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I don't like to stifle opposition. Vent away.
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Debate Hall Postbit
- Thread starter Zero Beat
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KrazyGlue
Smash Champion
Nah, no venting for me.
As I said, I'm just happy with having the postbit.
As I said, I'm just happy with having the postbit.
Nysyarc
Last King of Hollywood
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- Nysyarc
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Well I'm perfectly calm about it... but this has been a very disturbing and eye-opening turn of events as far as the egos of the mods in this forum goes. I didn't like the moderating system here when I first joined (after I got flamed and insulted by a mod for stating my opinion on tiers) and I still don't like it now. If I'm not allowed to type my views on that and I get infractions for it, it will only strengthen my point.
Anyways I have nothing against the moderators personally, but there are certain things that can be done to make the system seem like less of a dictatorship. I don't really care about not getting to vote for the postbit (although it would be nice), it's what that represents that bothers me. I may elaborate on this in the forum complaints area later but for now I'm done...
Anyways I have nothing against the moderators personally, but there are certain things that can be done to make the system seem like less of a dictatorship. I don't really care about not getting to vote for the postbit (although it would be nice), it's what that represents that bothers me. I may elaborate on this in the forum complaints area later but for now I'm done...
Zero Beat
Cognitive Scientist
Yeah I'll be staying away from this thread but I will say one thing: My intentions were clear from the beginning, hopefully they aren't twisted or swayed.
If you people feel like complaining to me, all complaints are welcomed. I have msn, AIM, and skype. Fire away. Just don't expect me to post in this thread after this post.
If you people feel like complaining to me, all complaints are welcomed. I have msn, AIM, and skype. Fire away. Just don't expect me to post in this thread after this post.
And this.
Miggz
Pancake Sandwiches
So...when are we getting it anyway? It's no rush or anything but I can't help but feel a bit curious about it.
Well just quoting to remind you of what you just said.
Now then.
I just took a close look at this and was not very impressed.
Now correct me if I'm wrong, but why should we complain to Zero Beat about a lack of diplomacy or choice when it's you that's denied the people here a choice?
Let's see, Zero Beat made the thread, asked for input, and was going to set up a poll. Then you come in and say "No, not happening."
Then you seem to think you're being the good guy, saying people can vent their frustrations on the ******* Zero Beat.
Weren't you the one that decided to take the choice away? So really, Zero Beat isn't the one we should be PMing, is he?
I guess not being contacted about the whole thing would make you unhappy, that's understandable. However, instead of taking the approach of a 13 year old schoolgirl, perhaps, in the spirit of the DH, you could've ignored that and left the process how it was?
Nysyarc
Last King of Hollywood
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*Lengthy and enthusiastic applause*
M.K
Level 55
I second this applause.
Teran, you really are amazing for saying the things we all want to say. I'm so glad at least one of us can stand up to this kind of stupidity.
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Expect it to be a while. It has to first go to MLG, which MLG_JV said was backed up for a while. Hopefully, soon.
There is nothing respectful about this in any way:
It was a joke.
Zero Beat is one of four moderators, and he chose to make the decision all by himself. We'd have had things to say about this had he actually, I dunno, spoken with us. But he took it upon himself to not bother discussing it with his fellow moderators of this room.
If we'd had input from the beginning there wouldn't be any "sudden changes". And this is not behaving like a "thirteen year-old schoolgirl", nor do I consider that a "respectful way" of conveying one's disapproval. It's a blanket insult uttered in the absence of a rebuttal to the fact that this shouldn't have been started without our approval to begin with. Eric and I lobbied for a DH postbit for a long time before the MLG switch. I don't understand why we're in the wrong for exercising some authority on a decision that was not zero beat's alone to make.
Had Zero Beat spoken to us in the beginning and worked with us to determine how this would be decided, there would be no conflict. That is why Eric said to take your complaints to him -- there'd be nothing to complain about had he consulted the other 75% of this room's modding team.
He expressed his opinion -- one I share -- that Zero Beat's actions caused the unrest you're now exerting. That is not "stifling opposition". Closing this thread and dishing out infractions would be "stifling opposition".
We can't help that one person spoke for four. Take that up with the one person.
If we'd had input from the beginning there wouldn't be any "sudden changes". And this is not behaving like a "thirteen year-old schoolgirl", nor do I consider that a "respectful way" of conveying one's disapproval. It's a blanket insult uttered in the absence of a rebuttal to the fact that this shouldn't have been started without our approval to begin with. Eric and I lobbied for a DH postbit for a long time before the MLG switch. I don't understand why we're in the wrong for exercising some authority on a decision that was not zero beat's alone to make.
