveland lag of a waveshine).

Does SHDL have equal benefits as the SHL version?

SHDL is slower/ iteration. It shoots two lasers that's better for against some characters like peach and jiggs when far away to apply more pressure. The shl on the other hand is faster per iteration, and therefore, you can change your direction faster, allowing it to be better used at close ranges.

Wait, I don't get what you're saying about the dashed shine to grab/upsmash.

A jc usmash takes (at minimum) 8 frames to hit. (same w/ a jc grab).
A jc shine from dash takes 4 frames to hit, and can combo into a jc usmash/ grab.
A dash canceled shine takes 8 frames to hit, and combos into a jc usmash/ grab.

therefore, the only benefit to dash canceling a shine into a jc usmash or grab is the extra damage and invincibility (but worse hitbox).

using a jc shine on the other hand puts the hitbox out in only 4 frames, and combos into a usmash/ grab, allowing you to grab / smash someone in a smaller frame window (since you can hit them in only 4 frames as opposed to 8). Hope that makes more sense to you.

 

[Shai Hulud]

One good thing about SHDL over SHL is that you can move farther while doing it because you're airborne longer. Do RSDHL and DI back for instance. Most people can't really use mobile SHDL properly, though.

Shameless self-promotion time! Please watch my Fox vids, people. He needs your help. Together we can make a difference.

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=115087

 

[brawlpro]

alright buddy, currently loading here just so you know, i will watch them.

 

[captain mc cloud]

i dont know if this question is allowed but.. Silent Wolf how did you train your fox to become so technical..
because i'm just fighting lvl 1 peach on FD now, i can instantly drillshine and stuff.. but i wanna step it up now :D
so simply: how did you train?

 

[Silent Wolf]

When I'm just trying to master a technique, I use AR to make it only me there.
I practice combos and things like that on lv. 3 Fox, Marth, Peach, Falcon, Samus, and maybe another character every once in a while.