DK Stage Discussion - Brinstar

[highandmightyjoe]

I'm told that its the best stage to take Pikachu too. In my experience it really helps, and most of your usual counterpicks like Japes and Brinstar are actually kind of good for him too, so I tend to cp him with neutrals.

 

[TheNix]

I'm told that its the best stage to take Pikachu too. In my experience it really helps, and most of your usual counterpicks like Japes and Brinstar are actually kind of good for him too, so I tend to cp him with neutrals.

This is useful information, as one of my friends recently picked up Pikachu. I'm still going to give Japes a try, though. In a tournament setting, I'd probably just go Falco if he tried to use Pikachu on Japes.

I'll update the OP with Battlefield in a minute.

 

[highandmightyjoe]

On Japes Pika can camp one of the ledges and use his Jolt. It will just circle around the platform and keep him safe. If you don't have a projectile there is really nothing you can do about it.

 

[Mith_]

Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike Stage Spike

Main reason why I like battlefield.
Also, you can pull of some neat Uptilt/Uair tricks.

btw shiek = zangief.

 

[OmniOstrich]

Don't CP it against Olimar, or Marth, they will both juggle you very badly. I would also advise against it with Toon Link because his best option is camping the ledge, and its hard to avoid him on BF as opposed to FD or SV. It is wolf's best stage, but you really shouldn't be having problems with wolf so its no big deal.

Good CP vs G&W, ICs, Fox, Falco, and MK. These characters are going to be trying to outspace you and these tight constraints and platforms make it harder than other stages. For the most part brinstar is a better option against them, but this stage works just fine. There are several low tiers you could take here but I've never lost to a low tier on a neutral in tournament >_>

 

[highandmightyjoe]

I think I'm just a Toon Link killer, cause everyone keeps saying that stages are good for him that I murder him on. My roommate plays Tink and Yoshi's is his least favorite stage to fight me on, followed by BF. The upB out of cargo in the air works on him, and as mentioned this stage is good for stage spiking. Release to stage spike is like the most satisfying kill ever.

 

[TheNix]

Alright, now that the buzz from the up+b invincibility has died down a bit, we should continue discussion. Battlefield hasn't really been covered, yet.

I personally would much rather use Lylat or Yoshis than Battlefield (or even Delfino depending on the opponent), but it seems a lot of people prefer Battlefield. There must be reasons!

 

[highandmightyjoe]

I consider this one of his best stages, not just neutrals, one of his top 3 maybe 4 stages overall. The platforms work really well for him, he can stage spike, and overall the stage is small enough for him to keep pressure on pretty well. Not to mention his options with zero lag upB landings. I love this stage for DK. It really does seem to favor an aggressive playstyle though, maybe thats why I like it so much.

 

[Donkey Bong]

BF is DK's house.
best neutral for him IMO

those platforms really help him out continuing combos which without the platforms would be impossible.
you can also get cool early percent vertical kills if you somehow land an usmash on the top platform

 

[Chibi-Chan]

Battle field is good and all.. But I personally think DK gets comboed there raher easily by the other characters... For a Neutral stage, I'd prefer Yoshis since you can do the UpB AT so easy, and also the way the plataform is placed, you can combo extremely easily from below...

Battlefield is good, but against many matchups it might give THEM more advantages than you.. Solid.. Average I guess..

 

[daisho]

I was thinking, and the reason I like battlefield so much is that it helps so few characters comparatively to DK. Who benefits from randomly having a couple of platforms as much as DK? Who would like the small stage as much as an overly huge Ape? Who needs the slanted sides for stage spiking as much as teh Kong?

 

[TheNix]

I was thinking, and the reason I like battlefield so much is that it helps so few characters comparatively to DK. Who benefits from randomly having a couple of platforms as much as DK? Who would like the small stage as much as an overly huge Ape? Who needs the slanted sides for stage spiking as much as teh Kong?

Marth.

I dunno, Battlefield definitely works well against campy characters, but so does Lylat Cruise and Smashville (depending on the character). It's true that I never really feel that I am at a disadvantage on Battlefield, but I never really feel like I have any kind of advantage, either.

 

[Chibi-Chan]

Yeah, Battlefield is good against some matchups.. But its not soo One-sided liek say.. Japes.

Like NiX said, marth will own you here, so will Metaknight (More than usual) and Lucas... Those plataforms are just low enough for other characters to abuse.. compared to some like Lylat Cruise that are harder for some... Then again.. Lylat is weird, Though Id say Smashville is better for DK than this, so is Yoshis as far as neutrals.

Thogh its true DK can abuse plataforms.. As far as aerials he really ony has Bair and like.. Nair for chasing, while other characters can take advantage from any angle.

 

[Darknid]

Hey guys what about distant planet? I just recently took a Snake there and he didn't know what the **** was up,

You can cargo Dthrow people into the left side kill wall.

