"common knowledge" that a lot of people don't know

[ihavespaceblondes]

I've experienced it several times... old noob habit of mashing jump because no one would wait for Samus' lack of hitstun comes back to haunt me. Then I remember and stop pressing it, but auto-jump into a knee a split second later anyway.

 

[Dark Sonic]

The same is true of getup attacks (just asked Magus )

So if you knock someone over while they're mashing attack buttons (during multishines, rapid jabs, whatever) you canactually account for them getup attacking consistently.

20 frame buffers are so mean

 

[JPOBS]

yea, i friggin HATE the getup attack buffer though.

happens to me so much in spacies matches and then i get combo'd to death.
stupid game.

 

[KAOSTAR]

WTF, I never knew about this ****. When I mash jump I just assumed I timed it hella good on one of my many presses lol.

 

[MT_]

I just found out that in Kongo Jungle the Klaptrap can get caught in the barrel....whoa...

EDIT: and I just found out you can destroy the Great Fox's blaster on Corneria...!! HOLY CRAP. If you hit the blaster enough it'll eventually blow up and then you can't stand on it anymore.

I am just in full discovery mode today (to things that people probably already know haha)

 

[X1-12]

The same is true of getup attacks (just asked Magus )

So if you knock someone over while they're mashing attack buttons (during multishines, rapid jabs, whatever) you canactually account for them getup attacking consistently.

20 frame buffers are so mean

what about rolling from the floor etc?

 

[THeDarKnesS]

You can roll out of thunders and get up attack if u buffer it.

 

[mers]

You can roll out of thunders and get up attack if u buffer it.

I think these things don't work at really low percents. It depends on what attack hits you, and what percent you are at.

For example, I don't think it ever works with Falco's lasers.

 

[THeDarKnesS]

I don't have a specific situation in mind or any evidence, but I don't think that's necessarily true; although, you could be right.

 

[Pengie]

I think that your ability to do something after a jab reset (e.g. roll away, getup attack) is related to the strength of the move. That's why Jiggs's jab reset is so dangerous; her jab is to weak to roll out of the jab reset at low percents.

 

[Laijin]

Young Link has a sweetspot on his sword similar to Marth's sweet spot.
If you sweet spot his f-tilt, the knockback is increased. Same with his d-smash

 

[THeDarKnesS]

Young Link has a sweetspot on his sword similar to Marth's sweet spot.
If you sweet spot his f-tilt, the knockback is increased. Same with his d-smash

It would be really sweet if you could tell us where YL's sweet spot is vs a simple fact that he has one.

 

[Laijin]

It would be really sweet if you could tell us where YL's sweet spot is vs a simple fact that he has one.

I kinda figured the part where I said "Like Marth's sweet spot" gave it away...

 

[Dark Sonic]

I think that your ability to do something after a jab reset (e.g. roll away, getup attack) is related to the strength of the move. That's why Jiggs's jab reset is so dangerous; her jab is to weak to roll out of the jab reset at low percents.

It's actually based on the amount of hitstun the move causes (which is still based on the strength of the move I guess)

13 frames of hitstun or less=can only do normal getup (optionless jab reset)
14 frames of hitsun or more=can buffer any getup option by holding said option. (option jab reset)

Jigglypuff's jab reset is optionless until percents that don't matter.
Sheik's jab reset is optionless at low percents, but not past mid percents.

It'd be interesting if someone made a catalog of the percents where optionless jab resets turn into option jab resets.

 

[Pengie]

Lasers always do optionless jab resets =D Hooray for set knockback!!!

 

[THeDarKnesS]

I kinda figured the part where I said "Like Marth's sweet spot" gave it away...

Not necessarily. Similar to marth YL has a sweet spot. Its just a bit more clear if you just say YL has a sweet spot on the tip similar to marths.

Sounds like I just interpreted what you said diffferently then how you meant it.

But its at the tip of the sword or is it slightly below or something like that?

