COMPETITIVE Brawl+: Code Agenda

[Jiangjunizzy]

um, she can rack up damage fine, matt. in fact, she was one of the few characters in vanilla brawl that had a few nice combos. her fully charge shot just needs to be able to kill before 130%..

 

[matt4300]

um, she can rack up damage fine, matt. in fact, she was one of the few characters in vanilla brawl that had a few nice combos. her fully charge shot just needs to be able to kill before 130%..

hmm yeh ... im just trying to find a way for her to kill faster. damage bieing the quickest way . the faster you get the enemy to 130 the faster you can kick him/her/it right?
that and im also thinking of how to make her not just passable but G&W or marth level .. i mean why waste the time buffing a char when its still an uphill battle to play with them against the highteirs. thats like saying well lets buff the lowtiers! BUT keep them just bad enough that we can still **** them with falco and marth. >_>'

 

[Yeroc]

103 line code doesn't appear to fix Stamina.

 

[kupo15]

I updated the code set in the OP

 

[MK26]

What are all the codes in the recommended set? The text file hurts my eyes

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

hmm yeh ... im just trying to find a way for her to kill faster. damage bieing the quickest way . the faster you get the enemy to 130 the faster you can kick him/her/it right?
that and im also thinking of how to make her not just passable but G&W or marth level .. i mean why waste the time buffing a char when its still an uphill battle to play with them against the highteirs. thats like saying well lets buff the lowtiers! BUT keep them just bad enough that we can still **** them with falco and marth. >_>'

no. that's dumb. you simply need to give her a killing move.

 

[matt4300]

no. that's dumb. you simply need to give her a killing move.

"a killing move" isent goign to make her good that would just make her passable. most viable chars have at least 3 kill moves. some have more like G&W. but ya know w/e its not like im going to be makeing the codes. infact are we even sure that there will be space left for more than a mk nerf if that?

 

[cAm8ooo]

What are all the codes in the recommended set? The text file hurts my eyes

Yah. A fellow kirby in the brawl+ thread. Im not the only one lol

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

"a killing move" isent goign to make her good that would just make her passable. most viable chars have at least 3 kill moves. some have more like G&W. but ya know w/e its not like im going to be makeing the codes. infact are we even sure that there will be space left for more than a mk nerf if that?

samus can combo just fine. she can rack up damage. she won't be top tier, but if she has some reliable killing moves she will definitely be formidable.

 

[cooler1339]

Samus is really bad right now. She was one of the coolest characters but I wont play her anymore thanks to no kill moves :D

 

[kupo15]

What are all the codes in the recommended set? The text file hurts my eyes

Variable codes

Hitstun .495
0 buffer
2 frame PS
Shield gain .05
Shield dam .1
Shield stun X=13 Z=22 Y=5
hitlag .6
No decay plus fresh
Fall speed 1.15
FF 1.075
Dash speed 1.1

plus others

Samus is really bad right now. She was one of the coolest characters but I wont play her anymore thanks to no kill moves :D

What@? Samus is not terrible at all...

 

[Samuelson]

While I agree with you there, it's also good to get exposure in the regular forums. Every couple days now we see someone new trying it and enjoying the game. It's a good feeling. If we were isolated in our own forums, some of the people on the fence might never check out the sub-forum. Just a thought.

Yeah...I just wish more people knew about Brawl Plus. Everybody who ive talked to has said it was more fun then Brawl and that they would for sure go to a Brawl Plus tourney. Ive also brought my Brawl Plus set up to a couple tourney's now and people just sit there and play it for hours saying how much more fun certain characters are.

I think that eventually there will be a small community of Brawl Plus Smashers. I personally would go to both Brawl tourneys and Brawl Plus tourneys.

 

[GPDP]

Yeah...I just wish more people knew about Brawl Plus. Everybody who ive talked to has said it was more fun then Brawl and that they would for sure go to a Brawl Plus tourney. Ive also brought my Brawl Plus set up to a couple tourney's now and people just sit there and play it for hours saying how much more fun certain characters are.