Had Zero Beat spoken to us in the beginning and worked with us to determine how this would be decided, there would be no conflict. That is why Eric said to take your complaints to him -- there'd be nothing to complain about had he consulted the other 75% of this room's modding team.
He expressed his opinion -- one I share -- that Zero Beat's actions caused the unrest you're now exerting. That is not "stifling opposition". Closing this thread and dishing out infractions would be "stifling opposition".
We can't help that one person spoke for four. Take that up with the one person.
Nysyarc
Last King of Hollywood
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I disagree with everything you just said. But I've already made my complaints in the forum support.
One thing I will say though, is that the mods of the forum should probably moderate the forum. You know, by checking it once in awhile instead of relying on one of the other mods to inform them of recent events. But that's just my opinion, maybe there's an alternate definition for 'moderator'.
Well actually, considering the members of the DH didn't know this, you can't blame them.
What I'm trying to say is, instead of letting your frustration with Zero Beat get in the way of this, it would be nice to separate the moderators' issues from this and let the DH have the say it thought it was going to get, unaware of what was going on behind the scenes.
Besides, I don't see why you guys are so unhappy anyway, Zero Beat just got you a postbit that you like, anyway, so I don't see why you should be so upset.
Yes, really. He did, look, it was because of Zero Beat that the scale idea came up. It was nice wasn't it? So then, cut the dude a little slack.
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Well just quoting to remind you of what you just said.
Now then.
I just took a close look at this and was not very impressed.
Now correct me if I'm wrong, but why should we complain to Zero Beat about a lack of diplomacy or choice when it's you that's denied the people here a choice?
Let's see, Zero Beat made the thread, asked for input, and was going to set up a poll. Then you come in and say "No, not happening."
Then you seem to think you're being the good guy, saying people can vent their frustrations on the ******* Zero Beat.
Weren't you the one that decided to take the choice away? So really, Zero Beat isn't the one we should be PMing, is he?
I guess not being contacted about the whole thing would make you unhappy, that's understandable. However, instead of taking the approach of a 13 year old schoolgirl, perhaps, in the spirit of the DH, you could've ignored that and left the process how it was?
What? EE explained that he and I have tried to get a postbit before. Bureaucracy wasn't as bad as it is now, but we had no possible way of making it happened/were told not to even bother with it. LJ leaves we add Zero Beat to pick up the slack since the four of us have lives, enabling at least someone to be online.
My knowledge of this came from when Zero PMed me saying "here are the choices," and some messages I never got on AIM. Whenever I instituted ANYTHING new, I'd make **** sure EE knew what was going on before I did it. That is where EE's anger comes from. We essentially created this room from the **** that it was before, then when we were busy the new mod comes in and gives us no say in the matter.
We were fair in this. We chose from the four choices that you people picked. We could have easily just scrapped the whole thing since it wasn't technically authorized by us and have said start over, but instead we picked on that was from the four chosen pictures.
Had we been involved, we could have created a set of criteria and a list of other things to make this as uniform as possible.
Our beef with Zero Beat, not speaking for Mediocre, is just that he went above us for the PostBit without being informed. I check the room maybe once a day during the school week to make sure there are no fires, but weekends I am busy. Generally, I am going to be busy from Friday to Sunday with sparse chances to even pop on, much less read entire threads. EE's schedule is just as hectic. It would have been nothing for Zero to PM us if he couldn't get us on AIM, he didn't, and when we saw that this thing was basically happening without our support, we acted as leaders of the group.
I'm not really sure why it's a big deal to you, Teran, you only get the icon if you are flagged as a debater anyway.
Well, that certainly helps.
A clear explanation of circumstances the first time would have avoided ****storms.
Now, I want to ask you something. Could you make good on the whole streamlined process then? You know, do it how you wanted to in the first place? If not, cool, but just as a goodwill gesture.
Btw, if you think I have a personal gripe with you, then you'd be mistaken.
The postbit itself wasn't the issue. I was going to vote for the scales anyway.
I would have voted Scholar Hat if they actually included that... :/
M.K
Level 55
This statement bothers me greatly. Whether or not you considered the entries, I feel like the whole purpose of making all the different icons was not for the moderators to choose one, but for the people to choose their own.
I just want you to know that your actions are giving you a very "I'm better than you, you don't matter" sort of vibe right now. Whether that's what you think or not, that's how your statements are portrayed to an outside source.
