Falco Discussion Thread

Umbreon

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Ya, i acknowledge its a DAVID-SIRLIN-PLAY2WIN SCRUB mentality, but maybe there are some things more important than winning
lol every time kevin goes to a smash tournament, i ask him about his travels and not the tournament.

cause, you know, we'll talk about the smash eventually anyway.

cause we white homies.

kevin: see you at TGI Fridays

/white-man high 5.
 

Xyzz

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Haha, I'm somewhat like Bones. I really, really, really want to win, but if I don't, it's ok. I (hopefully) learned more than the other guy from our encounter, and I will keep practicing and do my best to get him next time :D
The only thing I get slightly mad at from time to time is myself for screwing up stuff I feel I shouldn't miss anymore, but never my opponent. Would be kinda hypocritical anyways, since I won't refrain from using any cheap trick in my book in order to win either, if it's a serious business tournament match (:
 

Bones0

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Ya, but i don't see why you would need to get mad to overcome obstacles, either way, my point is that you can be as cutthroat as you want, but i don't think people separate in the game from out of the game... you can lose a game and be mad at puff or whoever and be frustrated you lost, but you should have nothing but respect for someone who beat you. And if you truly respect them, you wouldn't sully their win by throwing a controller or johning later.
Well like I said, getting mad isn't a choice. If people get mad at Melee and can't help it, I would understand why they would use that to drive to make them more focused on winning because when you win you no longer care how they played or what happened. But like I said personally, I don't have this issue with Melee. I think back to playing you in Pritchard where I got rested and gimped over and over and over and at no point was I ever upset with YOU as a player or the game for letting it happen. I was obviously frustrated and upset, but only with myself because I am still so bad at the game. I've never experienced anything in Melee that made me feel like "yes, this is legitimately too difficult to learn to deal with." I think perhaps this happens more often at the top level (or maybe just on a larger scale) because of how engrained players are in their own perspective of the game. When someone like Armada gets pooped on by Hbox spamming bair and he legitimately feels helpless, I can understand why he would go the extreme route with YL. Whether you or I agree if it was necessary is irrelevant so long as to Armada it feels necessary.



"White-man high 5" seems redundant. I don't think I've ever seen any other ethnicity high 5... ever...
 

Dr Peepee

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Hey PP do you ever get super nervous during matches? I feel like I play terrible in tournament. My hands are sweaty, im all nervous. My friends are watching me. How do you block it out? Im sure you've been to enough tournaments that it doesn't effect you as much but I just get so nervous that I feel I just forget everything.
I'm seeing recurring topics here....I'll need to make a post on this soon to put in the OP.

But yes, everyone gets nervous. EVERYONE. M2K, Armada, Mango, Hbox, myself, EVERYONE. It's a human condition to get nervous before events and you'd be crazy if you didn't. Adrenaline pumps through your body and gets you hyped because your body is preparing itself for intense activity, why would you want to stop that?

When you get nervous, you can either focus on the feeling(like any emotion) or you can work to understand it and then work with it. You COULD focus on the fact that your cat died, or that everyone is watching you, or you have rent due next month and it'll be cut close, or any other random topic that can cause you added stress because human beings are amazing at doing that to themselves if you give them a chance. BUT you can also focus on why you're nervous: the competition will be difficult. That does not mean you should panic, but instead begin preparing appropriately. You have a tough match vs Fox coming up? You should be thinking about HOW to BEAT Fox(matchup) and how to beat the Fox player. Adrenaline will assist your thinking and keep you focused.

Warming up helps keep the nerves low, and allows you to prepare yourself for matches anyway. You focus on playing the game and thinking of nothing else, which is the best and really only way to handle nerves: focusing on the task you must accomplish and preparing as much as possible for it. If you have trained and practiced well, then your muscles will not lock up and your tech skill will be almost perfectly mechanical. If you have theorized and studied well, then your knowledge will not fail you. If you are taking care of your body, then you will not get tired and adrenaline will boost your focus and mental processing. Handling nerves is not something that can always be handled at the event because the things that you need to ignore them like I just listed are developed PRIOR to the event. If you have trained hard and are motivated, why should you focus on nerves? YOU SHOULDN'T! You should focus on what it takes to be successful.


