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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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Gengar84

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Dec 9, 2009
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This is not going to be a popular opinion, but I think my most wanted is Android 20. I really like the idea of having a family team with him, 16, and 21.
I have a similar unpopular opinion. I have absolutely no issue with non video game characters getting in Smash. I would love to play as Ichigo, Edward Elric, Predator, Venom, The Undertaker, The Ninja Turtles, Spawn, Chandra Nalaar, and tons of other characters. Maybe it’s just because I’m so used to the idea from Brawl modding for so many years that it doesn’t bother me at all.
 
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Perkilator

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Okay…I’ve decided to play this charade long enough.

I’ve had info on Vol. 2’s fighters ever since :ultbyleth:’s presentation. The spoiler below holds the info on every Vol. 2 fighter, including the final two, as well as what I’ve been through to get this If you don’t want to be spoiled, don’t read this.
484229B4-C6EB-4D06-82EE-C2FD960802FB.jpeg
 

Peripuff

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Okay…I’ve decided to play this charade long enough.

I’ve had info on Vol. 2’s fighters ever since :ultbyleth:’s presentation. The spoiler below holds the info on every Vol. 2 fighter, including the final two, as well as what I’ve been through to get this If you don’t want to be spoiled, don’t read this.
This is obviously a lie, you never discussed in great detail what you went through to get this! I would totally believe those two are the characters if you fix that mistake though.
 

Gengar84

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This is obviously a lie, you never discussed in great detail what you went through to get this! I would totally believe those two are the characters if you fix that mistake though.
I just want someone to make a fake leak that catches on that has some of my favorite more obscure characters on it. It seem like that is how a lot of support behind characters picks up.
 

Flyboy

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Personally I think my dream lineup for a next FighterZ season would be Mr. Satan, Champa & Vados, Jaco, Launch, and Mercenary Tao.

Also, I said this in RTC, but I really do have zero issues with non-game characters in Smash as long as they have a decent gaming connection. Goku would be amazing. I just don't think the world would implode if we were allowed to make decent well-thought-out support threads for Homura Akemi or James Bond or Scrooge McDuck or whoever. It's not like we can affect who is and isn't getting in with them, and we have significantly dumber threads floating around here, and threads for characters who don't even have canonical appearances or names being made just because people care more about being right than having fun with who they support, so like...
 

Gengar84

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Dec 9, 2009
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Personally I think my dream lineup for a next FighterZ season would be Mr. Satan, Champa & Vados, Jaco, Launch, and Mercenary Tao.

Also, I said this in RTC, but I really do have zero issues with non-game characters in Smash as long as they have a decent gaming connection. Goku would be amazing. I just don't think the world would implode if we were allowed to make decent well-thought-out support threads for Homura Akemi or James Bond or Scrooge McDuck or whoever. It's not like we can affect who is and isn't getting in with them, and we have significantly dumber threads floating around here, and threads for characters who don't even have canonical appearances or names being made just because people care more about being right than having fun with who they support, so like...
The only thing I care about is whether I like the character and if their moveset looks fun. It doesn’t really matter to me where they originated or even if they have a ton of games. That would definitely help but I would be lying if I said I wouldn’t be hyped for a Full Metal Alchemist character that isn’t really known for having many games.
 

DanganZilla5

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The Cell Saga is my favorite saga in DBZ and the entire span of episodes with Gohan beating the ever **** out of Cell and him freaking out is pure gold so I'm happy with this profile pic.

Yeah I would rather not have any 4th party characters, but if Goku did somehow get in then I would be stoked in a way. I'm a big fan of DBZ and Goku would be so much fun to play as. Not to mention the music is rockin. Cha-La, Rock the Dragon, Dragon Theme, Ginyu Force theme, Vegeta's theme, all of the SSJ transformation themes, and a bunch of great music from the games. So I would not be totally against his inclusion, even if it opens the floodgates to picks like Elsa and Jotaro which is not a direction that I want Smash to go in.
 
D

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Personally I think my dream lineup for a next FighterZ season would be Mr. Satan, Champa & Vados, Jaco, Launch, and Mercenary Tao.