You really, really should NOT blame Zero Beat for this. I'm sorry that you weren't informed, I am, but that's no reason to go crazy and say "**** this whole thing, we picked it, it's done". I mean, we were 12 pages into this discussion, and you missed it? Honestly, you can't hold the posters who tried so hard to get their ideas heard OR Zero Beat for organizing all of this accountable. If you hadn't have seen this thread before, I don't know what to say, it's been here for the better part of a week.
Oh, and you want to know the irony in this?
Scales represent balance, equality, and equal opportunity. Funny that it was chosen this way, no?
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The thread has been up since the 20th, which is Saturday. As I stated, I was away most of the weekend.
As for redoing it, probably not. I forward the choice to MLG, and as he said, it'd be a while anyway.
As for redoing it, probably not. I forward the choice to MLG, and as he said, it'd be a while anyway.
Well, doesn't change my vote, but the gavel voters will be disappointed, and the Phoenix ones.
KrazyGlue
Smash Champion
I just have one question, and I'd like to reinforce the fact that I'm not upset, so I'm in no way challenging your decision or authority. Having said that:
What is your reasoning behind making this decision?
Is it:
Punishment towards Zero Beat?
You don't want us to make a bad decision during the poll?
Other (if this, an explanation would be nice)?
What is your reasoning behind making this decision?
Is it:
Punishment towards Zero Beat?
You don't want us to make a bad decision during the poll?
Other (if this, an explanation would be nice)?
Zero Beat
Cognitive Scientist
Yeah, I'm re-closing this thread for the sake of preventing further drama and members getting in trouble.
While I did contact my superiors(Just Crimson King) before even making the thread, they weren't available at the time and since there are other more secure methods of contact(PM works better than IM'S because when you IM, you're assuming they'll be there to reply, and that was not the case), thus I don't mind taking responsibility for the mess. If any Staff member or Debater wishes to contact me about it, no problem. I will be glad to clarify any misconceptions.
Outcomes like these should be beneath us as members of the DH, let's put it behind and move on.
I apologize to the DH Staff and members for my error. Lesson learned, done and done.
While I did contact my superiors(Just Crimson King) before even making the thread, they weren't available at the time and since there are other more secure methods of contact(PM works better than IM'S because when you IM, you're assuming they'll be there to reply, and that was not the case), thus I don't mind taking responsibility for the mess. If any Staff member or Debater wishes to contact me about it, no problem. I will be glad to clarify any misconceptions.
Outcomes like these should be beneath us as members of the DH, let's put it behind and move on.
I apologize to the DH Staff and members for my error. Lesson learned, done and done.
Were you guys seriously insulting each other in the debate hall??
[this is not just to the staff, the petty arguing in this thread is astounding.]
That is...that is terrible form. :\
That being said, I understand the other mods being upset because a decision was made without proper notification or additional input. We are a team, and we need to work as one. End of story. There are so many ways this could have backfired that I don't even want to get into it. It still ended on a pretty crappy note.
However, a PM or a VM noting your displeasure would have been a bit better than hijacking the topic.
We're people, though, and people make mistakes.
I would sincerely hope this doesn't happen again.
Anyway, I'd like a poll to be up here by tomorrow afternoon. I'd post it myself but I still feel it's not my place to do so. This is not my room and I have no idea how anything works here, nor do I really care.
As for when the postbit is uploaded and usable, I can't really tell you. I don't want to tell you a time and be wrong, and the tech team is notoriously slow. Just know that it'll be there eventually, and please try to have patience.
I appreciate you accepting responsibility for your actions, Zero.
and guys...tempers? I understand being upset but there's no reason to be rude. Being rude only makes the situation worse. :\
[this is not just to the staff, the petty arguing in this thread is astounding.]
That is...that is terrible form. :\
That being said, I understand the other mods being upset because a decision was made without proper notification or additional input. We are a team, and we need to work as one. End of story. There are so many ways this could have backfired that I don't even want to get into it. It still ended on a pretty crappy note.
However, a PM or a VM noting your displeasure would have been a bit better than hijacking the topic.
We're people, though, and people make mistakes.
I would sincerely hope this doesn't happen again.
Anyway, I'd like a poll to be up here by tomorrow afternoon. I'd post it myself but I still feel it's not my place to do so. This is not my room and I have no idea how anything works here, nor do I really care.
As for when the postbit is uploaded and usable, I can't really tell you. I don't want to tell you a time and be wrong, and the tech team is notoriously slow. Just know that it'll be there eventually, and please try to have patience.
I appreciate you accepting responsibility for your actions, Zero.
and guys...tempers? I understand being upset but there's no reason to be rude. Being rude only makes the situation worse. :\
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