Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Arcadenik]

With them focusing primarily on current gens, I find it unfortunate we may never get characters like Meowth or Evee, who are very iconic mons.

This is why I hate the “current gen Pokémon” quota or the “we need a Pokémon for each gen” idea. Affirmative action for Pokémon...

Eevee and Meowth would have fit in with the Melee and even Brawl newcomers... unique yet simple. But now... the newcomers are becoming more and more complicated and flashy. You can see it in Smash 4 and Ultimate. So... I feel that if Eevee and Meowth finally got in Smash, they would need to be crazy unique like the post-Brawl newcomers.

Crazy unique Eevee would be Eevee having the gimmick of evolving into Vaporeon, Jolteon, and Flareon. Crazy unique Meowth would be Meowth teaming up with Jessie’s Ekans and James’s Koffing.

When you consider Eevee’s history with Eeveelutions and Meowth’s history with Team Rocket, surely you can see how these “crazy unique” ideas suit them.

Eevee for Smash!
Meowth for Smash!

 

[Wunderwaft]

I mean, worse would been that Geno wouldn't be a character AND also didn't got his Mii costume back, like, total lack of representation, no spirits, no mii costume, nothing... that would been much worse, but he hasn't been ignored, he got a spirit and a fight against his spirit, now he got a Mii costume, it sucks, but at least it's something, they acknowledged him.

Aye
That's what happened to Isaac back in Smash 4. All Golden Sun content was removed except for like one song I believe, the fan demand did do something since it brought back the lost Golden Sun content in Ultimate with some extra things. It may not be the most optimal result for the two fan bases since there isn't a playable fighter, but there is the silver lining that the fan outcry wasn't ignored at least.

 

[Dinoman96]

I just think the problem is that the fandom is super fixated on the playable roster than anything else in Smash.

It's why you have people insist that Sakurai supposedly "hates" the Zelda series because the lack of newcomers for it since Brawl, really the lack of any actual unique newcomers since Melee. This notion completely ignores the red carpet treatment Zelda's been given in basically every other department, with multiple spirits, music tracks, items, assist trophies, and stages from across the entire franchise. But I guess it's not good enough because he won't add in some long forgotten supporting character as a fighter.

Even if not playable, the likes of Geno, Isaac, Krystal, etc still have gotten more love in Smash than they have from their respective shareholders. It's definitely an aspect the Smash fanbase takes for granted.

 

[Jocario Zero]

I may or may not have been a bit “bored” and made my personal list for challenger packs 9-11 if it went 100% my way.

Spoiler: wall of text

CP9 – a second Xenoblade-Character

At this point…I don’t care who it is. Elma, Fiora, Lora, Rex or even Tyrea (my girl should’ve been playable in definitive edition). I’m okay with all of them. Just give Xenoblade the attention it clearly deserves. If I can choose, I go with Elma because the current representation of Xenoblade X hurts me.

Mii-Fighter costumes:

-Zeke (Swordfighter) – My boy deserves at least this.
-Morag (Swordfighter) – You know you want this
-Lora (Brawler) – If she’s not playable…
-Lin (Gunner)
-Lloyd (Swordfighter) – It would be ideal to have the costume return with an RPG-character. Not much to say. I would like him or another Tales-Character to be playable.
-Claptrap (Hat) – I’m playing Borderlands for the first time and I love this little guy. Could maybe work as a gunner (I think he is even playable in the Pre-Sequel game).

CP10 – Shantae

My choice for an indie-character. Not much to say. I like the character, the series and the games. I want her playable. That’s it.

Mii-Fighter costumes:

-Risky Boots (Swordfighter)
-Rottytops (Brawler)
-Shovel Knight (Swordfighter) – Obvious choice for an indie-themed pack is obvious.
-Sash Lilac (Brawler) – It would be a dream if Freedom Planet is getting acknowledged in any way in smash. This would be the best that could happen to her (and give me the FP-main theme).
-Gunvolt (Gunner) – Never played the games. Just thought it would be fitting for the “indie-theme” for this pass.
-Ori (Brawler) – See Gunvolt but I plan to play the games at some point (played the demo of the first one and I liked it).

