Important Carefully Ask PPMD about the Tiara Guy

[elvenarrow3000]

...shwat? Ummm... wait, define smash DI? I don't think we have the same definition here =P

To survive say... a knee, the absolute best DI would be to SDI every frame of hitstun back behind Falcon, so you have the best possible launch position, then swap instantaneously to upwards trajectory DI on the control stick and towards Falcon with the C-stick for the ASDI, too.

Which seems uh.

Difficult.

 

[TresChikon]

I guess I'm misinformed about a few things.

I just don't know how SDI can help you survive a knee or something that will imminently hit you though, can someone explain?

I can see you using it to try and hit a wall or ceiling to save yourself, but not like taking a knee on FD while way up in the air.

Maybe I'm just missing something obvious?

Oh and yeah you definitely can't SDI into the ground and tech, my mistake, just read the DI guide.

 

[Strong Badam]

sdi = smash di
you're thinking of ASDI, which is w/ the C-stick and helps you ledgetech stuff.

Well maybe if you're so Action replay that you can just SDI and tech into the ground.

But realistically, it's pointless. SDI is just for escaping combos or avoiding a sweetspotted finisher...or doing armada techs or ledgete... w/e.

But Doc's fair IS the finisher, so... blegh.

yes, but Doc's fair's trajectory is already into the corner, so no DI is indeed the correct DI.

 

[TresChikon]

Well since we're on the topic of surviving stupid crazy hits.

Can I get a clarification on using double stick DI to ground-tech things like in this video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-n9iBmAL6SY#t=8m55s

I SDI down and away and hold down on the C-stick to tech the F-smash, is this the correct way? I just want to make sure since I'm not as knowledgeable about the concept of SDI as I thought.

 

[KAOSTAR]

sdi = smash di
you're thinking of ASDI, which is w/ the C-stick and helps you ledgetech stuff.


yes, but Doc's fair's trajectory is already into the corner, so no DI is indeed the correct DI.

ASDI can be done with the joystick too. The cstick takes priority over it during that last frame of smash dI.

Why wouldnt you want to slow your speed by holding

towards the opposite corner?

 

[TresChikon]

If you hold the opposite corner, you'll go higher than normal. It might be good to avoid dying off the sides, but you'll risk dying off the top.

It's good DI for like DL but it really depends on where you get hit on other stages.

 

[KAOSTAR]

? why would you go higher if you hold the opposite corner.

wouldnt that jus slow you down and keep you close to the same height and trajectory

 

[TresChikon]

Wait you meant as in holding into the trajectory? As in the fair sending you up and right, but you holding down and left?

That doesn't do anything, you can only DI perpendicularly to a trajectory, not parallel to it.

I thought you meant opposite corner as in left and up.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Right but if you get hit to the right, I thought holding left would slow you down.

It doesnt do anything for trajectory or maybe even surviving. But I thought you could change the speed


anyone kno 4 sure?

 

[Ndot]

I guess I'm misinformed about a few things.

I just don't know how SDI can help you survive a knee or something that will imminently hit you though, can someone explain?

I can see you using it to try and hit a wall or ceiling to save yourself, but not like taking a knee on FD while way up in the air.

Here's an example of how SDI can be applied to survivng a knee.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1WTIRfal8M&feature=related

At 2:53, Cactuar SDIs Darkrain's thunder knee. You can see that instead of just flying straight away, he kind of flies straight up a bit then away. He would of flew farther if he didn't do that.

 

[TresChikon]

Right, I see now, so SDI allows you to drastically change the angle of an attack compared to just having NDI alone. It still makes SDIing Doc's fair a bad idea though.

Thanks for the explanation Ndot.

And as for slowing down trajectories, I really don't know, but that'd be cool.

 

[Cactuar]

Smash DIing Doc's Fair is not a bad idea... especially considering you can ground tech it.

SDI doesn't drastically change the angle of the attack. It changes the starting point of your knockback.

Regardless of where an attack sends you, if you can alter where the starting point of your knockback is, it can only help.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

SDI doesn't drastically change the angle of the attack. It changes the starting point of your knockback.

Regardless of where an attack sends you, if you can alter where the starting point of your knockback is, it can only help.

Right, but my point is you'd have to input the SDI, which could cause you to miss the trajectory DI.

Otherwise if you can SDI and still get the normal DI, go for it.

 

[Cactuar]

Generally, SDI is in the same direction as the desired trajectory input...

And every time it isn't, it is only a quarter stick change in direction away.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Huh. That makes sense.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

How I do it, say I need to DI up and right to survive some attack. At the instant the attack hits I push up/right and hold it. Now I start closer into the stage, and I still DI the correct way.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

That's if you're only shooting for one SDI input though.

