Edge Spiking- A New Found Technique

[Masterplum]

As most of you dont know, I made a thread about this in snake character discussion because at the time I thought snake was the only character that could use it but while playing with kirby I discovered he could also edge spike which led me to try with other characters.

Edge spiking- done by using any characters jab (the first hit of neutral A) or F tilt.

Effect- your opponent is "spiked" to about the bottom of the crystal thing on final destination.

side note- If the jab or F tilt causes your opponent to trip, they will either grab the edge or fall on the ground depending on your distance from the edge.

Now I will discuss the effect this has on all the characters that this move can instant kill (discussed in snake character discussion thread). The two characters that this can kill indefinately are ike and link, though not every character can perform it on them.

Mario-
First I will start on how to edge spike with mario on ike and link.
When edge spiking link, it is recommended to use F tilt instead of the jab. So first you F tilt Link then follow up with a F air, if done correctly you will kill him. There are other combinations as well but the F air is the easiest to perform.
When fighting ike, the same thing applies.

Donkey kong- When fighting link with donkeykong, use either F tilt or jab to down air. There may be other methods that I have yet to discover. It is not recommended to use against ike with donkey kong. It will not work 90% of the time so dont even try it.


Link- It is not recommended to use against link or ike with link because Link has no follow up spike to finish them off with. He does have his down tilt but it's not reliable enough to use.


Samus- Another character you should'nt use this with against ike or link, it just does'nt work. I've tried many combinations but nothing seems to work.


Kirby- Kirby is probably one of the best characters to use this with because of his neutral B. When fighting Link perform the edge spike then simply fall and do a neutral B. Spit them out when you see fit so that they can not recover then recover yourself. For ike the same thing works. A good way to set up an edge spike for kirby is F throw> U air> F throw> U air> F tilt (edge spike) then neutral B. You must make sure you have enough space so that by the end of the combo you can use F tilt by the edge. You could also just shorten it to F throw> U air> F tilt. Whichever works best for the current situation.


Fox- Fox's edge spike is very easy to perform. You simply use F tilt, fall, then down B. Link or Ike will not be able to make it back. You can also use D air but Down B is much easier.


That concludes the first part of my thread. I will be updating it daily. I didn't do it all at once because

1) I'm using my wii and it takes a while lol.

2) I need to test the other characters.


Tommorow I will add %'s and other details like that. Hope this helps you guys.

 

[hough123]

Wow, this sounds useful, can Lucario do it?

 

[Mr.Trite]

WTF is this.

It's just knock the guy off the ledge then spike.

Ganondorf - neutral A them off the edge, jump off then down air. Is that right?

Dumbest attempt at a technique I've ever seen.

Also, not an instant kill at all. Consider meteor cancels or lower percents.

 

[ConnorTheKid]

^^^what he said. sheesh, Brawl tactical discussion has such garbage threads sometimes.

 

[AlAxe]

yea. This thread is a waste of life force.

 

[Masterplum]

Mr. Trite it works at any %. You should try it before you make comments like that and I dont know about lucario yet I gotta try tomorrow

 

[Masterplum]

oh and by the way it knocks them off vertically so its not just hit them off and spike. It hits them straight down.

 

[WouW]

Duh, spikes hit straight down.

 

[J4pu]

either I'm missing something or this is the stupidest attempt at a new AT ever, make a video if you are so sure it's a real useful tech.

 

[Mr.Trite]

Yea it works at any % then they can recover.

SUCCESS.

AWESOME.

 

[Kitamerby]

So basically, if I perform an ftilt/jab on someone who's standing ON the edge, it'll knock them downwards a set distance right through the ledge a set distance?

 

[Azzizaz]

I actually had something like this happen with Ness on BF. I was bored and was fooling around with Ness versus a CPU Lucas. When he jumped to grab the edge, I dtilted once and it spiked him low enough to where the CPU didn't use PKT until only half of Lucas' body was visible. And it also caused him to shoot directly down, not at an angle like a stage spike. I have the replay on my Wii, but it's not like I've ever replicated it so whatever.

 

[Masterplum]

this works when theyre on the stage though Azzizaz

and ya thats basically what it does kitamerby

 

[WouW]

Soo... a ftilt or jab into a spike sends them downwards? Whoa, how new. I never thought 'combo'ing into a spike sends the opponent downwards. Greeeat find.