More on this when I make a longer post. Basically, I focus on what I need to do and warm up more if I get too nervous. I, above all else, don't give into nervous thoughts and imagine all of the bad possibilities.

kevin's solution to everything is to get pissed. seriously sometimes mid-set on youtube you can actually see where he gets pissed lol
That is a giant troll

but it has just enough truth to where I can't get

mad

over it

ok kevin, teach me peach next semester. either that, or teach ashley lol.
teaching you falco, fox, sheik, falcon, marth, and now peach!

we will figure this character out eventually LOL

salt mode PP is really fun to play. this one time i was 2v1'ing him with team attack off with another guy and man, good times were had.
chris I was not salty about that <.<

but it WAS really funny

i don't think getting mad to win is healthy and i don't think its a good mentality to have

i think this community would be better as a whole if people didn't focus as much on winning at all costs and focused more on respect and fun
Just like nerves, giving into anger is not correct. That said, using anger to fuel your focus CAN be okay.

Emotion is like a sign telling you that something needs correcting. Getting angry means you are having to deal with an unpleasant thought and need to adjust your reality for it.

Scrub mentality. You are here to DEFEAT your opponent, not have sex with him.
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLOOOOLLLLLOO

What good is emotion if you let it take clear thinking away? Consider both sides if you're gonna sit in your chair and analyze. =p

I agree with Mahone. Watching two top level players just trying to destroy each other every stock gets pretty boring. When both players are taking it less serious and playing for fun like Mango it's much less tense and more fun for the viewer. That's why I would consider Mango better than Armada despite the results of Genesis 2 and Apex.
Mango doesn't play for fun.

It's a fun game, but he plays to win like everyone else.

Ya, i acknowledge its a DAVID-SIRLIN-PLAY2WIN SCRUB mentality, but maybe there are some things more important than winning



Well i wasn't saying that top players shouldn't take the matches seriously. Its fine if two players want to try their hardest and test themselves, but i think its not healthy to "get angry" just to try to beat someone. A good example of taking the game too seriously imo is Armada picking ylink and trying to time hbox out on purpose to "make him pay" for playing puff and playing gay or whatever. Like, armada should play to win, and its fine to counterpick, but purposefully trying to frustrate your opponent outside of the game seems rather cruel and unnecessary.

After all, it's still a game and no one is making that much money off of it, so i don't see why people feel the need to get so salty and rage. It's ok to be disappointed because thats just natural if you put a lot of time into something and don't succeed, but like hbox and pp throwing their controllers after losing to chu/javi seems pretty disrespectful to me.

I would much rather congratulate the opponent and ask to play friendlies, or try to learn why i lost, how they train outside of tourney, etc. than get mad and john which is what most people do.
When you put a lot of time into the game it's tough to watch your hard work go up in smoke sometimes. There is no excuse for being a child or acting disrespectfully, but it is a community of young adult males and we like being immature sometimes. As long as no one goes too far with immaturity like hitting people or whatever then I don't think a thrown controller here or there is THAT bad.

That said, you won't be seeing me throw anything or acting disrespectfully again unless something very serious is going on. I have been doing work on being more respectful and controlling myself lately and I have liked my progress thus far. =)

I don't think turnips are the big problem for Falco vs her. I think it's her float (then again, I hate turnips, so I dunno).
It's definitely the float and CC Dsmash LOL. Mostly float though I'd guess. Her OOS counter game is pretty nifty vs Falco's attacking game as well. Turnips are sucky but she has a super hard time pulling them vs Falco.

Ya, but i don't see why you would need to get mad to overcome obstacles, either way, my point is that you can be as cutthroat as you want, but i don't think people separate in the game from out of the game... you can lose a game and be mad at puff or whoever and be frustrated you lost, but you should have nothing but respect for someone who beat you. And if you truly respect them, you wouldn't sully their win by throwing a controller or johning later.



