Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SharkLord]

• One could also make an argument for Reimu, although apparently her ability to invoke Gensokyo's native gods isn't reliable. Would have to check and confirm that.

She doesn't really use the invoking power very often, but she does have the ability to float away from reality and become invincible and quite possibly immortal.

Yeah, Touhou powers are jacked

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Ludger was listed in 727th place twice because one guy typed in his full name and another guy left out the middle name.

idk why that is making me laugh

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

If Lloyd was the one chosen for Mii Costume status I’m sure he’d be the one chosen as the Tales character as well. That kind of seems like a no brainer.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Is the roster that lacking in new characters? I suppose it has barely any characters from the 10s, but I'm not sure who I'm missing out on specifically.

Well, a side effect of Capcom getting a bunch of veterans is that most of them are older characters, and the Nintendo side really only has Shulk, Inkling and Min Min. It might be wise to do a bit of research for both, in case you're missing any obvious "modern stars" or whatever they're called.

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

If Lloyd was the one chosen for Mii Costume status I’m sure he’d be the one chosen as the Tales character as well. That kind of seems like a no brainer.

Yuri talk mostly krept since the recent Switch port. Since then it feels like he might also be up for the running because of its relevancy on a Nintendo system. I personally think it's either or and I imagine if Lloyd got in, we would definitely see a Yuri costume and of course if Yuri got in, the Lloyd costume would return with him.

 

[Lyncario]

She doesn't really use the invoking power very often, but she does have the ability to float away from reality and become invincible and quite possibly immortal.

Yeah, Touhou powers are jacked

The funniest part about the absurd power level in Touhou, Hecatia, pretty much only has basic godly powers and being the embodiment of the "Me, myself, and I" meme, not manipulating the core fabric of reality, not manipulating any kind of energy trough a door to your soul, not even having a power that puts you on the level of the gods that shaped reality, she's just really strong, and there's also 3 of her.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So I'm still contemplating how Amaterasu could work, and I want to use all three of the weapon types. The reflector and the glaive are easy; The reflector is Amaterasu's main weapon and it gives her normals an "eh" disjoint in as well as quick attacks suitable for a fast character, and the glaive can be used for all of her Smash Attacks. It's that darn rosary that's giving me trouble. Pretty much every idea I can come up with would either make her super campy or is very not OK on a fast character. Or both. Probably both.


Also SmashBoards (or Google, whatever is doing the spellcheck) just told me glaive isn't a word, and the suggested correction was lawgiver...

 

[MattX20]

You know, with today's posting of the new Japanese 7-11 ad, it's very bizarre to say the least. With the exception of the March/April one from last year (though in fairness, we did get confirmation the first character of the second Fighter Pass was an ARMS rep), we've had a Smash reveal occur before the ads were taken down. Frankly, I'm not expecting FP9 to show up until March at the earliest, but still the timing of the ad's release is odd.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Yuri talk mostly krept since the recent Switch port. Since then it feels like he might also be up for the running because of its relevancy on a Nintendo system. I personally think it's either or and I imagine if Lloyd got in, we would definitely see a Yuri costume and of course if Yuri got in, the Lloyd costume would return with him.

all I hope for is if Yuri is a mii, his purple hair better stay Mejestic

 

[Speed Weed]

Case in point with this until I see other spirits being promoted, I feel this may have been an exception being under the request of the ARMS creator.

OK, but like.....why? Why does Min Min have to be an exception? What reason is there for Spirits to be actively kept out at this stage of development? Why would they be so against the idea?

Tell me something: can you seriously picture Sakurai, sitting in his office, rejecting any and all characters that have spirits just because they have them, despite this being after these spirits were added in (meaning they can be revisited) and despite some of these characters having merit on their own for an inclusion, only to go "fine but just this one time" upon learning that Min Min was requested by Yabuki? It's like I said: what good reason is there for them to keep actively walling off any Spirit promos at this point?