Also, I said this in RTC, but I really do have zero issues with non-game characters in Smash as long as they have a decent gaming connection. Goku would be amazing. I just don't think the world would implode if we were allowed to make decent well-thought-out support threads for Homura Akemi or James Bond or Scrooge McDuck or whoever. It's not like we can affect who is and isn't getting in with them, and we have significantly dumber threads floating around here, and threads for characters who don't even have canonical appearances or names being made just because people care more about being right than having fun with who they support, so like...
To this day, Tenkaichi 3 is the only DBZ Fighting game that really had some nice Dragonball representation. Kid Goku (not GT), Kid Chi Chi, Grandpa Gohan, Devil Man, Eighter, Tambourine, King Piccolo, Mercenary Tao, Arale, The Pilaf Gang in a Mech, and General Blue.

EDIT: Forgot about Nam! They even had Nam; a character who only appeared in like 3 episodes!
 
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Cutie Gwen

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He had her when he was like 22, not 17 lmao
I know, which is why you can't say **** from Part 3
Personally I think my dream lineup for a next FighterZ season would be Mr. Satan, Champa & Vados, Jaco, Launch, and Mercenary Tao.

Also, I said this in RTC, but I really do have zero issues with non-game characters in Smash as long as they have a decent gaming connection. Goku would be amazing. I just don't think the world would implode if we were allowed to make decent well-thought-out support threads for Homura Akemi or James Bond or Scrooge McDuck or whoever. It's not like we can affect who is and isn't getting in with them, and we have significantly dumber threads floating around here, and threads for characters who don't even have canonical appearances or names being made just because people care more about being right than having fun with who they support, so like...
Smash is just Rule of Cool tbh. Is say, the disaster bi lawyer Nick cool? If yes, put him in! Is Goku cool? Let him in! Is Miriam from Bloodstained cool? Hell no, garbage game, keep that **** outta here
 

Gengar84

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The Cell Saga is my favorite saga in DBZ and the entire span of episodes with Gohan beating the ever **** out of Cell and him freaking out is pure gold so I'm happy with this profile pic.

Yeah I would rather not have any 4th party characters, but if Goku did somehow get in then I would be stoked in a way. I'm a big fan of DBZ and Goku would be so much fun to play as. Not to mention the music is rockin. Cha-La, Rock the Dragon, Dragon Theme, Ginyu Force theme, Vegeta's theme, all of the SSJ transformation themes, and a bunch of great music from the games. So I would not be totally against his inclusion, even if it opens the floodgates to picks like Elsa and Jotaro which is not a direction that I want Smash to go in.
My reaction when the first non video game character is revealed:

 

Speed Weed

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Also, I said this in RTC, but I really do have zero issues with non-game characters in Smash as long as they have a decent gaming connection. Goku would be amazing.
I'd prefer it if Smash kept to video games cause it gives it a more focused and consistent approach that allows for better usage of what is there

But on the other hand, I would be an utter ****ing liar if I said I wouldn't pop off extremely hard for Tony Hawk
 
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SKX31

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My most wanteds will get in if not time to Solar Kamehameha the galaxy lol
It's not complete without the Cell Yell:


To be fair, I spend a lot more time speculating on the roster and imagining my favorite characters getting in Smash than I actually do playing it. I think the roster is a huge part of Smash’s appeal. The gameplay is a lot of fun but I don’t think it would be anywhere near as successful without its amazing roster.
Yes, the fact that the roster is a major part of why Smash Bros is so successful - especially since Nintendo's always promoted Smash Bros as "The Dream 4 Player Crossover Party Fighter". But I'd argue that gameplay does have a significant impact on why a lot of people latched onto the series: the old adage of "Simple to learn, hard to master" is very much apt when describing Smash Bros. Also, it might not have been as successful if it were more akin to a traditional FGC title (granted, the FGC was not in the best of positions by 1999, but still).

Most people who play Smash (probably) don't interact with either say the speculation or the competitive side a lot - beyond the occassional tweet, YouTube vid or hearing that X character is good. Still, those do have a decent impact on how much characters are played. Ultimategamedata.com recently updated their database to after :ultpyra: 's release. and now have 2,6 million online matches in their dataset.

Here's how much the DLC characters have been played in those 2,6 million matches (granted, FP2 characters have had less than a year on them, but still) plus their respective win rates:

Caveat: Ultimategamedata.com's sample consists of 1v1 games. This does leave out those who play FFAs, granted. But building an entire FFA dataset might not be feasible to do since part of Quickplay's jankiness comes from the fact that there are so many possible FFA rulesets. Such as Hazards Off / On, specific item toggles, Stock / Time / Stamina matches, Spirits etc. And thus it's next to impossible to compare those rulesets.

