~ Fairy Fountain Research Thread: buhbye ol' chum ~

[GodAtHand]

Legend tells of a extra jump hidden within N. Love: Is that a fact?

Welcome. I am pretty sure everything you will need is in this thread http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=232732

New topic:
How many frames of stun does dair have? I know it trips once in a while. And does it stun more if you hit someone who is already on the ground, or if they are slightly above the ground and you hit them a little bit into the ground?

 

[KayLo!]

I'm not 100% sure on this, but there are different types of trips.

There's either 2: banana trips + other trips.
Or 3: banana trips + forced trips (from moves like dtilt) + random trips.

Pikachu has one of the longest banana trips, but I think his regular/forced trip is ~the same length as every other character's.

I just remember K Prime testing Pika's trip lengths when he was doing frame data, and he got different numbers depending on how Pika tripped. But it doesn't matter since once your opponent trips off of dtilt, you have a considerable frame advantage anyway. Just sharing some info.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

That's good info Kata!

I guess I should also post something I made a while back now that I'm here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLQB8Et_890

It's nothing special and I'm guessing that everyone knows about the things shown in it already (most of it is just basic knowledge) but anyhoo.

Guuuys I think we should try to implement ledgewarping into our game a little more. You can pull of some crazy **** with that

I also haven't seen anyone else than me to use the grounded one yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3WdJKVWb28

 

[Kataefi]

How did you do that btw? I can't seem to do it... can she throw out a grounded move instantly?

edit: and all these links and tidbits will go into the OP in a little discussion section and stuff so we know what we're talking about stuff.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

How did you do that btw? I can't seem to do it... can she throw out a grounded move instantly?

You mean the grounded NL/DF from the ledge, right?

All you have to do is to press jump when hanging from the ledge and then input command for them after she lets go off the ledge but before she rises too high from the ground. The input must be timed correctly or else Zelda'll just ledgejump normally, but when you do it right her special moves stop all upward momentum she'd gain from her jump and make her kinda "appear" on the stage. With NL it's even possible to cancel all momentum before she reaches the stage level, so she'll just let go off the ledge and activate Nayru. The differences to normal ledgedropped one are that she starts the move from higher point and doesn't instantly start going down, so she doesn't fall as low and even her douple jump is enough to regrab the ledge.

The timing is really weird at first since you can't input the commands right after each other: there has to be a small pause in between. It isn't too hard, though, I can now do any of the things shown in the video constantly.

tl:dr: Grab the ledge. Press jump. Press B or >B.

Edit: For reversed Nayru's love from the ledge, it goes like this:
Jump=>direction away from the stage=>let go of the control stick=>B

 

[Kataefi]

No I meant the grounded teleport thing hehe!

 

[Half-Split Soul]

LOLOLOLOLOL

In order to do that you have to ledgewarp normally, but after she has vanished you have to start pressing the control stick in the completely opposite direction. However, your spacing from the ledge must be extremely good, or else you'll just do a normal ledgewarp.

It works because when ledgewarping the game counts that you land on stage and then fall off from it because of your momentum. This also cancels all lag from FW. So basically, when doing the grounded one you'll be landing on stage, the momentum carries you offstage and you DI back on it before falling off.

And yes, this allows her to do any ground move. The timing can be quite difficult though, since you'll have to buffer a move during a landing that actually doesn't even happen.

 

[KayLo!]

Not really specific to Zelda, but:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9mak7FXmSY
Visible hitboxes!

Once they figure it out a bit more, we'll be able to do this for every character. =D

Hooray!

Btw, I'm still working on copying over Zelda's data from PSA, but I still don't understand some of it yet.... plus I haven't had the time to really work on it. Might ask K Prime for help, but I definitely haven't forgotten joo guise.

 

[ADHD]

Hi kaylo, saw you this weekend

 

[KayLo!]

Hi kaylo, saw you this weekend

Hi ADHD, I remember that lame double Diddy team.

Nah, jk, doubles friendlies were fun. Come to more biweeklies! <3

 

[Kataefi]

Kaylo any chance you can get me frames on when Zelda charges her smashes and when she releases those charges? and shield disadvantaege of an autocancelled nair on sheild?

 

[KayLo!]

