Event - E3 Invitational 2014 E3 2014 Rumor/Leak Discussion Thread

[Spazzy_D]

There are a couple of reasons people keep coming back to the Sal Leak.

1.) Sal has previous credibility with leaks, he is not a complete nobody posting anonymously on random web forums.
2.) His is the only leak that has really stood the test of time and not been completely debunked, despite being one of the original Smash 4 leaks.
3.) The character choices don't read like a Smash fans wish list, and even if the choices aren't very exciting they all make sense when you look at them objectively.

That said, it's not gospel. It could very well turn out to be fake and I wouldn't be surprised... but I will at least take notice of it until we have concrete proof against it.

This new leak? I have no faith in it, I mean sure it's possible, but it reads like a wish list that was made to completely contradict the Sal rumor. Not to mention the fact that the poster is a random who is giving way more info then legitimate leakers normally do. E3 will clear it up one way or another I suppose.

 

[Reila]

Ridley was never announced as a boss.

2.) His is the only leak that has really stood the test of time and not been completely debunked, despite being one of the original Smash 4 leaks.

The Palutena screenshots leak say hi.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Ridley was never announced as a boss.

The Palutena screenshots leak say hi.

The difference in overalls length kind of killed that one for me, actually. I was going to mention it in my post regardless, guess I forgot.

She's as good as confirmed due to the Palutena Trophy fake out in my mind anyway.

 

[ChunkyBeef]

I like how you judge a leaks validity by how much you personally dislike it. Sakurai must really have it out for you.

You got a better way to judge leaks? I'd love to hear it.

 

[Spazzy_D]

You got a better way to judge leaks? I'd love to hear it.

You could try to look at them objectively. See if there are any holes in the leak, or if the leaker has any credibility, or even look at the characters in question to see what each would add to Smash and why they may or may not have been chosen.

Just a thought.

 

[Reila]

The difference in overalls length kind of killed that one for me, actually. I was going to mention it in my post regardless, guess I forgot.

She's as good as confirmed due to the Palutena Trophy fake out in my mind anyway.

So I take you are expecting newcomers for Zelda, Metroid and Fire Emblem based on the other three trophies?

 

[MasterofMonster]

Judging something to be fake just because you don't like it is, of course, illogical. Also, remember people, this is a E3 Leak/Rumor Place, so the Sal leak and whatnot doesn't really belong here. Would rather not this Place get Closed as well. ^^

 

[Spazzy_D]

So I take you are expecting newcomers for Zelda, Metroid and Fire Emblem based on the other three trophies?

Maybe... I feel like Palutena has been hinted at a lot (not taking any leaks into account.) I think FE will have a new comer from Awakening (Chrom always had the most support pre-E3 last year, so I expect him though he is probably the most boring choice,) and Zelda and Metroid seem like franchises that should probably get new comers this time around. I'm not sure I believe the trophies = newcomer thing, though. Palutena was a little different because it was framed in away to make us think she was not going to be playable and then BAM - Psuedo-Palutena.

@ MasterofMonster The thing is, @ ChunkyBeef is thinking something is fake just because he DOES like it, which is at least a fresh take on it. I mean, it's all guess work anyway.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I think the 4chan leaker is just getting our hopes up with the usual Chibi Robo and Robin, I wouldn't believe him.

 

[MasterofMonster]

@ Spazzy_D
Ah, well, that's equally illogical, for the very same reasons, but reversed.

 

[egaddmario]

Maybe... I feel like Palutena has been hinted at a lot (not taking any leaks into account.) I think FE will have a new comer from Awakening (Chrom always had the most support pre-E3 last year, so I expect him though he is probably the most boring choice,) and Zelda and Metroid seem like franchises that should probably get new comers this time around. I'm not sure I believe the trophies = newcomer thing, though. Palutena was a little difference because it was framed in away to make us think she not going to be playable and then BAM - Psuedo-Palutena.

@ MasterofMonster The thing is, @ ChunkyBeef is thinking something is fake just because he DOES like it, which is at least a fresh take on it. I mean, it's all guess work anyway.

I think the trophy theory has some merit- Metroid, KI, and FE are all series i want with a newcomer. Zelda just needs a reworked Ganondorf to feel complete.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Hmm, so on the official site for the Smash invitational Pikachu's ear's still stick out.... but no one else has parts outside of their box. Not sure if mentioned before.

http://e3.nintendo.com/#2014/tournament

 

[Dairz]

Hmm, so on the official site for the Smash invitational Pikachu's ear's still stick out.... but no one else has parts outside of their box. Not sure if mentioned before.

http://e3.nintendo.com/#2014/tournament

imo, Pikachu just looks really dumb with cut off ears. That probably doesn't mean anything, anyways. I mean, are we supposed to take into account the fact that only Olimar is tilted, too?

