Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[chocolatejr9]

Maybe it would have cool results, but I'm pretty sure it literally can't happen. Japan itself has to approve of a merger of a Japanese company that size and there's no way it would, because Nintendo is a massive part of Japan's cultural identity around the world, and they'd never approve of it merging with a Western company.

To be fair, nobody thought the Disney-Fox deal would go through, and look what happened...

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Personally I'm surprised there've been no rumblings about Battletoads coming to Switch since that's a small-scale product like Cuphead and Ori and all the Rare stuff would probably perform pretty well on Switch. I don't know if it did that great either since it looks kinda wack so the Switch audience could help out on that one.

Oh that's easy to explain, people who glorify Rare only really cared about DKC, Banjo and maybe Conker, they don't care about any other Rare IP. Like how there's a difference between Sonic fans and Sega fans

 

[Golden Icarus]

Pretty sure I heard this exact same thing before but instead of Doomguy and Masterchief it was Steve and Banjo.

I’d say that the Doomguy and Master Chief comparison is way more reasonable. They’re both western developed, FPS dudes, with futuristic green armor. Steve and Banjo are from completely different genres and have zero visual similarities. Anybody who believed that they couldn’t coexist in Smash was not thinking straight.

I’ve always been pretty doubtful of Doomguy though. He never really stood out to me as the best Bethesda rep and definitely doesn’t stand out as the best Microsoft rep.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Oh that's easy to explain, people who glorify Rare only really cared about DKC, Banjo and maybe Conker, they don't care about any other Rare IP. Like how there's a difference between Sonic fans and Sega fans

That... explains a lot, actually.

 

[Gengar84]

Not sure if he counts as an underdog, because he seems to have a decent chance. As far as fan speculation goes, though, the Chosen Undead isn't talked about all that much. A Dark Souls character has basically been my most wanted since I played Dark Souls in 2014. I would love a Bearer of the Curse alt, because I actually really enjoyed Dark Souls II.

Are you referring to the Battletoads about having a decent chance? I really hope so but I'm not expecting them. I'd be more than happy with anyone on that roster even though almost none of them have any shot.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I’ve always been pretty doubtful of Doomguy though. He never really stood out to me as the best Bethesda rep and definitely doesn’t stand out as the best Microsoft rep.

I suppose it is a little lower on the totem pole than the competition due to only just having resurged, but I think it is at least not as bad as something like Phoenix Wright. The lesser Capcom titles all have juggernauts like Monster Hunter, Street Fighter, Devil May Cry, Resident Evil and even classics like Mega Man over them. The lesser Microsoft ones I'm pretty sure are just Halo, Minecraft, and now The Elder Scrolls and Fallout, and uh...Banjo-Kazooie is also here because fan demand and wouldn't really get in otherwise.

 

[cashregister9]

Steve... wasn't the first Microsoft character in Smash... and this alleged hint happened after both existing ones already made it in.

Banjo was implied I just didn't mention him lol.

I was just thinking out loud in my original post and the process was, We already have 2 Microsoft characters so maybe that + the Indie games that have come to switch would be the extent of their Partnership, But the new rumors indicates more so maybe depending on how far back the specific partnership that is being hinted at there might be a third character to tie in with an announcement or some **** like that. Or again just xCloud or something.

 

[N3ON]

Oh that's easy to explain, people who glorify Rare only really cared about DKC, Banjo and maybe Conker, they don't care about any other Rare IP. Like how there's a difference between Sonic fans and Sega fans

Yeah, I'm not sure that's true. People don't care much about Jet Force Gemini or Blast Corps, but there are Battletoads, Killer Instinct, Perfect Dark, and especially Goldeneye fans out there too. I think you might just be looking at where Rare characters and Smash requests overlap.

I mean, a lot of people thought this was referring to Goldeneye to the point he made a follow-up tweet

Spoiler: Naughty words

To those of you speculating the Nintendo + Xbox news is related to Goldeneye, it's not. As I've said before, the Goldeneye port was being held back by Danjaq. No one else. That's why this Danjaq renewal is so ridiculously fucking exciting.

— Balatro Nick  (@Shpeshal_Nick) April 10, 2021

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Yeah, I'm not sure that's true. People don't care much about Jet Force Gemini or Blast Corps, but there are Battletoads, Killer Instinct, Perfect Dark, and especially Goldeneye fans out there too. I think you might just be looking at where Rare characters and Smash requests overlap.