CP11 – Officer Howard (Astral Chain)

I. Love. Astral Chain. This game is so good and not having a playable character seems like such a missed opportunity. I’d main this character immediately. And the music…my god the music…just…DO IT YOU COWARDS I NEED THIS PLS!!!!!

Mii-Fighter costumes

-Neuron uniform (Swordfighter) – Could also work as a gunner.
-Raven Armor (Gunner) – Pretty obvious choice for a costume.
-Lappy (Brawler) – again pretty obvious
-Doom Slayer (Gunner) – if he isn’t going to be playable then at least give me this (btw he’s my runner up for a possible challenger pack 12)
-Monster Hunter (Swordfighter) – I almost forgot about those costumes so I just put them in here for no real reason.
-Rathalos Armor (Swordfighter) – See above.

(I don’t apologize for any grammar errors. It’s late, im tired and I really wanted to finish this one okaythanksbye)

 

[7NATOR]

So, Thinking about how FF7 Finally got Mii costumes for it's Series, and perhaps for some interesting data, here are the 3rd Party franchises that have no Costumes

-Metal Gear
-PAC-MAN
-Street Fighter
-Bayonetta
-Castlevania

These are 5 Franchises, and Besides PAC-MAN, These franchises has someone that could fit a Mii Build

Personally at some point, I'd expect a Alucard Mii costume at least considering how he was considered to be the Castlevania Fighter

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Zagreus would be such an interesting fighter. He has so many weapons to begin with, but there's also the boon system to consider. Imagine if every so often he got random boons during a match. You're fighting him and halfway through his second stock, he gets a friggin Demeter boon so now his side special can freeze you

I guess if you made it like Nick's evidence mechanic in MvC then it could work, giving a temporary boost or element to stats and replacing 'find boon' with Cast. Maybe other times would have Zaggy find some random perks like Death Defiance, nullifying all knockback once or other Mirror perks


Actually I think I'm on to something there, that's like 2 percent of the moveset done

 

[Zeox]

Honestly, I just hope they add a Danganronpa mii costume with the main theme of danganronpa included, it's the 10th anniversary of the franchise and it would be cool to have music from that game... just saying.

 

[Zema]

I just think the problem is that the fandom is super fixated on the playable roster than anything else in Smash.

It's why you have people insist that Sakurai supposedly "hates" the Zelda series because the lack of newcomers for it since Brawl, really the lack of any actual unique newcomers since Melee. This notion completely ignores the red carpet treatment Zelda's been given in basically every other department, with multiple spirits, music tracks, items, assist trophies, and stages from across the entire franchise. But I guess it's not good enough because he won't add in some long forgotten supporting character as a fighter.

Even if not playable, the likes of Geno, Isaac, Krystal, etc still have gotten more love in Smash than they have from their respective shareholders. It's definitely an aspect the Smash fanbase takes for granted.

I was actually really happy to see Geno as a Mii fighter in Smash 4. I had given up all hope at the time. Definitely some people take this stuff for granted. At least Geno has a strong spirit and a Mii costume now, which is far more representation than he's had in about, what, 25 years? Still, it's also fair to feel disappointed that you didn't get what you really wanted. These are not two mutually exclusive viewpoints.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So, Thinking about how FF7 Finally got Mii costumes for it's Series, and perhaps for some interesting data, here are the 3rd Party franchises that have no Costumes

-Street Fighter

Huh, so if Chun-Li gets added then...


The Juri costumes...They're coming.

 

[Deleted member]

For real though I'm curious how anyone could make a Zag moveset because he has so much ****

An idea I had in mind for Zagreus was implementing boons to his moveset. I'd figure he'd only stick with the Stygian Blade since it's his main weapon, so the idea would be to implement boons in his attacks and specials each time he spawns like his attacks deflecting with Athena's boon or his cast being able to weaken attacks with Aphrodite's boon.

