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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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Goombaic

Goombaic

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Mar 18, 2015
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853
You all know the spirit/tournament event is probably just going to be shown at midnight or sometime later again with no reason for the delay in announcement. I want Toxtricity as much as the rest of y'all do but the Pokemon presents has a 99.99% of not including anything Smash.
CommanderZaktan said:
There was a problem fetching the tweet
Wario's angel and devil
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Kazuya: Look what I can do.

Wario: What does that have to do with any-
Pit:

No no, he's got a point.
 
PeridotGX

PeridotGX

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Shroob said:
Like I said before, I'm extremely certain that Sakurai would retweet the Direct.


That, and soft-confirming a character outside of a General Direct or major event like E3/TGA is unheard of. You wouldn't be targeting Smash's audience at all doing it like this.
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i don't really think it's happening, it was mostly a meme.

Shroob said:
Is it? We've never had DLC items before, be it Smash 4 or Ultimate.
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For what it's worth, we know they're physically capable of doing it if need be. Banjo's grenade is treated as an item and was added post-release.
 
DarthEnderX

DarthEnderX

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Bobthealligator said:
Really, so I can talk about my weird feeling that Goku is the last character?
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Joke, I've made before, but I can only see Goku if Sakurai really is done making Smash games.

Basically tossing a grenade as he leaves the room and leaving the next guy to deal with the mess.

Idon said:
Smash fans be like "God I hope we get some Assist Trophy promotions, I'm sick of these anime swordsmen" thinking they'll get this:
View attachment 326699

when if that happens they'll probably get this:
View attachment 326697
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NGL, group B is WAY better.

Þe 1 → Way said:
I agree, the best timeline is obviously the one where we get Black Knight.
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I wouldn't turn down an Ike echo.
 
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Ivander

Ivander

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11,468
With the amount of people wanting Dixie and Black Knight as Echoes to Diddy and Ike, I better not see any frickin' complaints about Blaziken being suggested as an Echo Fighter for Captain Falcon.
 
DarthEnderX

DarthEnderX

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Ivander said:
With the amount of people wanting Dixie and Black Knight as Echoes to Diddy and Ike, I better not see any frickin' complaints about Blaziken being suggested as an Echo Fighter for Captain Falcon.
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Well you're gonna. Because echoes/clones should always be from the same franchise as the character they're cloned from.

#DecloneGanondorf
 
Cosmic77

Cosmic77

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Pokémon presentations rarely feature anything outside content from actual Pokémon games.

Even if the last character is a Pokémon, I'd be more inclined to believe they'd announce the character literally a day after a huge Pokémon presentation rather than in the presentation itself.
 
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Cutie Gwen

Cutie Gwen

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Shroob said:
You're moving the goalposts, hard, but that's frankly not surprising considering the track record of:


October: Steve took all the budget, rest of the pass will be low key

December: Steve AND Sephiroth took all the budget, rest of pass will be low key

June: Steve, Sephiroth, AND Kazuya took all the budget



There's nothing saying that the last character will be 3rd party, but nothing saying they won't be 1st either. There's nothing saying if they're 3rd party that they'll be big, but also saying there's nothing saying they'll be small either.


I swear I've seen you disparage fan rules dozens of times in the pass, and yet, you keep making them every time we get a new character revealed.
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You forgot Min Min being evidence that FP2 is low budget and won't have any big third party names which was used to discredit medium level IPs

Also to go back to the Black Knight talk, there's our second Sonic character
 
SMAASH! Puppy

SMAASH! Puppy

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So now that I've done all the Fighter Pack concepts that I'm gonna do for this round of speculation, I decided to look back at them all and give my thoughts:
Freddy (Five Nights at Freddy's)
I think this one is the best one. It has a very clear design goal, and each of the moves work together to achieve that goal rather than taking a gimmick and working from there. To put it another way, I was thinking about how the player and their opponent would interact with the character rather than simply what move did what, and I think that’s what makes it the clearest. Even the quality of the writing itself seems to be better than the others. Also, I find the idea of a character being a heavy/zoner hybrid to be pretty interesting.

I do have a few nitpicks though. I didn’t consider how Vengeful Poster worked with Special Moves that can only be activated by command inputs, likely because Shakunetsu Hadouken was the only one at the time, but I would say those count as well. Also I said that you can setup a shield break setup with a combo, which is technically correct, but the more accurate term would be a block string.