 

[Strong Badam]

Why wouldnt you want to slow your speed by holding

towards the opposite corner?

you cannot DI parallel to the original launch angle.


getting more than one SDI input would require like quarter stick DI or something crazy, and really isn't worth it, especially since there are only 3 or so frames of hitlag on most moves. that'd require you to reset the stick and then smash again within 2 frames bro. you can use your C-stick for asdi to move yourself a bit before the attack launches you tho, but usually the control stick is used for normal DI to change your trajectory for survival.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Well! You guys were all "omg it helps so much" so I assumed you were doing something like that.

Seems like a fast quarter circle swipe would help, though.

 

[Strong Badam]

it would
it's not really worth the extra effort in comparison to learning other things like how to not get hit and hit your opponent more than he hits you

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

1 SDI input is good enough in most situations.

Its definitely better than 0

 

[RestInPeace]

Shield SDI is good.

 

[KAOSTAR]

it would
it's not really worth the extra effort in comparison to learning other things like how to not get hit and hit your opponent more than he hits you

I think its worth the effort.

You can survive those kill moves a little longer.

Im just waiting for the opportunity to practice my DI. Not like during a match but just taking hits and DIing them.

 

[DJMirror]

would it be wise to approach with shield? I think if i just run up and shield just a sec, I can fair out of shield or wd out of shield in case i feel like i should back out in certain situations

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

yes its good, but don't do it too often because you are approaching (entering their area) and then not taking control of the area. If they grab, space, or don't do anything you lose. You only win if they miss-space on your shield.

 

[RestInPeace]

Run up to the pill and shield to powershield it. Then, you can do whatever if the Pill connects with Doc (I saw this in a video just now).

Also, what do you do from a grab in Marth dittos? After they're 20%+. Are there tricks you can do? I've heard something about up throw leading to a guaranteed hit at a certain percent, but I'm not sure.

Dthrow -> turnaround Dtilt works pretty well if they're near the edge.

 

[Tero.]

Uthrow Utilt.
If they don't jump out of it you'll hit them.
If they jump out you can follow up with uair or fair and juggle them since they have no rejump left.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

few marths punish for this anymore, but bthrow (not dthrow) is a great mixup. If they don't DI away, you can get a free fsmash or bair and if your back was to the stage that means they are probably dead from the hit (or about to be)

 

[Cosmo!]

good places to use SDI:

fox dairs you
fox dairshines you
fox uairs you
falco shines you
falco shine-dairs you
jiggs uptilts you (I actually nailed this and barely still got rested in finals, lame as hell)

also Ive done a double stick DI ground tech on a jiggs uair to avoid a rest in tournament finals, lol too good

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Oh yeah, whoever asked about double stick techs...

You DI down and away, generally, to get the lowest possible send angle, then hold C-stick down to ASDI into the ground, click shield before you get hit. It doesn't work forever, but it'll work for a while.

 

[Ndot]

Dthrow -> turnaround Dtilt works pretty well if they're near the edge.

This doesn't work if the Marth being thrown knows how to DI away and then properly jumps to sweetspot the ledge and use the invincibility frames from the ledge to his advantage.

 

[KAOSTAR]

The instant tech works as long as you can get into the ground to tech. It can be done at high percents, well past what ppl normally live 2 for alot of moves.

Run up to the pill and shield to powershield it. Then, you can do whatever if the Pill connects with Doc (I saw this in a video just now).

Also, what do you do from a grab in Marth dittos? After they're 20%+. Are there tricks you can do? I've heard something about up throw leading to a guaranteed hit at a certain percent, but I'm not sure.

Dthrow -> turnaround Dtilt works pretty well if they're near the edge.

I like to Fthrow and try to get another grab. I seem to always be able to get 2 F throws even if they Di away.

At mid percents, I like to fthrow and chase their DI or punish the airdodge with more fthrows.
pretty much I like to fthrow as much as possible to get them to the edge so thatl I can get in a fsmash or something.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

I uthrow all non-fastfallers below forty percent. Just sets up juggles and such. Unless I'm right next to the edge.

 

[RestInPeace]

Thanks for the responses. Now what do I do against fast fallers?

 

[TresChikon]

CG 0-death

 

[Strong Badam]

go to the ledge and ledgehop a while and wait for your opponent to get impatient and then gimp them.
note: may only work against FL spacies

 

[Heart Break Kid]

And Eggm...

 

[elvenarrow3000]

If I recall correctly, you have a uthrow to fsmash tipper on all three fastfallers, if they DI. Falcon's is like at a hundred or seventy or something like that, though, whereas Fox and Falco's are more in the sixty to eighty range.

Chaingrab only works on spacies, tech chase Falcon or something.

 

[KAOSTAR]

marth can combo into Fsmash on everyone.

on spacies its so much better to put them into the position that you want to fsmash them instead of relying on them to DI there.

marths stage control is what makes him ****

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Well, the thing is, if they don't DI, you can hit them with a uair to set up for an fsmash anyway.