I think that eventually there will be a small community of Brawl Plus Smashers. I personally would go to both Brawl tourneys and Brawl Plus tourneys.

Lucky you. Of the very few people with whom I play, one doesn't play Brawl enough to care, one likes it but is kind of indifferent anyway, and another is a complete scrub that likes how Brawl holds his hand for him and thus hates Brawl+.

 

[cooler1339]

GPDP, I know people exactly like that. Once there is a standard set that isn't being constantly updated i'm sure more people will play. Also I bet a lot of people have trouble setting it up.

And Samus is not terrible, she just can't kill. I find myself trying to turn into ZSS most the time during the match because of frustration. I suck at doing that so I usually just die lol. Would be amazing if you guys could make her like Zelda and have a taunt button switch back and forth. Would solve my killing problems.

Edit: Maybe I should be saying that the amount of effort you have to put in to kill someone with samus is too much.

 

[CyberGlitch]

Samus's Super Missiles are a joke. Her charge shot isn't a killer anymore, but I thought it was a little overpowered in Melee anyways (despite being a Samus main, I'll admit this). It should be able to knock them off the edge.

In Brawl+, especially with .8 shorthops, Samus has no problem accumulating damage against most characters. Hopefully character specific shorthops could maintain this.

Her downsmash is currently useless, relatively slow, knocks them far enough away to prevent comboing but doesn't kill--just great. This could be argued about her smash as well.


But really, before we start arguing what needs to be done about character balance the coders need to be given a chance to explain what is actually possible, especially keeping line count in mind.

 

[Osi]

What@? Samus is not terrible at all...

I agree completely.

Samus in brawl+ has loads more to offer than she did in vbrawl. The forward smash and back air can be combo'd into for kills, the rockets can be used to set up spikes, and most her moves are nice for chaining combos. The spike she has is a giant hitbox that just hangs out there, and comes out nice on SH for bouncing up into combos(she can destroy most characters in tech rolls with this).

Know what, I'm going to start saving some videos with mine just to point this out. I really think she is improved, and video will talk more than words. I will have full match videos of my samus up in the coming days.

The only things I dislike about samus now are the weak charge shot (I actually use this in the middle of combos now to rack up damage at low % since it has a nice stun and comes out fast), the smash missiles are weak and can't cancel the same, and the nair is no longer nice for kills. I personally think samus is one of the most helped by auto sweetspot being off with her awesome edge guarding capabilities.


I have also switched back to normal SH height/ 1.2 dash speed/ 120% fast fall since it looks to be more of the normal settings we will land on. Taking footage over the next month on falcon and needed a standard set that will not have "oh yea look what is possible with that extreme code set" as the responses lol. I want it to stay relevant.

 

[SketchHurricane]

Samus in brawl+ has loads more to offer than she did in vbrawl. The forward smash and back air can be combo'd into for kills, the rockets can be used to set up spikes, and most her moves are nice for chaining combos. The spike she has is a giant hitbox that just hangs out there, and comes out nice on SH for bouncing up into combos(she can destroy most characters in tech rolls with this).

I would agree with this. Hitstun alone did a lot for her. I was THIS close to actually making a "Samus Sucks" video showcasing various characters out-prioritizing Samus' projectiles. I remember the first time Luigi actually naired through one of my fully charged shots, we were pretty dumbfounded. Hitstun allowing her to combo the charge shot pretty much fixed that, though. As for her not being able to kill, you can't ignore the usefulness of her dair spike. With hitstun, it's generally easier to get people off stage, so I image her spike game is a bit better as well.

Having said all that, she's probably still bottom tier right now. She's F tier in the SBR tier list, and if you look at all the character in both F and G, pretty much all of them got a lot better in B+ than Samus did .

 

[Starscream]

103 line code doesn't appear to fix Stamina.

Yeah, I'm getting the same result.

 

[MookieRah]

Also, a lot of people don't realize one of the most interesting and effective buffs that Samus got from hitstun. Her zairs knock her opponents down. This is an awesome setup and totally annoys her opponents way more than simply getting hit and stunned slightly. I haven't tried this since I lowered stun to 8%, but I'm pretty sure this still works.