That probably sounds OP on paper with how most other boons work in Hades, but given the nature of roguelites, it also sounds like a pretty fun concept for people playing as or against him. It keeps you on your feet as to what boons he's got on currently and how to play around them.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I just think the problem is that the fandom is super fixated on the playable roster than anything else in Smash.

It's why you have people insist that Sakurai supposedly "hates" the Zelda series because the lack of newcomers for it since Brawl, really the lack of any actual unique newcomers since Melee. This notion completely ignores the red carpet treatment Zelda's been given in basically every other department, with multiple spirits, music tracks, items, assist trophies, and stages from across the entire franchise. But I guess it's not good enough because he won't add in some long forgotten supporting character as a fighter.

Even if not playable, the likes of Geno, Isaac, Krystal, etc still have gotten more love in Smash than they have from their respective shareholders. It's definitely an aspect the Smash fanbase takes for granted.

Even casuals focus more on the fighters themselves than anything else. It helps that the box art only features them, and only fighters get elaborate CG. "Don't forget about the other types of representation" seems like a way to subtly go "please don't steal slots from MY characters".

 

[Flyboy]

Honestly, I just hope they add a Danganronpa mii costume with the main theme of danganronpa included, it's the 10th anniversary of the franchise and it would be cool to have music from that game... just saying.

I not-so-secretly am hoping for some kind of Visual Novel rep this pass (Phoenix Wright, naturally, is at the top of my list, but a Danganronpa character, Okabe Rintarou from Steins;Gate, a character from Style Savvy, Professor Layton, etc. would all be great) and I can only hope that a DR costume would come with that. It'd be really neat, even if it's just a Monokuma brawler.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Honestly, I just hope they add a Danganronpa mii costume with the main theme of danganronpa included, it's the 10th anniversary of the franchise and it would be cool to have music from that game... just saying.

Honestly I think a Danganronpa character would be really interesting, but I doubt it would happen at all.

 

[Wunderwaft]

I not-so-secretly am hoping for some kind of Visual Novel rep this pass (Phoenix Wright, naturally, is at the top of my list, but a Danganronpa character, Okabe Rintarou from Steins;Gate, a character from Style Savvy, Professor Layton, etc. would all be great) and I can only hope that a DR costume would come with that. It'd be really neat, even if it's just a Monokuma brawler.

Here's your Phoenix Wright

Umineko is 50% on Steam right now btw go get it

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

But I guess it's not good enough because he won't add in some long forgotten supporting character as a fighter.

That's a bit disingenuous. The characters that get requests are standouts within the series at the very least, and at most, a major form of the series's main antagonist. They may not be too important in the grand scheme of things, but they're not just some randos either. At least, no more than Rosalina & Luma and, in time, Incineroar.

EDIT: Of course, to say that the series gets no love is a lie, but I think being frustrated with the lack of newcomers for The Legend of Zelda series is fine.

 

[cashregister9]

I not-so-secretly am hoping for some kind of Visual Novel rep this pass (Phoenix Wright, naturally, is at the top of my list, but a Danganronpa character, Okabe Rintarou from Steins;Gate, a character from Style Savvy, Professor Layton, etc. would all be great) and I can only hope that a DR costume would come with that. It'd be really neat, even if it's just a Monokuma brawler.

Saber Shill Time!

I Still think Saber is one of the most slept on characters. But you say "The game hasn't been localized" the Main game Fate/Stay Night has not been localized but almost every single game since either has been released in the west or will release in the west. The main one being Fate/Grand Order. Saber has not only huge popularity but can represent visual novels.