Kirby's foot, Sonic's foot, Olimar's hand.

Psst, did you check the link? Those things aren't sticking out on the page...

 

[Cheezey Bites]

Hmm, so on the official site for the Smash invitational Pikachu's ear's still stick out.... but no one else has parts outside of their box. Not sure if mentioned before.

http://e3.nintendo.com/#2014/tournament

Kirby's foot, Sonic's foot, Olimar's hand.

 

[Robertman2]

Hmm, so on the official site for the Smash invitational Pikachu's ear's still stick out.... but no one else has parts outside of their box. Not sure if mentioned before.

http://e3.nintendo.com/#2014/tournament

This is like the fifth time someone has brought that up.

 

[Baskerville]

Some of you have to be REALLY desperate to think parts of characters sticking out = newcomers.

 

[ChunkyBeef]

You could try to look at them objectively. See if there are any holes in the leak, or if the leaker has any credibility, or even look at the characters in question to see what each would add to Smash and why they may or may not have been chosen.

Just a thought.

I look at it like that because past behavior is a great indicator of future behavior. Mostly disappointment for the Melee leak being proven right, WAY more disappointment for the Brawl leak being proven right. Looking at leaks objectively, looking for holes, if there's credibility, that stuff has no basis in reality when we have no physical proof. You can do that easy with picture leaks, but text leaks? Everything is valid no matter how gallant or goofy. So all we really have left is to say:

"How do I feel about this leak if it were real? How would this leak be received by the general populace if the game launched and this leak was real?"

If the answer is 'For the most part, this leak has sucky picks.' then congratulations! You've got a potentially valid leak! My faith of Sakurai has been at an all time low since Brawl, so it's up to him to prove me wrong. 'til he does, I'm going to sit here and judge every leak like that because it's honestly the most accurate way to do it.

@ MasterofMonster The thing is, @ ChunkyBeef is thinking something is fake just because he DOES like it, which is at least a fresh take on it. I mean, it's all guess work anyway.

Pretty much exactly sums it up right there, actually.

Judging something to be fake just because you don't like it is, of course, illogical. Also, remember people, this is a E3 Leak/Rumor Place, so the Sal leak and whatnot doesn't really belong here. Would rather not this Place get Closed as well. ^^

I don't find it illogical, no matter what way you decide to approach it, because we have no better means of judging leaks after the initial 'Oh, this could be real and could be fake!', so I'm simply cross-referencing my disappointment with the general consumer disappointment to come up with a disappointment rating.

Seriously, ask anyone who was around for the Melee and Brawl leaks. The disappointment with both of those were so thick you could cut it with a knife and serve it to guests. I've still got some in my freezer. That stuff doesn't spoil.

All kidding aside, people reacted to the ACCURATE, CORRECT leaks with the same reactions the Gematsu leak did: vehement denial, "Sakurai would never put these characters in the game, it's clearly fake!", and general disbelief. Then those leaks got proven correct and everyone was disappointed. Even then, most people said 'There has to be more to this leak! There's got to be secret characters they're missing!'. Huh, wow, just like the Gematsu leak! Alas, they were wrong.

The Sal Romano leak is almost 100% exactly like the Melee/Brawl leaks. There's subtle differences, yes, but the key similarities are all there.

1.) Disappointing.
2.) Most of the newcomer picks are uninspired and boring. Heck, most people ignored Sal's initial post 'til WFT got revealed.
3.) Vehement deniers out the gate. Only difference is that people are starting to settle on the leak being real because the leak has had time to stew in spite of no actual evidence beyond WFT.
4.) It seems like something Sakurai would do, especially Palutena and Chorus Kids.

I don't really want to think like that, but when the evidence is all there and things start becoming coincidence, well.. that seems to me the most logical way to look at leaks. You'd do well to adopt it, so when inevitably the Sal Romano leak winds up right and you're staring at the full screen of boring characters with no new villains and no real interesting characters jumping out at you that you want to play as, you can say, 'Man, ChunkyBeef was right, this roster is disappointing.'.

As I said earlier, it's up to Sakurai to prove me wrong, but I'm sticking to my guns.

 

[MasterofMonster]

All I meant was that liking it or not doesn't change the fact about how real/fake it is. We have no idea what Sakurai will do with the roster. It may include all the big characters people want, or it may just include a bunch of characters no-one really thought about. I don't mean you're not allowed to Believe/not Believe it, but liking or hating something isn't something you should use when looking how real it may or may not be.