I dunno, man. This reeks of desperately attempting to maintain the status quo.

 

[3BitSaurus]

There are a couple I can think of that could go up against both Galeem and Dharkon, although several are extremely unlikely to begin with. So:

• Any Dota character (It's saying something when several of those characters are meant to represent fundamental forces of the universe... and they can be killed by any other character. Sure, in-lore it's part of the "contract" they sign with the Ancient that's they're working under IIRC, but still.). I have little knowledge of LoL lore... but chances are the situation is similar there.
• One could make a very convincing argument for Kratos, for good reason.
• One could also make an argument for Reimu, although apparently her ability to invoke Gensokyo's native gods isn't reliable. Would have to check and confirm that.

Hmm, to an extent yes, I suppose. There are a few characters who are basically incarnations of universal forces in the LoLverse... but by God, do I dread Zoe ever getting in.

Because if she does... well, hope you have fun with these in Smash's awful online:

Spoiler: What were they thinking.jpg

Paddle Star ACTIVE: Zoe shoots a star in the target direction that collides with the first enemy hit, dealing magic damage in a small area, reduced to 80% to enemies hit beyond the first. The total damage is increased by 0% − 150% (based on distance traveled).

Sleepy Trouble Bubble ACTIVE: Zoe kicks a bubble in the target direction that bursts on the first enemy hit, or else forming a trap at maximum range for 5 seconds that arms after 0.8 seconds. The bubble can only move through terrain once but may do so indefinitely, can only move up to 650 units once outside terrain, and will fall short if it would enter terrain again. The bubble deals magic damage on contact with an enemy and renders them drowsy for 1.4 seconds, which gradually slows them, after which they fall asleep for 2.25 seconds.

But really, I actually think any character involved in the recent Ruined King lore would be good. I joked in the LoL thread about the "cinematic universe", but Riot themselves said that they kinda want to make 2021 one big story arc for League - with all four new champions connected to the Viego, the Ruined King's story (Viego himself being a Champion) and it looks like the plot will be told in several parts, including spinoffs. Several characters will come together to fight him - obviously, with the whole world at stake.

So the mood itself is pretty WoL-esque, in a way. Hypothetically, I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if there was some reference to that in a character trailer, despite how recent it is.

Failing that, LoL also has its share of reocurring magic cataclysms in the lore. They could use those too.

 

[Phoenix Douchebag]

Is the roster that lacking in new characters? I suppose it has barely any characters from the 10s, but I'm not sure who I'm missing out on specifically.

To be fair, CN Punch Time Explosion was made juuuust around the time Adventure Time and Regular Show were starting (Those 2 started airing at the start of 2010, the game was released in 2011 on 3DS) they were still mostly unproven at the time (in the same manner as to why we didn't have Inklings in Smash 4, and ARMS rep in Base Ultimate) plus the game came off the rails of the late Two Thousands, and is generally agreed that most Cartoon Network content from the late 2000s from '07 to '09 is unpopular or niche at best or just plain bad at worst (i mean ****, CN Real was just ending after an awful 2 year run, so you can tell things were dire for the Network)

There really weren't any truly successful CN stars that rised out in the latest years before CNPTE started development, plus the budget being and time schedule being short and tight likely meant they had to make their choices wisely, why chose a character from a just recently airing show over one of the main iconic Cartoon Cartoons? (which is why they went with the most obvious like the PPG, Dexter, and so on, and Captain Planet due to him being Ted Turner's pet project, Ted Turner being CN's Father btw)

God talking about this game makes me upset at how Aggressively mediocre that game was. If there's any game idea that has potential and i want to see fully realized (outside of a Castlevania 2: Simon's Quest re imagining) is a CN Smash Game at full scale and with proper passion, hell even a Traditional Fighting Game with CN's cast would make me happier than a kid a candy store (especially with Jawbreakers).