I said it before and I'll say it again. Have her shorthops fixed and buff her super missile and charged shots knockback and she should be fine. You don't have to make ALL of her old moves kickass... that would take too many lines of code. As it stands, she can outlast a lot of characters and can be very defensive. Having decent killing projectiles would be all she needs to be a really good character. I doubt she would be top, but she'd probably be good enough to win tournaments in the hands of a skilled player.

 

[Corpsecreate]

PLEASE could someone tell me how to convert NTSC-U codes to PAL codes? If not then could someone at least convert me the Buffer Modifier code? I would REALLY like to use this code since I absolutely hate the buffering system in brawl.

 

[Revven]

I said it before and I'll say it again. Have her shorthops fixed and buff her super missile and charged shots knockback and she should be fine. You don't have to make ALL of her old moves kickass... that would take too many lines of code. As it stands, she can outlast a lot of characters and can be very defensive. Having decent killing projectiles would be all she needs to be a really good character. I doubt she would be top, but she'd probably be good enough to win tournaments in the hands of a skilled player.

Yeah it'd be fine if her Super Missiles had more knockback and her charge shot actually KOed at 100% like it used to. But, I don't think everybody knows this yet but... we don't necessarily have to worry about code space too much anymore.

We can patch any ASM in spaces of unused memory in the game with Gecko OS 2.0 (when it comes out). We can have up to 255 patches to the RAM so it doesn't have to constantly use those same lines of code, like any ASM in hitstun for example would be shaved off and patched to the unused memory (there's lots of it). This is STILL temporary but, you would now have two different files you'd need for Brawl+.

A .gct (for the codes) and a .gpf (for the patching), the .gpf is what custom textures would use (an example) and any patching that needs to be done (what we'd be using this for). We'll have plenty of space with this option now, Mookie, so it's not out of the question to buff one of her Smash attacks or one of her aerials' KO power just to make her have some MORE viable options other than projectiles for KO. Buffing her projectiles would also help her match-up against MK greatly!

 

[SirPsychoMantis]

Tried out Brawl+ (Mookie's codes) yesterday with some friends and thought it was great, had lots of fun.

One thing though, with Mookie's code set, Wario's uthrow to uair or fart is a combo at most percents, and is quite OP.

Good job on the progress so far

 

[Fizz-sama]

Mookie, how big is the difference of 8% hitstun and 9.5? In your opinion should it be 8%, or is that you just testing it out?

 

[matt4300]

Also, a lot of people don't realize one of the most interesting and effective buffs that Samus got from hitstun. Her zairs knock her opponents down. This is an awesome setup and totally annoys her opponents way more than simply getting hit and stunned slightly. I haven't tried this since I lowered stun to 8%, but I'm pretty sure this still works.

I said it before and I'll say it again. Have her shorthops fixed and buff her super missile and charged shots knockback and she should be fine. You don't have to make ALL of her old moves kickass... that would take too many lines of code. As it stands, she can outlast a lot of characters and can be very defensive. Having decent killing projectiles would be all she needs to be a really good character. I doubt she would be top, but she'd probably be good enough to win tournaments in the hands of a skilled player.

with 8% hitstun you have to wait until like 60 or 70 before zair for link or samus will knock people down.
also i dont know why i forgot this but if her Nair was a kill move agin she would own pretty hard. its easily her easyest attack to combo into.

we don't necessarily have to worry about code space too much anymore.

"We can patch any ASM in spaces of unused memory in the game with Gecko OS 2.0 (when it comes out). We can have up to 255 patches to the RAM so it doesn't have to constantly use those same lines of code, like any ASM in hitstun for example would be shaved off and patched to the unused memory (there's lots of it). This is STILL temporary but, you would now have two different files you'd need for Brawl+."

umm awsome @_@ if this is true and works like you say then holy god this will be better than melee. if not for the gameplay then just for a more tightly balanced smash game! say hello to a less crappy link, and a not crappy bower!(@o@ SUPER ARMOR BOWSER FSMASH!!!!)

 

[Frogles]

Err, I haven't been paying much attention lately, but why the switch to 13/22/5 shield stun? What was wrong with 11/22/5?