 

[Spazzy_D]

@ Robertman2 I saw people mention how the smashfest page at bestbuy.com had parts of multiple characters out of the box. I never noticed anyone mention that the official Nintendo tournament page ONLY has Pikachu with parts outside of the box. Different web-site and this one is officially from Nintendo.... once again I haven't seen anyone bring that up, but I haven't gone through every page of this thread, so sorry if that's what you were referring to.

@ ChunkyBeef it's all cool man. I guess my only point of contention with you is that you are taking your personal feelings on the leak and projecting them on everyone. I mean, Chrom, Shulk, and Palutena had support threads that were hundreds of pages (edit: meant posts) long before the second "leak," so they had their fans. Pacman is VERY contentious, but his supporters are just as vocal as his haters. In my opinion, the biggest problem with the Sal leak (last time I bring it up here) isn't so much the newcomers included as much as the newcomers NOT included.

 

[ScottyWK]

If your qualifiers for believing a leak are all subjective ("Disappointing," "uninspired"), then there is an issue. I personally wasn't disappointed with R.O.B or Toon Link or Sonic or Pit, etc from Brawl. So am I allowed to use your logic and say "the leak is clearly fake because it doesn't make me happy?"

 

[ChunkyBeef]

All I meant was that liking it or not doesn't change the fact about how real/fake it is. We have no idea what Sakurai will do with the roster. It may include all the big characters people want, or it may just include a bunch of characters no-one really thought about. I don't mean you're not allowed to Believe/not Believe it, but liking or hating something isn't something you should use when looking how real it may or may not be.

I never really used the words 'liked' and 'hated'. I used to the word 'disappointment' plenty of times, though. There are aspects about every leak I've seen so far that I do like. Remember when I said I'd be totally down with Palutena? I'm fine with that. I'm sure a lot of other people are, too. I'm not really judging a leak by how much I do or don't like it. I'm judging a leak based on a combination of MY disappointment if it were real, and what I perceive would have been general CONSUMER disappointment if it were real.

I mean, look at the reactions to Wii Fit Trainer being revealed. It's so lukewarm and swept under the rug, the general consumer and journalist like 'They're kidding, right?'. And those are journalists and gamers, people there because Sakurai had something to show us and they love Nintendo.

We can sit here all day and argue about it all we want to, but really, there's no better way to judge a TEXT leak beyond how we feel we'd react to it and how the general consumer might react to it. I'm simply taking all the evidence I have and assuming that this Smash roster's reveal will be as disappointing as the last two. It's why I genuinely feel like the Sal Romano leak is right. It's just the right blend of disappointing and 'That's what I expected.'.

@ ChunkyBeef it's all cool man. I guess my only point of contention with you is that you are taking your personal feelings on the leak and projecting them on everyone. I mean, Chrom, Shulk, and Palutena had support threads that were hundreds of pages long before the second "leak," so they had their fans. Pacman is VERY contentious, but his supporters are just as vocal as his haters. In my opinion, the biggest problem with the Sal leak (last time I bring it up here) isn't so much the newcomers included as much as the newcomers NOT included.

And it's the logical, popular, expected newcomers NOT included that makes the leak believable to me.

If your qualifiers for believing a leak are all subjective ("Disappointing," "uninspired"), then there is an issue. I personally wasn't disappointed with R.O.B or Toon Link or Sonic or Pit, etc from Brawl. So am I allowed to use your logic and say "the leak is clearly fake because it doesn't make me happy?"

Everyone reacted differently to the final roster of Brawl and Melee. Some people liked it, but more people were disappointed by it, and that's just Smash fans. I informed less Smash-savvy friends about both rosters and it was met with confusion and disappointment. I have my reasons for judging leaks the way I do, because I have evidence that it works.

Again, it's Sakurai's job to prove me wrong, and we're batting a thousand on the disappointment so far.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Disappointing I get, but I don't think uninspired describes Wii Fit Trainer or Chorus Men. Or really any of the revealed newcomers, when you see just how different and interesting their playstyles have been shown to be.

I don't think this new leak is all that great actually, but I don't really care for Chibi-Robo or a playable My Unit, and I could take or leave characters like Mike Jones. I'm telling you, it all comes down to Ridley and a DK Rep when it comes to crowd pleasing.

 

[Reality_Ciak]

Disappointing I get, but I don't think uninspired describes Wii Fit Trainer or Chorus Men.

I don't think this new leak is all that great actually, but I don't really care for Chibi-Robo or a playable My Unit, and I could take or leave characters like Mike Jones. I'm telling you, it all comes down to Ridley and a DK Rep when it comes to crowd pleasing.

Does anyone want to see My Unit...