I freaking love this stage idea. It’s mechanics are something that have never been done before, and would bring a whole new dynamic to matches within the stage. It also is a perfect representation of the Five Nights at Freddy’s series to the point where it honestly wouldn’t even need a character if it got a stage like this. Though…I would still want one.

EDIT: One thing that I forgot to mention here is that when I was making the tracklist, I didn't know that the music from every game prior to FNaF World is either licensed or public domain, so it's actually unlikely for any of the music to come from Five Nights at Freddy's 4 and prior...oops.

Rex & Pyra/Mythra (Xenoblade Chronicles)
Well R.I.P. this concept. Feelings on how things actually went down aside, I’m somewhat happy with how this character turned out. The Blade Specials part definitely needs to be rethought since it has a problem with inconsistency (at the start of the match the input only switches Blades but later it does something else) and a few of the Blade Specials themselves stuck too close to the source material, while a few others would have to be changed a bit to be consistent with the existing interpretations of them should Rex & Pyra/Mythra ever be added in a post Pyra/Mythra world. However, the actual mechanic of Pyra and Mythra supporting Rex is really good IMO.

Other than that, I probably should have put that Pyra gives Rex the chance to OHKO things since the way it’s written implies that it always happens, and Mythra’s Foresight would probably work like it does on the current playable version of Mythra. The rest seems oddly par for the course despite the special to special cancel mechanic, and I really think the character concept would have benefited a heck of a lot from the more thought out playstyle that Freddy had (there is an inkling of one in that he’s supposed to be a combo based sword character, but I don’t think that really came across here).

As for the stage, I like Cloud Sea of Alrest better for representing Xenoblade Chronicles 2, but the Garfont Village concept would make a pretty neat second stage, and I like the idea of Core Crystals as an item.

Amaterasu (Ōkami)
“Her Neutral Attack is longer than normal”

Kazuya: “I’m gonna end this god’s whole career.”

Her 5 hit combo is actually meant to be a true combo, but it’s still a little funny.

I love how the Celestial Brush was handled, and kinda hope that this is how it would work should she actually get in the game. I think the idea of a rushdown character with the capacity to throw out big dumb hitboxes at a potential cost sounds very compelling as well. I’m not really happy with how the Devout Beads were handled though. The projectile attack and super juggle Up Aerial I think are fine, but the other two attacks just seem to be “oops this is a swordie move on a rushdown character. Better make it suck.” Her Forward Aerial is strange as well. I think it should just not give her all that much distance rather than being an air dodge with a hitbox. It’s just weird.

As for the stage, I really like it, and I think it would be a particularly notable one if it was in the actual game.

Chell (Portal)
This moveset concept sounds like it would be so much fun to play around with, and the idea of Chell being a strange setup/stage control zoner is pretty novel I think. The stage has a ton of potential as well, being a larger stage with multiple layouts to change up the experience from game to game. The peanut gallery that would also be included is a huge plus.

Bandana Waddle Dee (Kirby)
While he doesn’t have any super mind-blowing mechanics like a lot of the others, I think this moveset concept is simple, but effective, and I quite like it for that. Even so I did manage to add some cute stuff with the Parasol Shield, though the Up Smash might be a tad unnecessary.

The stage is similar; Simple, but effective. Even with hazards off turning off the mini-bosses, I think the layout would be pretty fun. All in all, I’m happy with both the character and stage, and probably wouldn’t change much about them if at all.

Toon (Disney's Toontown Online)
I think this moveset suffers a bit from adhering to the source material too much, and in practice would likely be about as undercooked as Isabelle’s moveset. In concept though this is probably one of the funniest character concepts out there, and I think it nails the nonsensical slapstick comedy aspect perfectly. I don’t think the ability to just completely ignore gravity while climbing up the ladder with Up Special makes sense even with the cartoon logic though. I should have just shot the Toon out of a cannon.

I like the stage too, and I like how the Cogs were handled as well.

Mega Man X (Mega Man)
I’m not sure what to think about this fighter concept in retrospect. I like the individual moves (sooo much better than punchy kicky Mega Man X from Marvel Vs. Capcom Infinite), but I really don’t see how they work together all that well, and the Special Moves seem to be a bit awkward as a result of trying to be super accurate to their original form. Would probably rewrite if I had the chance/10.