 

[Laijin]

Not necessarily. Similar to marth YL has a sweet spot. Its just a bit more clear if you just say YL has a sweet spot on the tip similar to marths.

Sounds like I just interpreted what you said diffferently then how you meant it.

But its at the tip of the sword or is it slightly below or something like that?

I'm not exactly sure where but its definitely the tip or around the tip. It only seems to matter on his f-tilt and his d-smash.

For example. A character's knockback will increase if you hit them with the tip of your f-tilt. If you hit them with your dmsash and they are too close to you, they get knocked up rather than away.

 

[Metal Reeper]

EDIT: I ment about the buffer out of hitstun, I knew you could buffer resets. And I thought everyone knew that about Ylinks sword...

 

[Laijin]

I'm only basing things off of what I have experienced >___>

 

[THeDarKnesS]

does it matter where you hit with the down smash to meteor spike them? or is that down tilt?

I know its the underside...but does it have to be sweet spotted as well?

 

[Nø Ca$h]

EDIT: I ment about the buffer out of hitstun, I knew you could buffer resets. And I thought everyone knew that about Ylinks sword...

this kid thinks fox lasers reset. flame him.

 

[Laijin]

Down tilt. I believe the only requirement is the character has to be in the air.
Not sure about any specific hit boxes or anything since I don't I have ever NOT meteor spiked anyone with d-tilt

 

[THeDarKnesS]

Sounds like its just a move that sends them down, if they are grounded they bounce up.

 

[BigD!!!]

metal reeper, most recently in the thread was a post saying that it was impossible for ganon to scoop fox with a rising uair, i was posting to say that it was

if it was posted much earlier in the thread, i dont know about it, but the last post i had seen in this thread concerning ganon's rising uair vs fox said that it didnt hit him

 

[X1-12]

It's actually based on the amount of hitstun the move causes (which is still based on the strength of the move I guess)

13 frames of hitstun or less=can only do normal getup (optionless jab reset)
14 frames of hitsun or more=can buffer any getup option by holding said option. (option jab reset)

Jigglypuff's jab reset is optionless until percents that don't matter.
Sheik's jab reset is optionless at low percents, but not past mid percents.

It'd be interesting if someone made a catalog of the percents where optionless jab resets turn into option jab resets.

bonus info, you can SDI out of all resets, and ASDI out of some. Magus made a list of what percents (with no SDI or ASDI) you can roll from sheiks jab for each character

Nah, by A/SDIing up you can jump out or land on your feet in normal air to ground landing lag. Whether you can choose your getup or are forced into stand only when you don't successfully avoid the reset is based on the hitstun (knockback).

The first thing Unknown said is if they do jab you when you don't tech. If you get jabbed by Sheik above around 32% on a non-tech you can hold up to get high enough from the jab that you avoid the reset. Below that, you will need to SDI her jab.

The 2nd part was if they don't jab. They don't need to jab you to be able to punish a non-tech, so it's not some kind of solution to escaping Sheik's techchasing.

When talking about CF's jab reset on FFers, if they're able to roll and attack it's because his jab has more KB/hitstun. It's not a universal thing that you can always go by percentages. Jigglypuff's jab for example has weaker KB and doesn't let them roll/attack until like 80-90 or something really high. Peach's jab has fixed KB and doesn't allow people heavier than Falco/Pikachu to ever roll/attack at any dmg, but anyone that weight or lighter will always be able to.

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9872129&postcount=28

There's no special treatment for spacies. If the hitstun is above a certain point you can roll/attack. If it isn't you can't.

This is for Sheik's jab, and if their damage after the jab hit is at this percent or higher they can roll/attack. If it isn't they are forced to stand only.

