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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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Theguy123

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All this talk about Shadow or other Sonic characters potentially making it in makes me wish that's the case for CP11, but at the same time I don't wanna get my hopes up.
I'll still give my two cents about it and get disappointed in the end though

I must also add, that in case of the 2nd chance theory, most people say there isn't evidence of Sonic being planned and stuff, but I find it really hard to believe if the idea wasn't at least considered, when
1. Sonic has received the most support for a 2nd rep out of the 3rd parties (since Brawl as well), not really a contest in this regard
2. At the same time he's one of the most recognizable 3rd parties alongside PAC-MAN and Steve
3. Most potential characters save for Eggman would be fairly easy to work with due to Sonic's model being used as a base
4. Shadow in particular receiving the better treatment a non-playable character can get (an AT with new properties and 2 spirits, one of which is Legend-Class, not counting miis ofc) while also getting praised by the man himself, makes me think he could've been considered at some point
5. I know Sonic miis were directly ported from Sm4sh, but the fact being, it's strange that Shadow hasn't received one for so long despite being one of the most requested characters
6. There's a case being made for FP2 filling ''base game gaps'' rather than anything tbh, and it seems to be the reason why Sephiroth got in at all (lackluster FF7 content). This may sound very subjective or anecdotal, but I think most people find it strange that Sonic hasn't got a character even though other franchises did (as he checks all the boxes), in the same vein that people thought it was weird that KoF got included before Tekken.
7. We know there has been talks with SEGA in the past, not only in regards to trailers and such, but because they technically have 3 characters already
Even though atlus is owned by sega Nintendo themselves don’t treat it that way since the trademark for persona on the smash website and game is just Atlus and not sega which makes a 2nd official sega rep more likely
 

DarthEnderX

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No, that's what you said. If you want to stop replying, then don't. But I have no intention of letting you spout nonsense without commenting.

Idiocy grows in the dark.

I get it, you can't accept the fact it was one of the best games on the Wii-U, quite possibly the best at the time, and thus had the benefit of relevancy bias.
Yes, one of the best games, on Nintendo's least successful console ever

The ballot was a 100% pure popularity contest. Being the best Wii U game would have barely moved the needle against...every other video game character ever.
 
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Twilord

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I honestly think we will end of a first party.

A Legends Arceus rep seems most likely to me, but I suspect that they will be a relatively interesting one at least.

Idiocy grows in the dark.

I know but replying to your conspiracy theories is exhausting.

Yes, one of the best games, on Nintendo's least successful console ever
Yeah the only way it could win a popularity contest would be if said contest was directly related to one of the other flagship titles of that console. Good thing for your argument that wasn't the case.
 
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TheLamerGamer

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I get that this thread is for discussion, and that disagreements are guaranteed to come from that, but can people stop arguing like if someone disagrees with them it's the end of the world.

When you get to the stage of insulting people over a game made for literal children, nobody's going to pay attention to your argument, and it makes people less likely to want to join in with the discussion, ruining the entire point of the thread.

If someone has a different opinion just calmly argue your opinion and move on.
 

Twilord

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I get that this thread is for discussion, and that disagreements are guaranteed to come from that, but can people stop arguing like if someone disagrees with them it's the end of the world.

When you get to the stage of insulting people over a game made for literal children, nobody's going to pay attention to your argument, and it makes people less likely to want to join in with the discussion, ruining the entire point of the thread.

If someone has a different opinion just calmly argue your opinion and move on.

You are right; and I am actually gonna move on now.

I need to work on not getting baited.

Sorry to everyone for my part in dragging down the conversation.
 
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PeridotGX

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Ok guys, the thread for the best possible candidate for Smash is up and running! Be sure to visit and officially support it!

 

SNEKeater

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Even though atlus is owned by sega Nintendo themselves don’t treat it that way since the trademark for persona on the smash website and game is just Atlus and not sega which makes a 2nd official sega rep more likely
I mean, Atlus is now owned by Sega. So technically Sega owns Persona.

The difference is that Atlus operates with pretty much the same autonomy as before of being bought, as far as I know.

In any case, Joker was added in Pass 1. Assuming third party companies will not double dip in the same pass, which has been the case so far, Sega is still free because they didn't get a character in Pass 2. They could get another one just like Microsoft and Square Enix.

About the last part, maybe I missed something and you're talking about Ultimate newcomers so no Smash 4 included, but if that's not the case Bayonetta should totally be considered an official Sega rep.
 
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Theguy123

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I mean, Atlus is now owned by Sega. So technically Sega owns Persona.

The difference is that Atlus operates with pretty much the same autonomy as before of being bought, as far as I know.

In any case, Joker was added in Pass 1. Assuming third party companies will not double dip in the same pass, which has been the case so far, Sega is still free because they didn't get a character in Pass 2. They could get another one just like Microsoft and Square Enix.