I mean, a lot of people thought this was referring to Goldeneye to the point he made a follow-up tweet

Spoiler: Naughty words

To those of you speculating the Nintendo + Xbox news is related to Goldeneye, it's not. As I've said before, the Goldeneye port was being held back by Danjaq. No one else. That's why this Danjaq renewal is so ridiculously fucking exciting.

— Balatro Nick  (@Shpeshal_Nick) April 10, 2021

I always see people blame Microsoft for Rare's failings, bemoan that modern Rare doesn't do anything with their classic IPs and completely ignore KI, whine that Battletoads is bad because it did the exact thing it did in the 90's and I've only seen a handful of people ever talk about the Perfect Dark announcent last year. It's always about Banjo and DKC and a smidge of Conker. You'd have a point if I was exclusively talking about Smash requests but I'm talking about in general, be it here, discord, twitter, with irl friends, youtube, etc. That last one especially as Rare would always be praised in damn near every video back in the day solely for the trio I mentioned

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I always see people blame Microsoft for Rare's failings, bemoan that modern Rare doesn't do anything with their classic IPs and completely ignore KI...

Eh, I dunno about Killer Instinct being ignored. From what I've seen it still has a relatively strong community, and #BringBackKI was a thing (though for that I don't really know how much of it was jut Max).

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Eh, I dunno about Killer Instinct being ignored. From what I've seen it still has a relatively strong community, and #BringBackKI was a thing (though for that I don't really know how much of it was jut Max).

I meant that the people who would whine about Rare not using their classic IPs (read: Banjo) always ignoring the entirety of Killer Instince's comeback, hell, I swear there were more people upset at no new Banjo announcement at MS' Not E3 stream last year than there were people excited for the new Perfect Dark announcement or for Battletoads since they showed it off

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I meant that the people who would whine about Rare not using their classic IPs (read: Banjo) always ignoring the entirety of Killer Instince's comeback, hell, I swear there were more people upset at no new Banjo announcement at MS' Not E3 stream last year than there were people excited for the new Perfect Dark announcement or for Battletoads since they showed it off

Oh OK that makes sense. Though I do theorize that the art style is what turned a lot of people off of the new Battletoads.

 

[Gengar84]

Does anybody want a side character or villain from any game that we don't have the main character yet? I realized that quite a few of my most wanted characters aren't actually the main protagonist of their game.

Let's just say, for example, that they really want to have an Astral Chain character but they aren't able to make the Legion mechanic work for reasons similar to why Rex was left out. How would people feel about Jena Anderson getting in Smash instead of Akira? Jena is one of the coolest looking game characters ever and I would be really hyped if she got in.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Oh OK that makes sense. Though I do theorize that the art style is what turned a lot of people off of the new Battletoads.

It's literally the same joke as the original NES game, copying TMNT. If you ask me, it's genius but after that people suddenly no longer cared about the game despite claiming they just wished Rare would use these classic IPs to make the same kind of games they used to be.

Does anybody want a side character or villain from any game that we don't have the main character yet? I realized that quite a few of my most wanted characters aren't actually the main protagonist of their game.

Let's just say, for example, that they really want to have an Astral Chain character but they aren't able to make the Legion mechanic work for reasons similar to why Rex was left out. How would people feel about Jena Anderson getting in Smash instead of Akira? Jena is one of the coolest looking game characters ever and I would be really hyped if she got in.

I abide by 'rule of cool' so sure, best example's gonna be seen in the RTC thread in a week or two with Beatrice from Umineko

 

[silenthunder]

Does anybody want a side character or villain from any game that we don't have the main character yet? I realized that quite a few of my most wanted characters aren't actually the main protagonist of their game.

Let's just say, for example, that they really want to have an Astral Chain character but they aren't able to make the Legion mechanic work for reasons similar to why Rex was left out. How would people feel about Jena Anderson getting in Smash instead of Akira? Jena is one of the coolest looking game characters ever and I would be really hyped if she got in.

GlaDOS before Chell and any Skyrim character before a created avatar

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Does anybody want a side character or villain from any game that we don't have the main character yet? I realized that quite a few of my most wanted characters aren't actually the main protagonist of their game.

Let's just say, for example, that they really want to have an Astral Chain character but they aren't able to make the Legion mechanic work for reasons similar to why Rex was left out. How would people feel about Jena Anderson getting in Smash instead of Akira? Jena is one of the coolest looking game characters ever and I would be really hyped if she got in.

I think it's fairly well known at this point that things like this generally don't sit well with me. In the case of Astral Chain's character being anything but the protagonist, I would be really upset since the protagonist is the coolest thing about the game imo.