Be playable?

I wouldn't mind. Joking aside it makes more sense than Chrom, could have both genders, both a hero and villain technically (sorry if that's spoilers), and it isn't just another blue haired sword swinging lord. Plus it would kill the Sal Leak. Please and thank you. Just call him/her Robin. Please.

 

[ChunkyBeef]

Disappointing I get, but I don't think uninspired describes Wii Fit Trainer or Chorus Men. Or really any of the revealed newcomers, when you see just how different and interesting their playstyles have been shown to be.

I don't think this new leak is all that great actually, but I don't really care for Chibi-Robo or a playable My Unit, and I could take or leave characters like Mike Jones. I'm telling you, it all comes down to Ridley and a DK Rep when it comes to crowd pleasing.

Maybe uninspired was a bad choice of words. Or maybe it was a good choice of words. I meant 'uninspired' not in the way the characters could potentially be unique and interesting, I meant 'uninspired' as in 'this character pick was uninspired', as in 'this chara. Whatever works, I guess.

And the leak just seems way too good to be true. This isn't just me being skeptical, it's literally too good to be true, so I'm assuming it, y'know.. just isn't true. I agree that a new DK representative would definitely be a crowd pleaser, but not so much on Ridley. I might want Ridley in myself, but I don't see Ridley getting as much love as we think. Japan is mostly going to be like 'Who is this? Awful pick!' while Metroid fans over here are going to go ape. I mean, overall it'll get received better than Wii Fit Trainer, but something like Ridley feels like a mixed bag to me. On the other hand, Dixie or K. Rool would probably get plenty of love from every side, but hey, who knows?

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

Look at what will never happen.

For now, this is the E3 roster assuming both Sal and LeakerBros are right. As you can see, I didn't put Zelda, DK and POKEMON since we have no information about their identiy ; while the DK is from the leak, I added the Zelda one for the quizz we saw in the direct, and the pokemon one to have six pokemon, as in brawl (counting each pokemon from PkmnT as one) ; feel free to remove them if you feel so.
Assuming the leak is true, we end with 58 characters (Ditto serves as the random slot). On those 58 characters, KID ICARUS would get two new representatives, as Fire Emblem ; one for Mario ; one for DK ; one for Metroid. The others all come from their own series.

Looks appealing, huh ? Saddly, as many of you are guessing right now, the source is from 4chan ; the same website who leaked the nintendo DSi, but also the same website who made us speculate for three days over a fake CSS for the Demo.
And obviously, it's too good to be true ; between 18-21 newcomers. And who will we have to unlock ? How many characters will be available ? And we all say Squirtle and Ivysaur were removed, what if they come back, taking the spot of the new pokemon ? And we have to deal with all the announcements at E3 ; many argue that Snake will make his appearance because of his new game (on a different support), some say Takamaru has a chance, same goes for a DK or Startropic character 'cuz of Retro making a new game, and I'm not even talking about Ridley... But if we look back at E3 last year, we had Wii Fit Trainer, Villager and Megaman. Were they revealed because of a game at E3 ? For advertisement ? I think Sakurai showed them randomly, and we will probably have random reveals again at this E3.

TL;DR ; Reveals are not related to games who will be revealed or whatever, Sakurai will show what he wants.

BTW I chose Ditto cuz you could choose him in tournament in melee.

EDIT ; I try not to be off-topic, just picturing what the E3/4chan leak implies for the final roster. Except if the LeakerBros leaves in a cavern, he KNOWS about the Sal leak and probably pictures the roster like this.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Does anyone want to see My Unit...

Be playable?

I wouldn't mind. Joking aside it makes more sense than Chrom, could have both genders, both a hero and villain technically (sorry if that's spoilers), and it isn't just another blue haired sword swinging lord. Plus it would kill the Sal Leak. Please and thank you. Just call him/her Robin. Please.

Fantastic. I don't know why I dislike the idea of "Robin" being playable, it just doesn't sit right with me for some reason. Maybe it's because it's a fully customizable avatar in a story driven game, and the character wouldn't feel like the one I used in the game. Plus, if we were to have a sword and sorcery character named Robin I would prefer it be Isaac.

In any case, that fact doesn't make me believe or disbelieve the leak anymore. I could see that character getting in, especially with Villagers many alt costumes revealed, and I see how it would be a good choice game play wise.

 

[Khoru]

@ Yoshi-Thomas the distinction is, as has been said, that the wii u's doing pretty poorly and ninty'll want to have Plenty Of Reasons for people to buy the console

 

[Spazzy_D]

@ ChunkyBeef I don't think this "leak" is meant to appeal to a Japanese audience. In fact, with Ridley AND Mike Jones included, they might consider it a very disappointing and uninspired roster. Leak just got a bit more valid!