See, i would say that you already made your mistake when you considered all those things "gay"... sure some things can be frustrating like ledge camping for example, but if you cant handle those things without getting angry, maybe you should reconsider your attitude and what your real goals in smash are.

There was a phase where i was getting frustrated that all these players were trying to time me out and just in general camp my puff a lot, so what i decided to do is take a break from entering tournaments. I don't choose to enter a tournament if i am not in the mood to be camped or "gayed" or whatever. When i DO enter, i have a good attitude and respect all my opponents strategies, even if they are trying to time me out.

It isn't fair for you to expect people to play YOUR melee when you enter a tournament. There are probably 100+ things you do that players you face will find annoying/gay/frustrating, so its not reasonable for you to get angry because they are using a strategy you personally won't use and think is "gay".

A good example is m2k, who camps the ledge harder than any other top player, but consistently complains about how gay puff and falco are... I just think these kind of attitudes are super disrespectful to your opponents and tbh it makes me not want to play a lot of the time, because no one feels good about making someone else angry, no matter how unreasonable they are being.
Great post!!!

Attaching names to a scenario, naming it, giving it connotations beyond what it is, that can only distract you more from dealing with it. You're 100% correct and I like how you handled your own issue.

****

Oh yeah. Sucks though. Most people have no respect for certain play styles and such. It is kind of a crappy mentality, but eh.

Even the top players do it.

Except pp as far as I know

:phone:
It is pretty unfortunate =(

I don't do it but it takes some focus once in a while not to be that way hahaha =p

lol every time kevin goes to a smash tournament, i ask him about his travels and not the tournament.

cause, you know, we'll talk about the smash eventually anyway.

cause we white homies.

kevin: see you at TGI Fridays

/white-man high 5.
PFFFFFFFFF

I love you
 

Dr Peepee

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It's good because if we approach with Dair at lower percents and you jump into it then the Dair stun gets canceled and you get free spinning moves.

Nair beats jumping but loses to CC Dsmash.


@SB: Not fully confirmed. I'm working on it!
 

ShroudedOne

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You wouldn't happen to know the percent ranges for that, would you? It seems really good when she's at low percent, but once she gets higher, she'd be forced to tech, and wouldn't be able to just absorb the hit and downsmash (unless she can tech in place > downsmash before you can reach the ground and do something).
 

Umbreon

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Dair sends most people into the ground around 40-45%, so I'll just go with that lol.
my favorite falco combo is dair > dair, it combos into itself until it pops them up, then it knocks them into the ground again so you can tech chase with dair, then around 60% you can dair to dair and spike them for the KO.

i'm clearly some kind of retarded genius.
 
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Hey does falco **** the samus matchup? Cuz if it's supposed to be heavy in your favor, I feel like I'm reallllllllllllllly missing something here lol

I guess the main thing for me is that I don't know how to combo her really hard. Shine sends her too far and other stuff doesn't seem consistent vs her cuz she spams up b/cc dsmash to get out. Also I can't combo her into a kill move except popping her up with a dair into bair/uair. And getting her when she's coming down is tricky too because her little bomb shenanigans messing with her movement and stopping you from jumping up into her.

Tl;dr I'm having trouble with samus living forever and getting big damage/putting her into a bad position
 
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55:45 IMO

Laser a lot to shut down her missile game. Grab a lot to beat her shielding. Combo where necessary. Edgeguard with lots of lasers, and edge hogging.

When combining samus, shine is mostly good on the platform stages since you can land then u-tilt -> moves. Starting combos with d-air -> u-Tilt, or u-throw -> u-air. Mostly just either try to keep her in the air, or knock her off the stage by any means

:phone:
 

Dr Peepee

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Hey does falco **** the samus matchup? Cuz if it's supposed to be heavy in your favor, I feel like I'm reallllllllllllllly missing something here lol

I guess the main thing for me is that I don't know how to combo her really hard. Shine sends her too far and other stuff doesn't seem consistent vs her cuz she spams up b/cc dsmash to get out. Also I can't combo her into a kill move except popping her up with a dair into bair/uair. And getting her when she's coming down is tricky too because her little bomb shenanigans messing with her movement and stopping you from jumping up into her.