Central Highway though? Noice. It pretty much removes everything I don’t like about Super Smash Flash 2’s version of the stage and then adds more bells and whistles. The actual layout is a bit less unique, but I think it would be more fun overall.

Zero (Mega Man)
I don’t think I really had a game plan in mind for this character other than “haha rushdown swordie go brrrr”, and while the direct translation of his source material work pretty well, it’s still not a good substitute for actually designing the character properly in terms of how the player and their opponent would interact with the moveset. Definitely has potential though.

The stage seems really nice, and I would probably play on the hazards off version all the time if it were real. The hazards on version might be a bit annoying though.

Rytlock (Guild Wars)
I love how far into crazy town this character’s Special Moves go, but I think I forgot the entire point of the stance switch gimmick as I was designing the moveset. Even so, his normals still manage to be interesting. Good concept, but needs to be more thought out in execution.

I’m…not the biggest fan of the stage. The last three parts of the stage kind of look like I had no idea what to do so I just built stuff on top of the flat land. It works for the Asura Gate area since it shows off the style of each race in the game, but the other two in combination with it just don’t sit well with me. I like the easter egg idea for it though, and the Mystic Forge area sounds like it would be fun.

Elma (Xenoblade Chronicles)
I think this character’s concept is pretty interesting, and some of the attacks sound like they’d be pretty fun. I do worry that this approach would find itself in design heck where there’s such a thin line between it being absolutely busted and underwhelming to straight up bad that the character is never where you want her to be in terms of execution. Assuming they’d get it right though, I think she could be pretty successful in that she would be easier to play at lower levels while also being pretty difficult at higher levels of play.

As for the stage, I like most of the transformations, but I’m not fond of how Oblivia’s transformation turned out. I think sticking so close to the source material here was to the detriment of the stage, and I probably should have made up some more interesting terrain like I did for Primordia’s transformation. Also, I think this concept Xenoblade Chronicles X the most justice in terms of stages since the exploration aspect is what it pushes, and any one area would put a damper on that. Also also, love the weather mechanic.

Amy (ZanZarah: The Hidden Portal)
I love Amy’s interaction with the match. It allows her to feel more involved despite not actually being involved.

I think I did pretty good with the fighters themselves considering the only attacks the fairies had were just magic lasers in the original game. I love the different take on the idea of a swapping character (especially with how swapping is now comittal), and quite like how nicely the original spell mechanics were placed into the Neutral Special. My worry is that in practice, Tadana is this weird middle ground character that doesn’t really fit into the checks and balances that the other two are strongly based around.

I think the Astral Plane stage will be fun in casual matches as well. It’s not too crazy, and there’s even a fun visual element attached.

All in all I think the general gist of it is that they're all really interesting concepts, but they needed to be more well thought out for the execution to be easier to picture in action among other things. Perhaps I'll redo these somewhere down the line (definitely not in the near future). They were a blast to make, and I hope you guys enjoyed them as well.
 
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FreeFox

FreeFox

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SMAASH! Puppy said:
So now that I've done all the Fighter Pack concepts that I'm gonna do for this round of speculation, I decided to look back at them all and give my thoughts:
Freddy
I think this one is the best one. It has a very clear design goal, and each of the moves work together to achieve that goal rather than taking a gimmick and working from there. To put it another way, I was thinking about how the player and their opponent would interact with the character rather than simply what move did what, and I think that’s what makes it the clearest. Even the quality of the writing itself seems to be better than the others. Also, I find the idea of a character being a heavy/zoner hybrid to be pretty interesting.

I do have a few nitpicks though. I didn’t consider how Vengeful Poster worked with Special Moves that can only be activated by command inputs, likely because Shakunetsu Hadouken was the only one at the time, but I would say those count as well. Also I said that you can setup a shield break setup with a combo, which is technically correct, but the more accurate term would be a block string.

I freaking love this stage idea. It’s mechanics are something that have never been done before, and would bring a whole new dynamic to matches within the stage. It also is a perfect representation of the Five Nights at Freddy’s series to the point where it honestly wouldn’t even need a character if it got a stage like this. Though…I would still want one.