Some characters have trouble with the platforms that lower as you stand on them. One thing I like to do is downb which usually causes them to land with lag onto the platform above them. As soon as I get out of the downb animation I start charging an fsmash and the platform lowers them right within range. This works even if they roll or use a get up attack.

Another trick I found was when they are recovering on the lower left side and the water is pushing them most players will jump from the ledge, well if I am in position(and you better believe I will be) I will get a free Fsmash on them as they jump right within range.

The ceiling and walls are boxed in close for easy kills.

When recovering, you can use the slope on the left for a lagless upB and maybe even the new invincibility AT.

Plus the stage gives you projectiles..FER GLIDE TOSSIN'

you can also cargo Dthrow people into that beast's mouth to kill them instantly. Also, when its mouth isn't open you can stage spike people off of its nose, pretty funny when it happens but rare.

 

[TheNix]

I love Distant Planet for glide tossing goodness. For some reason, my group has a habit of getting kinda silly on that stage. Not serious at all.

We can cover that stage later, though. I want to get the "most important" stages out of the way first (neutrals, our very best stages, and our very worst stages).

Speaking of which, does anyone have anything left to say about Battlefield? If not, I think we should cover one of these stages next:
- Pokemon Stadium 1
- Delfino Plaza
- Brinstar

 

[highandmightyjoe]

I think all there is to say about battlefield has been said. Of the ones you have listed I would recommend stadium next, since some places use it as there fifth neutral instead of Lylat(which I support by the way).

 

[itsthebigfoot]

just a note for lylat, i love taking falco and wolf there when brinstar/japes (respectively) is banned. spacies suck there for some reason

 

[TheNix]

Alright, Pokemon Stadium 1. Is there anything particular that needs to be mentioned?

What I don't know about is character matchups here. Who does well, who does bad?

 

[itsthebigfoot]

alright, trapping some characters under the stage with repeated ledge upbs ( snake and dedede are two notable ones) does work, even if they tech

this stage is bad for anyone with ko problems (except maybe lucario due to him living longer) it has really big blastzones, and a high ceiling, it also has a wall, so know who gets wall infinited and who can wall infinite

abuse the air brake

 

[ook]

Down-b under the windmill. The angles of the windmill keep them bouncing back toward you, so you can rack up huge percents there. Even if they tech, the windmill kinda traps them so they don't have anywhere to go.

 

[TheHulk]

I always cp this stage to anyone, even Metaknight. The reason why? I always live until 200% ish on this stage. THIS STAGE IS HUGE!!!!!! In fact, we can infinite there. =)

 

[Commander_Beef]

Who you should or woh you souldn't take to BF with you

Take Snake with you =).

 

[TheNix]

Are there any characters who do particularly well (or particularly poor) on Pokemon Stadium? It seems pretty good for projectile-users to me, though the edge can be a bane to the spacies if they aren't careful.

 

[TheHulk]

I would believe all light characters. They die easily on this stage for me at least. Especially MK, I always cp this stage for MK mainers. So far, I have not lost one to a MK on PK stadium 1 in a tournament. I will continue counter pick this stage today in a tournament.

 

[OmniOstrich]

I would believe all light characters. They die easily on this stage for me at least. Especially MK, I always cp this stage for MK mainers. So far, I have not lost one to a MK on PK stadium 1 in a tournament. I will continue counter pick this stage today in a tournament.

This is one of the best G&W stages, not that you should be having trouble with G&W.

Anyone that doesn't have a tether recovery is going to have a hard time with this stage, id pretty much always reccomend brinstar before PS1 but in 3/5 this BF and Delfino would be my next couple of choices, character depending.

Light and/or bad recovery chars to CP this on:
Marth
Toon Link
Kirby
Lucario
Peach
Pit
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Zelda

Thats all I can think of off the top of my head. I would pick Brinstar first for all of those characters except maybe Kirby though.

 

[Hylian]

Enjoy your sticky.

 

[TheNix]

Does anyone have anything else to say about Pokemon Stadium 1 before moving on? Not a lot was said about it, but I think it was covered pretty well overall.

I vote we cover Delfino next.

 

[MasterCheeze]

Don't fool around too much with that windmill 'cuz it just doesn't let either you or your opponent die— Down-B is the way to go. That's all I have to say.

Yeah, Delfino would be interesting to go with next. It's about a 60-40 on either helping you or screwing you.

+some wall infinites
+cargo KO off the sides
+water spiking
+couple of platforms every now and then to be used to your advantage
+you MIGHT live when under the moving platform as it's approaching solid ground (not reliable though)
+nice weather

-small stage so others can KO easier
-platform can ditch you
-wall infinites can be used against you, but you have an easier time setting them up
-opponents can attack you as they move under the moving platform

Delfino may seem like a good CP against DK for obvious reasons, but he can hold his own pretty well there.