Also I have no idea who Jena Anderson is but that might be because I didn't get far enough into the game. I really need to get back to it someday.

It's literally the same joke as the original NES game, copying TMNT. If you ask me, it's genius but after that people suddenly no longer cared about the game despite claiming they just wished Rare would use these classic IPs to make the same kind of games they used to be.

That is also a good point, though IIRC the artstyle was a turn-off for Rise of the TMNT as well so that still would make sense. It may have been a knee-jerk reaction that has subsided by this point since the show itself looks pretty good from what I've seen (aside from what's his face being absolutely terrible) so I could be wrong.

 

[ahemtoday]

GlaDOS before Chell and any Skyrim character before a created avatar

I struggle to think of any potential Skyrim characters other than the Dragonborn, to be honest. Um, there's Alduin, or Paarthurnax... that's about all I've got.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I struggle to think of any potential Skyrim characters other than the Dragonborn, to be honest. Um, there's Alduin, or Paarthurnax... that's about all I've got.

That was my thinking as well, though I don't really know much about Skyrim so I assumed I just didn't know rather than that Skyrim lacked any major characters other than the protagonist.

EDIT: Though with how they phrased it and with how iconic the Dragonborn seems to be, it kind of just seems like an "avatar bad" stance, which also kind of rubs me the wrong way.

 

[Gengar84]

I think it's fairly well known at this point that things like this generally don't sit well with me. In the case of Astral Chain's character being anything but the protagonist, I would be really upset since the protagonist is the coolest thing about the game imo.

Also I have no idea who Jena Anderson is but that might be because I didn't get far enough into the game. I really need to get back to it someday.



That is also a good point, though IIRC the artstyle was a turn-off for Rise of the TMNT as well so that still would make sense. It may have been a knee-jerk reaction that has subsided by this point since the show itself looks pretty good from what I've seen (aside from what's his face being absolutely terrible) so I could be wrong.

Yeah I would think most people would rather have the main character. How did you feel getting Min Min instead of Spring Man? I personally liked Min Min better but I can understand being disappointed that she was chosen over the poster boy.

As for Jena Anderson, mild spoilers below:

Spoiler

she's pretty much a mad scientist and one of the main antagonists for a large portion of the game.

 

[Aerospherology]

I struggle to think of any potential Skyrim characters other than the Dragonborn, to be honest. Um, there's Alduin, or Paarthurnax... that's about all I've got.

Of course, Charles Martinet voicing a fourth character and it's not Waluigi.

 

[ahemtoday]

Personally, I kind of dig the "here's a popular side character instead of the main character" choices we've been getting lately. It's something I've noticed about MvC rosters - they're not exactly beholden to any kind of prominence hierarchy. We got Zero before we got X, and if we always went with the main characters we would not have Tron Bonne. It makes character choices a little more interesting, as well.

That was my thinking as well, though I don't really know much about Skyrim so I assumed I just didn't know rather than that Skyrim lacked any major characters other than the protagonist.

Neither do I. But if it's like "when you think about Skyrim, you don't think of the Dragonborn", who do you think of? And more importantly, who does an audience of people who may only know Skyrim by osmosis - like I do - think of? The only other interesting character I can think of is Paarthurnax. He's, like, a good dragon. I know that. And then I only know Alduin because he's the final boss and I think he's the one that shows up in the intro. And I don't even remember what they look like. Alduin was black, and I think Paarthurnax was gray.

I know I just said I was down for side characters over main ones, but at some point it's just kind of a stretch to put anyone else in.

 

[SharkLord]

Yeah I would think most people would rather have the main character. How did you feel getting Min Min instead of Spring Man? I personally liked Min Min better but I can understand being disappointed that she was chosen over the poster boy.

As for Jena Anderson, she's pretty much a mad scientist and one of the main antagonists for a large portion of the game.

View attachment 310919

The Legionis/Officer Howard would be my first pick (Partially so we can finally settle the "Akira/Not Akira" debate), but I'd take Jena too. She'd be a more straightforward, less gimmicky fighter, though she could still be a bit of a summoner with the Chimeras and Protolegions. Plus, the arm-blade and electricity would be pretty cool too.

 

[Ivander]

Oh that's easy to explain, people who glorify Rare only really cared about DKC, Banjo and maybe Conker, they don't care about any other Rare IP. Like how there's a difference between Sonic fans and Sega fans

only DKC, Banjo and Conker
no Goldeneye or Perfect Dark

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Yeah I would think most people would rather have the main character. How did you feel getting Min Min instead of Spring Man? I personally liked Min Min better but I can understand being disappointed that she was chosen over the poster boy.