About the last part, maybe I missed something and you're talking about Ultimate newcomers so no Smash 4 included, but if that's not the case Bayonetta should totally be considered an official Sega rep.
Yeah that’s my mistake. Didn’t realise I put official 2nd rep. Was meant to put official 3rd rep. My apologies
 

TheLamerGamer

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I mean, Atlus is now owned by Sega. So technically Sega owns Persona.

The difference is that Atlus operates with pretty much the same autonomy as before of being bought, as far as I know.

In any case, Joker was added in Pass 1. Assuming third party companies will not double dip in the same pass, which has been the case so far, Sega is still free because they didn't get a character in Pass 2. They could get another one just like Microsoft and Square Enix.

About the last part, maybe I missed something and you're talking about Ultimate newcomers so no Smash 4 included, but if that's not the case Bayonetta should totally be considered an official Sega rep.
Actually, it's always felt weird to me that Platinum isn't in the copyright section on smash's title screen and trailers, since I was under the impression that they owned the games and Sega / Nintendo just published them, so Platinum would be the copyright holders for Bayonetta. I could be wrong though.
 

SNEKeater

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Actually, it's always felt weird to me that Platinum isn't in the copyright section on smash's title screen and trailers, since I was under the impression that they owned the games and Sega / Nintendo just published them, so Platinum would be the copyright holders for Bayonetta. I could be wrong though.
I guess they could have added Platinum to the copyright section, but they never owned Bayonetta as far as I know, it has been always owned by Sega. They overall own the IP, so they can put Bayonetta 1 anywhere (it's on PS4 and PC, for example). But Bayonetta 2 was funded by Nintendo and they probably secured the rights of the game. Same case, I guess, with Bayonetta 3.

So for Bayonetta 2 and 3 Sega would need Nintendo's permission if they wanted to release both games in other platforms, and well, that's obviously not going to happen lol
 

TheLamerGamer

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I guess they could have added Platinum to the copyright section, but they never owned Bayonetta as far as I know, it has been always owned by Sega. They overall own the IP, so they can put Bayonetta 1 anywhere (it's on PS4 and PC, for example). But Bayonetta 2 was funded by Nintendo and they probably secured the rights of the game. Same case, I guess, with Bayonetta 3.

So for Bayonetta 2 and 3 Sega would need Nintendo's permission if they wanted to release both games in other platforms, and well, that's obviously not going to happen lol
If that's the case, it's pretty weird that they aren't there but ATLUS is, since they're just a subsidiary now. I guess it's because Persona's been around since way before Sega bought ATLUS, and ATLUS operates completely independently most of the time.
 

NessAtc.

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When you stick Pyra and Mythra in FP9 instead of at the end, that's a dead giveaway that what's actually there is more likely than not something a good bit smaller than Xenoblade 2. And Xenoblade 2 is the smallest thing in the pass so far. Not a lot that could be smaller, yet still feasibly make it in.
 

chocolatejr9

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When you stick Pyra and Mythra in FP9 instead of at the end, that's a dead giveaway that what's actually there is more likely than not something a good bit smaller than Xenoblade 2. And Xenoblade 2 is the smallest thing in the pass so far. Not a lot that could be smaller, yet still feasibly make it in.
Would a mobile game be smaller? Because I'm putting my bets on Euden.
 

FreeFox

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We are talking about which Nintendo might make it? Well, I am still hoping for Paper Mario. (Dont have much hope for Isaac since he is an AT)
 

Gengar84

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I don't know how anyone has the mental energy to argue on a thread like this. I just come in to talk to myself out loud and disengage whenever I'm miffed about somethin'.
Yeah, I think I just don’t care enough to seriously argue about anything Smash related. I love the game but I’m pretty accepting of almost everything. As far as the ballot is concerned, I think it all worked out well in the end so it seems like a waste to argue about it at this point.
 

Rie Sonomura

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We are talking about which Nintendo might make it? Well, I am still hoping for Paper Mario. (Dont have much hope for Isaac since he is an AT)
Y’all know who I’m backing at this point

my little babies 🥺🐙

don’t have much hope for Elma if any cuz well… Pyra and Mythra
 

zumaddy

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Xenoblade as a series is more popular than Arms, and Pyra and Mythra are more popular than any Arms character, so I wouldn't say their inclusion was the smallest below Min Min (and this is coming from a fervent Min Min supporter)

I'm sad the Paper Mario House thread is kill
 

NessAtc.

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We are talking about which Nintendo might make it? Well, I am still hoping for Paper Mario. (Dont have much hope for Isaac since he is an AT)
And why is that? I mean, Spring Man was almost in by default, and the decision for an ARMS character was up to Yabuki anyway. If Yabuki had wanted Spring Man, what would have happened? Would the universe have collapsed in on itself?