That is mostly thanks to CN being completely unashamed of crossing over and interacting between shows, to the point the CN multiverse feels unified, from Bumpers to Commercials to other crossover games to even crossovers in their own shows (Billy and Mandy with KND, Say Uncle, Crossover Nexus) makes it feel as this idea is part of CN's identity. I even did a fan roster months ago and put the likes of the Eds, Courage and Black Hat, and i was sad because i had to exclude so many good ideas for characters. Even non-CN originals tend to cross over or at least feel at home, which is why i would be okay if the added Hanna Babera pre-1992 characters like Scooby or WB characters like Bugs (Rhapsody Rabbit was the first cartoon ever aired on the Network, after all) and even Tom and Jerry since their shorts were really prevalent in the early days of the Network. I would be okay with some non-CN original chars, as long as it is not something stupid like i don't know, Goku because he was on Toonami, or Sakura Kinomoto because her show aired on CN on international versions of the channel or Garfield for the same reason, and people started justifying it with "it's about the history of Animation now!" or something like that.

I would love if Hell Froze Over, The Planets Aligned, Pigs started flying, so that way CN could give a talented and passionate developer this game pitch, with the necessary funding and time for this to happen, that would probably be so amazing. Smash Needs more competition, not from fangames, but from actual games that can pull the quality of Smash in all apsects, which is why im cautiostly hyped for Fraymakers, which is basically Smash Bros with Indie characters, and made from the same team that made SSF2 (who have proved to know the intricacies of Smash, so we know we are in good hands) with new features such as an Assist Mechanic similar to strikers from KOF NESTs Saga, or Assists from MVC. If someone can make Fraymakers magic with Cartoon Network, then sing me the **** up.


........oh yeah, we were talking about Smash...................uh......................how do i make this on-topic?........


MIKE JONES FOR SMASH! Because Statropics deserves love too dammit, Regional Lock be damned (at least give me a spirit dammit)

 

[7NATOR]

Actually since Chun-Li has been talked about, I thought I mention this as well, but this might suggest either Chun-Li, Capcom Character, or Fighting game character next

(1) Official - Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion | Page 4028 | Smashboards

This talks about the Polish leak, which revealed early on what amiibo was being restocked

-Smash Mario and Luigi
-Smash Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, and Young Link
-Ryu
-Cloud (both versions)
-All the Breath of the Wild Amiibo
-All the Splatoon Amiibo (except Smash Inkling, weirdly)
-Super Mario Peach and Boo

Mario had the Anniversary, Zelda has Age of Calmity, and Cloud is related to Sephiroth, our CP7 Character

Splatoon and Ryu are unaccounted for. There was rumors of a Splatoon Spin-off that was supposed to be shown off this year. it's likely it was delayed

That just leaves Ryu. Cloud was speculated to mean Geno or something Square related. while it was Sephiroth, the Intention did line up, so in the case of Ryu, It would likely mean our Next character is related to him in someway, either being Capcom related, Fighting game Character related, or Chun-Li

 

[SharkLord]

Actually since Chun-Li has been talked about, I thought I mention this as well, but this might suggest either Chun-Li, Capcom Character, or Fighting game character next

(1) Official - Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion | Page 4028 | Smashboards

This talks about the Polish leak, which revealed early on what amiibo was being restocked

-Smash Mario and Luigi
-Smash Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, and Young Link
-Ryu
-Cloud (both versions)
-All the Breath of the Wild Amiibo
-All the Splatoon Amiibo (except Smash Inkling, weirdly)
-Super Mario Peach and Boo

Mario had the Anniversary, Zelda has Age of Calmity, and Cloud is related to Sephiroth, our CP7 Character

Splatoon and Ryu are unaccounted for. There was rumors of a Splatoon Spin-off that was supposed to be shown off this year. it's likely it was delayed

