Meta Competitive Impressions: TBH5

[~ Gheb ~]

Where on earth can you take Shiek?! Smashville you get potentionally faired off stage early, Battlefield you get consistent platform strings Final destination means you're constantly on the same verticals plane as Shiek

Depends on your character. In general I think Lylat is pretty good against her.

Whoever thinks Mario isn't Top 5 is deluded.

Mario is not top 10.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

People complaining about Sonic shutting people down with his speed when Mario does the same thing with his unholy fast aerials and airspeed.

Whoever thinks Mario isn't Top 5 is deluded.

Mario ain't top 5. Not when he has to fish so much for a kill.

Sheik, ZSS, Sonic, Rosalina all obviously better without a doubt

Ryu most likely after the newest patch, same with Pika because they got massively boosted. MK could make a case depending on how the patch treats him. Fox is pretty likely as well.

Mario has probably moved up a tad, but only because of Luigi dropping.

 

[Amadeus9]

Mario ain't top 5. Not when he has to fish so much for a kill.

Sheik, ZSS, Sonic, Rosalina all obviously better without a doubt

Ryu most likely after the newest patch, same with Pika because they got massively boosted. MK could make a case depending on how the patch treats him. Fox is pretty likely as well.

Mario has probably moved up a tad, but only because of Luigi dropping.

Not going to lie it's getting really hard for me to see MK not being top 5 this patch. I think the only thing that could potentially keep him out is how Yoshi is affected by shield changes. Zss definitely got harder in 1.1.1 but every other top tier matchup probably got easier for mk... The only one I'm not sure about is Yoshi. Oh and maybe Ryu... but that's one matchup that was unexplored even before now. If shield changes are as good for Ryu as I think they are, the matchup could be really hard. Still don't think ZSS, Sheik, Rosa, Sonic, MK being the top 5 is that absurd. The lowest I see him is maybe top 8.

 

[teddystalin]

People complaining about Sonic shutting people down with his speed when Mario does the same thing with his unholy fast aerials and airspeed.

Whoever thinks Mario isn't Top 5 is deluded.

Between Sheik, ZSS, Rosa, Diddy, Pika, Fox, Mario, and Sonic, our Top 5 seems awfully crowded.

 

[Amadeus9]

Between Sheik, ZSS, Rosa, Diddy, Pika, Fox, Mario, and Sonic, our Top 5 seems awfully crowded.

Mario, Diddy, Pika, and Fox don't belong in top 5 at all.

 

[Djent]

Abadango continues his general tendency to ruin US dreams while losing back home:

Anyway, top 8 characters:
x2.5
x2.5
x1.5
x1.0
x0.5
Trace amounts and

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Abadango should consider moving to the USA at this rate.

Mario, Diddy, Pika, and Fox don't belong in top 5 at all.

Diddy, Pikachu and Fox are all top 5 contenders for sure.

 

[HeroMystic]

You can make an argument for Mario being in Top 10, but definitely not Top 5. His issue with fishing kills are too strong while the real top 5 do so pretty easily.

Definitely a tournament contender, however.

 

[Amadeus9]

Abadango should consider moving to the USA at this rate.



Diddy, Pikachu and Fox are all top 5 contenders for sure.

I'll go ahead and call it bias - I think MK is better than Fox and Pika

 

[T4ylor]

Don't see how can say Fox is a better character than Mario. Every time I watch Fox I see him get shut out of a top placing by a Rosalina or Luigi. Never see that happen to Mario

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Don't see how can say Fox is a better character than Mario. Every time I watch Fox I see him get shut out of a top placing by a Rosalina or Luigi. Never see that happen to Mario

Never seen this happen?

Ally's Mario has just lost to Anti's Luigi and Anti's Mario has literally just lost to Rayquaza's Rosalina. Today. Like, half an hour ago or so.

 

[HeroMystic]

Don't see how can say Fox is a better character than Mario. Every time I watch Fox I see him get shut out of a top placing by a Rosalina or Luigi. Never see that happen to Mario

Rosalina and Luigi are some of Mario's worst MUs.

 

[kj22]

He doesn't get to travel a lot, does he? What's the character diversity in Texas like?

No he doesn't sadly, but this is slowly changing.
Off the top of my head

Top 10 Houston has Falcon/Fox, Ryu, Diddy, Sheik, Roy, Mario, Yoshi, Villager, just outside it Peach, Sonic, and Ness
SA has Fox, MK, Sonic, Pika
Dallas has Sheik, Zss, Diddy
Austin has Rob Fox Sheik

 

[HeroMystic]

No he doesn't sadly, but this is slowly changing.
Off the top of my head

Top 10 Houston has Falcon/Fox, Ryu, Diddy, Sheik, Roy, Mario, Yoshi, Villager, just outside it Peach, Sonic, and Ness
SA has Fox, MK, Sonic, Pika
Dallas has Sheik, Zss, Diddy
Austin has Rob Fox Sheik

SA also has Yoshi, Luigi, and ZSS.

Edit: It's also true Megafox has never been outside of Texas and this is first national. Saying he's "not that good" is rather critical considering how far he got when you account for tournament nerves and literally fighting against top level players.