Xenoblade as a series is more popular than Arms, and Pyra and Mythra are more popular than any Arms character, so I wouldn't say their inclusion was the smallest below Min Min (and this is coming from a fervent Min Min supporter)
Popularity means nothing when you're talking about "how big" a title is, because visible popularity only goes as far as however many people have actually bought the game. Xenoblade 2 being more popular than ARMS doesn't make ARMS a less recognizable or smaller choice, because more people bought and experienced ARMS than Xeno 2.
 
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Momotsuki

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Y’all know who I’m backing at this point

my little babies 🥺🐙

don’t have much hope for Elma if any cuz well… Pyra and Mythra
Octoling would be pretty cool! Off the Hook - and by extension, partially an Octoling - would be an especially good idea for the sake of avoiding the derivative stigma that matters a fair bit for a fighter you have to pay for.
 

MattX20

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Well, I think it's fairly likely that FP11 will be revealed during the September Direct for this year. Given that Nintendo Directs typically happen no later than the week of the 15th of the month, that means we've got at most 8-10 weeks worth of time left to wait before we get it. That, and at bare minimum 4 spirit events and tournament events before then
 
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Momotsuki

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And why is that? I mean, Spring Man was almost in by default, and the decision for an ARMS character was up to Yabuki anyway. If Yabuki had wanted Spring Man, what would have happened? Would the universe have collapsed in on itself?
I think that in the alternate timeline that Yabuki wanted Spring Man, the assist trophy simply becomes Springtron when Spring Man is in the match. Smash has done this kind of thing all of the time, I never really got why people find the idea so out-there.
 

Perkilator

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I think that in the alternate timeline that Yabuki wanted Spring Man, the assist trophy simply becomes Springtron when Spring Man is in the match. Smash has done this kind of thing all of the time, I never really got why people find the idea so out-there.
Those were relatively minor things. In Spring Man's case, you'd have to retroactively accomodate for a character who was already an AT.
 

GilTheGreat19

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Well, I think it's fairly likely that FP11 will be revealed during the September Direct for this year. Given that Nintendo Directs typically happen no later than the week of the 15th of the month, that means we've got at most 8-10 weeks worth of time left to wait before we get it. That, and at bare minimum 4 spirit events and tournament events before then
I wouldn't be surprised if the announcement happened during the direct.
Maybe even depending on the character; say, if it's someone big, they could end off the direct with the character. I don't REALLY think they'd start off with the FINAL Smash reveal.
Starting off with an end, in other words.
 

NessAtc.

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I think that in the alternate timeline that Yabuki wanted Spring Man, the assist trophy simply becomes Springtron when Spring Man is in the match. Smash has done this kind of thing all of the time, I never really got why people find the idea so out-there.
I meant in terms of "if Yabuki wanted Spring Man instead, would Sakurai have disagreed?". It seems pretty outlandish to think that Sakurai would outright deny a creator's wishes just because the character already has a presence within gameplay. Even if it was part of Yabuki's consideration, thinking that Sakurai enforced it on him feels almost dictatorial, which is ironic given how underpronounced Sakurai's control is over DLC.
 

Gengar84

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We are talking about which Nintendo might make it? Well, I am still hoping for Paper Mario. (Dont have much hope for Isaac since he is an AT)
There are still a lot of first party characters I’d be excited for although I don’t know how likely most of them are. Here are a few examples:

Goomba/Goombella
Gengar
Dixie Kong (with Animal Buddies)
Impa (HW1 design)
Ganon
Medusa
Jena Anderson
Elma
The Black Knight
Isaac
Wart
 

Þe 1 → Way

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Those were relatively minor things. In Spring Man's case, you'd have to retroactively accomodate for a character who was already an AT.
Okay, but what exactly does that entail? The main idea I’ve seen is Springman is either replaced by Springtron or just turned off when Springman is in play.

Hell, they might not even need to do anything. Chrom can get styled on by an identical looking version of himself if hit by Robins FS.

All of these things accommodate the AT while taking at most a new model, some lines of code, or literally nothing if the team decides. Doesn’t seem like a big issue.
 

Inferno7

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Are we doing 1st party wishlists?
If so I'll do mine

MW:
I actually have not one, but two first party MWs, those being;
-Dry Bowser: One of my most used chars in Mario Kart, I also love his design. I'd like to have him as an echo, contrary to popular belief, I wouldn't like it if he was actually unique just because I want him.
-Galacta Knight: Either semi-clone or echo would do the work, but I'm leaning towards the former, since Galacta not only does use a lance and a shield, but has lots of moves that differ from MK (at least in Smash) and could be translated beautifully, see Return to Dream Land for reference. Also smh at not including his banger of a theme in this game.