Rex & Pyra/Mythra
Well R.I.P. this concept. Feelings on how things actually went down aside, I’m somewhat happy with how this character turned out. The Blade Specials part definitely needs to be rethought since it has a problem with inconsistency (at the start of the match the input only switches Blades but later it does something else) and a few of the Blade Specials themselves stuck too close to the source material, while a few others would have to be changed a bit to be consistent with the existing interpretations of them should Rex & Pyra/Mythra ever be added in a post Pyra/Mythra world. However, the actual mechanic of Pyra and Mythra supporting Rex is really good IMO.

Other than that, I probably should have put that Pyra gives Rex the chance to OHKO things since the way it’s written implies that it always happens, and Mythra’s Foresight would probably work like it does on the current playable version of Mythra. The rest seems oddly par for the course despite the special to special cancel mechanic, and I really think the character concept would have benefited a heck of a lot from the more thought out playstyle that Freddy had (there is an inkling of one in that he’s supposed to be a combo based sword character, but I don’t think that really came across here).

As for the stage, I like Cloud Sea of Alrest better for representing Xenoblade Chronicles 2, but the Garfont Village concept would make a pretty neat second stage, and I like the idea of Core Crystals as an item.

Amaterasu
“Her Neutral Attack is longer than normal”

Kazuya: “I’m gonna end this god’s whole career.”

Her 5 hit combo is actually meant to be a true combo, but it’s still a little funny.

I love how the Celestial Brush was handled, and kinda hope that this is how it would work should she actually get in the game. I think the idea of a rushdown character with the capacity to throw out big dumb hitboxes at a potential cost sounds very compelling as well. I’m not really happy with how the Devout Beads were handled though. The projectile attack and super juggle Up Aerial I think are fine, but the other two attacks just seem to be “oops this is a swordie move on a rushdown character. Better make it suck.” Her Forward Aerial is strange as well. I think it should just not give her all that much distance rather than being an air dodge with a hitbox. It’s just weird.

As for the stage, I really like it, and I think it would be a particularly notable one if it was in the actual game.

Chell
This moveset concept sounds like it would be so much fun to play around with, and the idea of Chell being a strange setup/stage control zoner is pretty novel I think. The stage has a ton of potential as well, being a larger stage with multiple layouts to change up the experience from game to game. The peanut gallery that would also be included is a huge plus.

Bandana Waddle Dee
While he doesn’t have any super mind-blowing mechanics like a lot of the others, I think this moveset concept is simple, but effective, and I quite like it for that. Even so I did manage to add some cute stuff with the Parasol Shield, though the Up Smash might be a tad unnecessary.

The stage is similar; Simple, but effective. Even with hazards off turning off the mini-bosses, I think the layout would be pretty fun. All in all, I’m happy with both the character and stage, and probably wouldn’t change much about them if at all.

Toon
I think this moveset suffers a bit from adhering to the source material too much, and in practice would likely be about as undercooked as Isabelle’s moveset. In concept though this is probably one of the funniest character concepts out there, and I think it nails the nonsensical slapstick comedy aspect perfectly. I don’t think the ability to just completely ignore gravity while climbing up the ladder with Up Special makes sense even with the cartoon logic though. I should have just shot the Toon out of a cannon.

I like the stage too, and I like how the Cogs were handled as well.

Mega Man X
I’m not sure what to think about this fighter concept in retrospect. I like the individual moves (sooo much better than punchy kicky Mega Man X from Marvel Vs. Capcom Infinite), but I really don’t see how they work together all that well, and the Special Moves seem to be a bit awkward as a result of trying to be super accurate to their original form. Would probably rewrite if I had the chance/10.

Central Highway though? Noice. It pretty much removes everything I don’t like about Super Smash Flash 2’s version of the stage and then adds more bells and whistles. The actual layout is a bit less unique, but I think it would be more fun overall.

Zero
I don’t think I really had a game plan in mind for this character other than “haha rushdown swordie go brrrr”, and while the direct translation of his source material work pretty well, it’s still not a good substitute for actually designing the character properly in terms of how the player and their opponent would interact with the moveset. Definitely has potential though.

The stage seems really nice, and I would probably play on the hazards off version all the time if it were real. The hazards on version might be a bit annoying though.

Rytlock
I love how far into crazy town this character’s Special Moves go, but I think I forgot the entire point of the stance switch gimmick as I was designing the moveset. Even so, his normals still manage to be interesting. Good concept, but needs to be more thought out in execution.