That just leaves Ryu. Cloud was speculated to mean Geno or something Square related. while it was Sephiroth, the Intention did line up, so in the case of Ryu, It would likely mean our Next character is related to him in someway, either being Capcom related, Fighting game Character related, or Chun-Li

Seeing as that's before Steve was even revealed, this feels a bit too early to be anything but a coincidence

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Actually since Chun-Li has been talked about, I thought I mention this as well, but this might suggest either Chun-Li, Capcom Character, or Fighting game character next

(1) Official - Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion | Page 4028 | Smashboards

This talks about the Polish leak, which revealed early on what amiibo was being restocked

-Smash Mario and Luigi
-Smash Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, and Young Link
-Ryu
-Cloud (both versions)
-All the Breath of the Wild Amiibo
-All the Splatoon Amiibo (except Smash Inkling, weirdly)
-Super Mario Peach and Boo

Mario had the Anniversary, Zelda has Age of Calmity, and Cloud is related to Sephiroth, our CP7 Character

Splatoon and Ryu are unaccounted for. There was rumors of a Splatoon Spin-off that was supposed to be shown off this year. it's likely it was delayed

That just leaves Ryu. Cloud was speculated to mean Geno or something Square related. while it was Sephiroth, the Intention did line up, so in the case of Ryu, It would likely mean our Next character is related to him in someway, either being Capcom related, Fighting game Character related, or Chun-Li

I’m gonna go for a non fighting game Capcom character. Getting Chun Li or a different fighting game character would break the Round 2 Pattern.

 

[N3ON]

Except we didn’t even see nearly all the ATs returning. If, during pre-release, we saw the return of every single AT in history except those two, that would be a better comparison.

No it wouldn't, it would still be a pattern people formalized based on incomplete information; conjecture, as many faulty theories are.

It would be more understandable as to why people would reach that conclusion, but it wouldn't lend it any more actual validity. It would still be saying "x can't happen because it's yet to happen"; the basis of so many misconceptions.

Especially because we've seen prior DLC costumes get upgraded as early as the first newcomer shown for Ultimate, and prior ATs get upgraded totally before Ultimate was even a thing. So even forming these theories in the first place requires moving goalposts to some extent.

 

[Megadoomer]

OK, but like.....why? Why does Min Min have to be an exception? What reason is there for Spirits to be actively kept out at this stage of development? Why would they be so against the idea?

Tell me something: can you seriously picture Sakurai, sitting in his office, rejecting any and all characters that have spirits just because they have them, despite this being after these spirits were added in (meaning they can be revisited) and despite some of these characters having merit on their own for an inclusion, only to go "fine but just this one time" upon learning that Min Min was requested by Yabuki? It's like I said: what good reason is there for them to keep actively walling off any Spirit promos at this point?

I dunno, man. This reeks of desperately attempting to maintain the status quo.

I'd find it really unfortunate if Min Min winds up being the only spirit that gets promoted to playable in Ultimate. That could very well wind up happening, since there are only three spots left and there's a ton of competition, but there are a ton of potential characters (not even accounting assist trophies, there's Captain Toad, Elma, Dixie Kong, Bandanna Waddle Dee, Rayman, Fawful, Impa, Dark Matter, Saki from Sin and Punishment... and that's just some of the possible options from base game spirits) that could very well wind up being relegated to being stuck as spirits because, for some reason, they might have decided to only promote one.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I'd find it really unfortunate if Min Min winds up being the only spirit that gets promoted to playable in Ultimate. That could very well wind up happening, since there are only three spots left and there's a ton of competition, but there are a ton of potential characters (not even accounting assist trophies, there's Captain Toad, Elma, Dixie Kong, Bandanna Waddle Dee, Rayman, Fawful, Impa, Dark Matter, Saki from Sin and Punishment... and that's just some of the potential options from base game spirits) that could very well wind up being relegated to being stuck as spirits because, for some reason, they might have decided to only promote one.

Shantae, Tsubasa, Octoling (Octo Expansion), Raiden too...