 

[Gunla]

Abadango continues his general tendency to ruin US dreams while losing back home:

Anyway, top 8 characters:
x2.5
x2.5
x1.5
x1.0
x0.5
Trace amounts and

Interesting to note that all traces of the major characters (outside of Sheik), including and just disappeared; Ikes in the first elimination, and the Sonics gradually.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

He's good, just mu inexperienced.

Saying he's "not that good" is rather critical considering how far he got when you account for tournament nerves and literally fighting against top level players.

Might be overly critical but I consider MU experience, dealing with tournament nerves and handling top players part of player skill and if Megafox lacks these traits then he has yet to work his way up there. I mean, he's not new to the smash tournament scene and he has played plenty of top level players [at least in Brawl]. And as far as MU experience is concerned, well Larry didn't need a lot of Pikachu experience to beat ESAM.

So these are all things that are in his hands to change and not some otherworldly circumstances that he has no control over. Until then I consider him high level but not top, as I would evaluate the other Fox players I mentioned [plus a few more]. Perhaps I'm critical but I don't think I'm unfair.

 

[Djent]

Realistically, if you're not a threat to win a major you're not a "top player." Of course we have to loosen our criteria slightly for this game (because otherwise Zero and Nairo are pretty much it), but even expanding it to Salem-level improbabilities isn't enough for him to cut it IMO.

 

[Kaladin]

A wii fit made top 8, guys

 

[Amadeus9]

I'm so glad Luigi is dead in 1.1.1

 

[Zannabluke]

at least it was not a kill from a grab

 

[hypersonicJD]

WHAT ARE THESE UPSETS!? ALLY NOT MAKING IT TO TOP 8, ABADANGO DEFEATED. ZERO LOSING TO SEAGULL.

My god. This has been a really awesome tourney jeez.

 

[|RK|]

Is this the furthest a Luigi has made it in a national recently?

 

[Pazx]

This is the furthest a Luigi has made it in any relevant tournament ever.

And Anti's Luigi isn't even that great. Good yes, but great is pushing it.

 

[Djent]

This is the furthest a Luigi has made it in any relevant tournament ever.

But Larry used him to beat the Lew bros. at CEO and got 4th.

 

[Pazx]

But Larry used him to beat the Lew bros. at CEO and got 4th.

Oh yeah true my b (although I don't know WHY he used Luigi against ZSS)

 

[Djent]

Anti is top 4.

Now his run is up there with Larry's.

 

[SuqAta8]

oh my

zero just got two stocked

 

[NegaNixx]

I remember someone was saying that it'd be hilarious if a Luigi came and wrecked people in the last tournament before the patch.

Anti must have read that and said "Sure, why not?"

 

[Djent]

Rosa can definitely win the Sheik MU at top level:
Dabuz > Vinnie
Kirihara > Edge
Rayquaza making Zero sweat

Which pretty much solidifies her spot as #3 in 1.1.0. It'll be interesting to see if she can hold a top-5 spot going forward. With the buffs to her roughest MU it's going to be hard.

 

[NairWizard]

Rayquaza is definitely looking like a top-level player. His performance in doubles, vs. Anti, vs. Nairo, and vs. ZeRo were all fantastic.

Oh yeah true my b (although I don't know WHY he used Luigi against ZSS)

I think Luigi's bad matchups are frequently overrated pre-1.1.1. I don't think that he actually lost to Villager/Pacman/Rosalina as people believed, nor necessarily to ZSS. His reward was just that good (and Cyclone).

 

[Kaladin]

oh my

zero just got two stocked

Can't watch right now. By who? When? In what round? Did he lose the set?

 

[Nu~]

Rayquaza is definitely looking like a top-level player. His performance in doubles, vs. Anti, vs. Nairo, and vs. ZeRo were all fantastic.



I think Luigi's bad matchups are frequently overrated pre-1.1.1. I don't think that he actually lost to Villager/Pacman/Rosalina as people believed, nor necessarily to ZSS. His reward was just that good (and Cyclone).

Lol no.He didn't even play the matchup correctly. I saw no trampoline camping and way too much jumping around. Luigi loses because of trampoline, not hiding behind the hydrant.

 

[Shaya]

Is anti going to reverse his recent mistake of forcing general Wii Fit perspective to be bottom tier forever?

 

[SuqAta8]

Can't watch right now. By who? When? In what round? Did he lose the set?

first game against rayquaza- he whiffed getting back on the stage within the first 20 seconds of the game and immediately lost a stock

but zero ended up taking the match

 

[Apeirohaon]

https://twitter.com/Anti_SSB/status/650792649872510976

"Im the one who always says Luigi wont ever make top 8 at a major yet im the first Luigi to do it -_-" - anti

 

[Djent]

WTF ANTIIIIII that 9%-death

 

[Kaladin]

So, evidently, the update added a Mario cosplay skin for ZSS.

 

[HeroMystic]

You can make an argument for Mario being in Top 10, but definitely not Top 5. His issue with fishing kills are too strong while the real top 5 do so pretty easily.

Definitely a tournament contender, however.

Strongly reconsidering this now.

 

[|RK|]

Man, at the highest levels, Sheik has to work soooo hard to get kills. Like, sooo hard.

 

[Kaladin]

I guess you could say

That was

Anti-climactic.

Alright. Bad jokes aside, this gives the "mario beats/goes even with Sheik" crowd much more ground to stand on. Thoughts?