I dislike and disagree with the decision, but I'm not super bitter about it like I am with solo Pyra/Mythra, likely because I don't view it as a betrayal of a ton of what ARMS stands for. She's still able to show off what makes ARMS special, but I still think Spring Man would have been better at it.

For an example of a non-protagonist that I would probably be fine with getting in first, I'd go with Edelgard since she seems more in the same vein as Robin, Chrom, and Lucina are to Fire Emblem: Awakening. I do think Byleth represents the game better since he's at the forefront of all three routes, but Edelgard is also extremely important in all three of them, and to a lesser extent, so is Demitri. I dunno what Claude does in the other routes though...Or in his own. I need to finish my playthrough of the game. lol

 

[Gengar84]

The Legionis/Officer Howard would be my first pick (Partially so we can finally settle the "Akira/Not Akira" debate), but I'd take Jena too. She'd be a more straightforward, less gimmicky fighter, though she could still be a bit of a summoner with the Chimeras and Protolegions. Plus, the arm-blade and electricity would be pretty cool too.

Yeah, the Howard siblings are cool too and would have a really interesting moveset. There's just something about Jena's design that I absolutely love and makes her one of my favorite looking characters ever. I think Jena's only real chance is if they can't get Akira's moveset to work for the same reason as why Rex and Pyra didn't work. Akira without the Legion wouldn't really work at all like they were able to do with just Pyra/Mythra.

I would have loved to see Dimitri or Edelgard get in Smash over Byleth personally. Nothing really against Byleth but I've always found silent protagonists to be kind of boring. I would also love some of the more minor characters like Petra, Felix, Shamir, and Katherine but that is never happening.

 

[Technomage]

Personally, I kind of dig the "here's a popular side character instead of the main character" choices we've been getting lately. It's something I've noticed about MvC rosters - they're not exactly beholden to any kind of prominence hierarchy. We got Zero before we got X, and if we always went with the main characters we would not have Tron Bonne. It makes character choices a little more interesting, as well.

Plus, the Dissidia games have done something similar with Final Fantasy 11, adding the likes of Shantotto and Kam'lanaut (among more than a few other side characters) and not the Adventurer, the game's protagonist.

 

[N3ON]

I always see people blame Microsoft for Rare's failings, bemoan that modern Rare doesn't do anything with their classic IPs and completely ignore KI, whine that Battletoads is bad because it did the exact thing it did in the 90's and I've only seen a handful of people ever talk about the Perfect Dark announcent last year. It's always about Banjo and DKC and a smidge of Conker. You'd have a point if I was exclusively talking about Smash requests but I'm talking about in general, be it here, discord, twitter, with irl friends, youtube, etc. That last one especially as Rare would always be praised in damn near every video back in the day solely for the trio I mentioned

Think there might be a coincidence that you've heard more gripes and fewer demands for series we've gotten more recently and more praise and demand for series that have been away longer?

You have to gauge your personal anecdotes with the fact that these are the Rare IP Microsoft saw fit to bring back in the first place. They don't do that if they don't believe there's an audience. I mean, Grabbed By the Ghoulies isn't going to be back any time soon. Meanwhile Microsoft now has Halo, Gears, Doom and Wolfenstein and still saw fit to revive Perfect Dark.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Yeah, the Howard siblings are cool too and would have a really interesting moveset. There's just something about Jena's design that I absolutely love and makes her one of my favorite looking characters ever. I think Jena's only real chance is if they can't get Akira's moveset to work for the same reason as why Rex and Pyra didn't work. Akira without the Legion wouldn't really work at all like they were able to do with just Pyra/Mythra.

Yeah if Rex and Pyra/Mythra didn't work, there's no way that Astral Chain's protagonist would. Hopefully the hardware (or whatever engine they're using) for the next game will be able to support puppet(ish) fighters that aren't incredibly simple in design.

 

[SharkLord]

Yeah, the Howard siblings are cool too and would have a really interesting moveset. There's just something about Jena's design that I absolutely love and makes her one of my favorite looking characters ever. I think Jena's only real chance is if they can't get Akira's moveset to work for the same reason as why Rex and Pyra didn't work. Akira without the Legion wouldn't really work at all like they were able to do with just Pyra/Mythra.