 

[keeper]

I don't see why this is even a topic. You just follow up hitting them off the stage.

Azzizaz, you can do that with a lot of characters and even in Melee...

 

[DKKountry]

Video please. It's a bit vague.

 

[Morrigan]

Video please. It's a bit vague.

Read please. Don't be lazy.

 

[keeper]

Video please. It's a bit vague.

You hit the person off the stage, then meteor them. It's nothing advanced.

 

[Masterplum]

you dont understand, its not the f tilt to spike that spikes them. The f tilt itself spikes. And almost to the bottom of final destination. It makes it harder for them to recover. Someone named cat fight is going to help me make a video so just be patient or try it out yourself.

 

[wolfyjr]

could we get a video of it or nething? prove the actual effects of it?

 

[Masterplum]

i just said someone named cat fight is going to make a video of it for me.

 

[suzuki brawl]

Video please. It's a bit vague.

 

[iEatPikmin]

How does the Ftilt spike? And wolfyjr posted at 5:48 P.M. just like you. Your post probably wasn't there at the time he posted...

 

[AlAxe]

Now I'm just confused. ftilts spike? wtf.

 

[Ayaz18]

Ftilt Spiking? I may have a theory to better explain TC's attempt to explain this "tech"

you know how we can angle Ftilt, maybe he means that if angled downward, it will send people at a "spike" emulated angle?

m I doin it rite?

 

[Yuna]

you dont understand, its not the f tilt to spike that spikes them. The f tilt itself spikes. And almost to the bottom of final destination. It makes it harder for them to recover. Someone named cat fight is going to help me make a video so just be patient or try it out yourself.

If F-tilt spikes, why do you keep telling us to use Meteors after F-tilt/Jab? And how could F-tilt possibly spike, anyway?

Also, these aren't even combos, for the love of male genitalia! Jab to Fair with Donkey Kong? I mean, come on!

 

[Morrigan]

OH NOOOO, YOUR NEGATIVE PEACH IS GONE.

I'm sad.

 

[Veggi]

Maybe what he's saying that you can use an ftilt to send them as low as the diamond in FD. (not sure how) However despite it putting them at an uncomfortable position, they can still survive so it's suggested that you meteor them afterwards? Is that it?

 

[-Mars-]

this sounds really silly to me

 

[Shirahama]

There's one thing I'd like to venture: the reliability of this technique.

It's pretty straightforward and very practical but have you tried preforming this on any other stages than Final Destination?

 

[Black_Heretic]

Wow, this sounds useful, can Lucario do it?

Lucario doesn't have a meteor meaning that he can't use this "technique"

all he's saying to do is hit them off the edge and jump off to spike

nothing new unless these videos he's speaking of prove us wrong

 

[Yuna]

OH NOOOO, YOUR NEGATIVE PEACH IS GONE.

I'm sad.

It's still on sitting on my desktop as a JPEG. I'm going to start rotating my avatar on a weekly or bi-weekly basis, so we'll see it again.

There's one thing I'd like to venture: the reliability of this technique.

It's pretty straightforward and very practical but have you tried preforming this on any other stages than Final Destination?

No it's not. For one thing, every single example he gave us is easily rememedied by aerialing them in the face when they try it on you. I mean, jab/F-tilt to Fair as Donkey Kong? Come on!

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

pretty much like everyone else I think your just saying hit them off the stage and then spike them and for Ike its not really anything knew. if an Ike lands a jab by on you by the ledge he'll probably follow up with a dtilt

 

[Vyse]

I found a new technique, it's called 'spacing'. What you do is use the control stick to move your character away from the opponent when he attacks to stop yourself from getting hit.




But seriously, this sounds like a common 'strategy' not even a technique.

 

[Shirahama]

It's still on sitting on my desktop as a JPEG. I'm going to start rotating my avatar on a weekly or bi-weekly basis, so we'll see it again.


No it's not. For one thing, every single example he gave us is easily rememedied by aerialing them in the face when they try it on you. I mean, jab/F-tilt to Fair as Donkey Kong? Come on!

I had Fox's Reflector in mind when I was constructing the post. I really didn't give thought to any other players.