Characters I'd like:
-Tabuu: The guy who singlehandedly teached me how to spot dodge, also like his design and powers
-King Bob-Omb: One of my favorite bosses from Mario, very underrated imo
-Waluigi: He's funny tall lanky purple man, one of my favorites from the Mario cast as well
-Funky Kong: My favorite Kong, was also my most used in Mario Kart Wii.
-Primeape/Mankey: My favorite Pokémons but they are pretty much impossible
-Infernape/Giratina: Favorites from Gen 4, but again, impossible
-Genesect: Fav from Gen 5
-Ghirahim
-Gengar
-Demise
-Skull Kid
-Marx
-Ashley
-Dark Matter
-Magolor
-Krystal:
Really liked the way she played in SSF2
-Black Knight
-Blood Falcon:
Why on Earth is he not an echo? (Before you say Black Shadow, body proportions exist)
-Isaac: never played his game but he looks and plays cool ig
-Takamaru
-Sukapon
-Pretty much any potential character from Kid Icarus such as Hades, Medusa or Viridi


Too bad most of them lost their chance for this game though
 
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NessAtc.

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The only thing I want at this point is Isaac. That's really the only thing I find lacking with ultimate at the moment, because it doesn't feel right to have been given this kind of spotlight for the character and his franchise, and yet they didn't bother to add his battle theme, even though 6 of the spirits already use the same battle theme. This was a problem with Xenoblade 2's spirits as well, and it was rectified in CP9.
 

FreeFox

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And why is that? I mean, Spring Man was almost in by default, and the decision for an ARMS character was up to Yabuki anyway. If Yabuki had wanted Spring Man, what would have happened? Would the universe have collapsed in on itself?
Mostly trying to temper my expectations. Nothing more, nothing less. Since we have spirit fighters and we havent had an upgraded assist trophy in the same game, I am trying to be careful.
Funnily enough, Paper Mario and Issac are the last two missing characters to complete my 7 wish list. I list I had for a long time now.
 

NessAtc.

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Mostly trying to temper my expectations. Nothing more, nothing less. Since we have spirit fighters and we havent had an upgraded assist trophy in the same game, I am trying to be careful.
Funnily enough, Paper Mario and Issac are the last two missing characters to complete my 7 wish list. I list I had for a long time now.
My point is that we almost already had it happen. It doesn't matter if we haven't had it happen yet, that proves that there's no such rule that says it cannot happen.
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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I think that in the alternate timeline that Yabuki wanted Spring Man, the assist trophy simply becomes Springtron when Spring Man is in the match. Smash has done this kind of thing all of the time, I never really got why people find the idea so out-there.
Or they'd just temporarily disable it. Why would they make an all new model for that? Especially when Springtron makes more sense as an alt costume. A far better use of resources. It takes less time and coding to disable it(if that's even necessary) while Spring Man is playable. Alts or otherwise. Basically, there's nothing that's actually needed to be done beyond a tiny snippet of coding. They already do this in the game alone, and would repeat it again. Rerigging an entire model like that is a lot of extra work for zero pay-off. Besides that, it's a fan rule, not some logical rule. It assumes Sakurai would go out of his way to waste resources for, basically, no pay-off. As I said, the model is better spent on an alt. Or, like Min Min, just pure recolors of Spring Man and that's it. Springtron would've been an obvious Spirit though.

At the very least, Spring Man would've had a chance in that regard. He was the obvious AT by default when not playable, being the mascot and all. Then DLC came along and Nintendo got requested by Yabuki for Min Min. Spring Man obviously would've been considered if it was "any ARMS character", if not the most likely choice for Sakurai to default to. He doesn't just go with his favorite characters either, as there's more to it than that.

But we're in a different timeline where Nintendo wanted Min Min due to Yabuki, so. Ninjara and Min Min were both Sakurai's personal choices either way. Wouldn't even matter much, though.

I'm sad the Paper Mario House thread is kill
It's not even a character in fiction(a species is an actual character in a story by design). I don't know what people expected here. There's some pretty awkward character threads, but this one is a location that is quite clearly not alive or even almost close to. I admit there's some weird ones that are more debatable, but this one was honestly a very expected outcome.
 

Quick Gaming (QG)

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When you stick Pyra and Mythra in FP9 instead of at the end, that's a dead giveaway that what's actually there is more likely than not something a good bit smaller than Xenoblade 2. And Xenoblade 2 is the smallest thing in the pass so far. Not a lot that could be smaller, yet still feasibly make it in.
most likely something not associated with Nintendo usually if Kazuya is any indication
 

SharkLord

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I think that in the alternate timeline that Yabuki wanted Spring Man, the assist trophy simply becomes Springtron when Spring Man is in the match. Smash has done this kind of thing all of the time, I never really got why people find the idea so out-there.
I don't even think they'd go through the trouble of trying to find a replacement for the ATs. They'd just turn them off, like they do when the ATs interfere with a stage's cameos and/or mechanics.
 
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