I’m…not the biggest fan of the stage. The last three parts of the stage kind of look like I had no idea what to do so I just built stuff on top of the flat land. It works for the Asura Gate area since it shows off the style of each race in the game, but the other two in combination with it just don’t sit well with me. I like the easter egg idea for it though, and the Mystic Forge area sounds like it would be fun.

Elma
I think this character’s concept is pretty interesting, and some of the attacks sound like they’d be pretty fun. I do worry that this approach would find itself in design heck where there’s such a thin line between it being absolutely busted and underwhelming to straight up bad that the character is never where you want her to be in terms of execution. Assuming they’d get it right though, I think she could be pretty successful in that she would be easier to play at lower levels while also being pretty difficult at higher levels of play.

As for the stage, I like most of the transformations, but I’m not fond of how Oblivia’s transformation turned out. I think sticking so close to the source material here was to the detriment of the stage, and I probably should have made up some more interesting terrain like I did for Primordia’s transformation. Also, I think this concept Xenoblade Chronicles X the most justice in terms of stages since the exploration aspect is what it pushes, and any one area would put a damper on that. Also also, love the weather mechanic.

Amy
I love Amy’s interaction with the match. It allows her to feel more involved despite not actually being involved.

I think I did pretty good with the fighters themselves considering the only attacks the fairies had were just magic lasers in the original game. I love the different take on the idea of a swapping character (especially with how swapping is now comittal), and quite like how nicely the original spell mechanics were placed into the Neutral Special. My worry is that in practice, Tadana is this weird middle ground character that doesn’t really fit into the checks and balances that the other two are strongly based around.

I think the Astral Plane stage will be fun in casual matches as well. It’s not too crazy, and there’s even a fun visual element attached.

All in all I think the general gist of it is that they're all really interesting concepts, but they needed to be more well thought out for the execution to be easier to picture in action among other things. Perhaps I'll redo these somewhere down the line (definitely not in the near future). They were a blast to make, and I hope you guys enjoyed them as well.
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Forgive my ignorance but coud I request you to add the game from which each one comes from? To search a bit about some of them that I cant recognize.
 
SMAASH! Puppy

SMAASH! Puppy

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FreeFox said:
Forgive my ignorance but coud I request you to add the game from which each one comes from? To search a bit about some of them that I cant recognize.
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It didn't occur to me since the original essays all specify the series/games and they're all linked in my signature, but I put in the series as requested. The only lesser known character around here who's series has more than one game in it is Rytlock, who is from Guild Wars 2 specifically.

EDIT: Also you are in no way ignorant for not knowing some of these characters.
EDIT EDIT: I feel it's worth mentioning that if ZanZarah: The Hidden Portal sounds interesting to you, it is on Steam, but you'll also have to install a 3rd party software (dgvoodo) in order to get the UI to work properly, as Steam made 0 effort to get the game to work on modern systems. It's still "playable" without it, but trust me, playing the game with it's outdated graphics language is a painful experience.
 
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Evil Trapezium

Evil Trapezium

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Theguy123

Theguy123

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I find it funny that the smash bros Twitter page hasn’t even posted anything about the event yet and we had to find out through the game instead. Any bets on how long they’ll go before telling us about the new event. I’ll give it about a day before they randomly tell us about the event being out.
 
Staarih

Staarih

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Theguy123 said:
I find it funny that the smash bros Twitter page hasn’t even posted anything about the event yet and we had to find out through the game instead. Any bets on how long they’ll go before telling us about the new event. I’ll give it about a day before they randomly tell us about the event being out.
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It was the same with the Mario Golf: Super Rush spirits, the Twitter post came pretty last minute, the same probably happens here. While two times doesn't make a pattern, I wonder if it's a deliberate choice to announce them a bit later from now on.

Evil Trapezium said:
I don't think this anything to get worked up over. Stuff like this can get unused all the time in game development and updates.
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Agreed, the missing events may just never show up and were just scrapped for one reason or another.
 
G

Guynamednelson

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Lyncario said:
Can we take a moment to apreciate how the live-chat for the Pokemon Presents has been disabled? They know exactly what kind of fanbase they're dealing with lmao.
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Or they don't want little kids to see cuss words.
 
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