Bowser .... 45
DK ........ 44
Samus ..... 44
Ganon ..... 43
Yoshi ..... 43
CF ........ 42
Link ...... 42
Dr Mario .. 42
Luigi ..... 42
Mario ..... 42
Ness ...... 40
Peach ..... 39
Sheik ..... 39
Zelda ..... 39
ICs ....... 39
Marth ..... 39
Mewtwo .... 38
Roy ....... 38
Y Link .... 38
Falco ..... 37
Pikachu ... 37
Fox ....... 36
Kirby ..... 35
Jiggs ..... 33
G&W ....... 33
Pichu ..... 32

^^ That's the option aspect of it which already assumes you are forced into a getup by being on the ground when the down damage animation (what you go into when hit by a move that does less than 7.00% during a bounce/laying on the ground) ends.


Depending on the strength of the vertical KB, your DI, and the character's fallspeed though that may not even happen. This is also for Sheik's jab, and if they hold up (ASDI) this is the damage after the hit they'll start getting high enough off the floor to avoid getting reset in the first place:

Fox ....... 71
Falco ..... 43
CF ........ 33
Sheik ..... 25
Roy ....... 20
DK ........ 19

^^You can escape earlier than that by SDIing up

 

[mers]

Whoa. Being able to SDI out of Falco's laser reset and Jiggs' jab reset will change my game if I can master it.

 

[battousai555]

Whoa. Being able to SDI out of Falco's laser reset and Jiggs' jab reset will change my game if I can master it.

You can't get out of Jiggs' jab reset 'til really high percents though, sir.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Whoa. Being able to SDI out of Falco's laser reset and Jiggs' jab reset will change my game if I can master it.

stop mashing r/l and learn to tech.

 

[Metal Reeper]

this kid thinks fox lasers reset. flame him.

Lol, I know they don't when I played Colbol I just hit up on the control stick

metal reeper, most recently in the thread was a post saying that it was impossible for ganon to scoop fox with a rising uair, i was posting to say that it was

if it was posted much earlier in the thread, i dont know about it, but the last post i had seen in this thread concerning ganon's rising uair vs fox said that it didnt hit him

Yeah I think I just misread earlier, thought it said that you could, hah sorry about that BigD

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

well... i thought this was common knowledge, but apparently a lot of people don't know it.

you can buffer jumps out of hitstun.

wooooooooaaaaah

i had no idea

 

[FoxLisk]

wooooooooaaaaah

i had no idea

yeah it's super gay... i lose my double jump to it sometimes.

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^What's even gayer is that it's a 20 frame buffer window.

 

[ranmaru]

stop mashing r/l and learn to tech.

I think people who click the button all the way down to wavedash/L cancel should try to learn to half click or whatever, to be able to tech more than usual.

Even I need to learn that, haha.

(Meaning not pressing the button all the way down)

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^Airdodging requires a full press (as does wavedashing).

 

[ranmaru]

^^Airdodging requires a full press (as does wavedashing).

I mean when possible. : D

Like, L cancelling doesn't need a full press, Airdododging does. I guess we should be careful when wavedashing. : D

 

[FoxLisk]

yeah, i retrained myself to do that a couple years ago. it doesn't help as often as i expected it to, but it is worth doing since it's strictly better.
i actually divided it up so I use L for full clicks (air dodges (inc. WD), techs) and R for light clicks (L cancelling, shielding)

 

[KAOSTAR]

I realized why I miss hella techs vs falcon. Its trying to powershield **** that ****s me up. or when Im getting tech chased and I try to get a shield out quickly and I full press but I get hit b4 the shield====no ****ing tech if they start a combo.

These all start your tech window:

Wavedashing
Airdodging
powershielding

These can start ur tech window with a full press

l cancel
shielding

Getting shield poked from a fully depressed shield, can get u ****ing *****. USE THIS TO UR ADVANTAGE WHEN ON THE OFFENSIVE!

 

[ranmaru]

Thing is I use L for L cancelling and Shielding, R for Airdodging/Wavedashing.

I always L cancel with a full press. I should practice light pressing it. : ]

 

[KAOSTAR]

R and L are on the same timer so it doesnt matter which button you use.

Yu should def practice L canceling with a light press, or switch to using Z to L cancel.

 

[Divinokage]

If I would take from my experience, I usually spam R 2-3 times to L cancel lol.

Do what's more comfortable for you. =P