Nah, son. I'm doing the guide (only because I already mentioned it and got people hyped), then I'm unsubscribing from this forum and never looking back.

 

[KayLo!]

Double post, yadda yadda.

Anyways, my convo with HSS reminded me: I started working with K Prime on the visible hitbox thing for Zelda. I probably won't finish it now, but I'll pass along what little we've started (a.k.a. what he's started, because I don't understand half of it, lolol).

Maybe someone else will finish the rest.

Be forewarned that multihit moves can be a little funky (the hitboxes are the right size but show up on the wrong frames sometimes), and because Zelda has so many of them, it may not be 100% accurate. But at least the sizes are right, so we'll get a clear picture of her range.

 

[zeldspazz]

I think people in the Peach Boards are actually doing it for us, they started a couple hours ago iirc. Cool to have more than 1 on the job ^_^

Its really quite interesting how they figured out how to do that. Snakes are ridiculous ;-;

 

[KayLo!]

I think people in the Peach Boards are actually doing it for us, they started a couple hours ago iirc.

Oh, word? I'll let them do it, then. No need to have more than one group of people doing the same exact thing, especially since they'll actually finish.

PSA is a ridiculous program in general. Props to whoever came up with it, because I've been playing with it for weeks now, and there're still things I don't understand. @.@

 

[GodAtHand]

I can't wait to see that finished! Can someone make sure to be really obnoxious about it so I will notice? please?

 

[NinjaLink]

so we're working on the zelda hitboxes? Glad i found the original video

NOW we're gettin somewhere. Someone make the pac and I'll make the video.

 

[KayLo!]

so we're working on the zelda hitboxes?

Apparently the Peaches are.

Although Prime started working on the .pac a couple nights ago. But I don't want him doing unnecessary work, so I'm waiting to see if the Peach boards really are doing it.

EDIT: Yeah, some dude over at the Peach boards is almost done with Zelda's. I'm assuming he'll be done with the .pac pretty soon.

Go to their hitbubble thread and ask him for it so you can make the vid. *excited* =X

EDIT 2: Bonus points if you put it to KH music.

 

[NinjaLink]

Apparently the Peaches are.

Although Prime started working on the .pac a couple nights ago. But I don't want him doing unnecessary work, so I'm waiting to see if the Peach boards really are doing it.

EDIT: Yeah, some dude over at the Peach boards is almost done with Zelda's. I'm assuming he'll be done with the .pac pretty soon.

Go to their hitbubble thread and ask him for it so you can make the vid. *excited* =X

EDIT 2: Bonus points if you put it to KH music.

Just for you *winkwink*


xD

I'll go ask

 

[GodAtHand]

EDIT 2: Bonus points if you put it to KH music.

http://www.carbohydrom.net/music/CarboHydroM_-_Rising_Sun.mp3

I feel like I am missing something though... too many winks... I actually <3 KH though...

*Hides*

 

[NinjaLink]

NO RIOT........NO lol


jk its ok.

Anyway since imma be leaving for an OoS tourney soon it'll be awhile for me to make any videos. Just sayin that now.

 

[MrEh]

KH would have been more fun if it wasn't just pushing circle over and over again.

 

[KayLo!]

http://www.carbohydrom.net/music/CarboHydroM_-_Rising_Sun.mp3

I've heard that remix before.... I kinda wanna add it to my Brawl list. =X

KH would have been more fun if it wasn't just pushing circle over and over again.

It's the X button, get it right.

 

[MrEh]

It's the X button, get it right.

I was playing Final Mix.

Circle is attack. X is jump.

A handful of Japanese games are reversed for some reason.

 

[NinjaLink]

Chad is right. I was playin teh final mix version also lol

 

[MrEh]

Final Mix was pretty beast with all of those new boss fights.

Larxene is a jerk. :/

 

[KayLo!]

I was playing Final Mix.

Circle is attack. X is jump.

A handful of Japanese games are reversed for some reason.

Gotcha, gotcha... yeah, Japanese versions of PSP/PS2/etc. games reverse O and X. I wonder why that is?

Larxene is a jerk. :/

That's why I love her. Pimp slappin the **** outta Namine! Eeeeee~

On topic: So, uh, yeah, I look forward to hearing KH music in that hitbox vid. =X

 

[MrEh]

Gotcha, gotcha... yeah, Japanese versions of PSP/PS2/etc. games reverse O and X. I wonder why that is?