 

[Revven]

Err, I haven't been paying much attention lately, but why the switch to 13/22/5 shield stun? What was wrong with 11/22/5?

Some people felt it wasn't strong enough for certain attacks.

 

[Frogles]

And those attacks would be? Air attacks? Smash attacks?

 

[kupo15]

umm awsome @_@ if this is true and works like you say then holy god this will be better than melee. if not for the gameplay then just for a more tightly balanced smash game! say hello to a less crappy link, and a not crappy bower!(@o@ SUPER ARMOR BOWSER FSMASH!!!!)

I hate SA attacks. I think they ruin the game a little. I wish we could go as far as to make everyone immobile after their up b because that ruins smash I believe.

Sonic would be able to do 1 aerial while rising but is done after he spins
GaW/Snake is just done
ect

but it will prob never be approved

 

[matt4300]

I hate SA attacks. I think they ruin the game a little. I wish we could go as far as to make everyone immobile after their up b because that ruins smash I believe.

Sonic would be able to do 1 aerial while rising but is done after he spins
GaW/Snake is just done
ect

but it will prob never be approved

hmmm well ok then... i just always wondered why bowsers fsmash dident have super armor becuase of its speed and vunerability YET wario gets SA on his? doesnt make much since >_>

 

[cobaltblue]

So is there a value standard yet since everyone is talking about buffs? Cause if not won't combos and viablity be dependent on what each person has?

 

[Dan_X]

How many of you guys would consider a HAD code if it existed?

 

[matt4300]

So is there a value standard yet since everyone is talking about buffs? Cause if not won't combos and viablity be dependent on what each person has?

well there are a few things that arent in yet like air momentum, and grab release fixes. but those things wont have a huge impact on the teirs (well they might >_>)
i dont know. i would love for a thread to be made for char buffs/nerfs so we can start debateing and makeing fixes. plus from what falco400 says we might not have to worry about line limits. wich would give us ample space for char buffing.
heh im getting giddy about how this will affect brawl + im sure telling people that the chars are more balanced and most gay chain grabs are gone will make them more inclined to try it out. i know it would help me to try it if i hadent.

well all that and everyone agrees samus needs a buff

consider? no i would use it!

 

[zxeon]

How many of you guys would consider a HAD code if it existed?

I know I would.

 

[goodoldganon]

How many of you guys would consider a HAD code if it existed?

I'd mess with it, but I feel the Brawl dodge is fine. As I said on the NASL code, I feel we are trying to hard to buff the offense. We have a few codes in the works right now to buff it further, and the HAD dodge seems like it would only nerf the defense more.

(I'm assuming HAD dodge is allowing only 1 Brawl air dodge or it's a Melee Air dodge which we can still attack, up-B, etc. out of.)

 

[Deleted member]

ok who the hell asked to port buffer mod? I did that 2 weeks ago >_>.

and can some people tell me their settings, since mine is getting outdated.

 

[kupo15]

ok who the hell asked to port buffer mod? I did that 2 weeks ago >_>.

and can some people tell me their settings, since mine is getting outdated.

check the OP. Its closer to what other ppl use.

Also, post a link to your ports so I can add them to the op

 

[Revven]

ok who the hell asked to port buffer mod? I did that 2 weeks ago >_>.

lol, he PMed me about it and I gave him the link to where all the PAL codes are for this so, he should be good now.

 

[Deleted member]

check the OP. Its closer to what other ppl use.

Also, post a link to your ports so I can add them to the op

http://www.usbgecko.com/codes/index.php?r=e&c=RSBP01
that's the link.

and I just wanted to hear some personal settings, and the OP doesn't show actual values, does it?

 

[storm92]

How many of you guys would consider a HAD code if it existed?

I personally wouldn't.
BAD seems to work just fine with the current codes we have.

 

[kupo15]

http://www.usbgecko.com/codes/index.php?r=e&c=RSBP01
that's the link.

and I just wanted to hear some personal settings, and the OP doesn't show actual values, does it?

Besides all the values being in the txt file yes, I included a quote below it