Tl;dr I'm having trouble with samus living forever and getting big damage/putting her into a bad position
Dair to Dair when comboing. Use shine at lower percents at uptilt at specific mid percents that I don't remember.

Upthrowing her is great because her aerial mobility is bad.


Don't always commit early so then her bomb stuff isn't effective. Just stay directly under her and walk/WD more than run so you can keep the option to Uptilt.

Jump up early once in a while with Uair/Bair to keep her honest and scared of your options though.
 

Xyzz

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Dair to Dair when comboing. Use shine at lower percents at uptilt at specific mid percents that I don't remember.

Upthrowing her is great because her aerial mobility is bad.


Don't always commit early so then her bomb stuff isn't effective. Just stay directly under her and walk/WD more than run so you can keep the option to Uptilt.

Jump up early once in a while with Uair/Bair to keep her honest and scared of your options though.
We can always be awesome like silentwolf and do dash > crouch > uptilt! :D
 

Dr Peepee

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Dealing with Nerves

2 things I want to say going into this:

1. I'm working on a new way of problem-solving. I attempt to thoroughly identify the problem and all of its facets before moving on to solving the problem. Typically, the problem gives me easy to understand solutions once it is mostly/fully understood. Hopefully, this method of explaining the issue will allow people to come to their own conclusions. =)

2. Everyone is different. I'll try to cover as many angles as I can with my explanation/analysis, but I don't know everything about everyone or claim to know such things. If you, the reader, have further questions you should speak up after reading!



Dictionary.com defines nervousness as "highly excitable; unnaturally or acutely uneasy or apprehensive." Focusing on the latter part of that definition, one sees that this condition is "unnatural." Being nervous isn't really a common experience for most people throughout a given day, so that means it only occurs in strange or unusual situations once in a while. Being unfamiliar with a situation already means you're more surprised by it and less likely to handle it calmly or intelligently. In order to handle things intelligently, you must be able to disregard emotion and continue to focus on the task at hand. The first way to do this is to recognize that there is a problem in the first place. Emotion, almost always, is a great identifier of something being off-kilter and you need to figure out what it is to restore balance. Recognizing that you are experiencing an emotion and you need to understand why can cause the difference between a panic attack and some deep breathing that allow you to focus on your tasks normally.
Why does this strategy of identifying emotion work? Well, I'm not totally sure actually, but this always works for me and is recommended on various sites as a means of controlling yourself. It's how you get your foot in the door and begin to think calmly about a situation.

A great way to disregard nerves is closely related with preparing for the tournament. Many people lose their tech skill and freeze up under pressure. Should one work hard and train well for an event, then their tech skill becomes mechanical. When tech skill is mechanical, it is impossible to mess up unless you let yourself be completely overcome by emotion. Training hard for an event also keeps one's mind in the event. Would you be so nervous knowing you prepared as hard as you could for an event, and wouldn't you feel more nervous if you prepared inadequately?
Why does this strategy of preparing yourself work? Well, you already have a counter-argument for anything your nervous mind can throw at you for starters. Additionally, you also will naturally play better because your tech skill/playstyle is more refined then. Practice tends to solve/aid in solving many problems, and this is no exception.


Sometimes, you can't keep a clear mind no matter what you do. In instances like this, it would be nice if you kept a healthy practice of MEDITATION. Being able to clear your mind at a moment's notice is an invaluable trait to have. Instead of becoming buried under the mountains of paranoid thoughts your mind can produce when you get worried, you can push all of those aside by closing your eyes and focusing on deep breathing/nothing at all. As you practice the habit(and the longer you practice it), you'll be able to remove all thoughts instantly, allowing you to eliminate distractions and see situations and problems clearly.
Why does this strategy of meditation work? It's like you're training your brain to work as you want it to instead of allowing it to run rampant every time an emotion gets near it. By emptying your mind, you don't really need to worry about focus or many thoughts or even one thought. You only need to worry about staying clear-minded so you can play Melee and nothing more. The good play will come technically if you've been practicing, and the rest is up to you staying calm and clear.