  • :ultjoker: :150K games played, 4th most popular character overall, but also has the 4th lowest winrates in the sample at 41 %. While his initial announcement took the Smash world by storm and Persona 5 is a popular game, he's also absolutely a case where some people heard that the #1 player in the world wins tournaments with the character / hear that he's top tier, and thus choose the character. Other top tiers like Palutena and Wolf are amongst the most played as well. He can be difficult to get a hang of initially outside of Arsene and he's harmed by online, so that might explain his win rate.
  • :ult_terry: : 85K games played, 19th most popular character overall. 53 % winrate. Already overtaken B-K, which may come as a major shock to the speculators here... but part of it might be that Jab-Jab-Power Dunk is both pretty easy to pull off and devastating at the same time. That's not the only reason - Terry's specials are powerful and versatile, and he's surprisingly heavy, Has a top player using him (Riddles), so that helps drive interest a bit too.
  • :ultbanjokazooie: : 74K games played, 28th most popular character overall; between Jigglypuff and Ganondorf. The duo have an respectable 52 % winrate online. Already more played than mr. DORIYAH, which is indicative of the casual popularity. A bit harmed by the fact that getting better playing as them is pretty damn unorthodox and that there's no top player using them, but OTOH the versatility benefits them a lot. Also, a few moves like Wonderwing arguably become more potent online.
  • :ulthero: : 63K games played, between WFT and Greninja. Win rate's at 49 %. While a lot of people likely played him for the RNG shenaningas and meaty attacks he possesses, he's also a bit volatile, it can be a bit difficult for a casual player to get a hang of him, and DQ's only become relatively popular in the West recently. The Japanese Hero player Akakikusu made waves in a big Japanese tournament recently, so there's that.
  • :ultpiranha:: 49K games played, sandwiched between Falco and Fox. Almost 48 % win rate. Being a heavy with long recovery helps, but Plant also has a few wonky attacks. Doesn't have a lot else besides the "PLANT GANG" meme helping it along.
  • :ultminmin : 43K games played. 57 % winrate, and really, superlong range with good coverage does well overall vs. people who have practiced the matchup. Online is full with people who don't know how to deal with that, so Min Min does even better for the most part.
  • :ultbyleth: : 40K games played. 42 % winrate, the 7th lowest. Likely harmed online by a lot of swings (F-Air, B-Air, F-Smash) being narrow and difficult to connect online, plus the lag harms the strategic focus. The fact that Byleth's already overtaken by Min Min in terms of matches played says quite a bit too.
  • :ultsteve: : 35K games played, likely about to overtake Richter / Dr. Mario. High online win %, at 55. Likely because Steve has a lot of stuff that works online, whether it's the Minecart or the quick swings.
  • :ultsephiroth: : 23K games played, likely to overtake Ice Climbers and Lucario soon. The 6th lowest win %, at 42. Like with Byleth, Sephiroth has more trouble hitting with F-Airs,B-Airs and F-Tilts online due to the narrow hitbox. Still, he's a popular choice.
  • :ultpyra: : 11K games played, but only a couple thousand games away already from overtaking Daisy / Simon / Rosalina as the least played characters. Almost 45 % winrate, which might be due to people having some trouble adjusting between Mythra / Pyra online.

This may look a bit different in a year when CP11 has released, but my main point stands. Character popularity and how good a character is percieved to be - a gameplay-related topic - certainly impacts Smash Bros.
 
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Wunderwaft

Smash Master
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Mar 21, 2019
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Personally I think my dream lineup for a next FighterZ season would be Mr. Satan, Champa & Vados, Jaco, Launch, and Mercenary Tao.

Also, I said this in RTC, but I really do have zero issues with non-game characters in Smash as long as they have a decent gaming connection. Goku would be amazing. I just don't think the world would implode if we were allowed to make decent well-thought-out support threads for Homura Akemi or James Bond or Scrooge McDuck or whoever. It's not like we can affect who is and isn't getting in with them, and we have significantly dumber threads floating around here, and threads for characters who don't even have canonical appearances or names being made just because people care more about being right than having fun with who they support, so like...
Preach it

Dragon Ball has a long ass history with video games dating back since the 80s. There's a ton of great games like Budokai Tenkaichi 3, Attack of the Saiyans, FighterZ, Kakarot, Xenoverse, and so much more!