 

[RouffWestie]

So, Thinking about how FF7 Finally got Mii costumes for it's Series, and perhaps for some interesting data, here are the 3rd Party franchises that have no Costumes

-Metal Gear
-PAC-MAN
-Street Fighter
-Bayonetta
-Castlevania

These are 5 Franchises, and Besides PAC-MAN, These franchises has someone that could fit a Mii Build

Personally at some point, I'd expect a Alucard Mii costume at least considering how he was considered to be the Castlevania Fighter

I've been thinking, it'd be a crazy shakeup for speculation if the next newcomer came with a Mii Fighter wave comprised of costumes from each of these 5 series.

 

[I.D.]

I like to classify representation by how much work it actually demands from the Smash team

Fighters > Stages > Music remixes == items > mii costumes > everything else (spirits, non-remixed tracks, etc, only require being put in the game with no changes)

Yes, I know there are some caveats, like third party negotiations and stuff. But I perfectly understand why people value a fighter over an item, or an item over a spirit.

 

[Perkilator]

I not-so-secretly am hoping for some kind of Visual Novel rep this pass (Phoenix Wright, naturally, is at the top of my list, but a Danganronpa character, Okabe Rintarou from Steins;Gate, a character from Style Savvy, Professor Layton, etc. would all be great) and I can only hope that a DR costume would come with that. It'd be really neat, even if it's just a Monokuma brawler.

Sakura has the unique treat of her series also being half-visual novel along with being half-RPG. So maybe she's a viable candidate?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Hey can I shill trauma center now

it’s part visual novel part surgery sim and it’s got a fire ass soundtrack

pls play them

also, Derek Stiles for Smash please and thank you

 

[Dinoman96]

edit: nvm misread

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Also I got to ask, Considering Sakurai said that the Sephiroth challenge took awhile to Implement, and that just has a Cool UI and specific fight conditions, I'm going to say that it's unlikely we getting another Boss Character

I don't think Sakurai would only add one "boss" character just because Sephiroth Challenge took a while to do since the lineup was likely decided long before the idea of the Sephiroth Challenge was even brought up.

If anything, the fact that the team managed to impliment it means it'd be easier for them to do a similar challenge in the future, since they could simply copy-paste the coding of the Sephiroth Challenge and change a few things to make it themed around a different character.

Plus, it might be done again in the future, regardless of whether a future fighter is a boss or not, since people seemed to have reacted positively to the idea.

Starting to think Sephiroth was the fall back after both Sora AND Geno fell through

Sora because Disney and Geno cause of the New Mario Order(tm) like I would not be surprised at all if that’s the case

If you really think one of gaming's most iconic villains of all time is a "consolation prize" for not getting a relatively obscure 25-year-old game's side character, you might need to recheck your priorities, imo.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

It's funny how Saber's rarely discussed as a Visual Novel rep even if I get that people don't associate Fate with VNs. I'd say she's the most likely alongside Nick though.

Here's your Phoenix Wright

View attachment 296955



Umineko is 50% on Steam right now btw go get it

Battler Ushiryoma will never make it in Smash

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

To be honest I was skeptical of “voice theory” as it was argued prior. The original concept was that “one character will have two voices” such as Monster Hunter, and I always kinda thought that was questionable.

The only reason I am giving it any attention now is the possibility that, with 3 characters remaining, and another potentially real bit of information suggest Street Fighter, a repeat DLC series like Final Fantasy, would fit that “2 series” and “3 voices” scenario if it was followed with a Tales pick and one other.

That’s the only reason I engaged in the conversation about it as a possibility. I’m not trying to prove a theory that I didn’t even come up with. I just thought it was funny because the argument that “they could just change it” is eerily similar to when I argued Box Theory and got told I was an idiot for it because...”they could just change it! Geno is probably on the back anyway!” In a weird way, it was a result I will savor for quite some time. Call it petty but MAN was that something.

We don’t have enough information to know if it will lead to something anyway. Just an interesting tidbit.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Hey can I shill trauma center now

it’s part visual novel part surgery sim and it’s got a fire ass soundtrack

pls play them

also, Derek Stiles for Smash please and thank you

Is that the guy from Supernatural?