 

[Michael the Spikester]

You know, with today's posting of the new Japanese 7-11 ad, it's very bizarre to say the least. With the exception of the March/April one from last year (though in fairness, we did get confirmation the first character of the second Fighter Pass was an ARMS rep), we've had a Smash reveal occur before the ads were taken down. Frankly, I'm not expecting FP9 to show up until March at the earliest, but still the timing of the ad's release is odd.

Today? It was a few days ago. You're talking about the one that was lacking Sephiroth on the Pass right?

 

[Eldrake]

There are a couple I can think of that could go up against both Galeem and Dharkon, although several are extremely unlikely to begin with. So:

• Any Dota character (It's saying something when several of those characters are meant to represent fundamental forces of the universe... and they can be killed by any other character. Sure, in-lore it's part of the "contract" they sign with the Ancient that's they're working under IIRC, but still.). I have little knowledge of LoL lore... but chances are the situation is similar there.

I just imagine Arc Warden showing up and imprisoning Galeem and Dharkon within the moon because from his viewpoint they're basically Radinthul 2.0 and Diruulth 2.0 except omnicidal.

Though Invoker could work for such a trailer. Cataclysm outta nowhere.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

So I'm still contemplating how Amaterasu could work, and I want to use all three of the weapon types. The reflector and the glaive are easy; The reflector is Amaterasu's main weapon and it gives her normals an "eh" disjoint in as well as quick attacks suitable for a fast character, and the glaive can be used for all of her Smash Attacks. It's that darn rosary that's giving me trouble. Pretty much every idea I can come up with would either make her super campy or is very not OK on a fast character. Or both. Probably both.


Also SmashBoards (or Google, whatever is doing the spellcheck) just told me glaive isn't a word, and the suggested correction was lawgiver...

Just make the rosary act like Byleth's whip moves?

 

[True Blue Warrior]

No it wouldn't, it would still be a pattern people formalized based on incomplete information; conjecture, as many faulty theories are.

It would be more understandable as to why people would reach that conclusion, but it wouldn't lend it any more actual validity. It would still be saying "x can't happen because it's yet to happen"; the basis of so many misconceptions.

Especially because we've seen prior DLC costumes get upgraded as early as the first newcomer shown for Ultimate, and prior ATs get upgraded totally before Ultimate was even a thing. So even forming these theories in the first place requires moving goalposts to some extent.

You mean like how people assume every first-party character has to fit the model of being promotional despite not fitting the same category as?

 

[SNEKeater]

Honestly the only character I can imagine going up against Galeem and Dharkon at once in their trailer is Demifiend, you know, cause the whole post-apocalyptic setting, morality system with no right answer and the iconic image of crushing a demon and an angel in each hand. I can't think of anything half as fitting

Now I want this

I wanna see this image but with Galeem and Dharkon instead of the Oni and the Angel

 

[MarioRaccoon]

Hey guys, Ive been playing the DKC trilogy recently thanks to nintendo switch online (the only game i played before was the first DKC) and I now I understand why people want Dixie Kong, she is the real co-protagonist of the trilogy with Diddy Kong. I hope they include her, at least, as a bonus. She can be a semi-echo fighter from DD.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Just make the rosary act like Byleth's whip moves?

It's one of the few ideas I actually like, but it's only one move (Up Smash and Up Aerial are taken by attacks that are more fitting for them) and I need to use it a bit more than once or twice to make it not seem kinda random. I think what I'll do is have her take a bit to ready her lashes with the Devout Beads so that they can still threaten space while still allowing her Celestial Brush Techniques and her agility to be her primary forms of controlling space.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

It's one of the few ideas I actually like, but it's only one move (Up Smash and Up Aerial are taken by attacks that are more fitting for them) and I need to use it a bit more than once or twice to make it not seem kinda random. I think what I'll do is have her take a bit to ready her lashes with the Devout Beads so that they can still threaten space while still allowing her Celestial Brush Techniques and her agility to be her primary forms of controlling space.