I understand not wanting random stuff that barely relates to video games in Smash but characters like Goku and Darth Vader have a deep and long history with video games, they would be awesome as hell!
 

chocolatejr9

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First, we need Xenoverse content in FighterZ. It's only fair since the latter gave the former Android 21.

Secondly, I have a strange question to ask. During Smash 4's April Fools Day, I saw somebody "reveal" that Nestor from Nintendo Power was going to be in that game as a playable character. He had fake artwork and everything, though I don't remember said artwork being that good. Anyways, I was trying to remember who actually did that joke. I wanna say it was Nintendo themselves, but it was so long ago, I don't remember for certain. All I remember is that a gaming news site (I believe IGN) mentioned it on their list of gaming April Fools jokes for that year, and how the reception to said joke was mixed...
 

PeridotGX

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While on the topic of 4th parties, I've been thinking up a Spider-Man moveset. While my focus is on referencing the PS4 game, I want to give some attention to the MVC series. Does Spiderman have many notable attacks from that series?
 

Þe 1 → Way

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Alright, I wake up super late after having no Wifi for almost an entire day, come back here and we’ve rebranded into Dragonball Characters.

I only have one question. What took so long? :4pacman:
 
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Knight Dude

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While on the topic of 4th parties, I've been thinking up a Spider-Man moveset. While my focus is on referencing the PS4 game, I want to give some attention to the MVC series. Does Spiderman have many notable attacks from that series?
Absolutely.

Web Ball: Projectile that does damage and traps the opponent for a follow up like Sub-Zero's Ice ball. Mid-Air version is angled downward like Akuma's Air Hadokens. Fun fact: First time he did Web-Ball in the comics was when he first fought Dr.Doom in ASM#5.

Web Swing: A forward Swing Kick. Pretty useful move, and it's probably the move he does the most in the comics. PS4 Spider-Man does it too, as his Hold Square attack in the air. Perfect Side B.

Spider-Sting: Multi-Hit Uppercut that has a follow up that Spikes downward called Spider-Bite.

Web-Throw: In MVC it's a long ranged Command Grab/Pseudo Projectile thing that can be angled forward diagonally and upwards. Could be used for his throws in Smash.

Spider-Cannon: MVCI added this, it's a cool Dropkick move, it causes a wall bounce in that game. Could be a Guard breaking Down-B or something. Kind of acts like Spider-Man's version of Ryu's Donkey Kick now that I think about it.

Web-Zip: Kind of the reverse of Scorpion's Bloody Spear. Spider-Man uses it to deal a bit of damage and pull himself towards the enemy. The Web-Strike in Web of Shadows and the PS4 games work very similarly. Kind of a move he does fairly often in the comics.

If you do stuff with the PS4 game, I suggest giving Spider-Man something like Electric Webs as a secondary projectile, could to D.O.T or something. Really any of the gadgets could work.
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

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Absolutely.

Web Ball: Projectile that does damage and traps the opponent for a follow up like Sub-Zero's Ice ball. Mid-Air version is angled downward like Akuma's Air Hadokens. Fun fact: First time he did Web-Ball in the comics was when he first fought Dr.Doom in ASM#5.

Web Swing: A forward Swing Kick. Pretty useful move, and it's probably the move he does the most in the comics. PS4 Spider-Man does it too, as his Hold Square attack in the air. Perfect Side B.

Spider-Sting: Multi-Hit Uppercut that has a follow up that Spikes downward called Spider-Bite.

Web-Throw: In MVC it's a long ranged Command Grab/Pseudo Projectile thing that can be angled forward diagonally and upwards. Could be used for his throws in Smash.

Spider-Cannon: MVCI added this, it's a cool Dropkick move, it causes a wall bounce in that game. Could be a Guard breaking Down-B or something. Kind of acts like Spider-Man's version of Ryu's Donkey Kick now that I think about it.

Web-Zip: Kind of the reverse of Scorpion's Bloody Spear. Spider-Man uses it to deal a bit of damage and pull himself towards the enemy. The Web-Strike in Web of Shadows and the PS4 games work very similarly. Kind of a move he does fairly often in the comics.
Forgot Maximum Spider. smh :p
 

MarioRaccoon

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Here a theory of why we didn’t get a smash spirit/tourney event this week:

Apparently by next thursday, they will announce a big update to NSO system that would explain why Mario 3DAll Stars was a limited release. That update is that in the future we can purchase N64 and NGC games individually with the same features as Mario 64/Sunshine ports (4:3 720p resolution for N64 games and 16:9 1080p resolution for NGC games). Some of these ganes will feature online functions (like NES/SNES NSO games).