 

[Wunderwaft]

Battler Ushiryoma will never make it in Smash

T-This can't be.....
Red?!

 

[Rie Sonomura]

T-This can't be.....
Red?!
View attachment 296956

Quick someone think of a blue truth to counter it

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Hey can I shill trauma center now

it’s part visual novel part surgery sim and it’s got a fire ass soundtrack

pls play them

also, Derek Stiles for Smash please and thank you

I can see the average Smash fan's reaction now:

"Derek? As in, the guy who used to be part od GameXplain?"

 

[Flyboy]

Sheesh, I didn't expect everyone to chime in with their Visual Novel wants...

...Not that I'm complaining. If Sega ever made a Smash game, Derek Stiles would be the exact kind of deep cut I'd love them to make. Saber, Battler, Derek, Sakura, and plenty of others would all be great.

It's a shame Cing is dead. Once upon a time Kyle Hyde would've made it near the top of my most-wanted VN reps.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

For the record, I was talking about Zelda in particular there.

The one-off supporting characters like Midna, Ghirahim, Skull Kid, etc that the series has mostly moved on from, barring non-canonical spinoffs like Hyrule Warriors.

As was I, I just hadn't named it. And just like the Midna, Girahim, and the Skull Kid, the Super Mario series has moved on from Rosalina, and Incineroar has already started to lose its spotlight. Pretty soon the Pokémon won't even be available in the games. I don't think that makes them lesser picks.

Also, here was something I decided to add, but did so too late for you to see it:

EDIT: Of course, to say that the series gets no love is a lie, but I think being frustrated with the lack of newcomers for The Legend of Zelda series is fine.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Sheesh, I didn't expect everyone to chime in with their Visual Novel wants...

...Not that I'm complaining. If Sega ever made a Smash game, Derek Stiles would be the exact kind of deep cut I'd love them to make.

It's a shame Cing is dead. Once upon a time Kyle Hyde would've made it near the top of my most-wanted VN reps.

At least they remembered him with a spirit

were they technically allowed to do that tho? I guess so since the original copyright holder is no more

 

[Goombaic]

For the record, I was talking about Zelda in particular there.

The one-off supporting characters like Midna, Ghirahim, Skull Kid, etc that the series has mostly moved on from, barring non-canonical spinoffs like Hyrule Warriors.

Point still stands. Nearly all of those "one-offs" are referenced in Breath of the Wild and have enough fans to warrant the creation of a Warriors spinoff which shouldn't be ignored just cause, so they aren't forgotten at all.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

At least they remembered him with a spirit

were they technically allowed to do that tho? I guess so since the original copyright holder is no more

I'd imagine it either went to someone else, or the character entered the public domain. Either would allow for that to be a thing.

At least, I should hope the law is well enough thought out so that people aren't locked out of using something for years because the person who owned it died.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Ok so in less than a week we've already gotten into Byleth whining, cuts and Zelda newcomer discourse. I'm almost impressed

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Ok so in less than a week we've already gotten into Byleth whining, cuts and Zelda newcomer discourse. I'm almost impressed

Don’t forget the random Goku talk

there will ALWAYS be Goku talk. Goku is E T E R N A L

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Don’t forget the random Goku talk

there will ALWAYS be Goku talk. Goku is E T E R N A L

Ok but Goku talk's always done ironically and everyone goes "haha funny Goku moment" instead of taking it seriously

 

[Zeox]

Ok but Goku talk's always done ironically and everyone goes "haha funny Goku moment" instead of taking it seriously

Yeah like, everyone knows Perfect Cell would be the perfect Dragon ball fighter for smash.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Y’all sleepin on my homie Mr. Satan smh

 

[Speed Weed]

It should be El Hermano

 

[Wunderwaft]

Don’t forget the random Goku talk

there will ALWAYS be Goku talk. Goku is E T E R N A L

What could've been....
Had the laws of Smash been different Goku would've been the shoe in of all shoe ins.