 

[Kalm]

I think we need to go ahead and get character discussions for each stage in and on the OP. There are some serious advantages and disadvantages that needs to be posted for all DKs to see.

We could start off just listing characters that are neutral or better against DK to help us claim an advantages. We could either do this by listing character names under each stage and then putting a +5 or -10 depending on how it affects the matchup, or we could put a character name and list stages under it.
Example would be to put Falco's name down in a new section on the thread, then list maybe the 3 or so best stages to take him to maybe in order of best to worst, like

Falco, take him to...
Norfair, Luigi's Mansion, Brinstar, Lylat Cruise
Avoid...
Smashville, Battlefield, Japes, FD

OR

(Picture of Battlefield)
Falco -5
Marth - 5
Pikachu +10
G&W +5

Of course those are just examples and may not be correct at all number wise.
Waffles are so good.

 

[TheNix]

I think we need to go ahead and get character discussions for each stage in and on the OP. There are some serious advantages and disadvantages that needs to be posted for all DKs to see.

We could start off just listing characters that are neutral or better against DK to help us claim an advantages. We could either do this by listing character names under each stage and then putting a +5 or -10 depending on how it affects the matchup, or we could put a character name and list stages under it.
Example would be to put Falco's name down in a new section on the thread, then list maybe the 3 or so best stages to take him to maybe in order of best to worst, like

Falco, take him to...
Norfair, Luigi's Mansion, Brinstar, Lylat Cruise
Avoid...
Smashville, Battlefield, Japes, FD

OR

(Picture of Battlefield)
Falco -5
Marth - 5
Pikachu +10
G&W +5

Of course those are just examples and may not be correct at all number wise.
Waffles are so good.

I think getting numbers would be tough, though. Something like this might be good enough:
Pikachu
Mr. G&W
Marth
Falco

Just taking from your example above. I'd only mention characters who have a clear advantage or clear problems on the stage in question.

EDIT: I added some of this on the first page under the stages that were previously covered. Does it look good? Which characters should be mentioned on Pokemon Stadium?

And I'll be moving on to another stage very soon.

 

[Kalm]

It's a start, but not quite the detail I had in mind.

Basically, I wanted the idea to serve the purpose of, lets say, I'm about do a match with a well known ROB main. I want to know what would be ROB's worst stage in the game and consider that to counterpick, and at the same time know what his best stage in the game is and consider that for a ban.

I know it's complicated overall and if it's too much work and not enough to benefit the community, then I would understand. But I was hoping for a list that would tell me the characters that the stages hurt or benefit, and also if it's a prime focus on the matchup, whether it be for or against Monkey Kong.

 

[Luigi player]

Wow, this upB invincibility thing on yoshis island is really easy to do and really great o_O this could be a really good DK camp stage... (does everyone already know how to do this 100 % of the time?)

Sorry that I'm a bit late on this.

 

[TheNix]

Wow, this upB invincibility thing on yoshis island is really easy to do and really great o_O this could be a really good DK camp stage... (does everyone already know how to do this 100 % of the time?)

Sorry that I'm a bit late on this.

Yeah, it's pretty rare for me to mess it up, now.

That said, ZSS's forward B has hit me out of my up+b like seven times now when I'm sure I should be invincible. Confuses the hell out of me every time.

I'll update this thread with a new stage tomorrow when I have time.

 

[TheHulk]

it's because your up b wont have invincible in the beginning of 1-2 frames i think.

 

[TheNix]

it's because your up b wont have invincible in the beginning of 1-2 frames i think.

No, the forward+b hits me while I'm in mid-spin in the middle of the stage.
It's entirely possible that I just keep screwing up the technique, but it has happened enough times when I'm pretty sure I should be invincible for me to question it.

 

[TheNix]

The OP has been updated for Brinstar. This is considered to be one of DK's best stages (especially if Jungle Japes and/or Luigi's Mansion get banned), so it's a very important one to know. Is there any specific tactics I should mention about this stage, and what characters should we take here?

 

[Ripple]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=190951

just to add more to this you should take Zelda, yoshi, falco, wolf and other characters that would have a hard time sweet spoting the ledge/ spam projectiles to here

 

[Kalm]

Take Yoshi to Brinstar? Are you crazy it's Yoshi's best stage lol. I took KO Kingpin's Yoshi to Brinstar this weekend at Game Galaxy and he was bomb sliding all over the place. Don't ever take Yoshi to Brinstar it's scary.
>.>

 

[blakinola]

I think Brinstar is an absolutely terrible stage.

 

[TheNix]

I think Brinstar is an absolutely terrible stage.

I honestly don't like the stage, either. I always have trouble getting my spacing right here, and the grounded up+b doesn't seem to be as effective. I would still counterpick it for the likes of Falco and other projectile-users, but I think I'd prefer Yoshi's against a lot of characters.