I meant the general concept and overall range.

Also, Byleth down tilt.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I meant the general concept and overall range.

Also, Byleth down tilt.

Ah, right.

Thinking about how Amaterasu would attack with the rosary is actually the easy part. The problem is that the weapon type has more range than the Masamune, maybe even more than Min Min's Punch. They'd definitely have to shorten it for the purposes of Super Smash Bros., but it'll still have a bit more range than the average swordfighter due to its original purpose and the fact that it would look kinda weird if it was too short. It works great for conventional zoner attacks, but it's a bit more difficult to incorporate into a quicker fighter, and it also overlaps with how I think Power Slash should work.

I think I've got a grasp on how to use it now though.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

The problem is that the weapon type has more range than the Masamune, maybe even more than Min Min's Punch.

Both of these are shortened from their origin game, iirc.

 

[SneakyLink]

Looks to be a mustache spirit event this week.

No deconfirms

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Looks to be a mustache spirit event this week.

No deconfirms

Hecc... back to generic themed ones... but I still do hope they can throw in some new ones more often too

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Infeasible isn't the right word so much as implausible. It's implausible they add more.

With how willy nilly SNK was with letting Sakurai add 50 songs, and the SNK content that was there in general, I can't say I can agree with 'implausible'.

 

[MattX20]

Today? It was a few days ago. You're talking about the one that was lacking Sephiroth on the Pass right?

Yeah, that one. I only learned about it today

 

[Rie Sonomura]

It’s actually my meta-headcanon that since Steve’s a pacifist just trying to build a house for God’s sake, he said no Spirit slaughters

then Sephiroth showed up and is like hello naughty children it’s bloodbath time

 

[SharkLord]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

The Spirit Event in question, in case you were curious

 

[Rie Sonomura]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

The Spirit Event in question, in case you were curious

the guy from Codename STEAM has a beard not a mustache

excuse me sir that’s cheating

 

[N3ON]

You mean like how people assume every first-party character has to fit the model of being promotional despite not fitting the same category as?

Yes, that is a good example of exactly what I was saying.

With how willy nilly SNK was with letting Sakurai add 50 songs, and the SNK content that was there in general, I can't say I can agree with 'implausible'.

The implausibility isn't predicated on SNK's willingness, it's predicated on Nintendo, SNK's remaining properties, and how widely the company was represented the first time.

By the time Terry was released, Nintendo knew who was to follow in the next pass. If it was going to be a series like Metal Slug or Samurai Shodown or something, aside from those options not being overly likely in the first place, their presence within the first pack would be pretty dubious.

Not like FF or Minecraft showed up with Hero and Banjo.

 

[Guynamednelson]

excuse me sir that’s cheating

Translating the Tweet tells me the spirit event's name is "Fluffy! Dundee! Proud beard".

So it's EVERYONE ELSE who's cheating! Ha!

 

[Megadoomer]

excuse me sir that’s cheating

I think that, in Japanese, the word for "beard" and "mustache" is the same thing.

That's the only explanation that I can think of for why this guy is called Whitebeard:

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Yes, that is a good example of exactly what I was saying.


The implausibility isn't predicated on SNK's willingness, it's predicated on Nintendo, SNK's remaining properties, and how widely the company was represented the first time.

By the time Terry was added, Nintendo knew who was to follow in the next pass. If it was going to be a series like Metal Slug or Samurai Shodown or something, aside from those options not being overly likely in the first place, their presence within the first pack would be pretty dubious.

Not like FF or Minecraft showed up with Hero and Banjo.

Obviously, that means the second SNK rep is Rock Howard

 

[chocolatejr9]

excuse me sir that’s cheating

Look, as long as Code Name: S.T.E.A.M. gets ANY sort of acknowledgement, it's fine by me.