@ Yoshi-Thomas I'm going to go ahead and assume that that's the actual roster for the game. I'm also going to include Isaac to make it an even 60 characters. I'm going to inevitably be disappointed with the roster, so I might as well be SPECTACULARLY disappointed.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

@ Yoshi-Thomas the distinction is, as has been said, that the wii u's doing pretty poorly and ninty'll want to have Plenty Of Reasons for people to buy the console

With Smash Brothers doing ad for other licenses ? We have the Roy example, but that was over ten years ago. Except for Pokemon, will they really put newcomers just for the sake of showing new licenses people could try on wii U ?
The E3 leaker, if he is a liar, probably take his guesses from the popular ones, plus one possibility, star tropic, counting on Retro making a new ST game. Hell, even if they make Mike Jones as a new hero of a brand new game, the leak still can't be proven true. All leaks are fake until the game is out. And E3 will probably makes this one garbage. Wait & See but the will to speculate is too high.

 

[Reila]

Does anyone want to see My Unit...

Be playable?

I wouldn't mind. Joking aside it makes more sense than Chrom, could have both genders, both a hero and villain technically (sorry if that's spoilers), and it isn't just another blue haired sword swinging lord. Plus it would kill the Sal Leak. Please and thank you. Just call him/her Robin. Please.

Fantastic post. No more blue haired sword swinging lords please.

 

[ChunkyBeef]

I don't think this "leak" is meant to appeal to a Japanese audience. In fact, with Ridley AND Mike Jones included, they might consider it a very disappointing and uninspired roster. Leak just got a bit more valid!

I figured, but I'm just saying. Considering the evidence we have at how lukewarm/poorly Western popular picks have been with the East (Little Mac, specifically), Ridley would get a similar reaction from them, if not more-so.

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

I figured, but I'm just saying. Considering the evidence we have at how lukewarm/poorly Western popular picks have been with the East (Little Mac, specifically), Ridley would get a similar reaction from them, if not more-so.

It would be less lukewarm. I mean, at least they all know who he IS.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

Oh and I counted the number of series introduced in each game with characters ;

-10 in the original smash (Mario, Zelda, Kirby, POKEMON, Metroid, StarFox, DK, Yoshi's Island, F-ZERO, MOTHER)
-3 more in Melee (Ice Climbers, Fire Emblem, Game&Watch)
-6 more in Brawl (R.O.B., Kid Icarus, Sonic, Metal Gear, Pikmin, Wario Ware)
If this leak is real, we would get 11 more ;

-Animal Crossing
-Star Tropic
-Rythm Heaven
-WII FIT
-Mii games
-Takamaru (dunno the name of the game)
-Xenoblade
-PAC-MAN
-Megaman
-Punch-out
-Chibi-Robo

If you want to count Animal crossing represented in Brawl, it makes 7 more in brawl against 10 more in WIIU/3DS.
A bit too much for my tastes, I'm not sure Sakurai would drown us under dozens of licences.

 

[Katy Parry]

I don't see anything about Isaac, and I feel he's a pretty strong contender. So I don't really believe these leaks honestly.

 

[Reila]

Isaac is a strong contender? More like the opposite, if anything.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I don't see why more licences = bad. It's the complete opposite to me.

To me, more licences = good because it means:
-Character (not always, but pretty often it does)
-A stage (not always, but pretty often it does)
-More music
-Trophies
-Possibly Assist Trophies (maybe 1 or 2)
-Items

I feel that the only reason why someone would consider "too many franchises" bad would be those who want more villains and sidekicks.

 

[Katy Parry]

Isaac is a strong contender? More like the opposite, if anything.

He's really one of the only first party Nintendo characters left that represents an entire franchise that has over 10 years under its belt. Seeing as how he could have the Little Mac treatment as well, I do think he's pretty high up there, considering it seems like Sakurai has special spots for older reps. (Little Mac, Villager)

 

[Reila]

He's really one of the only first party Nintendo characters left that represents an entire franchise that has over 10 years under its belt. Seeing as how he could have the Little Mac treatment as well, I do think he's pretty high up there, considering it seems like Sakurai has special spots for older reps. (Little Mac, Villager)

You bring some valid points, but I still wouldn't call he a strong contender. I do think Golden Sun should have a rep in Smash, tho.

 

[ToothiestAura]

Isaac is second party actually, but I don't think that distinction means much.

 

[R0Y]

Some would argue that they gimped the 3DS screen for cheapened production costs recently without a word...

Way back in late 2011/2012 apparently.