Among the list of games that Nintendo will announce, there will be Smash 64 and Melee. So, Smash Bros Twitter will make a tweet about them and how they are happy that newer Nintendo fans can discovered that games with new functions.
 

Guynamednelson

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Here a theory of why we didn’t get a smash spirit/tourney event this week:

Apparently by next thursday, they will announce a big update to NSO system that would explain why Mario 3DAll Stars was a limited release. That update is that in the future we can purchase N64 and NGC games individually with the same features as Mario 64/Sunshine ports (4:3 720p resolution for N64 games and 16:9 1080p resolution for NGC games). Some of these ganes will feature online functions (like NES/SNES NSO games).

Among the list of games that Nintendo will announce, there will be Smash 64 and Melee. So, Smash Bros Twitter will make a tweet about them and how they are happy that newer Nintendo fans can discovered that games with new functions.
If Melee doesn't have Slippi-tier netcode lots of people are gonna be mad.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Apparently by next thursday, they will announce a big update to NSO system that would explain why Mario 3DAll Stars was a limited release. That update is that in the future we can purchase N64 and NGC games individually with the same features as Mario 64/Sunshine ports (4:3 720p resolution for N64 games and 16:9 1080p resolution for NGC games). Some of these ganes will feature online functions (like NES/SNES NSO games).
How to piss everyone off:

"Limited Edition! Get 'em while supplies last!"

...

"lol now they're basically free and you can get 'em whenever."


Yeah I would hope that Nintendo's not that stupid.
 
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chocolatejr9

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Sep 30, 2018
Messages
8,391
Here a theory of why we didn’t get a smash spirit/tourney event this week:

Apparently by next thursday, they will announce a big update to NSO system that would explain why Mario 3DAll Stars was a limited release. That update is that in the future we can purchase N64 and NGC games individually with the same features as Mario 64/Sunshine ports (4:3 720p resolution for N64 games and 16:9 1080p resolution for NGC games). Some of these ganes will feature online functions (like NES/SNES NSO games).

Among the list of games that Nintendo will announce, there will be Smash 64 and Melee. So, Smash Bros Twitter will make a tweet about them and how they are happy that newer Nintendo fans can discovered that games with new functions.
Did you heae that from anyone in particular?
If Melee doesn't have Slippi-tier netcode lots of people are gonna be mad.
So people are gonna be mad, got it.
 

cashregister9

Smash Hero
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Apr 4, 2020
Messages
9,414
Here a theory of why we didn’t get a smash spirit/tourney event this week:

Apparently by next thursday, they will announce a big update to NSO system that would explain why Mario 3DAll Stars was a limited release. That update is that in the future we can purchase N64 and NGC games individually with the same features as Mario 64/Sunshine ports (4:3 720p resolution for N64 games and 16:9 1080p resolution for NGC games). Some of these ganes will feature online functions (like NES/SNES NSO games).

Among the list of games that Nintendo will announce, there will be Smash 64 and Melee. So, Smash Bros Twitter will make a tweet about them and how they are happy that newer Nintendo fans can discovered that games with new functions.
Requiring a payed subscription to buy individual games is a very Nintendo move that I can totally see lol.
 

UserKev

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May 10, 2017
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2,702
Preach it

Dragon Ball has a long ass history with video games dating back since the 80s. There's a ton of great games like Budokai Tenkaichi 3, Attack of the Saiyans, FighterZ, Kakarot, Xenoverse, and so much more!

I understand not wanting random stuff that barely relates to video games in Smash but characters like Goku and Darth Vader have a deep and long history with video games, they would be awesome as hell!
On the topic of 4th party, I would absolutely love Finn The Human and Steven Universe. I wouldn't lose hope in humanity if Goku got in because I'm very connected to the character.
 

SharkLord

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Fourth-parties in Smash are an interesting thing. On one hand, it opens the floodgates to pretty much anything and runs the risk of losing the focus on the content... But on the other, I pretty much treat my Smash wants as just a place for all my favorite games to come together and punch each other in the face. Maybe just every so often, we sneak in a fourth-party with a lot of games.

And Goku himself would be great, honestly. The fast-paced superpowers would make him one of the few brawlers I'm really interested in, and I'm curious as to how the Super Saiyan forms would be implemented.
 
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