 

[Cat Fight]

Plum if yr available tomorrow to demonstrate then I'll record and see wtf this is.

People in this thread need to relax, christ.

 

[theEffinBear]

If the target is right on the edge and you do this to them, they are, knocked downwards a little bit. Seriously, try it yourself -- it only takes a few minutes: use Snake, set your target to teeter on the edge, and then smack them with ONLY the first hit of Snake's f-tilt. Instead of going nowhere (which would set up the second hit of the f-tilt like normal), they go straight downwards, regaining control at about the height of FD's lower corner. When trying this out at first, don't even bother to follow up with anything; just observe their trajectory.
EDIT: don't set the target teetering on the edge; instead, have them roll towards the edge when they're already close to it, so they're facing onto the stage.

This knocks the target downwards. Spike = knocks downwards. Ergo, this = spike.

It still looks pretty weird, though.

EDIT: I have spoiler-ified all the parts of this post that relate to the theory I described here, as it turns out to be wholly wrong.

Spoiler

HERE BEGINS MY UNTESTED, UNPROVEN, WILD-GUESS THEORY is: this Edge Spiking is due to a strange interaction between hitstun (only when it doesn't cause the "blargh I've been sent flying in an uncontrollable spiral") and the ledge-grab vacuum effect. Snake's f-tilt knee moves you slightly, and if you're teetering on the edge, there's nowhere to move besides off the stage. The ledge notices that a) you're off the stage and within reach, and b) you're not in the "blargh I've been sent flying in an uncontrollable spiral" state, so it vacuums you downwards so you can grab the ledge*. But you're still in the hitstun -- you can't grab the ledge. Which means that you continue straight downwards until the hitstun wears off**, when you're at about the height of the lower corner of FD.
*it's like speed-hugging: if you try speed-hugging at 1/4 speed, you'll notice that your character enters the "hanging on the ledge" animation while their body is still quite a ways above the ledge, but you very quickly drop until only your hands are on/above the ledge.
**this "fall till hitstun wears off" part may be incorrect, and it may instead be some amount of "ledge-stun". HYPOTHETICAL: if the ledge tries to make you grab it, you're put into a state where you can't do air-jumps, etc, which is normally overridden by the hanging-from-ledge options; if you're edge-spiked, then you get the ledge-stun but no hanging-from-ledge options to cover. I don't know how you'd really test this besides looking at the source code, and I'm not about to try doing that.
HERE ENDS MY UNTESTED, UNPROVEN, WILD-GUESS THEORY.

Some ways to disprove this theory:
• try edge-spiking off a non-grabbable ledge of a pass-through platform, like the roof of Luigi's Mansion.
• try edge-spiking off a non-grabbable ledge of a solid platform, like the indoor upper level of Luigi's Mansion.
• try edge-spiking off a grabbable ledge that's being edge-hogged.
• try edge-spiking off a grabbable ledge while the target holds "down" so they normally ignore ledges.
If edge-spiking still occurs under any or all of these four situations, then my theory is wrong (there are probably a lot of other ways to prove my theory wrong, too, but those are the first four that came to mind).

As to the practicality of this: yes it's situational, but the situation doesn't seem so terribly uncommon. You're vulnerable to being edge-spiked every time your roll is stopped short by the ledge

Spoiler

(if my theory is correct, then you can save yourself from the ledge-spike by holding "down" when hit)

.

Get that video up, guys!
/RtEB

 

[xandeR-]

Well this was explained horribly but I suppose it's kind of interesting.

I more equate it to people "falling" off the edge but hey, it sets up a nice situation for ya if you do it.

 

[SinkingHigher]

I dont get how you're meant to hit with jab. Video plz.

 

[Vyse]

If the target is right on the edge and you do this to them, they are, knocked downwards a little bit. Seriously, try it yourself -- it only takes a few minutes: use Snake, set your target to teeter on the edge, and then smack them with ONLY the first hit of Snake's f-tilt. Instead of going nowhere (which would set up the second hit of the f-tilt like normal), they go straight downwards, regaining control at about the height of FD's lower corner. When trying this out at first, don't even bother to follow up with anything; just observe their trajectory.

After reading that, it makes more sense to me.
Could be interesting, yet highly situational.