No idea.

Japanese games are always reversed like that. O always means "confirm", while X always means "go back."

I guess FM was just going with that standard. Or something.

 

[GodAtHand]

Peach boards got their hitboxes up. Some surprises there... That uptilt had more range than I expected!

 

[KayLo!]

O always means "confirm", while X always means "go back."

Ya know, put that way, it kinda does make more sense than the way we have it. (hmm)

Peach boards got their hitboxes up. Some surprises there... That uptilt had more range than I expected!

Inorite. I'm waiting for Commander-whos-it to send me that .pac. ><

 

[Battletanx_Commander]

Inorite. I'm waiting for Commander-whos-it to send me that .pac. ><

Yeah, Commander-whos-it. :V Usmash and Dair are being very troublesome.

 

[KayLo!]

Yeah, Commander-whos-it. :V Usmash and Dair are being very troublesome.

Lol, no rush, I'm extremely grateful that you're doing this. K Prime as well -- he breathed (uh, typed) a sigh of relief when I told him somebody was already on the job.

I just have horrible short term memory. x.x

 

[KayLo!]

Kata, I just looked at dtilt on PSA, and it says the trip rate is 0.4%. Um. I dunno what that means.

But it's significantly higher than, say, Pika's jab, which is 0.1%. His dtilt is 0.3%. Ness's dtilt is 0.3%. I'm giving you numbers for other stuff hoping that maybe it'll give you some perspective on the number, because I don't really understand it.

x.x

 

[Kataefi]

0.4 = 40%... from a scale of 0 to 1

Does the PSA say anything about the positioning of dtilt at all? As in does she trip a little more or less when dtilt is at its tip or if its close etc etc...

Also would it be tricky for you to copy paste all the PSA info on her moves over here at all? I understand that's A LOT of info there so don't worry if not.

edit: what are her LK and Jab trip ratios out of curiosity?

 

[KayLo!]

Oh, 40%? That's what I thought, but I didn't want to assume since the percentage sign being after "0.4" confused me a little. x.x

Anyways, it doesn't say anything about positioning or whatever, but it has the same trip rate for all 4 collision lines.... so I'm guessing which part you hit with doesn't matter.

I have to copy the info by hand (it won't let me copy-paste move stuff for some reason -- just character attributes), but I was planning on doing that anyway.... I've finished ~half of it so far.

Jab has a 0% trip rate.
Same for LKs.

*shrug* Don't ask me, I'm just copying what I'm reading. ><

 

[Half-Split Soul]

The percentage sign is probably the definition for 100% in the code, meaning the game actually reads it as
0.4 * 100% = 40%
That's what I'd guess anyway.

Also, Jab and LKs having a rate of 0% probably means that they have no added chances of causing a trip. However, based on what I've read earlier, every move in the game has a slight chance of causing a trip when used on grounded opponents as long as their knockback remains under a set value. I don't know if this is actually true, but it would explain why moves with no trip rates of their own cause opponents to trip every now and then.

 

[KayLo!]

Makes sense.

My expertise pretty much stops at the basics of frame data. All this programming ****..... I have no idea what half of it means, I'm just copying what I see. @.@

 

[PK-ow!]

Kata, I just looked at dtilt on PSA, and it says the trip rate is 0.4%. Um. I dunno what that means.

But it's significantly higher than, say, Pika's jab, which is 0.1%. His dtilt is 0.3%. Ness's dtilt is 0.3%. I'm giving you numbers for other stuff hoping that maybe it'll give you some perspective on the number, because I don't really understand it.

x.x

Ness' dtilt doesn't trip at chance.

It's a specific part of the hitbox. I and some other Nesses can trip reliably on any character... and I have no reason to believe tripping can be caused with the move any other way.


Are you sure those values are used at all?

 

[Kataefi]

What specific part of his hitbox trips?

 

[KayLo!]

Are you sure those values are used at all?

Like I said, I barely understand PSA. I'm just copying what it shows me, and what it says is that the trip rate on Ness's dtilt is 0.3% on all three hitboxes.

*shrug*