Going a little deeper into the definition of nervousness, we see that in the Dictionary.com definition of the term that it is a state of being where one is "acutely.....apprehensive." This is like saying getting nervous is a heightened state of awareness. Biologically, this makes sense. Your body produces the hormone adrenaline when you get nervous, and that amps up your system. Elevated heart rate, dilated pupils, and increased blood flow to the brain and muscles are all effects of becoming nervous. Essentially, your body is preparing you to play in the tournament! Rather than letting this state of being bother and worry you, you should EMBRACE the nervous feelings and allow them to aid your performance and abilities.



I guess I could have worked up to that point better, but really the end idea is you want to embrace the nerves. They offer so many advantages and you're going to experience them regardless(everyone does), so why not accept them and use them to your benefit instead of worrying?



*********************


I tried to cover as much as I could with this, but if you have further questions regarding nerves/this post, then please ask in the thread! =)
 

Bones0

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I'm just going to add that when you are mid game and don't have the opportunity to full-blown meditate, I think a single solitary deep breath can do wonders. It also becomes somewhat ritualistic like a basketball player doing the same dribble pattern before a free throw.
 

Dr Peepee

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Yeah I didn't go into mid-game stuff because I was hoping most people just could get this handled beforehand and it should keep them okay mid-game.

But yes taking a moment on the respawn platform or even in a lull in the match(edgeguard or whatever) you can just take a deep breath like you said to regain some composure.
 

Bones0

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I actually struggle more mid-game. I am pretty good at going into a game with a good mentality, but then I get distracted by stuff and then I become conscious of the fact that I'm distracted which only makes me more distracted. :/
 
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Kind of random now, but when I wrote up about the dieting thing. Fruits with anti-oxidants are great ofc (strawberry, cherries, blueberries, super fruits [like pomegranate, açai berries]). Usually in the morning. Still, bananas are the best fruit (though I don't like the taste personally).

:phone:
 

Dr Peepee

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But do you go into a game thinking about much or calmly and clearly?

And how do you get distracted if you have been practicing keeping a clear mind? If you have then you shouldn't be getting distracted.

Be sure to practice playing in a clear way so you can make it a habit that easily carries over to tourneys.


If that didn't give you a line of attack on the problem, then I think you just need to be more specific about what is happening. =)



Edit @ unknown: yeah I've read similar stuff lately. I've been eating lots of bananas anyway and like them so I'm lucky there haha. I'll have to get down harder with the morning fruits I think.
 
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55:45 IMO

Laser a lot to shut down her missile game. Grab a lot to beat her shielding. Combo where necessary. Edgeguard with lots of lasers, and edge hogging.

When combining samus, shine is mostly good on the platform stages since you can land then u-tilt -> moves. Starting combos with d-air -> u-Tilt, or u-throw -> u-air. Mostly just either try to keep her in the air, or knock her off the stage by any means

:phone:
Dair to Dair when comboing. Use shine at lower percents at uptilt at specific mid percents that I don't remember.

Upthrowing her is great because her aerial mobility is bad.


Don't always commit early so then her bomb stuff isn't effective. Just stay directly under her and walk/WD more than run so you can keep the option to Uptilt.

Jump up early once in a while with Uair/Bair to keep her honest and scared of your options though.
Thanx guys!
 

Metal Reeper

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PP can you or someone right a godlike post on beating Doc? I just cannot ****ing do it he is so ****ing gay. Dair camping the ledge. Ledgedashing with invincibiliy, throwing out pills and coming in with whatever the **** he wants. Which way do I throw him? it seems all I can do is shoot lasers and space Bairs. What works on him? UGH
 
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