I would have loved to see Dimitri or Edelgard get in Smash over Byleth personally. Nothing really against Byleth but I've always found silent protagonists to be kind of boring. I would also love some of the more minor characters like Petra, Felix, Shamir, and Katherine but that is never happening.

Granted, the AC designs are pretty detailed. There's a decent chance we could actually get another Rex scenario where we get Jena over the Legionis (Or a solo Legion moveset, but I'm not sure that would work very well).

 

[Dinoman96]

The real reason we're not getting a new Banjo game is because it's really up to Gregg Mayles (who still works at Rare) and he doesn't want to make another Banjo game unless he has a big new "innovative" idea for it.

i.e Nuts & Bolts.

 

[SNEKeater]

Worst scenario the Legion could appear automatically when Officer Howard uses an attack. Like Peach's and Daisy's counter but for most of the moves.

I know that wouldn't achieve that much the feel of controlling 2 characters at once like in Astral Chain, but it's a compromise I'm willing to accept if the other option is no Astral Chain character at all, to be honest.

 

[N3ON]

I think the Rare argument has been misconstrued into "people care about x more than y" when the basis of the argument was whether people care about y in the first place.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The real reason we're not getting a new Banjo game is because it's really up to Gregg Mayles (who still works at Rare) and he doesn't want to make another Banjo game unless he has a big new "innovative" idea for it.

I.E Nuts & Bolts.

So basically, if there is another Banjo-Kazooie game, it will be completely devoid of what people liked about the series in the first place. Great.

 

[PeridotGX]

PMEX Remix has a handful of side characters who were added before the main character: Sub Zero from Mortal Kombat, Nu-13 from BlazBlue, Zero from Mega Man X, Elizabeth from Fate, and Sans Undertale. It's a fan game, so the situation is different (and they plan on adding a few of the main characters), but it's still an interesting look at a smash that doesn't prioritize the MC.

 

[Guynamednelson]

PMEX Remix has a handful of side characters who were added before the main character: Sub Zero from Mortal Kombat, Nu-13 from BlazBlue, Zero from Mega Man X, Elizabeth from Fate, and Sans Undertale. It's a fan game, so the situation is different (and they plan on adding a few of the main characters), but it's still an interesting look at a smash that doesn't prioritize the MC.

To be fair, some of those can be seen as more iconic than the actual main character: Sans, Sub-Zero, maybe Zero.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

PMEX Remix has a handful of side characters who were added before the main character: Sub Zero from Mortal Kombat, Nu-13 from BlazBlue, Zero from Mega Man X, Elizabeth from Fate, and Sans Undertale. It's a fan game, so the situation is different (and they plan on adding a few of the main characters), but it's still an interesting look at a smash that doesn't prioritize the MC.

Nu-13's whole deal seems to be her hyperfixation on Ragna so it's a very strange decision to add her without him.

To be fair, some of those can be seen as more iconic than the actual main character: Sans, Sub-Zero, maybe Zero.

Apparently Sub Zero was Mr. Mortal Kombat until they pushed Scorpion from I think Mortal Kombat IX and onward. Most people agree that either would be perfectly fine and both would make just as much sense as far as I know.

 

[PeridotGX]

Nu-13's whole deal seems to be her hyperfixation on Ragna so it's a very strange decision to add her without him.

take this with a grain of salt, but apparently they plan on adding both Nu and Ragna. the guy who was making them finished Nu before Ragna, so we just have an odd situation with Nu but no Ragna for awhile.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

As far as Battletoads I don't think its necessarily entitled to want another entry from a series and not be terribly thrilled with the direction they went with. I mean Streets of Rage 4 differed in its direction from the Genesis trilogy in some ways and it didn't get nearly the same backlash. I think the original games benefited from the tone being left to individual players interpretation and giving definitive personalities and a specific type of humor to the modern version made some dislike inevitable, Ironically the franchise went through the same thing decades ago via the infamous Battletoads cartoon pilot which also got panned by fans for its interpretation of the title characters.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Apparently Sub Zero was Mr. Mortal Kombat until they pushed Scorpion from I think Mortal Kombat IX and onward. Most people agree that either would be perfectly fine and both would make just as much sense as far as I know.

Both of the original playable ninjas can be seen as MK's mascots, more so than Liu Kang.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Both of the original playable ninjas can be seen as MK's mascots, more so than Liu Kang.

Yeah I forgot that Liu Kang exists. My thought for a 3rd Mortal Kombat character instead went to the Cages.

EDIT: Specifically Johnny Cage.